Don't flatter yourselves.

[Sol Logos]

He's a cocky teenager - that is probably true but it is not about him, it is about us and about our reactions
as someone said somewhere:
eye for the eye and teeth for the teeth will leave us in the world of blind people mauling each other to death
there is nothing wrong in resisting attacks but if you fight back:
if you fight the dragon be careful to dont become one

He was given what he asked for.
yes, and many members enjoyed delivering, and it is this enjoyment that i wanted to bring forward, the fight back is absolutely not necessary in case of this forum, you have created a grater selfinforced family of members, why would you want to respond in other way than an education, is he any danger to anybody here? is he able to change your opinions?
Take it as lost annoying child banging around, but you wont scream to the child, will you?
Any time we fight back we wake up our predator and put soul to sleep, an very part of our program

Who was fighting back?

Beating around the bush in this context wouldn't be considerate to anyone especially the individual who opened this thread in the way he / she did. Its not very considerate either to enable someone to avoid personal reflection and validate their false self beliefs by partaking in their baited arguments. Wouldnt it be also unkind to "educate" someone who demonstrates no willingness or desire to learn? Also wouldn't it be unkind to oneself to spend precious time on a fruitless task?

 

[Nević Nenad]

I will be burned on the stack together with doomandgloom but cant resist..

Here it goes:

"I don't think doom... is really asking for anything except attention and energy, and maybe to have some fun"
He is trying to show "Predator's mind (an integral part of being human) has a grip on your (forum members) thinking."

If you don't like how things are run here - fine, plenty of other forums for virtually any taste.
You are acting like a jerk and that is not tolerated here.
When all your physiological needs are met, maybe we could talk.
This forum is essentially an online Esoteric School, and not a club
I recommend reading more and working on yourself

just to name few

Where comes from all this crush and revange for dare to question the flock?
Why flock doesnt teach just bites?

"I've seen some wise contributors be turned away" - Could it be that lower ranks of this place has been hijacked and keep guard on the doors so many wise contributors leave before enter?
Lets be honest, general response to doomandgloom shows he did hurt you in some way, and if he did than probably it was your weak spot , and who have the guilt of own weaknesses?
He just came here to tempt your egos, please contemplate that because it is of immeasurable value for all tempted
Could it be better to learn to ignore (if one is not able to confront in STO manner), revenge has closed the loop, you have lost (let your emotions to take over) and he didnt learn anything but former

Anyway some of us must make this journey alone, others wont make it even together

All the best to the members

What is the use of trying to interact or even trying to learn/teach, when the person don't want to interact or at least try to learn? As you can see from the beginning of this thread "the flock" was very cooperative and was trying to talk with the Doom . . . in a very concise and very polite manner. His/Hers answer was rude, arrogant and didn't seem to be cooperative. So, why give energy on that?



Edit: Sorry, alkhemst, seems that I wrote post very similar to yours at similar time. No delete option . . .

 

[timejack]

"timejack, you seem quite upset by this.
hmmmmm, not much , but do you feel good about that?
Could you point out where others shouted at him? Where people became dragons?"
This is matter of speech but i did point few at beginning, not an shouting really but rather as hesperides said:
"clearly overt so as to provoke negative reactions from the members"
and he was quite successful,
All this story is much more subtle than appears on the first look, and finally boils down to :
he provoked and many reacted, and it is how we are controlled by 4th sts, emotions, reactions, autoprotection instinct etc

 

[Laura]

All this story is much more subtle than appears on the first look, and finally boils down to :
he provoked and many reacted, and it is how we are controlled by 4th sts, emotions, reactions, autoprotection instinct etc

It all depends on whether or not the person is identified with the emotion. Being able to say what needs to be said without being attached to it, or identified with it, is a useful ability/strategy.

 

[lilyalic]

"timejack, you seem quite upset by this.
hmmmmm, not much , but do you feel good about that?
Could you point out where others shouted at him? Where people became dragons?"
This is matter of speech but i did point few at beginning, not an shouting really but rather as hesperides said:
"clearly overt so as to provoke negative reactions from the members"
and he was quite successful,
All this story is much more subtle than appears on the first look, and finally boils down to :
he provoked and many reacted, and it is how we are controlled by 4th sts, emotions, reactions, autoprotection instinct etc

I doubt very much that any members became emotional or reactive towards Dooms comments. This sort of thing is done quite often when there are members that come onto the forum thinking they know more than they do, have negative strong opinions, calling out other members with their false assumptions etc. It's our responsibility to warn off this sort of negativity, and with that, many comment to come to a conclusion, most of the time the individual is found out rather quickly. You know, objectivity is achieved best with many opinions of the right kind. Dooms had many opportunities to respond in a constructive way. I don't think members have the time to be sweet about it, as many have mentioned there have been many threats in the past.

 

[RedFox]

I don't think members have the time to be sweet about it, as many have mentioned there have been many threats in the past.

http://cassiopaea.org/2010/05/08/the-wave-chapter-8-everywhere-you-look-there-is-the-face-of-god/

The young and the injured are uninitiated. Neither knows much about the dark predator and are, therefore, credulous. But, fortunately, when the predator is on the move, it leaves behind unmistakable tracks in dreams. These tracks eventually lead to its discovery, capture and containment.
Wild Ways teaches people when not to act ‘nice’ about protecting their souls. The instinctive nature knows that being ‘sweet’ in these instances only makes the predator smile. When the soul is being threatened, it is not only acceptable to draw the line and mean it, it is required.

 

[Approaching Infinity]

Yes, ofcourse I must be the one who has the giant spiritual ego, especially since I pointed out that you guys might be suffering from it!

Actually, that's pretty much the truth. If 'DoomAndGloom' didn't have a giant spiritual ego, they certainly wouldn't have posted the way they did.

Great reflection there guys, way to figure it out! It couldn't possibly be you! Nonono, you are too wise for that. And ofcourse you must be very afraid of me, protect your weaker newer members from the dangerous outsider who offers a different perspective which is not so completely distorted towards light/wisdom... BURN THE WITCH!!

Nope, we're not afraid. That's just another sign of said 'giant spiritual ego'. DAGIAL just didn't get what they wanted in terms of response, and so is throwing the 'spiritual' equivalent of a tantrum. (Or, they got exactly what they wanted, and the predictable responses were just a pretext to launch more insults and misguided criticisms.) Most members can see through this all. Pointing out the wrongness of the things written isn't so much for the benefit of 'weaker newer members' (but that's a bonus), but simply for the sake of being objective. Because people without a long familiarity with the material here often get taken in by DAGIAL's sort of nonsense. Thankfully this is a forum where that won't fly.

So basically what I'm trying to say is that all you seem to be doing is REFLECTING everything I said back unto me!

Because DAGIAL is projecting.

(I've noticed a couple members have tried internalizing it but then unfortunately quickly join the group consenses again.) I told you in my OP already, it's not about me! Why are you all so tense?

Yes, I do sound like a pathetic little teenager but maybe this is all part of the message, part of the act! ("Oh look, he said 'act', admitting he is a troll!"), to show just how much you are distorted towards knowledge/light. You all lack the green ray! Sing with me: "I'm blue da ba dee da ba die..." And since you lack the green ray, you'll never get to the indigo (green and blue merged) and never will open gateway to intelligent infinity! Read Gurdjieff all you want, it's all a bunch of mental crack, it's all intented to sheer you away from love (green) through strongly biasing you to the light (blue). The only ones who should read Gurdjieff are those opposite to yourselves who lack light. It really comes down to this simple truth. If you're a thinker, you should learn to feel, while if you're a feeler, you should learn to think. BALANCE, like you said. The problem is, you guys don't do balance far enough, because you are too afraid of loosing your precious knowledge which you have built up so much. My cup is too full you say? Well, yours is pretty darn full as well! Look in dam mirror.

This just goes to show that DAGIAL really doesn't have a clue about what we do here. Sure, balance is something strive towards. If one is a thinker, learn to feel. But also learn to think properly. If one is a feeler, learn to think. But also learn to feel more objectively. Not much evidence of either of those in DAGIAL's posts.

 

[Approaching Infinity]

He was given what he asked for.
yes, and many members enjoyed delivering, and it is this enjoyment that i wanted to bring forward, the fight back is absolutely not necessary in case of this forum, you have created a grater selfinforced family of members, why would you want to respond in other way than an education, is he any danger to anybody here? is he able to change your opinions?

How are you so sure members 'enjoyed delivering'?

Take it as lost annoying child banging around, but you wont scream to the child, will you?

DAGIAL is presumably not a child. And even then, the responses to him can hardly be compared to 'screaming'.

Any time we fight back we wake up our predator and put soul to sleep, an very part of our program

It's not that cut-and-dried. There's a difference between uncontrolled revenge and pointing out where someone is wrong. We don't do the whole 'revenge' schtick here.

 

[Richs]

He's a cocky teenager - that is probably true but it is not about him, it is about us and about our reactions
as someone said somewhere:
eye for the eye and teeth for the teeth will leave us in the world of blind people mauling each other to death

I have to agree this is generally true, but we did not respond to him in the manner in which he was speaking to us. It was not as you describe above. There was never as far as I can recall any attempt to harm him, only to explain where he was incorrect in his thinking.

there is nothing wrong in resisting attacks but if you fight back:
if you fight the dragon be careful to dont become one

I'm not sure if his posts could even be considered an "attack". Still, the only way to counteract untruths is with what is true. This is really what took place. No 'fighting' as you intimate was actually occurring.

He was given what he asked for.
yes,

Isn't this the very description of what STO does? "Give all to those who ask!" Generally speaking, we gave him EXACTLY what he was asking for. Why should this be a problem?

and many members enjoyed delivering, and it is this enjoyment that i wanted to bring forward

I can only speak for myself, but I felt this all rather distasteful and would have been happy to be discussing other things with the members here. It's fairly certain that the other respondents in this thread felt pretty much the same way.

the fight back is absolutely not necessary in case of this forum

On the contrary, we find it is always necessary to counter untruth with the truth. If you want to categorize this as a "fight back" you are welcome to do so, but we do not consider this to be so because we were not 'against' him, but 'for' the truth. There is a difference between the two, although it is not always so readily apparent to some.

Any time we fight back we wake up our predator and put soul to sleep, an very part of our program

Not so. Being nice and turning the other cheek is what we have all been taught is right and proper. Who do you think taught us to be that way so as to be able to control us so much better? We are not against anyone, but for our destiny. That destiny does not allow untruth to stand and we will always strive to expose it with what is true.

 

[Andrian]

All this story is much more subtle than appears on the first look, and finally boils down to :
he provoked and many reacted, and it is how we are controlled by 4th sts, emotions, reactions, autoprotection instinct etc

It all depends on whether or not the person is identified with the emotion. Being able to say what needs to be said without being attached to it, or identified with it, is a useful ability/strategy.

I think this is a very true and wise advice, so thank you Laura for that, i will confess it's a mistake that i'm doing a lot but also i try to learn how to adopt the best strategy to protect myself from falling in the same trap again and again. Because allowing yourself to fall in this trap you are opening a window in yourself and allow the predator mind, the wetiko virus to feed on you and even make of you it's puppet, it can force you to act against your own nature thus destroying a small part of your core being or it may lure you in a conflict which will bring no positive results to you for sure, so eventually by acting this way you only loose, you loose yourself.

Edit: Punctuation.

 

[SummerLite]

For my part in this conversation with d&g I had no emotional reactions in what I said to them. I only shared my observation of his/her behavior from what I've learned and is my view this type of behavior is predatory and so sts. This type of thinking makes a person open to be used and is used. And d&g's behavior was attacking simply put. I experienced no satisfaction in saying what I did. If i did then I'd be in that predatory mind/sts myself. I've studied this mind pattern for years and being outside that is my aim. And so observing in a objective manner with no emotional stings is the stance.

Afterwards I wondered and conflict arose in my mind...was I to harsh? Was I wrong (haha wanting to be right!) and then I thought of this programing of "being nice". I'm plagued by that one sometimes. Do I go on and on about the predators mind to much?

Being nice and turning the other cheek is what we have all been taught is right and proper. Who do you think taught us to be that way so as to be able to control us so much better? We are not against anyone, but for our destiny. That destiny does not allow untruth to stand and we will always strive to expose it with what is true.

Yes, this is it. I see b&g as being a very young person who thinks they have all the answers. It seems constructed of the new age thinking...

edit:clarity

 

[T.C.]

No the thread didn't specifically make me think on this - it's something that I have been thinking of in general lately, and it seemed to apply to the theme of the thread. With regards to people reacting emotionally I was trying to refer to posts that Doom may have read in the context of the 'complaint' regarding some perceived conflict in other posts with new members, or people who did not fit in, not necessarily the responses in this thread =)

Ah, right - I see. Thanks for explaining!

He's a cocky teenager - that is probably true but it is not about him, it is about us and about our reactions
as someone said somewhere:
eye for the eye and teeth for the teeth will leave us in the world of blind people mauling each other to death
there is nothing wrong in resisting attacks but if you fight back:
if you fight the dragon be careful to dont become one

He was given what he asked for.
yes, and many members enjoyed delivering, and it is this enjoyment that i wanted to bring forward, the fight back is absolutely not necessary in case of this forum, you have created a grater selfinforced family of members, why would you want to respond in other way than an education, is he any danger to anybody here? is he able to change your opinions?
Take it as lost annoying child banging around, but you wont scream to the child, will you?
Any time we fight back we wake up our predator and put soul to sleep, an very part of our program

Have you listened to the latest episode of The Truth Perspective from sott? I mention it because it has a theme that keeps coming up: the definition of freedom - and how the ponerisation of the concept has lead to an attitude that if you 'fight back' against someone who is doing something harmful, you're violating their freedom. This is similar to your attitude towards the responses Doom... has received.

Edit: fixed quote box

 

[shellycheval]

Richard S

Re: Don't flatter yourselves.
« Reply #83 on: Yesterday at 09:27:07 PM »

Quote

Quote from: timejack on Yesterday at 05:53:05 PM

He's a cocky teenager - that is probably true but it is not about him, it is about us and about our reactions
as someone said somewhere:
eye for the eye and teeth for the teeth will leave us in the world of blind people mauling each other to death

I have to agree this is generally true, but we did not respond to him in the manner in which he was speaking to us. It was not as you describe above. There was never as far as I can recall any attempt to harm him, only to explain where he was incorrect in his thinking.

Quote

there is nothing wrong in resisting attacks but if you fight back:
if you fight the dragon be careful to dont become one

I'm not sure if his posts could even be considered an "attack". Still, the only way to counteract untruths is with what is true. This is really what took place. No 'fighting' as you intimate was actually occurring.

Quote

He was given what he asked for.
yes,

Isn't this the very description of what STO does? "Give all to those who ask!" Generally speaking, we gave him EXACTLY what he was asking for. Why should this be a problem?

Quote

and many members enjoyed delivering, and it is this enjoyment that i wanted to bring forward

I can only speak for myself, but I felt this all rather distasteful and would have been happy to be discussing other things with the members here. It's fairly certain that the other respondents in this thread felt pretty much the same way.

Quote

the fight back is absolutely not necessary in case of this forum

On the contrary, we find it is always necessary to counter untruth with the truth. If you want to categorize this as a "fight back" you are welcome to do so, but we do not consider this to be so because we were not 'against' him, but 'for' the truth. There is a difference between the two, although it is not always so readily apparent to some.

Quote

Any time we fight back we wake up our predator and put soul to sleep, an very part of our program

Not so. Being nice and turning the other cheek is what we have all been taught is right and proper. Who do you think taught us to be that way so as to be able to control us so much better? We are not against anyone, but for our destiny. That destiny does not allow untruth to stand and we will always strive to expose it with what is true.

Well said Richard--I agree wholeheartedly.
Shelly

 

[whitecoast]

Reading your comment made me think: fats and carbs might be like truth and lies. Like, we need to cram as much truth into ourselves as possible, however much it hurts, and sit on it, letting it burn, without softening the experience with buffers or rationalisations or lies to our self, because our 'bodies' need to be forced into "truthosis" and cheating by ingesting a lie undermines the process.

Strictly speaking about diet, people who are older or have more mitochondrial DNA damage usually find easing into ketosis a little more slowly to be better. ;) What you wrote above is a great analogy for working in a school or network. Gurdjieff has also said that, because of how saturated with lies normal life is, pure truth as a food is inedible to the average person. This is why B influences exist (which means information which doesn't come from an esoteric school but points in the general direction of esoteric studies- think the matrix movie).

 

[Sol Logos]

Edit: Sorry, alkhemst, seems that I wrote post very similar to yours at similar time. No delete option . . .

A Vulcan mind meld moment :)