an issue that remains sin

[webglider]

Looking at the length of my post, I am now worried that what I have written is unimportant and externally inconsiderate as it is wasting people's time.

I didn't get that impression at all. Your post seems very sincere to me. There does seem to be a program running though - one that is compelling you to meet everyone's approval. If I'm correct, and I may not be, then this program will cause you to second guess yourself time and time again as there's no way you can ever know for sure what people will think because what others are thinking is as likely as not to be conditioned by their programs.

If you are not being externally considerate and are wasting people's time me someone will let you know. It may feel bad if that happens, but it's part of the process of identifying programs.

You don't have to be perfect to participate on this forum.

Wow. I went from confidence to confusion faster than I can say neurotic and am now fighting the desire to delete this before I post.
quote]

Well once it's posted, the way others react to it is out of your control. That is scary. Many of us have felt that way in the beginning - you're in good company. Consider that if everyone were too afraid to post, there would be no forum. Thank you for overcoming your hesitation and joining us - the more mirrors, the better.

 

[Mountain Crown]

Hi Gonzo,

I don’t feel you should be too nervous about rejection. Banning happens when the rules are severely breached or when the Moderators see pathological influences that endanger the safety of the purpose of the forum.

That’s not to say it’s always smooth sailing, there is the need to correct disinformation, to mirror programs, confront sacred cows, and such. It’s also true however, that there is much patience and respect shown during the process, because we’re all here to learn, and thereby grow.

Just for the record, I found your post apropos and worth reading.

 

[Buddy]

You don't have to be perfect to participate on this forum.

...there's no way you can ever know for sure what people will think because what others are thinking is as likely as not to be conditioned by their programs.

That is so true. Thanks for pointing that out webglider!

Fwiw, Gonzo, I thought this:

I was planning to suggest that one doesn't necessarily need to know what started a fire to put it out and that it was in his soul's best interest to "put the fire out" since acting on such impulses would violate a child's free will and be a predatory STS activity...

...was very well said, especially now that we have the EE program!

Just for the record, I found your post apropos and worth reading.

Agreed!

 

[go2]

I had been taught that paedophiles were predominantly heterosexuals.

Yes, it is a common blurring of definition that pedophiles are predominantly heterosexual. Pedophiles are sexual attracted to prepubescent children. This category has nothing to do with homosexual or heterosexual. If the attraction is acted upon, it is child sexual abuse and a crime.
Where were you taught that pedophiles are predominantly heterosexual? Whose agenda is served by blurring the definition of pedophilia?

I also felt compelled to inform others that it is common for a young gay male to engage in sex with a considerably older man, especially for the first few times the young man has sex. This happens for several reasons, including the difficulty in finding an available partner without outing oneself to a judgmental peer group, when there are several older men outside of the peer group showing interest. To a certain degree, this behaviour is common and accepted in gay culture, which is why gay communities protest legislative efforts to raise the legal age for consensual sex, especially when the gap between a younger person and an older person comes into play.

An adult who has sex with a person younger than the legal age of consent is a sexual predator by legal definition. Indeed, in my opinion, it is sexual predation to solicit or participate in sexual relations based on advantage of power, position, or experience.

 

[Biomiast]

I agree MC, well put. I initially read over this thread earlier, and didn't know what to make of it. Was he asking for help, he seemed like someone who legitimately had some type of problem and needs help, guidance, and a lot of work on himself in order to break the behaviour. But after what Laura posted, I read the thread more thoroughly into what some of the things he was saying, and it was as if he was refuting all the help he was given. And it seemed like it was a big joke to him after a certain point in the thread. I felt really ill at ease after reading this thread. I initially thought I detected guilt and real remorse from him too, but reading back, I wonder if that was just my imagination.

FWIW, at his first posts, I thought he might be wounded and confused. Refusing all the help offered was also a red flag for me, I noted it but thought there are people who are unable to accept that they are wrong, harmful to others etc. I think truth seeker hit the nail when she said:

Do not take the point you quoted above lightly. Engaging with minors is not only against the law, but also inflicts suffering upon others and those others are unfortunately not at a phase in their lives where they can process such a thing. Are you saying that this does not concern you?

What I'm finding most disturbing about your posts are that you don't seem to show concern for the feelings of the people we're talking about.

And insipido04's response was:

maybe it sounds horrible for many it was for me also .
but how about if they change the laws tomorrow and now your an adult at 16, or how about if i look 15 and have sex with an actual 15 yo boy???

At that point, I saw no point in engaging in a conversation, I know I am an impatient person, but that sentence caused me to get really angry. As if he completely ignored truth seeker's initial remarks about feeling concern for others and mentioned something else, justifying his behaviour. The way I am reading this is that he wouldn't mind having sex with a 15 year-old boy if it wouldn'tbe illegal, or am I misinterpreting the sentence?

So DanielS, I don't know if it is your imagination, but I initially felt that too. Or was it our imagination?

Just my two cents, fwiw.

 

[Cyre2067]

Woah. Scary.

First off, rolyateel I'm so sorry for your experiences, but am impressed you were able to overcome them and be with us here today. ::Big hug::

I gotta admit, I was impressed with the quality of everyone's responses, but after reading two or three of insipid's replies it was pretty clear he wasn't able to grok what was being said. Something as simple as suggesting he get professional help wasn't sinking in, and then he pulled out the suicide line, a lure I'm quite familiar with.

His responses also had a very odd, difficult to understand vibe. Sometimes it can be a language barrier, and that's one thing, but other times it's deliberate, as I think it was in this case per his reference to 'sarcasm'.

I'm glad Laura stepped in and shut it down.

 

[Nević Nenad]

Rolyateel, you are one brave soul


Reading the whole thread now, insipido looks like wolf in the sheep’s hide. Coming and saying "I am exactly like you, just a little bit different" and we say "OK, it’s no big deal, you will accommodate and we have wide perception of everything". And that starts troubles, accepting that "little bit" makes little shift in perception (or frequency) and than that bit becomes larger and larger and one day we all are pervert and consider that normal.

Just like it was with the whole planet.

I know that this is way simplified and that insipido really is not aware of it, but I think it could be like that.

 

[webglider]

I know that this is way simplified and that insipido really is not aware of it, but I think it could be like that.

How do you know that insipido really is not aware of it?

 

[bjorb]

-Hi inspido

[quote author=inspido]because nobody chooses their sexuality and may be im a pedophilic/phycopath or may be im not but this sensation is intencifing. you cant just wake up one day and say hey now im gonna have attraction for women"[/quote]

[quote author=inspido]but how about if they change the laws tomorrow and now your an adult at 16, or how about if i look 15 and have sex with an actual 15 yo boy??? is more than what it sounds evaluate this situation before anything[/quote]

[quote author=inspido]maybe as a psychopath i should kill myself not to hurt people i thought that already[/quote]

Even if they chance those laws or you are in way a genetic pedophile.

It doesn't chance the fact that if you engage in such activities it will inflict tremendous suffering upon others, for the rest of their lives!

- Understand this!

It seems to me like you are trying to convince yourself and even us that having sex with a minor is allright. That there is nothing wrong with that.

A lot of pedophiles who are caught confess that they didn't did anything wrong. They even go as far by proclaiming that the child in question wanted the sexual interaction. Some even tried to convince the child in which it is unable to understand to engage in such sexual activities.

It's nothing more than deluding yourself. Like said the fact of the matter stays. It's EVIL. It will cause tremendous suffering.



[quote author=inspido]no i couldn't harm anyone as i said i have no bizarre obcetion with that its just a feeling its just attraction.[/quote]

You already gave yourself away. Please read Ana post and see what you actually said. You really are contradicting yourself.

If you don’t control your mouth. Your mind will become just as weak.



[quote author=inspido]i need answers emotions hurt me for so long throughout my life until i learned how to get ride of them , though i lost such skill, but that's a different story[/quote]

You can only bring chance in yourself when you recognise your emotions and deal with them. What you are truly feeling.

Trying to get rid of them will only bring you further away from yourself. It's a path that will most likely will turn you in somekind of a psychopathic, even if you don't see it.


I really got the impression that you where sexual abused yourself when you where a child. Understand that Victims of this sometimes repeat those act to others. Even if they can't remember it.

You really need help. You say you don't have money for a psychiatrist. Maybe getting a job can resolve that. I don't know if it is possible in your country but if possible try to let social services know about your feelings and let them be able to help you!




- Hi everyone.

Maybe I am feeding the troll right now. I really have the impression that he tried to steer us in a discussion that pedophily is alright. That he is the victim and not those who are traumatised by it. But if there is this possibility that he has some conflict inside him regarding this issue.

Than I also try to give him advice.

This really left me disturbed.

 

[Nević Nenad]

I know that this is way simplified and that insipido really is not aware of it, but I think it could be like that.

How do you know that insipido really is not aware of it?

I thought that if he is aware that he can do that, in other words if he came consciously with some agenda, in example to change someone perception, he would make appearance and approach more cautiously and better prepared.

In that case his first job would be to convince us that he is the same, get some reputation, even read books that are recommended, and then do his job step by step.

On the other hand maybe he is really aware of it, just lacks some skills, discpline and intelligence.

This makes me wonder is there among us pathological persons who convinced even themselves that they are not (me included)

 

[abstract]

This makes me wonder is there among us pathological persons who convinced even themselves that they are not (me included)

If any of us, including me, is pathological then I think that it's a bit difficult to stay under wraps forever. We are all getting better all the time at figuring this stuff out, and we have a few

people here who are especially good at spotting it compared to myself, who's only just started learning how, not that it's always an easy thing to do.

A truly pathological person can't really help themselves, can they? If they truly are unable to control themselves then it's merely a matter of time before they get weeded out, but i could be way wrong.

 

[Turgon]

Maybe I am feeding the troll right now. I really have the impression that he tried to steer us in a discussion that pedophily is alright. That he is the victim and not those who are traumatised by it. But if there is this possibility that he has some conflict inside him regarding this issue.

Hi Bjorn, yeah he definitely was trying to steer for that. His initial post seemed to be a cry for help, but at the end of his first post he writes this

i want answers, i need to know why me, i see no side effect from any mental disorder, this was clearly meant to be but why its afecting me so much now

I'm not stressed, or sick or ill or drunk ,high[, or nothing, for those who asked.

no i dont have any kind of bizarre odd or dgusting dreams , fantasies of any sort when i think about it,

Well, he doesn't seem too concerned with the situation seeing as he is not stressed out, and whatever guilt he may have, is at least not manifesting itself through his subconscious or dreams..

i realized by having sex with people most of them older, that ANYthing that you like can be changed by will or external factors ironically i liked old men too on those days
now I'm "old" and nothing have disappeared just changed and even have become stronger. i like young boys and lately that feeling have increased i can control myself pretty well but nothing lasts for ever and that's where the question comes from

What does that mean? How does having sex with people older than you equate to changing anything he likes through will or external factors. I don't understand how the two compute.

have no feeling or emotional need while writting im pretty sure since ten years already

emotions hurt me for so long throughout my life until i learned how to get ride of them

If OP's are emotional reaction machines, and Souled individuals obviously have emotions, what does that mean? Is he truly finding a way to get rid of emotions, or is it a self-defense mechanism, or maybe his understanding of emotions is extremely limited.

having sex with a minor or older is not sinonim of suffering but it could become so like everything, like i said i didn't choose this, maybe in 5th lol but not this flesh.
10 years of self control have been a probe but its still there in fact there was an specific period when i felt completely asexual. but nothing lasts for eevveerr

In this last quote it seems like he's making a mockery of the situation. How seriously could this issue of his really be affecting him if the people offering help are more concerned than he is. Could it be that we actually saw a psychopath at work.

So DanielS, I don't know if it is your imagination, but I initially felt that too. Or was it our imagination?

I think our imagination led to wishful thinking. Hoping that this guy really was making an effort. That he really saw how abherrant his behaviour and thinking is, and truly wanted to make a change by interacting with the forum. People can redeem themselves, irregardless of what they have done, but they need to realize the ramifications of their actions, have real guilt and remorse inside them, and fueled by that make a truly consistent effort to change themselves (I speak from experience) I look back in my past, how I was as an individual, and it fuels me to change.

I've heard multiple accounts of people who've had near-death experiences who say their entire life flashes before their eyes. I often think about this, what will I see when I die, because at that point, I don't think you can lie to yourself anymore and truly have to face yourself and there's no justifications to protect you. Insipido, if your still reading this thread, how do you think your life will pass before your eyes when that time comes...

 

[knowledge_of_self]

rolyateel, your post was very moving and I just wanted to say thank you for posting it.

I gotta admit, I was impressed with the quality of everyone's responses, but after reading two or three of insipid's replies it was pretty clear he wasn't able to grok what was being said. Something as simple as suggesting he get professional help wasn't sinking in, and then he pulled out the suicide line, a lure I'm quite familiar with.

Yes, the second I read the suicide line I realized he was just feeding off everyone's responses. Or at least it really felt that way.

His responses also had a very odd, difficult to understand vibe. Sometimes it can be a language barrier, and that's one thing, but other times it's deliberate, as I think it was in this case per his reference to 'sarcasm'.

I agree!

I'm glad Laura stepped in and shut it down.

Absolutly! After the suicide line, I was just waiting for a mod to step in and put an end to his feeding.

 

[truth seeker]

I agree MC, well put. I initially read over this thread earlier, and didn't know what to make of it. Was he asking for help, he seemed like someone who legitimately had some type of problem and needs help, guidance, and a lot of work on himself in order to break the behaviour. But after what Laura posted, I read the thread more thoroughly into what some of the things he was saying, and it was as if he was refuting all the help he was given. And it seemed like it was a big joke to him after a certain point in the thread. I felt really ill at ease after reading this thread. I initially thought I detected guilt and real remorse from him too, but reading back, I wonder if that was just my imagination.

FWIW, at his first posts, I thought he might be wounded and confused. Refusing all the help offered was also a red flag for me, I noted it but thought there are people who are unable to accept that they are wrong, harmful to others etc.

This point, coupled with the chaos in the language is what had me confused at first. In addition, he never clearly stated what the question was. I found myself rereading the post several times and when it wasn't shut down I thought that either they were watching and waiting or a moderator hadn't seen the thread yet.

maybe it sounds horrible for many it was for me also .
but how about if they change the laws tomorrow and now your an adult at 16, or how about if i look 15 and have sex with an actual 15 yo boy???

At that point, I saw no point in engaging in a conversation, I know I am an impatient person, but that sentence caused me to get really angry. As if he completely ignored truth seeker's initial remarks about feeling concern for others and mentioned something else, justifying his behaviour. The way I am reading this is that he wouldn't mind having sex with a 15 year-old boy if it wouldn'tbe illegal, or am I misinterpreting the sentence?

So DanielS, I don't know if it is your imagination, but I initially felt that too. Or was it our imagination?

Just my two cents, fwiw.

I don't think that's your imagination at all. It was the last part of that sentence that stuck and still sticks in my mind. I got the clear impression that the only thing stopping him (if it is stopping him) was the law. I also thought for a moment that it may be actually going on and he was clever enough not to out himself - of course I may be completely off on this.

I think our imagination led to wishful thinking. Hoping that this guy really was making an effort. That he really saw how abherrant his behaviour and thinking is, and truly wanted to make a change by interacting with the forum. People can redeem themselves, irregardless of what they have done, but they need to realize the ramifications of their actions, have real guilt and remorse inside them, and fueled by that make a truly consistent effort to change themselves (I speak from experience) I look back in my past, how I was as an individual, and it fuels me to change.

This hit me last night. I think I was definitely engaged in some wishful thinking that he would somehow understand what was being said to him (this is where the chaotic playing with language came in). A part of me was finding it hard to believe I was speaking to someone capable of thinking this way. Part of me wanted to believe that it was just someone playing a practical joke.

This makes me wonder is there among us pathological persons who convinced even themselves that they are not (me included)

I think that what makes the difference is that "normal" people will question themselves. Even when faced with the disturbing things insipido was saying in this post, people were trying to understand the confusion and may have found ourselves questioning how to reply. This thread could have easily degenerated into anger which I think is what insipido wanted. I'll speak for myself and say that it was a practice in keeping calm in the face of chaos.

I feel I have to apologize to everyone for arrogantly suggesting that there was a lesson in this for us (members) what I really meant to say and should have was that it was and is a lesson for me as I have no right to determine the needs of others.

 

[abstract]

I feel I have to apologize to everyone for arrogantly suggesting that there was a lesson in this for us (members) what I really meant to say and should have was that it was and is a lesson for me as I have no right to determine the needs of others.

I don't know if I would count that as arrogant, friend. We are all here to learn and grow and one should never be insulted by the chance to do so.

I actually learned something from this thread, believe it or not! I think maybe next time I see a post I can't even understand halfway, I probably shouldn't mess with it...

I feel a tad responsible since I was the one who replied first, not only mistaking the gender of insipido, but also ASSUMING that this person was psychologically stable, when he clearly was not.

(I mean no offense to insipido, just stating my opinion) So I may do best to drop my assumptions altogether with new people.