Asking For Advice Or Words Of Solace Please...

[Charles]

She & I have almost opposite personalities; she's endowed with more practical common & business sense while I tend to be absent-minded & terrible with money.

I recognize that. In general, women are way more down to earth. And I know that there is still something to learn there for me.

We have a 6-yr-old boy, & just had a 7-month-old girl.

We have a 7 year old girl and a five year old boy. I am 43, she's 36.

I guess I can't expect someone who swears they love me to be honest & faithful, can I?

Well, you can expect it, but you can never be 100% sure? To be honest and faithful is something you alone can give. It can not be demanded, because otherwise it will not be authentic. Likewise, to betray a relationship is something you do to yourself, mostly. The question is more whether she will be able to forgive herself, or just rationalize it away.

I also had a very hard time around September. But the matter was entirely different. At times, my partner had moments that are often described as "mood swings", but which are usually a euphemism for "ravening mad, like being possessed by the devil himself". I came to a moment when I realized, that I was not going to sweat this out for the rest of my life anymore. This decision was the outcome of an extremely difficult and painful process with grief and anger, and self-doubt and what have you not. But the frequency of those insane episodes was on the rise. And while before there was repentance afterwards, now there was only amnesia of what had transpired the evening before or a week before.

And so, for the sake of the children, and although it is known that it hurts them a lot when parents divorce, there comes a time when the balance falls the other way.

I detached emotionally. Looking back at this time from where I am now, I have learned how dangerous this attitude can be. It could have been a seriously complicating factor, for I did not know, how fast, and deeply I could fall in love with somebody else once this window was opened. Nothing happened, luckily.
Because, you see, by the end of September, and after two years of trying to convince my partner, I finally succeeded to get her to really stop taking the contraceptive pill, also thanks to her sister, who stopped taking it years ago. Just type the key words on any search engine (“mood swing” and “contraceptive”) and you’ll be shocked at the sort of testimonials you can find. It turned out that she was taking a hormone where two hydrogen atoms are replaced with FLUORINE atoms.

After she stopped taking it she lost her libido entirely for two months full. However, the moments of loss of self control (possession?), were decreasing in frequency and intensity. And than one day, it was like I had my girlfriend back. I saw it. I walked up to her, and asked her what had happened? She shrugged, but knew something had happened and gleamed because of it. I had my girlfriend back.

She can still have mood swings, hey, I can be moody too. But since that day those moments of sheer insanity have been completely absent.

I hope you don’t mind that I have used this thread as an opportunity to get this little titbit (little?) about contraceptives out. It is also just to show how the future is open, and although ours had a happy ending (like temporarily, or snapshot along the time axis), I know full well how devastating these things can be, especially when very young children are involved.

Empathising with your case, and from the little I can distil, I can imagine how such emotional shock makes your thinking sort of get stuck in a loop. Can we say … transmarginal inhibition ? Smoking does help.

After reading this thread and your brief account, I noticed that I heard a sonic Youth song playing between my ears again and again. So I looked it up :
_http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4gi59alEYQ&feature=related
I will give you the lyrics. I guess there are many interpretations and you can read some very interesting ones over here: _http://www.songmeanings.net/lyric.php?lid=3530822107858480836. Just see what you can do with it yourself as we really lack details of your situation. All I hope for is that it will somehow help you in breaking the thinking loop(s).

time takes it's crazy toll
and how does your mirror grow
you better watch yourself when you jump into it,
cuz the mirror's gonna steal your soul
i wonder how it came to be my friend
that someone just like you has come again
never, never know how close you came
until you fall in love with the diamond ring
you throw all his trash away
look out he's here to stay
your mirrors gonna crack when he breaks into it
and you'll never, never be the same
look into his eyes and you can see
why all the little kids are dressed in dreams
i wonder how he's gonna make it back
when he sees that you just know it's make believe
blood crystalized to sand
and now i hope you understand
you reflect into his looking glass soul
and now the mirror is your only friend
look into his eyes and you will see
that men are not alone on the diamond sea
sail into the heart of the lonely storm
and tell her that you'll love her eternally
time takes its crazy toll
mirror fallin' off the wall
you better look out for the looking glass girl
'cause she's gonna take you for a fall
look into his eyes and you shall see
why everything is quiet and nothing's free
I wonder how he's gonna make her smile
when love is running wild on the diamond sea

One more thing. If I would be in your case, I would most definitely NOT take any antidepressants. My personal opinion (not 100% sure but still an educated one) is that these “things” seem to restore the “outer shine” but in the mean time eat your soul from within. You do not sound like a depressed person. Depression is a totally different state than sadness or anger. And like Miss Isness has said already, it is normal (healthy even) that you will go through periods of grief and anger, and restoration. Try to stay as sound and honest with “who you are?” as possible through these processes, and you will learn a lot from it. But I guesstimate that by now you are mostly shocked, still.

 

[ScioAgapeOmnis]

I recognize that. In general, women are way more down to earth.

Do you have any data to support this generalization?

Well, you can expect it, but you can never be 100% sure?

I think its wiser not to just outright expect it, since "expectation" can be nothing more than wishful thinking. But instead to try to Know the person so that you can assess the probability of it being true or false more correctly. You can never be 100% sure but the more you know the other person (and yourself) the better you know how true or false it is likely to be, osit.

Likewise, to betray a relationship is something you do to yourself, mostly.

Could you please elaborate on that? Are you saying that Ominous "betrayed" the relationship?

 

[Charles]

I recognize that. In general, women are way more down to earth.

Do you have any data to support this generalization?.

If this would have been a generalization than I would have written that "all women are more down to earth." So no, all I am seeing is a certain bias.

And the data for the statement I did make : Personal observation of mother, father, family, myself, partner, friends, colleagues. And maybe also the fact that in many different cultures (Africa, China, Japan) women take care of the money side of the household, and the hands on dealing with the direct and immediate challenges of life, food on the table, and these sort of things.

Likewise, to betray a relationship is something you do to yourself, mostly.

Could you please elaborate on that? Are you saying that Ominous "betrayed" the relationship?

No not at all, SAO! It has nothing to do with Ominous. For all we know is that the partner of Ominous has betrayed the relation, and we can only guess to what extent she has betrayed the relationship.

The point I am trying to get out is that in the end, she is doing it to herself! I have been there, done that myself in a previous relationship. No way I will make that same mistake. This is not only because I have hurt my partner back then doing what I did. I also realized, in retrospect, that I did it to myself: besides the feelings of guilt, because I did what I did, there was this sudden wall between me and my partner. She didn't feel it (just yet) because I had decided to be quiet (lie?) about it. So who was the first victim of what I did? It was me myself and I of what "i" did. Several months later, there was a moment when everything was there to have a deep communication with my partner (back then). But this wall was still there, and it was something of my own making! To purify the relationship, and get this superficiality out I decided to tell her about it, although I knew that it was going to hurt her and yes ...

It did not break the relation, but it could have stained it in an irrecoverable way.

What I am trying to get across is something related to personal responsibility. You alone can decide whether to be trustworthy and sincere towards your partner (and have a deep relation from the heart), or to not be trustworthy (and have a very superficial relationship). It is your responsibility (between you and spirit so to say) if you chose to live that way. The moment somebody else demands you to be trustworhty, the authenticity of such "decision" is ... gone.

You see where I am coming from?

 

[anart]

I recognize that. In general, women are way more down to earth.

Do you have any data to support this generalization?.

If this would have been a generalization than I would have written that "all women are more down to earth." So no, all I am seeing is a certain bias.

This is a bit of legalistic nitpicking on your part, Charles. It seems you've identified a bit with Ominous' situation and emotionally projected your own experiences/understandings and expectations onto his situation. This is certainly not unusual, but it might be wise to see it for what it is.

And the data for the statement I did make : Personal observation of mother, father, family, myself, partner, friends, colleagues. And maybe also the fact that in many different cultures (Africa, China, Japan) women take care of the money side of the household, and the hands on dealing with the direct and immediate challenges of life, food on the table, and these sort of things.

So, it is your subjective interpretation - which is fine if stated as such. Seems you're rather jumping through hoops to explain here (which indicates that you don't see what is really going on).

No not at all, SAO! It has nothing to do with Ominous. For all we know is that the partner of Ominous has betrayed the relation, and we can only guess to what extent she has betrayed the relationship.

The point I am trying to get out is that in the end, she is doing it to herself! I have been there, done that myself in a previous relationship.

You see where I am coming from?

Yes, it seems clear that you are interpreting Ominous' situation as if it were your own - you are projecting your own experiences (and subjective understanding) and feelings onto him/his situation. Again, this is not unusual, but it is wise to see it for what it is and understand that his situation may not be similar to your situation at all (or it might) - and - that , either way, your comments are really only about Charles and his situation(s).

 

[rrraven]

Hi Ominous,
I agree that anti-depressants may not be a good idea ,but having said that ,there is a "chemical"that might help.
When I get depressed I take "Bach Flower Rescue Remedy" see-http://www.bachflower.com/ available from Health food shops or mail order.I find the effect so instant my sceptic-program often says to me :How can something so simple have such a big effect ,you mustn't have felt that bad in the first place.
there are also Australian Bush Flower Remedies but I think they dont get exported,with them I found the
Adolesence essence invalueable in raising teenagers(there is even one to stop swearing-Mountain devil)
As in going to see a "good" doctor the C's said in session 980314 :It is true that one is wise not to trust bold proclamations from your "mainstream'medical system,as these are motivated by intense STS energy. Also,they have proven to be wrong far more often than right. It is perhaps wise for one to reserve visits and consultations with the above mentioned "establishment" to the instances of physical trauma,and life threatening emergencies,as this is the "place' for said entities. Chronic conditions and wellness,prevention,etc.,these are the realm of the homeopath and Naturopaths,all paths inspired by 4th density STO
It always amaises me how parallel my life path is with other members of this forum,even when I dont ask any
questions someone out there is going throug the same/similar thing and has asked them already.
I have just come out of a 13 year "wishful-thinking"relationship but managed a peaceful break up ,we are still
friends and I left our 9 year old son with his father because I feel he is at an age where he needs the male
influence and companion ship more than being with mum.
In my village peaceful break-ups are common(the peacefull part not the break-ups)where both parents do still
live on the same property or still in the village,the children don't seem to suffer ,only the poor schoolbus driver
gets gray hair from trying to remember which kid on which weekday gets droped off at which parent,so maybe
you and your partner can agree on a parenting plan that causes the least grief for all concerned,most of all the kids who did not choose any of this.
after thought maybe they did? as in preview of life from 5 D session 990703 :you saw a preview and you volunteered
and depression IS a stepping stone so maybe all that medication,homeopathic or pharmaceutical,is a shortcut
that sends you right back to sleep
anyway
hope it helps RRR

 

[Ruth]

It depends on the severity, but if it's really driving you nuts then I'd recommend finding a good psychotherapist and making sure you're getting enough sleep. Also avoid antidepressants.
* * *
Whatever doesn't kill you, makes you stronger.

I agree with that. Also, think about how you can channel anger creatively. As a person who has 'issues' with anger, I think what I see is a possible link between anger and depression. It's almost as if depression is the mirror image of anger that is unable to be expressed... and turns inwards to become depression.

Sometimes simply doing something about a situation or honestly reviewing your own reactions and reasons for "things done" is enough to transform or relieve it. But, it is a real challenge, you can be sure of that! Many times I've felt I've just been beating my head against a brick wall. Probably because I can be quite stubborn.

 

[Tigersoap]

I agree with that. Also, think about how you can channel anger creatively. As a person who has 'issues' with anger, I think what I see is a possible link between anger and depression. It's almost as if depression is the mirror image of anger that is unable to be expressed... and turns inwards to become depression.

For what it is worth, I do think the same. Maybe not all depressions are anger turned inwards but I saw the same dynamic played in me.
I realized lately that my current depressed mood was due to the fact that I was "punishing" myself through the negative introject voice.
Strangely enough, once I said to myself and "felt" that I had no reason to feel angry at myself/depressed I felt way better. I hope It's not wishful thinking on my part though.

 

[Charles]

Referring back to Anart’s analysis of my post
http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=8159.msg58407#msg58407

I can not fully agree with your conclusions Anart.
About the legalistic nitpicking I can partly agree, and also about me going through a lot of hoops to support the bias I am seeing between men and women. But what really confuses me is that you have used each of your statements to somehow find support in Charles projecting his own experiences unto the situation of Ominous. Maybe, this is due to quoting things out of context? If doing so myself, I’d probably come to the same conclusion(s) as you did.

This culminated in :

Yes, it seems clear that you are interpreting Ominous' situation as if it were your own - you are projecting your own experiences (and subjective understanding) and feelings onto him/his situation.

It seems clear ? that I am projecting?
Again this “conclusion” really eluded me, until I realized that maybe you did not read my previous post.

Again, this is not unusual, but it is wise to see it for what it is and understand that his situation may not be similar to your situation at all (or it might) - and - that , either way, your comments are really only about Charles and his situation(s).

Yes of course, and you will see that I emphasized this twice.

So okay, let's get to the stuff.
In my previous post, addressed to Ominous, you will be able to read :

“I also had a very hard time around September. But the matter was entirely different.”

But the matter was entirely different. How could such result to a conclusion that I am projecting? It was the opening sentence in a description of what happened to me. That’s all. And I know that it is entirely different and I even stated it.

So, why than did I do it? I used it as an intro to touch the problem of unbridled and widespread use of contraceptives (the pill), none of them being the natural hormone (they wouldn’t work at the doses used) and all of them chemically derivatized with fluor atoms, or cyclopropane, or ethyn groups. I can assure you that since my partner stopped taking them, the difference is like day and night. And such relief it turns out to be for both of us.

I ended my personal experience with :

I hope you don’t mind that I have used this thread as an opportunity to get this little titbit (little?) about contraceptives out.”

Again I am reminding any reader, but Ominous in particular, that what I had just shared was unrelated. This was followed with:

“It is also just to show how the future is open, and although ours had a happy ending (like temporarily, or snapshot along the time axis), I know full well how devastating these things can be, especially when very young children are involved.”

Here I do relate to something that can or could be used by Ominous: some hope (future is open) and warmth (I feel you, I recognize it, but I don’t pity you, because than I would pity myself).
I continue with :

“Empathizing with your case, and from the little I can distil, I can imagine how such emotional shock makes your thinking sort of get stuck in a loop.”

Here and for the first time I am trying to place myself in his situation. But I try to do it without projecting and I immediately add that there is not much I can distil from what he has shared. And that I can imagine (from many accounts in my life) how such can make your thinking machinery stuck. I could have added that for a process like self-pity to continue, it often is the formatory mind that is the only one functional, and that keeps your thinking machinery stuck. To further clarify I added:

“Can we say … transmarginal inhibition ? Smoking does help.”

And then I continued with the lyrics of a Sonic Youth song, of which I could only hope that it could help to break the loop of the thinking processes.

So far my previous post.

You also quoted from my last post from which you also concluded that I was projecting my situation(s) unto this of Ominous. Again this is something that eludes me, because it was meant as a clarification to SAO. And while trying to explain why I stated in my previous post :

“Likewise, to betray a relationship is something you do to yourself, mostly.”

, yes indeed, I did go back to a personal experience of a far away past. Because it was there that I came to realize that there is a universal truth in it.
What is wrong with this, but above all … where is the projection?

I know that sometimes there could be a lack of external consideration on my part when trying to explain things. It is not the first time that I do not take enough time, or skip steps that could help to follow the reasoning process. Just tell me, because I know that I often skirt over things, assuming that people will understand what I am trying to communicate.

And if you did not read my previous post, or if you feel in retrospect that you must have missed things for such and such reasons, just tell me as well.

Maybe I should have started a separate thread to share my (our) experience of using hormonal contraceptives. I planned to do this anyway but decided to first do further research and get more data.

Thanks.

 

[anart]

Hi Charles, yes, of course I read your previous post. I wasn't quoting anything out of context - at least not the context in which I interpreted what you were writing, which, of course, could be mistaken. Your comparisons of children's age and partner age was the first tip off that you were seeing yourself in Ominous' situation - instead of trying to see his situation for what it is and helping him. From there, it rather took on a life of its own.

As I said earlier, this is very common, as the most common way human beings relate to one another is by noticing and 'identifying' with similarities - however, this often masks and distracts from the truth of any situation/person.

The strength of your response indicates that there is quite a bit of energy going into disproving my take on it - that is interesting in itself.

I'm not criticizing you, Charles - just pointing out that in a thread where Ominous is sincerely asking for help, you turned it into a thread about you and what you are interested in. I would imagine that you did this because you think your experience is so similar to his that it would help him - that you are seeing yourself in his situation (projecting) - however, it could just be that you are more interested in what you want to say - whether it relates directly to helping Ominous or not.

Again, it is not an unusual thing - just pointing out what appears to be going on - and, as always, I could be mistaken.

 

[ScioAgapeOmnis]

But the matter was entirely different. How could such result to a conclusion that I am projecting?

I can't speak for Anart, but my understanding is that even if we consciously state that it is different, we can mechanically project anyway. One clue is perhaps in why you brought your situation up in the first place. Probably because you thought (whether consciously or not) that there were some similarities between those 2 situations - and therefore not truly "entirely different"?

I hope you don’t mind that I have used this thread as an opportunity to get this little titbit (little?) about contraceptives out.”

Actually, if that was all there was, then I think that's pretty rude and strange to just hijack this thread for a totally unrelated selfish purpose, especially considering the sensitive context of this thread. But again, I don't think that this is true even if you're now consciously using this as an argument to prove why there was no projection. Projection is something that happens unconsciously, so you cannot use "conscious intentions" as evidence that there was no unconscious processes happening.

Again I am reminding any reader, but Ominous in particular, that what I had just shared was unrelated.

Your story was about your issue with a loved one, this is what Ominous is going through. The details may be different but your mind didn't come up with this story absolutely randomly. You didn't tell a story about an awesome trip to the beach in Hawaii.

One clue to your identification, which is what probably led to the projection is when you said, "We have a 7 year old girl and a five year old boy. I am 43, she's 36."

What is the significance of stating the above?

Another clue is when you said, "It has nothing to do with Ominous."

How do you know it has nothing to do with Ominous in his situation?

Another clue is when you said, "The point I am trying to get out is that in the end, she is doing it to herself! I have been there, done that myself in a previous relationship."

How do you know that "she is doing it to herself" - this is what happened in your situation maybe, but what makes you think this also applies to Ominous' situation?

“It is also just to show how the future is open, and although ours had a happy ending (like temporarily, or snapshot along the time axis), I know full well how devastating these things can be, especially when very young children are involved.”

Again, a clue that you don't really think the situations are different because you grouped them togetherby saying "these things". Whether you consciously admit it or not, it seems you feel there is much similar about those situations.

yes indeed, I did go back to a personal experience of a far away past. Because it was there that I came to realize that there is a universal truth in it.
What is wrong with this, but above all … where is the projection?

But you said that "she" betrayed the relationship, not Ominous? If you do it to yourself, then doesn't that mean Ominous did it to himself? Could you please clarify cuz it sounds like a contradiction to me.

I think the first clue that you you're doing one thing consciously but another unconsciously is that you're clearly seeing similarities in your situations and drawing parallels and all that, but consciously denying that you're doing this and saying this is just unrelated situation you simply wanted to talk about. And other clues exists in the fact that you seem to be making statements without enough supporting data about Ominous's situation, which suggests that you're (unconsciously) getting the data from your situation(s) due to your emotional identification with what Ominous is going through.

I may be wrong, but this is what I'm seeing at the moment, and I think possibly why Anart said it as well.

Edit: Anart posted while I was writing this post, but it looks like she saw similar things going on, fwiw.

 

[Charles]

First of all, thank you both Anart and SAO for taking the time to further elaborate on what you were seeing.

I want to keep it as short as possible. I felt already a little embarrassed with my first post because I did realize that what I wrote could be seen as a form of high jacking of a thread that was meant to bring some clarity and solace for Ominous. Sorry Ominous. And from there it just got worse to the point that I even hesitated to post my last one wherein I explain why I disagree on the conclusions of Anart.

That there is a form of identification is evident. Like you said SAO, if that would be entirely absent it would have been a very selfish thing to post something that is entirely unrelated.

Indeed, the ages are a give away. We both have a relation, with (very) young children, and I have been at the brink of stopping it. It tore my heart apart. While going through the thread, there was this song playing of Sonic Youth between my ears. I genuinely wanted to help. So I started writing. Soon I realized that all I could really do was write an account of what happened to me, which I made very clear. This is the main reason Anart why I disagreed with your conclusion of Charles projecting his situation onto Ominous. This is also the energy you have felt ; I hope you haven’t felt anger because that was simply not there; what was there was disbelief and a lot of frowning while sitting at my desk.

yes indeed, I did go back to a personal experience of a far away past. Because it was there that I came to realize that there is a universal truth in it.
What is wrong with this, but above all … where is the projection?

But you said that "she" betrayed the relationship, not Ominous?

No that is not true. See first page and second page of what Ominous wrote.

If you do it to yourself, then doesn't that mean Ominous did it to himself? Could you please clarify cuz it sounds like a contradiction to me.

No no not at all. I wonder where it is that you are stuck? I just don't see it. Can I refer back to how I tried to explain it the first time, wherein I relate it to taking personal responsibility.

And maybe with other words: you can only really work on yourself. You can't change another person. You can support them and help them, of course, but you can't really change them. Long ago, before getting into the work, I came to realize that if you are unfaithful towards your relationship, that in essence you are doing it to yourself. And this is how I came to see something like faithfulness and sincerety. It is something that I alone can give. This insight, if you really live it, protects you from being pulled along with the entropic maelstrom of this world.

Suppose you just learned that your partner has been unfaithful to you. Will you start thinking that you could have been unfaithful back then or that other time? And that now that you just learned how your partners faithfulness is ranked that you should have done the same, or something similar? Or are you going to remain strong in your decision, to be as faithful as possible ?

Hope this clarifies.

Again thanks, both of you.

 

[mada85]

Ominous's original post has a quality of honestly spoken suffering, and he is sincerely asking for advice and solace, in a difficult situation. And then, Charles, you wrote a post that was basically about you and your experience. It is very common for us to relate to another's pain by telling the other how we have been through something similar, and telling our story. But this is not empathy or advice or solace for the other, this is self-importance, pure and simple – a mechanical association of ideas. It is in fact a way of ignoring and belittling the other's pain, perhaps because, to allow ourselves to truly empathize with the other would be too painful for ourselves, reminding us of painful situations from our past.

Reading through your post I noticed that you wrote 'I…' many times. Here they are, isolated from the main text:

I recognize that.
And I know that there is still something to learn there for me.
We have a 7 year old girl and a five year old boy. I am 43, she's 36.
I also had
I came to a moment when I realized, that I was not going to
I detached emotionally.
from where I am now, I have learned
for I did not know, how fast, and deeply I could fall in love
it was like I had my girlfriend back. I saw it. I walked up to her
I had my girlfriend back.
I hope you don’t mind that I have used this thread as an opportunity
I know full well
from the little I can distil, I can imagine
I noticed that I heard a sonic Youth song playing between my ears again and again. So I looked it up
I will give you the lyrics. I guess there are
All I hope for
If I would be in your case, I would
But I guesstimate

Here's a quote from Gurdjieff, from Life is real:

any emotion that you have, that contains any sympathy whatever, for you, yourself , is going to be complex, confusing, foggy, and above all, dirty. Only sympathy, emotion, feeling for the OTHER is direct, simple and clean.

'direct, simple and clean ' feeling for the other would lead directly to external considering, imho.

I hope you don’t mind that I have used this thread as an opportunity

It seems that at some level you were aware of hijacking Ominous's thread, but you used 'I hope you don't mind…' to try and calm yourself and trigger Ominous's 'make nice' program; Ominous may not have a make nice program, but that is beside the point.

You quoted lyrics from Sonic Youth. Why? More self-importance, imho, because they mean something to you, but may be completely irrelevant to Ominous: meaning in song lyrics is subjective, and is only found because the lyrics agree with your machine, in a mechanical way.

It seems to me that your intention was to assist Ominous in a difficult time, but you appear to have allowed your intention to be hijacked by your self-importance, which led to you hijacking this thread.

My impressions, fwiw.

 

[Ominous]

After having had some time to think this over & ponder the generous replies given, I can come to one sure conclusion at this moment in "time:" that I, as a person, am much better equipped to deal w/ this situation than I would've been 6 months ago. Because up until then, I would've simply run the same programs over again. Now, tho, I can introduce some new elements into the mix. Such as an awareness of the programs themselves. I also realize how the emotion we call love has been twisted to encompass self-importance, possessiveness, & jealousy, which makes for a smorgasboard of negativity. I'm sort of hanging back & attempting to observe it all as objectively as I possibly can.

 

[Ominous]

Now I'm encountdring a new problem: I've lost my drive to learn...or do anything, for that matter. I realize that there are people starving & dying who have it much worse, but this knowledge doesn't change anything for me. I am stuck, & feel helpless even tho I know I am not. Also I feel redundant in putting these "poor me" posts up here. I don't know why I do, because no one has the magic answer. Either I make it past this, or I don't. Wow, talk about an "I" post - I outdid myself this time. Best wishes to everyone here, and thanks again for your kind suggestions.

 

[j0da]

Now I'm encountdring a new problem: I've lost my drive to learn...or do anything, for that matter.

I'm experiencing this state from time to time, Ominous and as far as I remember some other members could say that as well. It's hard for me to offer an advice in this regard, but from my experience this state is temporary, maybe cyclical. Maybe while this apathy/ambivalence lasts you could just observe what goes in your mind, make notes of your observations so when you feel better you'd have some material to discuss - here at the forum or during therapy sessions (if you decide to enter therapy).

I realize that there are people starving & dying who have it much worse, but this knowledge doesn't change anything for me.
I am stuck, & feel helpless even tho I know I am not.

So you see the difference. You know you are not helpless, but you feel like it. There may be many reasons for this feeling, but if you have recently lost many illusions about yourself, about your partner and about the world in general - it's no wonder you experience this state. Just like people mourning their beloved ones who passed away feel numb, detached and apathetic.

Usually, people get over this state. However sometimes when one's loss is too big, one stays stuck in apathy, that's why it's very important to explore this "loss" and discuss it with a therapist or a group.

Also I feel redundant in putting these "poor me" posts up here. I don't know why I do, because no one has the magic answer.

You feel redundant, but do you think your posts were redundant? Redundant how? For whom?