Dear Laura, whats going on?

[Phill4]

To Laura:

We see that there is a lot of disonance between us. This tells us that something is not right.
There is a vast chasm in knowledge on the forum.
I always thought of the forum as a place where pure STO values are propagated. Yet I was wrong.
Through the allowances the STS forces were allowed to corrupt the knowledge and what is even worse
it is FORCED on others through
the mods and veteran members. Many clearly think that number of postings is related to the
STO-sness of the members. But is it? Imagine a being from 4D STO world showing up on the forum
for the first time in order to help. What would happen?
The point of STO is not to answer all questions that are thrown at us. It is to help others to learn
, to gain knowledge. And to gain knowledge doesn't mean memorizing some texts and then throwing it
around on the forum without true understanding. Knowledge IS true understanding and vice versa.
Only those who truly understand can help others to also understand.
This was my duty and now it is over. It is up to you now. You cannot have two contrary essences at the same time in the same place.
We are STO, we do not want, we do not need, we do not beg. We do not command. Do as you please and bear consequences.
I am leaving.

Or maybe things didn't turn out the way you expected and "since you are not wrong" and you are "pure STO" (who somehow in the years here missed that we are still humans and now that he is challenged reacts agresively and defensively) you wanna leave with the high ground.

What is more likely, that you are an adavnced being and it is the forum's fault and the mods are demons and blah blah? Or that you have too much pride?

The other thing, you don't need a crystal connection to 6D to "connect with your girl". All you need is better your comunication skills, with women and with people in general.
It is more simple and human than all you wrote.

It is easier to express you know what, i'm wrong about this and move on, keep learning from the wrongdoings than being stubborn about a delusion that's eating you alive.

We know Laura is working and she was kind to let us know her current endeavors in spite of the cryptic indirect message from menna, but what are you doing ? Preaching your pureness to around?

We heard what you had to say here, the problem is you never returned the courtesy. Because in your mind you already know.

In any case
Adios.

 

[A Jay]

The point of STO is not to answer all questions that are thrown at us. It is to help others to learn
, to gain knowledge. And to gain knowledge doesn't mean memorizing some texts and then throwing it
around on the forum without true understanding. Knowledge IS true understanding and vice versa.
Only those who truly understand can help others to also understand.

The above reminds me of another pseudo-intellectual word salad from a few years ago:

THE ONE IS NOT THREE.THE ONE IS SIX WHICH IS SEVEN WHICH IS ONE IN INFINITE PROJECTION OF ONE WHICH IS PROJECTION OF ZERO AND VICE VERSA

 

[Mikha'El]

In my opinion, when you have a situation like this the best thing to do would be to try and win over the offending party.

Work with that person and not against them, show them their errors (in your opinion, because none of us has all the answers) in a kind and humble manner and do your best to bring them into the fold.

You have to understand that that person came here for some reason. Whatever that reason may be, we should see that as an opportunity for growth and common understanding.

Not an opportunity to show off our own knowledge or capacity to write really long diatribes breaking down that person's perceived faults. (There is no way that anyone can truly know anyone else when they only interact with them in the limited manner that these types of message boards offer)

At least, that is my understanding of what it means to be an STO candidate, inclusiveness not exclusion.

In my personal experience, all people have the ability to teach. They can either teach directly through their own words or actions or indirectly through how we react to them and then studying that reaction.

All experiences in life are opportunities for growth, if we just take the time to step out of our own egos and give people the opportunity for understanding.

Cooperation has been proven time and time again to be preferable to competition. While I understand that a competitive spirit does help in certain situations, I don't feel that it belongs in a forum that is dedicated to the gaining of a common ground of knowledge.

This is purely my opinion and I would appreciate that it is taken as it is.

 

[Mr. Premise]

In my opinion, when you have a situation like this the best thing to do would be to try and win over the offending party.

Work with that person and not against them, show them their errors (in your opinion, because none of us has all the answers) in a kind and humble manner and do your best to bring them into the fold.

That's true, but kindness and humility can take different forms. For example, what should the network do if someone refuses to answer simple questions and becomes manipulative. Some people just need a gentle nudge, but others have a thick shell that's hard to penetrate. In the latter case, more forceful methods may actually be truly kind to the real self of the person who truly wants to grow. On the other hand, some people don't really want to grow, they might just want to impress others with their wisdom and then react aggressively or passive-aggressively when anyone questions their self-image. Have you read In Search of the Miraculous? Or really examined how this forum works? You might want to look up the "scratch test" which is in In Search of the Miraculous.

You have to understand that that person came here for some reason. Whatever that reason may be, we should see that as an opportunity for growth and common understanding.

Not an opportunity to show off our own knowledge or capacity to write really long diatribes breaking down that person's perceived faults. (There is no way that anyone can truly know anyone else when they only interact with them in the limited manner that these types of message boards offer)

Do you really think people in the network and mods and admins are showing off knowledge and writing long diatribes?

At least, that is my understanding of what it means to be an STO candidate, inclusiveness not exclusion.

Well the Cs said that STO involves giving all to those who ASK. But the key is what is the real self asking? A person's real self might be asking in some way for correction, like lies are asking for the truth.

In my personal experience, all people have the ability to teach. They can either teach directly through their own words or actions or indirectly through how we react to them and then studying that reaction.

And they can also teach by showing us the way not to interact.

All experiences in life are opportunities for growth, if we just take the time to step out of our own egos and give people the opportunity for understanding.

Cooperation has been proven time and time again to be preferable to competition. While I understand that a competitive spirit does help in certain situations, I don't feel that it belongs in a forum that is dedicated to the gaining of a common ground of knowledge.

This is purely my opinion and I would appreciate that it is taken as it is.

If people are manipulative, much noise can be created trying to cooperate with them. When the network calls us on manipulative tactics, it's important not to take it as an attack on ourselves but as directed against our false personality or bundle of programs that is not our real self. Here's an example: your last sentence is manipulative. You are trying to control how we react to what you said and make it so we take it "as it is" whatever that means. Now all of us engage in manipulative behavior from time to time, but we come here to have it called out by people who love our real selves not our false personalities. That part of us that gets defensive when these maneuvers are called out is not our true self.

 

[Alada]

At least, that is my understanding of what it means to be an STO candidate, inclusiveness not exclusion.

Well the Cs said that STO involves giving all to those who ASK. But the key is what is the real self asking? A person's real self might be asking in some way for correction, like lies are asking for the truth.

It’s important I think, that in each event as it unfolds, we pay attention to the balance between asking and manipulating. Can we discern what the driving force is of a given event? How might our response, if any, change according to what we see with that context in mind?

Generally we’re not taught to be aware of, take into consideration such things, and so can tend to think that an STO path must be inclusive of everything, that the more STO the orientation the more inclusive. But that is an error I think. In order for there to be balance, for the STO orientation to continue to exist, there has to be some exclusion and refusal of manipulation. There are some interesting notes on that theme here, in the Cass Wiki: All to those who ask.

 

[biala84]

To Laura:

We see that there is a lot of disonance between us. This tells us that something is not right.
There is a vast chasm in knowledge on the forum.
I always thought of the forum as a place where pure STO values are propagated. Yet I was wrong.
Through the allowances the STS forces were allowed to corrupt the knowledge and what is even worse
it is FORCED on others through
the mods and veteran members. Many clearly think that number of postings is related to the
STO-sness of the members. But is it? Imagine a being from 4D STO world showing up on the forum
for the first time in order to help. What would happen?
The point of STO is not to answer all questions that are thrown at us. It is to help others to learn
, to gain knowledge. And to gain knowledge doesn't mean memorizing some texts and then throwing it
around on the forum without true understanding. Knowledge IS true understanding and vice versa.
Only those who truly understand can help others to also understand.
This was my duty and now it is over. It is up to you now. You cannot have two contrary essences at the same time in the same place.
We are STO, we do not want, we do not need, we do not beg. We do not command. Do as you please and bear consequences.
I am leaving.

Did you leave alredy???
If not better hurry Up there is no place to say the things like this and criticizing, i'm not gonna let see people doing these kind of things to a Most Sensitive and Intelligente Person i Ever Seen in my Life. I' ve seen already STS caseson forum that they come and see what we are doing here...

 

[Woodsman]

Wow.

It's been a while since we've had a storm this big in this small a tea cup. It feels like a LOT of compressed energies released over, (literally speaking) almost nothing.

Menna posted four words, and.., POW.

That's all it takes sometimes.

In its own way, even the comment forum expresses the earthquake of our times!

 

[Trobar]

just wanted to say that if STO orientation is someone personal intent, and we know that, no matter how much or how long someone is on that path, than we shall be less rigid to each other, specially to those who committed as moderators, but as well as to Menna ...

But the problem is that your statement is not really correct. The appropriate way to respond to someone cannot be locked down and is pretty much always context specific.

As usual, this thread has been profoundly educational. :)

I very much share the understanding and the perspective posted here by Joe, that the "appropriate" way cannot be locked down and I especially follow the line of thought where it is "pretty much always context specific". Although we may 'want' absolutes when it comes to engaging with each other and at best . . . agreeing that we disagree, it is all quite variable and often the probable outcome changes with each spoken or written word.

Within the context of disagreements between two people or a large group of people, the fundamental ingredient for a successful outcome is the intention of all parties involved. LOL! Yes, this does seem like 'wishful thinking' that all involved will have the best of intentions. However, the topics, the issues and the lessons that are made available on this forum are really not that different than what we encounter in everyday earthly life. Also . . . they are not that different from what we will encounter as we evolve and we transition to other densities/locations. If we do not maintain a broad and open perspective about all that is, then one possibility is that we will fail to communicate. Interesting, how the word 'communicate' begins with 'commun' which brings to mind the word 'community'. The thing here is . . . we are a community and we encounter and will continue to encounter all the challenges that emerge when dwelling within a community as a genuine member. It ain't easy. :)

On my end, the question of my own genuine 'intention' as a member of this 'community' is a gigantic billboard sign. What am I really thinking? What am I really feeling? Am I looking at the big picture . . . or am I wearing blinders and generating noise? Did reading something I did not care for/agree with bring up some stuff I had swept under the rug?

Membership here . . . learning here . . . is rarely easy. It has not been so for me. However, pausing and biting my fingers before I venture to post is a skill that I am learning about on this forum and that translate outside of the forum into my personal and professional life. So many lessons available on so many levels.

This reminds me of when my three sons and I would engage in very drawn out and heated debate about some issue we deemed very important and at some point . . . we would all grudgingly realize that we simply were not going to agree and would end up laughing and going about our business. We would tease each other and say silly things like "well . . . I'm going to hand in my resignation as a member of this family". :)

These words are not intended to provide anyone with any answers to anything. The words are simply my most humble thoughts and most humble opinion based on the perspective of an initiate.

 

[Josi]

In my opinion, when you have a situation like this the best thing to do would be to try and win over the offending party.

Work with that person and not against them, show them their errors (in your opinion, because none of us has all the answers) in a kind and humble manner and do your best to bring them into the fold.

You have to understand that that person came here for some reason. Whatever that reason may be, we should see that as an opportunity for growth and common understanding.

Well, if you are in a well trained/tuned orchestra you can't have someone who has picked up an instrument for the first time, and announce they know exactly how to play, and you must allow them to make their noise. Everything begins with the basics and progression .

tohuwabohu didn't come here for growth or understanding. He thought he already knew.

 

[bjorb]

[quote author= Mikha'el]Work with that person and not against them, show them their errors[/quote]

You can only work with someone who is able to listen and does not have a full cup. I think that is where it went wrong, I mean we pretty much tried or so I think. But the person in question rather intented to start a riot.

 

[mocachapeau]

So... this has been a pretty educational thread, to be sure. It's always interesting how much we can learn about ourselves when someone sort of "scratches" us. I'm referring to Menna's original post and how so many were offended by it. Or, assumed that Laura would be offended by it. It was certainly a little questionable, and could use some clarification from Menna, but hardly a capital offense. Have we become a gang of social justice warriors?

Having said that, it seems odd that Menna still hasn't responded. Maybe the hue and cry his post stirred up has made him "afraid" to jump in. But that also seems odd, because it it's kind of out of character for him. I hope there's nothing wrong.

If you are reading this thread, Menna, I would just like to encourage you to speak up. In my opinion, your post wasn't all that big a deal, just lacking some external consideration in the way you expressed yourself. I think we have all been guilty of that at one time or another - I sure have - and in much worse ways.

I think it might be good that you at least show some sign of life, so we know you are okay. And as for the rest, like I said, not that big a deal. No one wants to flog you.

 

[jimxster]

Re: Dear tohuwabohu, whats going on?

To Laura:

We see that there is a lot of disonance between us. This tells us that something is not right.
There is a vast chasm in knowledge on the forum.
I always thought of the forum as a place where pure STO values are propagated. Yet I was wrong.
Through the allowances the STS forces were allowed to corrupt the knowledge and what is even worse
it is FORCED on others through
the mods and veteran members. Many clearly think that number of postings is related to the
STO-sness of the members. But is it? Imagine a being from 4D STO world showing up on the forum
for the first time in order to help. What would happen?
The point of STO is not to answer all questions that are thrown at us. It is to help others to learn
, to gain knowledge. And to gain knowledge doesn't mean memorizing some texts and then throwing it
around on the forum without true understanding. Knowledge IS true understanding and vice versa.
Only those who truly understand can help others to also understand.
This was my duty and now it is over. It is up to you now. You cannot have two contrary essences at the same time in the same place.
We are STO, we do not want, we do not need, we do not beg. We do not command. Do as you please and bear consequences.
I am leaving.

Dear psychic vampire,

Have you left yet? Sorry, that wasn't a serious question. Of course you haven't left. How do I know you haven't left? Because you said you were leaving. Any psychic vampire's words of departure can always be translated as "I'll be back". I don't know if you'll be back under this name or another, depends on if you get banned or not in the meantime I suppose.

I know it seems a bit rude of me to make my first "real" post here one that is "not nice" when I haven't even introduced myself yet. I've made many attempts to do my self-intro since I created my account in 2014, but I canceled each one it never seemed right. So now I have to risk getting banned myself for being an unknown troll.

Because I am an unknown here though and this post may seem like either an unprovoked attack on an innocent user or an attempt to stir up the flames again, I will offer the following to suggest that I am not doing either of those things with this post.

1. tohuwabohu said he was leaving, therefore anything I say here cannot be seen as a personal attack on him if he is telling the truth and has left.
2. If he is lying and he comes back, this will only confirm my theory that he is indeed a psychic vampire and therefore my "attack" was not on an innocent person even if he reads it.
3. My account is over 2 years old but has virtually zero posts. Flame war participants don't do so well with such a small post rate.

I was going to list all the reasons why I believe tohuwabohu to be a psychic vampire, but realised I would then be indirectly attacking the free will choice of anyone who doesn't want to see it so I refrained. All the clues are there for anyone that wants to see them though.

I will however quote tohuwabohu one last time before I finish, only because it is such a poetic item of interest, and ties in so nicely with my quote at the start.

This is my home now.

 

[Gawan]

Re: Dear tohuwabohu, whats going on?

I know it seems a bit rude of me to make my first "real" post here one that is "not nice" when I haven't even introduced myself yet. I've made many attempts to do my self-intro since I created my account in 2014, but I canceled each one it never seemed right. So now I have to risk getting banned myself for being an unknown troll.

Because I am an unknown here though and this post may seem like either an unprovoked attack on an innocent user or an attempt to stir up the flames again, I will offer the following to suggest that I am not doing either of those things with this post.

Welcome then to our forum jimxster,

I think you are already aware of it that it would be great when you make yourself known in the Newbies section and write a small intro about yourself and how you found the forum etc.

 

[T.C.]

Hi jimxster

It's interesting that your post was about the idea of the 'psychic vampire' and also about your struggle with writing your introductory post.

Is there a connection there? Does your fear of posting come from a fear of acting like a psychic vampire, or that you'll be perceived as one? I just think there's something in the fact that you've been wanting to post for three years, and the thing that was finally a strong enough trigger to motivate you was what tohuwabohu wrote.

An introductory post doesn't need to be an epic poem. It's a cultural custom and a symbolic gesture of good will, like a handshake might represent the fact that you're not holding a weapon. In real life, I have a weird program that makes it very hard to converse with someone who I haven't been formally introduced to. Saying who you are, why you're here and what brought you here establishes the beginning of a bond of trust.

 

[Nienna]

Re: Dear tohuwabohu, whats going on?

I will however quote tohuwabohu one last time before I finish, only because it is such a poetic item of interest, and ties in so nicely with my quote at the start.

This is my home now.

Hi jimxster and welcome to the forum. I look forward to reading your introductory post. :)

Just a note about your quote from tohuwabohu; this is really Laura's and Ark's home. The rest of us are merely guests. That's why we should all be trying to be the best guest that we can be here on the forum.