Session Date: October 24th 2009
Laura, Ark, P*****, Joe, A***, DD, Allen, A***l, I**, C**, Scottie, G***
Q: (L) Geez, we only have two more months of this year, and it's been one hell of a year. Once again. Every year we say that. Every year we think the year has topped... ya know? Each year has its own particular evil. (Ark) This year was all work. Work work work! (L) Okay. Here we are... Hello.
A: 84 questions all in one!
Q: (L) Who do we have with us?
A: Olimpia of Cassiopaea. Questions are the beginning of wisdom!
Q: (L) Well, now you say, "84 questions in one," and "Questions are the beginngin of wisdom." Are we supposed to be asking 84 questions, or...?
A: Tonight you are launching a new world.
Q: (L) How?
A: By asking the right questions.
Q: (L) Boy, that's a heavy responsibility! Well, I guess there's no other way to do it than to start launching into some questions and see where it goes. (Long pause) Okay, I guess the first thing that comes to my mind to ask is: how are our breathing and meditation practitioners doing in the forum and in the group? In QFS and in the forum?
A: Whether they realize it or not, they are making dramatic progress. Do you notice the growing sense of community?
Q: (L) Well, yes I noticed that a lot of forum members were starting to take care of newbies and answer questions and analyze things – and doing a darn good job of it, too! They're starting to think out of the box. Anything else that I should be noticing?
A: Their connections are forming at higher levels.
Q: (L) Well (pause) anybody want to ask more about it? Obviously we've got a big responsibility here to ask the right questions. (P*****) Why 84 and not 83 or 82? Is there specific meaning in this figure "84"?
A: Figure of speech.
Q: (L) Okay, let's try to stay on track. So, we're talking about the forum and the last thing was something about their connections are forming on higher levels. Okay, is there anything that they are supposed to do about this, or that we are supposed to do about this at this point to assist in some way?
A: You have already taken the steps for QFS, so now you must open the door for the forum and more.
Q: (L) What do you mean exactly?
A: Remember your attorney? Remember the papers filed?
Q: (L) Well, yes. We filed papers to create a legal entity, a legal church to be the shelter for the breathing and meditation program and for anybody who is going to be teaching it. I mean, it's a necessary legal protection.
A: And so much more than that! It is the 3D symbol for 4D connections being forged.
Q: (L) So you're saying that we should open this to everyone? Right now? Launch it as a religion right now and offer memberships to not just QFS, but to forum members? Well, we had planned to include some forum members who were interested in teaching the breathing program - for their own protection - but, open the doors for anybody and everybody?
A: Pretty much!
Q: (Long pause and silence) (L) Well, we've been working on this document, the Statement of Principles… We've been working on the statement of principles and it's almost finished. I guess I could speed it up and make it available. I did want to get some other things incorporated in there first, though.
A: It is a stunning piece of work! It needs to be shared ASAP. It is the clearest and most cogent statement of its kind that has ever launched a true system of growth and participation with higher realms that we know of.
Q: (L) Well of course we run the risk of being accused of being a cult once again by good old Vinnie and his gang.
A: He sure has done his job hasn't he?
Q: (L) Well, yeah. He's made us afraid of doing the logical thing to say the least. Well, alright. Any particular suggestions about how to go about this? I mean about memberships and so forth since this was designed to be legal protection for QFS mainly and those forum members who are interested in getting more involved?
A: There should be levels of membership so that different people can participate to the degree that is comfortable and possible for them. As they grow, they will expand into the wider circle. Because these levels must not be hierarchical, but rather circles.
Q: (Ark) Question is, should we consult about the bigger stuff with our French attorneys so that we are safe in France where there are strict rules?
A: Ultimately, yes but not necessary immediately. You created the structure for the protection of those in the USA first where it is most needed. Proceed with the steps as you go along.
Q: (L) So basically we have created a legal structure to protect the rights of our group members and forum members and now, anybody else who wishes to join with us, and who believes that the rights that we stipulate in our statement of principles are ones that they value and consider to be their own as well and wish to have protected. So, we have that, and we have an attorney - or team of attorneys - who will ensure that those rights are protected. Of course, the question is that, obviously, if people are going to be coming under this umbrella to protect their rights and we have attorneys at the ready to protect those rights, we're certainly going to have to have money to pay those attorneys. Which means that somehow, in some way, this is going to have to - depending on what the situations are that will arise - at the very least we need to be ready. Because certainly, someone will come along and say something or do something and challenge those rights that we seek to protect, and we have to be ready. So, how do we deal with that?
A: Levels of membership. Those who wish to participate at the level where it might be necessary to employ legal protection should contribute to the structure commensurately.
Q: (L) So you mean something like tithing? I mean, that's how...
(Joe) I mean, we do it already with group members. I mean, whoever can donate...
(L) So it doesn't have to be an actual amount, it's just a commitment according to their ability to commit and not a set amount.
(Joe) And I wouldn't say we should go anywhere near a percentage like other groups do...
(L) No, because there will be some people who will be very committed and will be participating to a great extent and yet who may not have a lot of money. And then there will be other people who have more, so it will have to depend entirely on their situation. So long as it's a regular commitment...
(Joe) In a situation where someone would need legal defense, supposedly it would only happen that we would have to support them in that respect if they didn't have the money. They could mount their own defense with their own money if they had it.
(L) Right, yeah. We would help so that for example, if somebody wanted to say, "Hey, I'm not taking vaccinations because it's against the principles of my religion, that vaccinations are harmful and we don't believe in them."
(Joe) I wonder if we could work something out the lawyers. In the case where it would happen, it would be an ongoing thing where an increasing number of people would need that defense.
(L) Things like that can be handled with class actions, too. A lot of people can be argued for, and if you win for one, you've won for all.
(Joe) Exactly.
(L) And things like vaccinations, things like the right to smoke tobacco, the right to talk about conspiracies, the right to be spiritual AND interested in world affairs... There are a number of things in the statement of principles that we think are pretty much agreed upon by nearly everybody in the so-called "Truth Movement" even, who do not have the kind of protection that will be afforded to people that come under the umbrella of Our fellowship.
(Joe) Something like that would be pretty clear cut. It's not going to be like the case that was argued against Pepin. It's an incorporated religion.
(L) No, it's not going to be any kind of case like that. It will be strictly first amendment issues – cut and dried.
(Joe) Did we ever ask {attorney} if there's any precedent where something like that went to court and the judge was able to dismiss the legality of the religion itself?
(L) No, that's never been done that I know of. Look at those people who started that religion there in Texas or Arizona or wherever where they took all their kids away... Those people really are sick puppies, let's face it. That's my opinion and I have a right to it. First amendment. But even they got their kids back because of freedom of religion! And what they were doing was clearly abuse, mind-programming, and so on. Geeze, they start on those people when they are babies! That’s abusive, in my opinion.
(Allen) Jehovah's Witnesses have a thing against vaccines. So you know it's been challenged, so we could just look it up and see what happened with that.
(L) It's becoming more widespread for people to be accused of being mentally ill because they think that George Bush and the gang and Mossad and everything were behind 9/11. So, I mean if the church council, the supreme council or whatever you want to call it, the Elders of the church say that this is what the believers should believe, then it's covered under freedom of religion! Conspiracy theory and all the issues about psychopaths are all incorporated into this statement of principles.
(Joe) It makes sense because people have been called crazy and families have got worried about them - about members of families who started thinking "crazy thoughts" and had them committed and stuff. And a lot of times when that happens, the things those people are thinking are no crazier than the things people are thinking and believing in the name of the mainstream religions. But if they said it's in the name of a religion then it's "okay, fine, no problem!"
(L) In the DSM-3, that was specifically covered. I don't know if they've removed that, but at that time, it said anybody who believed they heard voices was suffering from some kind of mental illness EXCEPT if it happens in the context of religious beliefs!! So people could be hearing voices and be crazy as loons, but if it falls under religious beliefs, well, that makes it okay!
(L) It is the logical next step to be taken. It is the logical blanket to throw over the entire Truth Movement. There are gonna be a lot of them who are not going to be able to accept some our esoteric ideas, the meditation, and all that kind of stuff. But the fact is that in order to be a practicing member, they're going to have to be doing the meditation and breathing program - at LEAST that. They don't have to believe anything else. But they have to be doing the meditation and breathing program. And if they're doing the meditation and breathing, and making some efforts to detox their body with some dietary changes, then they're fully-fledged members and they're fully entitled to all the protections which cover all of these other areas.
(Joe) It makes total sense. It's kind of like taking stock of the situation as it is now in terms of trying to get the truth out and realizing that all these corporations and monotheistic established religions on the one side that demonize as "conspiracy theorists" anyone who can see clearly. So the idea is that we join them on their playing field and say, "We're a religion now too! You believe in Jesus? I believe in 9/11 conspiracy theories! What's the difference?!"
(L) And we have something that they don't have. We have a living source that tells us things about 9/11, conspiracies, psychopaths, evil pathology in government, and so forth. So, it's part of a living esoteric source that none of these other people have. I mean, they just have like a bishop or a pope who is just a human being sending down papal bulls... papal BS!
(DD) Copernicus and Galileo would have joined!
(L) Still, to be entitled to the protections, they will have to be at least minimally practicing members, and practicing members have certain responsibilities. And this is even considered in legal definitions. They say, "A church is..." and they have a list of things that its members do. If a person is claiming to be a member of the church, they have to do certain of these things on this list. Not ALL of this list, of course, but say, at least five of them. If they are doing those things, then there are legitimately members.
(Joe) Of course, nobody verifies that, right? That's not open to scrutiny by any authority, whether they're doing it not.
(L) In some cases it can be. Suppose somebody says, "That goes against my religion because I'm 7th Day Adventist," and there's some real issue that the PTB really want to squeeze them over, they may go and ask their neighbors if they've seen them ever going to church. Then they'll come back and say you're not a 7th Day Adventist because you've never gone to church, your name isn't on any membership role, etc. So you're just using this to get out of a legal situation.
(Joe) So the main thing is a membership role and minimal participation.
(L) Yeah, and they would have to be to some extent participating member. But of course, according to our statement of principles, being a participating member is going to be carefully defined so that it will cover different levels of membership.
(Joe) Well, we would recommend that everyone who is a member have a copy of the DVDs.
(L) Absolutely. They have to have the DVDs because they have to be doing the meditation, they have to have - and know - the Prayer of the Soul. (L) We have to have virtual churches - an online church.
(Joe) With a forum that people attend... We could show their attendance by...
(L) By the log on the online church.
(Joe) We would have to be sure that we would have all that, that we have their real name and address.
(L) That would be voluntary for those who want to be members. They sign up and sign a register saying, "I did such and such this week, I did the meditation this many times, blah blah blah," and then they just check in and we have those records for their virtual participation. (L) It's a good idea. So, where are we?
(Joe) We're talking about levels of participation.
(L) So, we have levels of participation. How many should we have?
(Joe) You said 7.
(L) Somebody said 4 because they liked Gurdjieff's 4. 7 is a prime number, and there are 7 density levels.
(Ark) The more levels, the more we have to classify...
(L) That's true. Maybe we could have sub-levels. Like each level has two classifications... well, three levels have two classifications, and then...
(Joe) How do we define graduation to levels? Participation?
(L) I would say it has to do with participation, their descriptions of their experiences with the meditation and breathing program, have they held any meetings in their town teaching the breathing program and the meditation to other people, etc. So that would be a certain level of course.
(Ark) But shouldn't it depend so to say on the level of knowledge?
(L) Well, yeah, but that's going to be difficult to determine.
(Ark) Well, nevertheless, there can be workshops.
(L) Yes, they can attend workshops and we can evaluate people individually.
(A***) Yeah, what books they've read, how well they've understood the material...
(L) And also their participation in the virtual forum or church. The forum itself can be the virtual church.
(C**) But then you'll have crazy people like psychopaths teaching breathing...
(L) Well they can't be teaching it until they attend a workshop, and they have to be ordained as ministers before they can be teaching it. That's one thing, for sure. Just ordinary members can't be doing that.
(C**) So that would be like level 2.
(L) So we can have people who are Listeners that are just reading and participating in discussion. And then, Active Members who are doing the meditation and detox; and then we can have Teachers. That's three levels right there. And then we have people who are Teachers of Teachers. And then you have the Elders. I've made five, haven't I? And then the Elder Elders? (laughter)
(Joe) "The Really Old Elders"?
(A***) Well what do the C's have to say about it? Should be there be 4 or 7 or 5?
A: We like 5.
Q: (L) They like 5. (Joe) So there's circles then. Like the olympic circles. (P*****) Not concentric circles? (Joe) Concentric circles. (C**) Yeah, because you expand to a wider circle. (Joe) So it's outwards not inwards... (Scottie) The smallest group is the center circle. And as you move outward, the outer circle encompasses the inner circle, so the higher level is the outer circle because the outermost circle encompasses all the inner circles.
(L) So, I guess we have to do this. It all makes perfect sense. It’s the logical step to take considering all the many concerns of our group, the forum members, our readers, and even a wider public. I guess that means we're going to just do it. Okay, so I guess we can get now to some of our personal questions. I want to ask about my mom. I don't know what to ask. I'm afraid to even ask anything.
A: She is on her journey home.
Q: (L) So, it's going to take some time for everything to shut down, is that it?
A: Yes
Q: (L) Is she comfortable?
A: Yes
Q: (L) Is she suffering any pain?
A: Little.
Q: (L) And I guess the medications they're giving her help with that?
A: Yes
Q: (L) Was she able to understand all the things that we said to her when we sent these audios to her?
A: Yes
Q: (L) Alright. I guess I want to ask about J***. What is going on there with the boils and all that?
A: He needs to practice the meditation to resolve emotional issues. He also needs medical attention.
Q: (L) So anybody else got any questions? (DD) I'd like to ask about medical attention. Should I seriously entertain going ahead with my surgical procedure on my esophagus?
A: What do you feel?
Q: (DD) Well, I feel like it's not a good thing, but I'm wondering if the diet and the meditation are enough to overcome this damage?
A: Give it six months.
Q: (DD) Okay, I can do that. Is there any nutrient that I'm seriously deficient in?
A: Not in particular. It is mostly inflammation.
Q: (DD) Inflammation of the esophageal sphincter?
A: Body.
Q: (DD) Huh. And how would one reduce the inflammation? (L) That's what the diet's for. (DD) No quick fix. (Joe) Gotta be strict, DD! No cheatin'! (L) It takes six months to really get inflammation under control. It really does. Or longer. It took longer for me. It'll probably be shorter for you. (DD) Is gluten the source of that inflammation?
A: Mainly. Also dairy.
Q: (Joe) DD, DD, DD! What have we been telling you? (DD) Does goat and sheep derived milk products constitute dairy?
A: Yes.
Q: (DD) Okay, I'm all done. Thank you very much. (L) Have you been having goat and sheep products? (DD) I've stayed away from the vache, but yeah, I still have a little bit of brebis or... (L) You'll never get rid of it if you keep having it. (DD) Okay, well that's what I needed to know. That answered a whole lot of my questions. (Joe) Can I ask how A***'s pancreas is doing?
A: Better but not fully healed.
Q: (Joe) Is there anything she should be eating or ingesting, or not eating or ingesting to speed up the healing?
A: She does well with fish, liver, rice protein etc.
Q: (L) Anything that makes you feel better than anything else? (A***) Ultra shakes are safe. I think they're the only thing that I'm sure is safe. (L) I think those and fish. (A***) Fish, maybe some brown rice, maybe some steamed vegetables. (L) And that's it. Anything else is deadly. (A***) I'm not even sure about bananas any more.
A: No
Q: (A***) No bananas. What about mint for me?
A: OK
Q: (A***) Lemon?
A: OK
Q: (A***) Phew! (laughter) (Joe) Bananas are evil for everybody! (L) NO! (Joe) They're from South America and were developed by Quetzalcoatl, who dropped down out of his spaceship and said, "Eat these!" (laughter) (Scottie) Bananas were invented by the Atlanteans! (Joe) Look at them! They're yellow and bendy! (P*****) I would like to ask a question about this dream Laura had about this treasure in a cave in the Pyrenees.
A: Wait for more on that. Not time yet.
Q: (L) Alright. Anything more about our group and our forum members? (pause – no new questions) (L) So we're gonna be pretty busy getting this organizational thing done. So, anything more for the group?
A: Once the external structure begins to take shape, real communities will form and chakra connection will be facilitated exponentially. Make haste but be gentle and wise. There is now more to be done so proceed with JOY. Goodbye.
END OF SESSION
***********************************************
I'll post the Statement of Principles mentioned above, even in its unfinished state, in a separate thread for discussion.
Laura, Ark, P*****, Joe, A***, DD, Allen, A***l, I**, C**, Scottie, G***
Q: (L) Geez, we only have two more months of this year, and it's been one hell of a year. Once again. Every year we say that. Every year we think the year has topped... ya know? Each year has its own particular evil. (Ark) This year was all work. Work work work! (L) Okay. Here we are... Hello.
A: 84 questions all in one!
Q: (L) Who do we have with us?
A: Olimpia of Cassiopaea. Questions are the beginning of wisdom!
Q: (L) Well, now you say, "84 questions in one," and "Questions are the beginngin of wisdom." Are we supposed to be asking 84 questions, or...?
A: Tonight you are launching a new world.
Q: (L) How?
A: By asking the right questions.
Q: (L) Boy, that's a heavy responsibility! Well, I guess there's no other way to do it than to start launching into some questions and see where it goes. (Long pause) Okay, I guess the first thing that comes to my mind to ask is: how are our breathing and meditation practitioners doing in the forum and in the group? In QFS and in the forum?
A: Whether they realize it or not, they are making dramatic progress. Do you notice the growing sense of community?
Q: (L) Well, yes I noticed that a lot of forum members were starting to take care of newbies and answer questions and analyze things – and doing a darn good job of it, too! They're starting to think out of the box. Anything else that I should be noticing?
A: Their connections are forming at higher levels.
Q: (L) Well (pause) anybody want to ask more about it? Obviously we've got a big responsibility here to ask the right questions. (P*****) Why 84 and not 83 or 82? Is there specific meaning in this figure "84"?
A: Figure of speech.
Q: (L) Okay, let's try to stay on track. So, we're talking about the forum and the last thing was something about their connections are forming on higher levels. Okay, is there anything that they are supposed to do about this, or that we are supposed to do about this at this point to assist in some way?
A: You have already taken the steps for QFS, so now you must open the door for the forum and more.
Q: (L) What do you mean exactly?
A: Remember your attorney? Remember the papers filed?
Q: (L) Well, yes. We filed papers to create a legal entity, a legal church to be the shelter for the breathing and meditation program and for anybody who is going to be teaching it. I mean, it's a necessary legal protection.
A: And so much more than that! It is the 3D symbol for 4D connections being forged.
Q: (L) So you're saying that we should open this to everyone? Right now? Launch it as a religion right now and offer memberships to not just QFS, but to forum members? Well, we had planned to include some forum members who were interested in teaching the breathing program - for their own protection - but, open the doors for anybody and everybody?
A: Pretty much!
Q: (Long pause and silence) (L) Well, we've been working on this document, the Statement of Principles… We've been working on the statement of principles and it's almost finished. I guess I could speed it up and make it available. I did want to get some other things incorporated in there first, though.
A: It is a stunning piece of work! It needs to be shared ASAP. It is the clearest and most cogent statement of its kind that has ever launched a true system of growth and participation with higher realms that we know of.
Q: (L) Well of course we run the risk of being accused of being a cult once again by good old Vinnie and his gang.
A: He sure has done his job hasn't he?
Q: (L) Well, yeah. He's made us afraid of doing the logical thing to say the least. Well, alright. Any particular suggestions about how to go about this? I mean about memberships and so forth since this was designed to be legal protection for QFS mainly and those forum members who are interested in getting more involved?
A: There should be levels of membership so that different people can participate to the degree that is comfortable and possible for them. As they grow, they will expand into the wider circle. Because these levels must not be hierarchical, but rather circles.
Q: (Ark) Question is, should we consult about the bigger stuff with our French attorneys so that we are safe in France where there are strict rules?
A: Ultimately, yes but not necessary immediately. You created the structure for the protection of those in the USA first where it is most needed. Proceed with the steps as you go along.
Q: (L) So basically we have created a legal structure to protect the rights of our group members and forum members and now, anybody else who wishes to join with us, and who believes that the rights that we stipulate in our statement of principles are ones that they value and consider to be their own as well and wish to have protected. So, we have that, and we have an attorney - or team of attorneys - who will ensure that those rights are protected. Of course, the question is that, obviously, if people are going to be coming under this umbrella to protect their rights and we have attorneys at the ready to protect those rights, we're certainly going to have to have money to pay those attorneys. Which means that somehow, in some way, this is going to have to - depending on what the situations are that will arise - at the very least we need to be ready. Because certainly, someone will come along and say something or do something and challenge those rights that we seek to protect, and we have to be ready. So, how do we deal with that?
A: Levels of membership. Those who wish to participate at the level where it might be necessary to employ legal protection should contribute to the structure commensurately.
Q: (L) So you mean something like tithing? I mean, that's how...
(Joe) I mean, we do it already with group members. I mean, whoever can donate...
(L) So it doesn't have to be an actual amount, it's just a commitment according to their ability to commit and not a set amount.
(Joe) And I wouldn't say we should go anywhere near a percentage like other groups do...
(L) No, because there will be some people who will be very committed and will be participating to a great extent and yet who may not have a lot of money. And then there will be other people who have more, so it will have to depend entirely on their situation. So long as it's a regular commitment...
(Joe) In a situation where someone would need legal defense, supposedly it would only happen that we would have to support them in that respect if they didn't have the money. They could mount their own defense with their own money if they had it.
(L) Right, yeah. We would help so that for example, if somebody wanted to say, "Hey, I'm not taking vaccinations because it's against the principles of my religion, that vaccinations are harmful and we don't believe in them."
(Joe) I wonder if we could work something out the lawyers. In the case where it would happen, it would be an ongoing thing where an increasing number of people would need that defense.
(L) Things like that can be handled with class actions, too. A lot of people can be argued for, and if you win for one, you've won for all.
(Joe) Exactly.
(L) And things like vaccinations, things like the right to smoke tobacco, the right to talk about conspiracies, the right to be spiritual AND interested in world affairs... There are a number of things in the statement of principles that we think are pretty much agreed upon by nearly everybody in the so-called "Truth Movement" even, who do not have the kind of protection that will be afforded to people that come under the umbrella of Our fellowship.
(Joe) Something like that would be pretty clear cut. It's not going to be like the case that was argued against Pepin. It's an incorporated religion.
(L) No, it's not going to be any kind of case like that. It will be strictly first amendment issues – cut and dried.
(Joe) Did we ever ask {attorney} if there's any precedent where something like that went to court and the judge was able to dismiss the legality of the religion itself?
(L) No, that's never been done that I know of. Look at those people who started that religion there in Texas or Arizona or wherever where they took all their kids away... Those people really are sick puppies, let's face it. That's my opinion and I have a right to it. First amendment. But even they got their kids back because of freedom of religion! And what they were doing was clearly abuse, mind-programming, and so on. Geeze, they start on those people when they are babies! That’s abusive, in my opinion.
(Allen) Jehovah's Witnesses have a thing against vaccines. So you know it's been challenged, so we could just look it up and see what happened with that.
(L) It's becoming more widespread for people to be accused of being mentally ill because they think that George Bush and the gang and Mossad and everything were behind 9/11. So, I mean if the church council, the supreme council or whatever you want to call it, the Elders of the church say that this is what the believers should believe, then it's covered under freedom of religion! Conspiracy theory and all the issues about psychopaths are all incorporated into this statement of principles.
(Joe) It makes sense because people have been called crazy and families have got worried about them - about members of families who started thinking "crazy thoughts" and had them committed and stuff. And a lot of times when that happens, the things those people are thinking are no crazier than the things people are thinking and believing in the name of the mainstream religions. But if they said it's in the name of a religion then it's "okay, fine, no problem!"
(L) In the DSM-3, that was specifically covered. I don't know if they've removed that, but at that time, it said anybody who believed they heard voices was suffering from some kind of mental illness EXCEPT if it happens in the context of religious beliefs!! So people could be hearing voices and be crazy as loons, but if it falls under religious beliefs, well, that makes it okay!
(L) It is the logical next step to be taken. It is the logical blanket to throw over the entire Truth Movement. There are gonna be a lot of them who are not going to be able to accept some our esoteric ideas, the meditation, and all that kind of stuff. But the fact is that in order to be a practicing member, they're going to have to be doing the meditation and breathing program - at LEAST that. They don't have to believe anything else. But they have to be doing the meditation and breathing program. And if they're doing the meditation and breathing, and making some efforts to detox their body with some dietary changes, then they're fully-fledged members and they're fully entitled to all the protections which cover all of these other areas.
(Joe) It makes total sense. It's kind of like taking stock of the situation as it is now in terms of trying to get the truth out and realizing that all these corporations and monotheistic established religions on the one side that demonize as "conspiracy theorists" anyone who can see clearly. So the idea is that we join them on their playing field and say, "We're a religion now too! You believe in Jesus? I believe in 9/11 conspiracy theories! What's the difference?!"
(L) And we have something that they don't have. We have a living source that tells us things about 9/11, conspiracies, psychopaths, evil pathology in government, and so forth. So, it's part of a living esoteric source that none of these other people have. I mean, they just have like a bishop or a pope who is just a human being sending down papal bulls... papal BS!
(DD) Copernicus and Galileo would have joined!
(L) Still, to be entitled to the protections, they will have to be at least minimally practicing members, and practicing members have certain responsibilities. And this is even considered in legal definitions. They say, "A church is..." and they have a list of things that its members do. If a person is claiming to be a member of the church, they have to do certain of these things on this list. Not ALL of this list, of course, but say, at least five of them. If they are doing those things, then there are legitimately members.
(Joe) Of course, nobody verifies that, right? That's not open to scrutiny by any authority, whether they're doing it not.
(L) In some cases it can be. Suppose somebody says, "That goes against my religion because I'm 7th Day Adventist," and there's some real issue that the PTB really want to squeeze them over, they may go and ask their neighbors if they've seen them ever going to church. Then they'll come back and say you're not a 7th Day Adventist because you've never gone to church, your name isn't on any membership role, etc. So you're just using this to get out of a legal situation.
(Joe) So the main thing is a membership role and minimal participation.
(L) Yeah, and they would have to be to some extent participating member. But of course, according to our statement of principles, being a participating member is going to be carefully defined so that it will cover different levels of membership.
(Joe) Well, we would recommend that everyone who is a member have a copy of the DVDs.
(L) Absolutely. They have to have the DVDs because they have to be doing the meditation, they have to have - and know - the Prayer of the Soul. (L) We have to have virtual churches - an online church.
(Joe) With a forum that people attend... We could show their attendance by...
(L) By the log on the online church.
(Joe) We would have to be sure that we would have all that, that we have their real name and address.
(L) That would be voluntary for those who want to be members. They sign up and sign a register saying, "I did such and such this week, I did the meditation this many times, blah blah blah," and then they just check in and we have those records for their virtual participation. (L) It's a good idea. So, where are we?
(Joe) We're talking about levels of participation.
(L) So, we have levels of participation. How many should we have?
(Joe) You said 7.
(L) Somebody said 4 because they liked Gurdjieff's 4. 7 is a prime number, and there are 7 density levels.
(Ark) The more levels, the more we have to classify...
(L) That's true. Maybe we could have sub-levels. Like each level has two classifications... well, three levels have two classifications, and then...
(Joe) How do we define graduation to levels? Participation?
(L) I would say it has to do with participation, their descriptions of their experiences with the meditation and breathing program, have they held any meetings in their town teaching the breathing program and the meditation to other people, etc. So that would be a certain level of course.
(Ark) But shouldn't it depend so to say on the level of knowledge?
(L) Well, yeah, but that's going to be difficult to determine.
(Ark) Well, nevertheless, there can be workshops.
(L) Yes, they can attend workshops and we can evaluate people individually.
(A***) Yeah, what books they've read, how well they've understood the material...
(L) And also their participation in the virtual forum or church. The forum itself can be the virtual church.
(C**) But then you'll have crazy people like psychopaths teaching breathing...
(L) Well they can't be teaching it until they attend a workshop, and they have to be ordained as ministers before they can be teaching it. That's one thing, for sure. Just ordinary members can't be doing that.
(C**) So that would be like level 2.
(L) So we can have people who are Listeners that are just reading and participating in discussion. And then, Active Members who are doing the meditation and detox; and then we can have Teachers. That's three levels right there. And then we have people who are Teachers of Teachers. And then you have the Elders. I've made five, haven't I? And then the Elder Elders? (laughter)
(Joe) "The Really Old Elders"?
(A***) Well what do the C's have to say about it? Should be there be 4 or 7 or 5?
A: We like 5.
Q: (L) They like 5. (Joe) So there's circles then. Like the olympic circles. (P*****) Not concentric circles? (Joe) Concentric circles. (C**) Yeah, because you expand to a wider circle. (Joe) So it's outwards not inwards... (Scottie) The smallest group is the center circle. And as you move outward, the outer circle encompasses the inner circle, so the higher level is the outer circle because the outermost circle encompasses all the inner circles.
(L) So, I guess we have to do this. It all makes perfect sense. It’s the logical step to take considering all the many concerns of our group, the forum members, our readers, and even a wider public. I guess that means we're going to just do it. Okay, so I guess we can get now to some of our personal questions. I want to ask about my mom. I don't know what to ask. I'm afraid to even ask anything.
A: She is on her journey home.
Q: (L) So, it's going to take some time for everything to shut down, is that it?
A: Yes
Q: (L) Is she comfortable?
A: Yes
Q: (L) Is she suffering any pain?
A: Little.
Q: (L) And I guess the medications they're giving her help with that?
A: Yes
Q: (L) Was she able to understand all the things that we said to her when we sent these audios to her?
A: Yes
Q: (L) Alright. I guess I want to ask about J***. What is going on there with the boils and all that?
A: He needs to practice the meditation to resolve emotional issues. He also needs medical attention.
Q: (L) So anybody else got any questions? (DD) I'd like to ask about medical attention. Should I seriously entertain going ahead with my surgical procedure on my esophagus?
A: What do you feel?
Q: (DD) Well, I feel like it's not a good thing, but I'm wondering if the diet and the meditation are enough to overcome this damage?
A: Give it six months.
Q: (DD) Okay, I can do that. Is there any nutrient that I'm seriously deficient in?
A: Not in particular. It is mostly inflammation.
Q: (DD) Inflammation of the esophageal sphincter?
A: Body.
Q: (DD) Huh. And how would one reduce the inflammation? (L) That's what the diet's for. (DD) No quick fix. (Joe) Gotta be strict, DD! No cheatin'! (L) It takes six months to really get inflammation under control. It really does. Or longer. It took longer for me. It'll probably be shorter for you. (DD) Is gluten the source of that inflammation?
A: Mainly. Also dairy.
Q: (Joe) DD, DD, DD! What have we been telling you? (DD) Does goat and sheep derived milk products constitute dairy?
A: Yes.
Q: (DD) Okay, I'm all done. Thank you very much. (L) Have you been having goat and sheep products? (DD) I've stayed away from the vache, but yeah, I still have a little bit of brebis or... (L) You'll never get rid of it if you keep having it. (DD) Okay, well that's what I needed to know. That answered a whole lot of my questions. (Joe) Can I ask how A***'s pancreas is doing?
A: Better but not fully healed.
Q: (Joe) Is there anything she should be eating or ingesting, or not eating or ingesting to speed up the healing?
A: She does well with fish, liver, rice protein etc.
Q: (L) Anything that makes you feel better than anything else? (A***) Ultra shakes are safe. I think they're the only thing that I'm sure is safe. (L) I think those and fish. (A***) Fish, maybe some brown rice, maybe some steamed vegetables. (L) And that's it. Anything else is deadly. (A***) I'm not even sure about bananas any more.
A: No
Q: (A***) No bananas. What about mint for me?
A: OK
Q: (A***) Lemon?
A: OK
Q: (A***) Phew! (laughter) (Joe) Bananas are evil for everybody! (L) NO! (Joe) They're from South America and were developed by Quetzalcoatl, who dropped down out of his spaceship and said, "Eat these!" (laughter) (Scottie) Bananas were invented by the Atlanteans! (Joe) Look at them! They're yellow and bendy! (P*****) I would like to ask a question about this dream Laura had about this treasure in a cave in the Pyrenees.
A: Wait for more on that. Not time yet.
Q: (L) Alright. Anything more about our group and our forum members? (pause – no new questions) (L) So we're gonna be pretty busy getting this organizational thing done. So, anything more for the group?
A: Once the external structure begins to take shape, real communities will form and chakra connection will be facilitated exponentially. Make haste but be gentle and wise. There is now more to be done so proceed with JOY. Goodbye.
END OF SESSION
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I'll post the Statement of Principles mentioned above, even in its unfinished state, in a separate thread for discussion.
