an issue that remains sin

[Gonzo]

I'm pretty sure it's determined before you leave the womb. However, transgendered people may be a result of chemical interruption during the pregnancy. Although gender (simply put, the way we identify man and woman) and sex (a biological classification using chromosones, genitilia and other physical characteristics) are completely separate terms, our society tends to use them either synonymously or linked in absolute terms. I find it all quite fascinating. We are all initially female up to a certain stage until chromosomes that fertilized the egg start to play a role and gender either continues as female or switches to male.

In terms of sexuality and sexual preference, there seems to be quite a range of possibilities between heterosexual male and female. gay male and female, and an array of preference we call bisexual - it really is a wonderful rainbow.

It always amazes me how some people would normally be heterosexual but given a lack in the gender of their preference, have no problem engaging in homosexual relationships. Homosexual behaviour in prisons comes to mind. Perhaps these individuals were always bisexual, but social conditioning limits their attraction. So there seems to be s distinct difference between homosexuality and homosexual behaviour.

Gonzo

 

[webglider]

This makes me wonder is there among us pathological persons who convinced even themselves that they are not (me included)

I don't get the impression that you are a psychopath, Avala although you may have destructive programs that at some point you begin to listen to and neutralize if you haven't begun to already.

What I'm learning here is that there are parts of virtually everyone living today that are seriously out of alignment in some way. I can speak only for myself, but I think I spent a lot of time on the forum monitoring myself so that the parts that I disown wouldn't be shown to anyone else.

The best thing that happened on the forum was when, under a time of great stress, when the buffers broke down those aspects of my false personality started coming out for everyone to see. In other words, the mask came off. Of course everyone addressed what they saw, and it was devastating..

However, something is happening. I have started listening to the programs without identifying with them. This didn't happen all at once. There was a great deal of shame until I realized that everyone was really trying to help me see what they saw: I wasn't rejected or banned.

I was mirrored.

I've come to realize that there is a is a core in me that is authentic and can grow, but there are many destructive programs that have been poisoning my life and I'm beginning to learn how to listen to them and at the same time choose not to act on them. It's amazing how they go on and on in my head, and how awful they are. As I listen to them, I go back to specific points in my life, and I am beginning to understand what exactly made me make the choices I did. It's a pretty agonizing process, very emotional - lots of tears, but there is the promise of liberation and that keeps me going. Maybe I won't be keep repeating the same patterns over and over again, and instead create a harmonious and productive life for myself.

Remember also the list that Cumulus presented that gives specific characteristics to look for in psychopaths. Insipido04's posts had a very different "taste" to them than those of anyone else on this thread.

word salad - confused sentence structure, random punctuation, random typography (lines ending here, there, everywhere). This isn't the same as the grammatical errors we make when we are writing in a different language. It's very confusing and it's intended to be.

sarcastic screen name - there is nothing insipid about a predatory pedophile.

self-contradicting - In this case, it went: "I'm a pedophile, I don't want to be, I'm fated to be, accept me, you're defective in compassion if you can't accept me, I want to change, help me change'.

pity ploy - Martha Stout has talked about this one. Feel sorry for me because I'm a monster. (or, "help me help me I think I'm a monster please tell me I'm not")

arrogance - I don't really know how to describe this one. It's a kind of 'preening' feeling you get about the poster, as though all the time they're acting out they have one eye on themselves in a mirror somewhere. A quality of falseness but also of conceit. It's hard to capture it in words, but it does somehow come through underneath the words they post.

This is from my own experience, so I can't cite references as much as I would like, but I can say that Martha Stout captures much of this in "The Sociopath Next Door", and Hare and Babiak capture some in "Snakes in Suits".

I feel I have to apologize to everyone for arrogantly suggesting that there was a lesson in this for us (members) what I really meant to say and should have was that it was and is a lesson for me as I have no right to determine the needs of others.

I'm so glad you did, or I might not have consciously thought to look for a message. So for me the message is to first objectively identify a situation and trust that I see what I see. I second guess myself, and I think a lot of people responding to Insipido04's posts saw what Laura saw but didn't want to see what they saw and got sucked in.

What struck me about her response was that there was firmness, not anger, in it, . And she did give him some benefit of the doubt while protecting the integrity of the forum.

You may download and continue to practice the EE breathing and meditation program, but unless and until you achieve significant results (see a therapist), there is no reason for you to be taking the time of the forum members here.

So, truth-seeker, because you did suggest looking for a lesson in the experience, I was able to evaluate a situation today and see it for what it is, and get out of it. I also didn't become angry which is one of my poison programs; I just extricated myself from the situation.

Again, thank you for asking that question.

Don't the Cs say "All is lessons?"

 

[anart]

I had been taught that paedophiles were predominantly heterosexuals.

Yes, it is a common blurring of definition that pedophiles are predominantly heterosexual.

Go2, I think it would be helpful if you could help track down some data on that. You state that it is a 'blurring of definition that pedophiles are predominately heterosexual', so could you provide some research data that reflects the truth of that statement? I ask because it's my understanding that this is not at all a blurring of data, and that the majority of pedophiles are adult heterosexual males. So, I'd really appreciate having that cleared up with some data if any is available, since if I've been misinformed, I'd like to know.

 

[Nienna]

Gonzo, the last part of your post got me thinking about homosexuality a bit.

What is up with this whole "people choose to be gay" stuff? I honestly cannot believe that a homosexual consciously chooses to be that way. Makes no sense whatsoever.

Now I could be wrong, but isn't your sexual orientation like, hardwired into your brain from birth? Or how does that work?

I know that I am not Gonzo, and that there are other people here who know more about this than I do, but I wanted to tell you about a friend I had while I lived in a different stated.

I met here while I was in Tae Kwon Do. I had just moved to another location and started classes there. We became good friends, although we really never visited each other except while at classes. Her brother also took the same class. He told me that she was a lesbian, which really didn't matter to me as she was my friend and a good person, and that's all that matters to me. But he also told me that she wasn't always a lesbian. She had dated men all of her life until she started dating policemen. She went from one abusive relationship to another - all with policemen. She got beat up so badly so many times that she just stopped having relationships with men and turned to women.

As I left that area, the last class I took there I was told by her and her brother that she had a date with a man - and it was a policeman. I looked at her brother and he nodded and I told her that that was not the best idea in my mind. And her brother agreed with me. But she was determined to give it a go.

I don't know how it turned out as I had moved fairly far away and didn't have any contact with her again. But I really hope all has gone well for her. She was a very good-looking, energetic and kind person.

I don't know if this happens often, but just wanted to put it out there.

fwiw

 

[dannybananny]

What is up with this whole "people choose to be gay" stuff? I honestly cannot believe that a homosexual consciously chooses to be that way. Makes no sense whatsoever.

Now I could be wrong, but isn't your sexual orientation like, hardwired into your brain from birth? Or how does that work?

I remember that Ra said that gays were women in most of their previous lives so because of that they are attracted by men, and it's the same with females who were in their past lives mostly males. I think it is also mentioned that it's a consequence of industrialization. But I think it also depends on negative personal experiences that may influence sexual orientation, and Nienna Eluch gave good example of that.

She went from one abusive relationship to another - all with policemen.

This kind of stories happen often, people become addicted to pain and suffering and they are afraid to take a change or stand, or they don't won't to hurt another person while that person is hurting them, they think they deserved it. Knowledge is really precious in these kind of situations!

 

[Cumulus]

still shy but feeling encouraged. I'm glad I could help. MC, Oxajil, Pete02 - thank you for the reassurance, it helps a lot.

I'm amazed at how the thread has developed, the insight and sharing that is happening in spite of initial pain or fear, mutual teaching and learning from what could have been a very destructive experience. I'm learning from every post but I am getting an incredible message from the whole thread.

This is what it looks like when people really commit to build something together. This is community.

I know, this has happened here many times. It feels different though to be here at the exact time when it is happening, even to add a little piece to it. It's a true gift.

Good wishes to everyone.

 

[go2]

I had been taught that paedophiles were predominantly heterosexuals.

Yes, it is a common blurring of definition that pedophiles are predominantly heterosexual.

Go2, I think it would be helpful if you could help track down some data on that. You state that it is a 'blurring of definition that pedophiles are predominately heterosexual', so could you provide some research data that reflects the truth of that statement? I ask because it's my understanding that this is not at all a blurring of data, and that the majority of pedophiles are adult heterosexual males. So, I'd really appreciate having that cleared up with some data if any is available, since if I've been misinformed, I'd like to know.

Hi Anart, The point I tried to make is that pedophilia is not an issue of homosexual or heterosexual orientation, but a pathological sexual preference for children.
However, if you like, we can agree that majority of pedophiles are adult heterosexual males as adult heterosexual males are 96% to 98% of the male population.
The incidence of homosexual pedophilia is 9% to 40%, but it could be that heterosexual adult male pedophiles are attracted to homosexual pedophilia.

Pedophiles are usually attracted to a particular age range and/or sex of child. Research categorizes male pedophiles by whether they are attracted to only male children (homosexual pedophilia), female children (heterosexual pedophilia), or children from both sexes (bisexual pedophilia).3,6,10,29 The percentage of homosexual pedophiles ranges from 9% to 40%, which is approximately 4 to 20 times higher than the rate of adult men attracted to other adult men (using a prevalence rate of adult homosexuality of 2%-4%).5,7,10,19,29,30 This finding does not imply that homosexuals are more likely to molest children, just that a larger percentage of pedophiles are homosexual or bisexual in orientation to children.19

Individuals attracted to females usually prefer children between the ages of 8 and 10 years.3,5,31 Individuals attracted to males usually prefer slightly older boys between the ages of 10 and 13 years.3,5 Heterosexual pedophiles, in self-report studies, have on average abused 5.2 children and committed an average of 34 sexual acts vs homosexual pedophiles who have on average abused 10.7 children and committed an average of 52 acts.15 Bisexual offenders have on average abused 27.3 children and committed more than 120 acts.15

A study by Abel et al32 of 377 nonincarcerated, non-incest-related pedophiles, whose legal situations had been resolved and who were surveyed using an anonymous self-report questionnaire, found that heterosexual pedophiles on average reported abusing 19.8 children and committing 23.2 acts, whereas homosexual pedophiles had abused 150.2 children and committed 281.7 acts. These studies confirm law enforcement reports about the serial nature of the crime, the large number of children abused by each pedophile, and the underreporting of assaults.1 Studies that used self-reports and polygraphs show that pedophiles currently in treatment underreport their current interest in children and past behaviors.33,34

Edit: I would like to note that I said "blurring of definition", not "blurring of data". FWIW

Edit: The following excerpt from http://www.childmolestationprevention.org/pdfs/study.pdf is relevant and confirms Anart's recollection that the majority of pedophiles are adult heterosexuals males. Homosexual pedophiles commit 8 percent of male child molestation and are 2 to 4 percent of the adult male population, indicating they molest boys at a higher frequency than heterosexual adult male pedophiles. Most of the literature and research on this subject is biased by a religious agenda or a gay community agenda. The two sources I have copied appear to have a scientific orientation and most of all, a concern for children. Pedophilia is a threat to our children and the question of the sexual orientation of the perpetrators seems to me, a distraction from the serious threat of pedophilia to our children.

Final estimated numbers: 2,231,372 sexually abused girls and 1,004, 117 sexual abused boys.
[..]
Final estimated numbers: 27,160,752 adult females and 12, 222,388 adult males are survivors of childhood sex abuse.
[...]
The 1,038 men who molested boys reported a range of adult sexual preferences. Contrary to popular belief, only 8 percent reported that they were exclusively homosexual in their adult preferences. the majority of the men who molested boys (51 percent) described themselves as exclusively heterosexual in their adult partner preferences. An additional 19 percent reported they were predominately heterosexual, while yet another 9 percent said they were equally heterosexual and homosexual in their adult sex life.
[..]
Second, and clearly the most startling finding, is that those who meet the medical criteria of pedophilia, molest 88 percent of the victims and commit 95 percent of child molestations. It is clear, that in order to reduce the number of children molested, we must identify the pedophile and implement treatment for the pedophile as rapidly as possible.

 

[abstract]

I remember that Ra said that gays were women in most of their previous lives so because of that they are attracted by men, and it's the same with females who were in their past lives mostly males. I think it is also mentioned that it's a consequence of industrialization. But I think it also depends on negative personal experiences that may influence sexual orientation, and Nienna Eluch gave good example of that.

So the causes can be numerous, and there is no singular reason, objectively speaking, that makes someone a homosexual, i guess.

What I was pointing out at first was that it is often taught by "christians" that being gay is a choice, like deciding what you are going to have for breakfast...they obviously don't study PSYCHOLOGY!! Because your brain is satan, right kids? (Yeah, I know, psychology isn't the only field applicable here, i know, cut me some slack :P)

 

[turtlemayhem]

sexual interest in kids is never ok........to their parents and freinds anyway. YUO have to fight it you have to fight the temptation andbe a MAN or a women:)

 

[turtlemayhem]

something like this happned to me, Growing up I always knew I was a straight male, but somehow someday i stopped becoming aroused by women and my eyes would lay heavy on fotos of men and rl men, untill the point of in my mind "OMG im actually turning gay i feel feminen"! powerless, this went on for ages, I kinda stopped going out too coz i was scared I was. and didnt want to be. because im a man and dont see it as normal for men to sleep together. eventually I figured out just to fight it and pull my eyes away from it and when the feelings kicked in, and hey presto the sick intrusive thoughts were gone. theres a certain amount of conscious activity involved too, A certaaain amount of "choice" and whether u see fit to fight it or not.

 

[turtlemayhem]

and after all making someone realize they are wrong is one of the hardest things of allm so of course gay people are like "we cant help it" when truely i think they can, they just dont have the will and strength to fight it, which gives birth to the thought that men are better than women (in a males mind") as they are weak and "helpless". hope this doesnt offend anyone (meh)

 

[turtlemayhem]

also i believe homosexuality is a sick thought in a mans mind who previously had huge amounts of sexual drive on females that they eventually become consumed into thinking they are themselves female in mind.females being this this thing that gives them so much pleasure in life. and wanting to act sick sexual stuff on men whilst thinking they are experiencing female sexual drive. best way to cure that is to reverse it step by step in your mind. thankyou, i now feel ashamed of myself

 

[Tigersoap]

Hi Turtlemayhem,

May I suggest you to try the Eiriu Eolas meditation and breathing program ?

Is it me or Turtlemayhem has some inspido04 flavor as well ??

 

[shijing]

Hi turtlemayhem

also i believe homosexuality is a sick thought in a mans mind who previously had huge amounts of sexual drive on females that they eventually become consumed into thinking they are themselves female in mind.females being this this thing that gives them so much pleasure in life. and wanting to act sick sexual stuff on men whilst thinking they are experiencing female sexual drive. best way to cure that is to reverse it step by step in your mind. thankyou, i now feel ashamed of myself

Belief may or may not match up with reality. I don't know of any reason to believe that the majority of gay people are gay for any other reason than they were actually born that way. I know that it is common to say otherwise, especially in mainstream religious circles, but the ideas that there is (1) anything wrong with being gay and (2) that gay people have chosen to be so because there is something wrong with them is both unfounded and insulting to those who are gay. The good news is, if you do feel natural attraction towards members of the opposite sex, you don't need to feel ashamed of yourself (one more thing that is wrongly foisted upon people under the mistaken premise that homosexuality is a form of deviancy).

More generally, I think you need to calm down and do more reading of the forum before posting -- please accept Tigersoap's invitation on the other thread on which you posted this morning to introduce yourself in the Newbies section:

http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?board=39.0

and then get started on reading all the material here. It would probably also be a good idea for you to consider taking a look at the Eiriu-Eolas breathing program that he suggested and that we encourage here:

http://paleochristianity.org/eiriu-eolas/

Added:

Is it me or Turtlemayhem has some inspido04 flavor as well ??

Yes Tigersoap, turtlemayhem has some energy about him that he needs to bring under control if he's going to participate here IMO.

 

[Al Today]

This is the world wide web... They come and they go...