Don't flatter yourselves.

[Menna]

I think it is a person who is working through spiritual ideas and philosophies likes us however there is ego and mental sacred cows and fears that stop him from taking other things into consideration. If you notice he called me out specifically but never responded to my posts when I tried to relate to him in a normal fashion unlike he did to me. I don't think he was an agent or anything like that sent here just a person who saw one side of something and decided to heavily comment on it and not in the best fashion IMO.

We all kept on saying we are all STS but yet he kept saying we are STS. Experience is needed for feeling center when one is heavily intellectual. For some reason I did feel a hate/negative feeling coming through in his posts like a us vs him/her people here are in it together no? The words and tones used are telling about alot something is there out of place. Why mad at forum he/she doesn't have to post we don't impact his/her life if there is no interaction. The whole thing is dumb.

 

[Richs]

I think it is a person who is working through spiritual ideas and philosophies likes us however there is ego and mental sacred cows and fears that stop him from taking other things into consideration. If you notice he called me out specifically but never responded to my posts when I tried to relate to him in a normal fashion unlike he did to me. I don't think he was an agent or anything like that sent here just a person who saw one side of something and decided to heavily comment on it and not in the best fashion IMO.

I would say that from the way he writes that he is not an agent (at least not consciously) and gives me the impression of a late teenage or early twenties lad who has a gigantically inflated opinion of his intellect, learning and ability to understand esoteric subjects. Of course, he could still be an agent sent here to disrupt. I suppose they even hire very unqualified people too if that is all they can get.

Unfortunately for him, he was way way off in what he thinks he saw about the Forum and it's members. He also seemed fixated on the 'love and light' side which gives him a skewed and distorted view of reality. His emphasis on blue rays and green rays was a giveaway as to what he thinks is of most importance. Also, did you notice how he dissed Gurdjieff?

We all kept on saying we are all STS but yet he kept saying we are STS. Experience is needed for feeling center when one is heavily intellectual. For some reason I did feel a hate/negative feeling coming through in his posts like a us vs him/her people here are in it together no? The words and tones used are telling about alot something is there out of place. Why mad at forum he/she doesn't have to post we don't impact his/her life if there is no interaction. The whole thing is dumb.

A big clue here is his Forum name, and this pretty often applies to those of this type: "DoomAndGloomIsALie". Right away one can see he is opposed to seeing anything negative and only wants to focus on the 'good stuff' that makes one feel soooo gooood! It seems to me he was mad at us for not thinking the way he thinks so he came with 'religious zeal' to convert us. It's been tried before....

 

[Sol Logos]

Or do people think Doom is legitimately concerned, but isn't expressing him/herself constructively?

If there's any legitimate concern its overshadowed by a deep need to feel superior I'd say, which would thrawt any constructive expression or objective assessment. I've had similar tendancies, especially in my early twenties. I'd sometimes get on random forums or chat rooms to do with philosophy or religion and be a know it all. For me it was a feeling of being unrecognised for the insights I felt I had and a deeper insecurity about who I was. Its not entirely faded in me, but much softer and I recognise it now, which I denied previously.

Time and self work would help this individual, but like anything its comes down to making that choice. In some ways its a shame - if say this individual approached this with humbleness and openness, a lot of help and understanding would have been available. Seeing and unpacking those insecurities and addictive needs for validation that people here often help others do so, would have gone a long way to crack some of that facade displayed. There's always opportunities it seems for real growth, not just a growth in a deluded belief of self progress, which maybe now the only take away for this person.

 

[Soluna]

Hi Soluna

I think 99% of the responses were really pretty kind and externally considerate. Even when Doom... went on the offensive with Menna, Menna didn't 'bite' either. And it seems it was only after that post that some people got a bit more firm. Is it more about how it has made you feel? Did Doom...'s post hit a nerve in you that created a need to think more about the subject of STS and STO?

No the thread didn't specifically make me think on this - it's something that I have been thinking of in general lately, and it seemed to apply to the theme of the thread. With regards to people reacting emotionally I was trying to refer to posts that Doom may have read in the context of the 'complaint' regarding some perceived conflict in other posts with new members, or people who did not fit in, not necessarily the responses in this thread =)

[quote author=T.C.]
The idea that STS isn't 'bad' fits a universal, all-is-one, concept - but we use language to make our lives easier and I'm quite comfortable with labelling many of the ideals, chief traits, behaviours and actions which characterise a being as being truly STS, as 'wrong' and 'bad'. It can help to figure out the opposite, and come to a better definition of what traits and behaviours are 'better', in terms of my aim.

I guess meditating on the idea that "STS is not bad" might make for a kind of philosophical exercise, but I'd rather have a negative emotional response to an atrocity, than try to ponder it from a 'high up' level where my nature doesn't belong yet.

Hope that's helpful.
[/quote]

I think I have a tendency to remove myself and take a step back to look at things from a much wider perspective as I 'am' a very emotional person and I am desperately trying not to be ruled by them. Pondering that STS is not 'wrong' in a grander scheme of things - I feel is a coping mechanism for me, so as not to be overwhelmed by the negative emotions I hang on the selfish nature of humanity and the atrocities we commit. Rationalising that on some level it is a necessary stage of learning, or Karma - despite physically hating it - seems to have been a calming exercise.

Although perhaps these thoughts aren't helpful and I need to feel more in the 'now' rather from the back seat. Hence why asking for a little feedback =) thank you.

 

[Chu]

Notice another sign that is fairly common with these types: persistence. They say "goodbye", yet they always come back to say something else. They don't like that other people have the right to choose NOT to associate with them. If it was not about themselves, as they usually say, it wouldn't matter whether they leave having "the last" word or not. They always try to show us the "right path", yet, they ignore all points made that would possibly allow for an adult discussion, and decide instead to blame others for what they themselves are doing. Very sad, if you ask me.

 

[sitting]

I think I have a tendency to remove myself and take a step back to look at things from a much wider perspective as I 'am' a very emotional person and I am desperately trying not to be ruled by them. Pondering that STS is not 'wrong' in a grander scheme of things - I feel is a coping mechanism for me, so as not to be overwhelmed by the negative emotions I hang on the selfish nature of humanity and the atrocities we commit. Rationalising that on some level it is a necessary stage of learning, or Karma -

Hi Soluna,

I thought your original post was insightful and expressed with great sincerity. I see no need to be apologetic.

Unity, or non-duality is the ultimate goal. All can agree. (Goyacobol has the references if needed). The real question is the process of getting there.

I know the ever present emphasis of all here regarding the Work. I'm deeply in it too. I think sometimes it's useful to ask oneself "what exactly am I aiming for--with this Work?" And answering it in very specific terms. This question needs to surface more often, I think. (It might be useful if someone here took the time and effort to spell out exactly what the aim of their Work is). It may help clarify lots of things I think.

The C's have suggested karmic & simple understandings. I take that to mean distillation-- from the complex psychological battles in our minds ... refined into something basic & universal. Pain, suffering, agony, joy, acceptance, detachment, no-self even--may all be a part of that distillation process.

Speaking for myself only, that's the direction I'm headed. And from that perspective, even graduation isn't really the top priority. If I miss out, I will simply come back and do it all over again. Ultimately, it's the process itself that matters. I believe that's the true meaning of "value fulfillment" in Seth's terms. And it's entirely experiential.

FWIW.

 

[Soluna]

Sitting - indeed the Work often feels like a struggling path to understanding.

I feel that the types of unhelpful-critical posters highlighted in this thread truly miss the 'Work' part of what is done here, and indeed on that part of their own paths that they often praise as being the correct one. Although at this point this topic seems thoroughly discussed!

The C's have said that there are other paths and ways (I wish I could remember where these snippets come from so I could quote them correctly) - to criticise people for choosing 'this' path and 'this' community in which to pursue their personal Work seems very anti to any of these paths, and very egotistical even if their personal thought or intention is to 'help' others to what they view as the correct path.

 

[RedFox]

Notice another sign that is fairly common with these types: persistence.

The persistence also comes through in how 'right they are/wrong we are' too. So another point is they always seem to be incapable or unwilling to ever question there own thinking - a lack of doubt.
It can be tricky to know if it comes from deep wounding and defenses or is just there nature.

I'm reminded of the following Sott article.
We are all confident idiots: 'The doorstep to the temple of wisdom is a knowledge of our own ignorance'

In our work, we ask survey respondents if they are familiar with certain technical concepts from physics, biology, politics, and geography. A fair number claim familiarity with genuine terms like centripetal force and photon. But interestingly, they also claim some familiarity with concepts that are entirely made up, such as the plates of parallax, ultra-lipid, and cholarine. In one study, roughly 90 percent claimed some knowledge of at least one of the nine fictitious concepts we asked them about. In fact, the more well versed respondents considered themselves in a general topic, the more familiarity they claimed with the meaningless terms associated with it in the survey.

It's odd to see people who claim political expertise assert their knowledge of both Susan Rice (the national security adviser to President Barack Obama) and Michael Merrington (a pleasant-sounding string of syllables). But it's not that surprising. For more than 20 years, I have researched people's understanding of their own expertise - formally known as the study of metacognition, the processes by which human beings evaluate and regulate their knowledge, reasoning, and learning - and the results have been consistently sobering, occasionally comical, and never dull.

The American author and aphorist William Feather once wrote that being educated means "being able to differentiate between what you know and what you don't." As it turns out, this simple ideal is extremely hard to achieve. Although what we know is often perceptible to us, even the broad outlines of what we don't know are all too often completely invisible. To a great degree, we fail to recognize the frequency and scope of our ignorance.

Knowing that we are blind to ourselves is the first step towards growth if we so choose.

 

[timejack]

I will be burned on the stack together with doomandgloom but cant resist..

Here it goes:

"I don't think doom... is really asking for anything except attention and energy, and maybe to have some fun"
He is trying to show "Predator's mind (an integral part of being human) has a grip on your (forum members) thinking."

If you don't like how things are run here - fine, plenty of other forums for virtually any taste.
You are acting like a jerk and that is not tolerated here.
When all your physiological needs are met, maybe we could talk.
This forum is essentially an online Esoteric School, and not a club
I recommend reading more and working on yourself

just to name few

Where comes from all this crush and revange for dare to question the flock?
Why flock doesnt teach just bites?

"I've seen some wise contributors be turned away" - Could it be that lower ranks of this place has been hijacked and keep guard on the doors so many wise contributors leave before enter?
Lets be honest, general response to doomandgloom shows he did hurt you in some way, and if he did than probably it was your weak spot , and who have the guilt of own weaknesses?
He just came here to tempt your egos, please contemplate that because it is of immeasurable value for all tempted
Could it be better to learn to ignore (if one is not able to confront in STO manner), revenge has closed the loop, you have lost (let your emotions to take over) and he didnt learn anything but former

Anyway some of us must make this journey alone, others wont make it even together

All the best to the members

 

[Azur]

I will be burned on the stack together with doomandgloom but cant resist..

Here it goes:

"I don't think doom... is really asking for anything except attention and energy, and maybe to have some fun"
He is trying to show "Predator's mind (an integral part of being human) has a grip on your (forum members) thinking."

If you don't like how things are run here - fine, plenty of other forums for virtually any taste.
You are acting like a jerk and that is not tolerated here.
When all your physiological needs are met, maybe we could talk.
This forum is essentially an online Esoteric School, and not a club
I recommend reading more and working on yourself

just to name few

Where comes from all this crush and revange for dare to question the flock?
Why flock doesnt teach just bites?

"I've seen some wise contributors be turned away" - Could it be that lower ranks of this place has been hijacked and keep guard on the doors so many wise contributors leave before enter?
Lets be honest, general response to doomandgloom shows he did hurt you in some way, and if he did than probably it was your weak spot , and who have the guilt of own weaknesses?
He just came here to tempt your egos, please contemplate that because it is of immeasurable value for all tempted
Could it be better to learn to ignore (if one is not able to confront in STO manner), revenge has closed the loop, you have lost (let your emotions to take over) and he didnt learn anything but former

Anyway some of us must make this journey alone, others wont make it even together

All the best to the members

A simple question was asked. He/she did not respond.

Many others interceded with their personal and subjective points of view.

 

[Laura]

Where comes from all this crush and revange for dare to question the flock?
Why flock doesnt teach just bites?

Hmmm.... I don't know where you get the idea that calling a spade a spade is "revange".

He's a cocky teenager (or certainly, not much more than that), who has read a very little bit and thinks he's invented the wheel. He was given what he asked for.

 

[hesperides]

I think this thread is interesting, and I have a question:

Where do people think Doom's attitude comes from? Do people think it's an attack on the forum? Is Doom a paid agent or psychopath? Or do people think Doom is legitimately concerned, but isn't expressing him/herself constructively?

This is what I got from his less than brillant discourse:

I´ve seen that his counterattacking mode has been clearly overt so as to provoke negative reactions from the members, which allows him having just a nice time and I bet he didn´t even care a bit about gathering followers. If that were the case he would have developed his ideas in some way or another. Just fulfilling his need to feel himself as the protagonist in the midst of a huge adventure, I would say. I also noticed a lot of hatred coming up to the surface going in crescendo through his posts. He really wasn´t worth more attention except for the learning of this particular thinking pattern. After a few posts from him, I felt quite bored but alert at the same time because from my experience I know with these people one never knows what comes next.

In my opinion, the difference between people who have learned to be aggressive because of lack of self-esteem and this guy is quite alarming and obvious in this case. The former one would surely have had at least one or more specific questions and answers related to his own intimacy or at least his life in general, while the last one has shown he doesn´t even acknowledge what these two concepts are referring to. Fwiw.

 

[timejack]

He's a cocky teenager - that is probably true but it is not about him, it is about us and about our reactions
as someone said somewhere:
eye for the eye and teeth for the teeth will leave us in the world of blind people mauling each other to death
there is nothing wrong in resisting attacks but if you fight back:
if you fight the dragon be careful to dont become one

He was given what he asked for.
yes, and many members enjoyed delivering, and it is this enjoyment that i wanted to bring forward, the fight back is absolutely not necessary in case of this forum, you have created a grater selfinforced family of members, why would you want to respond in other way than an education, is he any danger to anybody here? is he able to change your opinions?
Take it as lost annoying child banging around, but you wont scream to the child, will you?
Any time we fight back we wake up our predator and put soul to sleep, an very part of our program

 

[RedFox]

timejack, you seem quite upset by this.
Could you point out where others shouted at him? Where people became dragons?

 

[Nević Nenad]

I think this thread is interesting, and I have a question:

Where do people think Doom's attitude comes from? Do people think it's an attack on the forum? Is Doom a paid agent or psychopath? Or do people think Doom is legitimately concerned, but isn't expressing him/herself constructively?

In my opinion just an idiot. Intelligent one, but idiot. Without further mystification. There are people like that, he has read something, understand some of it, of course in a wrong way, set on a ego trip to explain his version of it to others. Without any deeper understanding of what he has read, or even a wish to understand it. It is just a few days fun for him, after that he will forget it and it will be just as he/she never read something like that. Of course, until the next "fun" text and opportunity to "interact" with "funny people" such as us.