EMF Exposure

shijing

The Living Force
LQB said:
I agree with MB here - your best approach is to install a ground plane (as simple as alum foil or metal screen) behind the meter. If you attempt to block the radiation to the exterior, you will likely increase the back-radiation into the home.
LQB, since I don't have a smart meter on my own home, do you have any advice about how to shield radiation coming from meters on adjacent properties? All the solutions I've seen so far involve covering your house with mesh or building a canopy (essentially a Faraday cage) over the sleeping area -- both of which are fairly big projects...
 

LQB

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
voyageur said:
LQB said:
MB said:
voyageur said:
Figured I would just add the comment, yet I'm still not positive about the "overheating" issue, this seems to be just what one electrical engineer said - need to assess more data. Looking forward to the results of your experiment with the screening.
A bigger concern might be that tampering with smart meters (or dumb ones, for that matter) can be illegal, although local laws vary. Adding shielding so that the signal doesn't pass through your home, especially if it is done on the inside, is not going to raise any alarms, I don't think, but I would suggest not doing anything that directly interferes with the device's operation.
I agree with MB here - your best approach is to install a ground plane (as simple as alum foil or metal screen) behind the meter. If you attempt to block the radiation to the exterior, you will likely increase the back-radiation into the home.
Ok, makes sense. Any blockage results in radiation taking the path of least resistance.
Yes, you can think of it like a balloon - push in, and it will come out someplace else.
 

shijing

The Living Force
In one of Mark's recent posts on infrasound, I noticed that Steven Magee (the person who posted the video about the makeshift infrasound detector) is an author and researcher in Tucson, Arizona specializing in EMF and RF pollution. He has a site with a number of useful resources:

http://www.environmentalradiation.com/

One of his recent posted videos is of a recent legal hearing on Arizona smart meters, which happened about a month ago:


https://youtu.be/oHTXt-LMWIE

It's a long hearing (over six hours), but the text on YouTube links to some of the highlights if you don't want to listen to the whole thing. The evidence presented by Dr. Martin Blank, beginning at 00:22:45, is quite interesting.
 

Voyageur

Ambassador
Ambassador
FOTCM Member
Just finished the above hearing video of Dr. Martin Blank, so thank for that. Martin Blank offered up some good advice to this council - group/networking advice to avoid industry attacks. Seeing and hearing is unfortunately another matter.
 

plutronus

The Force is Strong With This One
LQB said:
Divide By Zero said:
Why not point out the issues, or say, I don't think you are right? You can even say "I'm not sure about what you are saying".
I'm sure LQB or others who know a lot about this can chime in and explain whether his reasoning was invalid or not.

He does make valid points and I can say this because I work in the electrical field. 600mV is 0.6 volts. Out of 120 V, that is 0.5% of the RMS of the AC wave. The contacts themselves could have a tiny resistance or induction that affects measured voltage. Or, the wiring which might have other loads in the circuit could be having these microscopic voltage drops. In AC power, if there is inductance or capacitance, the current used during the wave is not as smooth as the sine wave, causing ripples.

However, I am not the one that did the tests, and do not know how frequencies work and whether there is some kind of resonant frequency that could make some these small voltage waves into strong energies that are absorbed by the body, etc.
The issue is not so much the amplitude (as a measure of danger) but the frequency. The high frequency noise components (greater than about 2Khz) begin to penetrate the flesh via capacitive coupling to the body. When this happens you get interference with cellular metabolic function. The Stetzer and Greenwave meters attempt to measure the power in the high frequency noise spectrum, and their reading in mv is a unit of convenience (rather than a direct voltage measurement). Since these meters measure only the high frequency noise (above 2KHz), they give a direct relative measure of the harmful noise - and a reading of 600 is quite high (the Stetzer meter pegs at 2000).

Prof Denis Henshaw (Univ of Bristol - Emeritus - Retired) makes a convincing argument that this noise, when imposed on the magnetic field, is far more dangerous (partly due to penetration) and responsible for certain cancers (childhood leukemia, brain cancers, etc) at elevated rates (I'll add aggravated blood sugar/insulin resistance). This means that a home that has a wiring error (such as crossed ground/neutrals) and high grid noise - is particularly dangerous [see earlier posts in this thread.]

So to say that 600mv is harmless by comparison with the 120V main is to entirely misunderstand the mechanism of damage.
LQB and All,

I appologize re; length of this post.

You did not run me off. No, I've been hitting the books, reading the physics of how things work in bio-chemistry, and unlike you (first sentence on your home-page), I'm not married to a physicist, I'm not a physicist, nor do I play one on TV, however, my gal of 35 years has a Master's in engineering and she worked in SSME group (Space Shuttle Main Engine) for a Rockwell orbitor engine sub. In fact that's how I met her. We bumped into one and another literally in the hallway (incidentally she has MS) while I was doing an engineering job in an SSME facility. I had a contract (1985~86) to design and fabricate an SSME flight-mission engine performance data and scientific analysis system, in which I down-streamed from the NSTL (Nat'l Space Transportation Laboratory) orbitor contractor facility national microwave MASER data-network. Those Rocketdyne catz had engineered a gadget to measure the torque of the SSME (Space Shuttle Main Engine) turbo-pump shaft while turning!!! Yeah...pumping 220,000 lbs of hydrogen and oxygen/minute into the compactor while in flight....Hah hah yeah baybee! ...it was a kewl contract, but there was also a great big humongous phaat bummer in it too. I had just met three of the Challenger Astronauts who had flown down (via their T38s into the TAW in Van Nuys Ca), just to see my system. They expended the day with me. Mike Smith, Dick Scobee and Judy Resnick (in fact she gave me her astronaut Space Shuttle ballpark cap, which I still have). She was a really smart gal, and cute too...a Xerox engineer. And just a few weeks later, they were killed when the SRB 'O' ring burned through causing the orbitor to breakup. Although its hardly known, the orbitor was blownup by range safety, after the SRB knocked off the wing. They had to, as the orbitor had canted in the direction toward the mainland and it was spinning wildly. Imagine the orbitor crashing in your neighborhood, weighing 40 million pounds going 15,000 mph. But my telemetry system worked flawlessly. It was a mind blower.

<SIGH>

I apologize about the transgression from the subject.

I re-read all of the posts here...I should clarify a few things. For one thing, I'm a career electronics engineer. I've been doing electronics since I was a wee tenager or about 55 years. The astute here, looking for 'flags' to descredit me, probably will notice that my age in my profile does not add-up. I **NEVER** disclose my actual birthdate to prevent data-miners from identifying me via my posts throughout the InterNet.

Re; Dirty-Power subjects...as I mentioned above, my gal has MS, in fact, her youngest and oldest also have MS, while the middle one, doesn't and no one else in her family has it either, going back seven generations. Medical science does not know what causes the disease, what triggers its onset, and there is no known cure. However, unlike the 1800s, which saw the invention of penicillin, the cure for polio, and a whole slew of cures for other diseases that are no longer in the public mindset, there is no cure for AIDS, Herpes, syphillus, Multple-Scelerosis (MS), or the common cold, et cetera. However, there **ARE** therapies. For AIDS, there are four shots per month, and after insurance, each shot, costs $1200. For MS, there is no cure, but there is a therapy, and after insurance, four shots per month (Avonex, BetaSeron, CoPaxone, etc) cost $1200 per shot. What a coincidence? Each shot irregardless of the disease, costs ~$1200. No single shot cures.

And for the common cold? The FDA has approved a $40,000,000,000 candy lozenge industry. The cold cold doesn't kill very often, it just makes ya miserable, and frankly, the candy companies are making poop-loads of money! Why invent a cure for colds when ya make all that money selling flavored sugar candy?

In my household, my youngest, and my oldest, and my gal have MS, but the middle aged one, doesn't

Myself being an engineer I have been aware of the electro-smog matter for many years. In fact a good friend of mine (still) was the personal friend of and was a technician for Bob Beck. I also knew Bob. Bob Beck, an engineer was one of the first people to study, design and (intially he gave all of his gadget design information away to anyone interested, gratis...no money involved), and later, he manufactured electro-smog devices. He was also one of the first (if not the first?) to produce power-line filters. However, his filters actually worked well.

But to bluntly speak...I am genuinely interested in electro-smog/dirty-power type subjects, mainly because, I want to make gadgets that are safe for general public usage, and if I find engineered products that are not safe for general public usage, study the whys and the hows of the problem, and publish that information in industry trade journals to edify others to the problem. Engineers are family people, we are good guys. But, one thing I've learned over the years, especially in alternative science subjects, there seems to always be a great big pile of BS surrounding those subjects. And for many different reasons, a few including (like in the billion Dollar cold remedy industry), outright deceitfulness, fabrications, and cover-ups. I suspect that there are few coverups taking place in certain areas of Dirty-Power, but as usual, there is so much BS, its hard to see the actual problem. Almost seems to be by design.

As in the ET presence science, the so-called 'dirty-power', the vast majority of interested people are non-technical, and so there is much confusion, myths, misperceptions, merging of unrelated ideas and a few unscrupolous folks who are making quack-gadgets and promoting, just under the FDA legitimacy wire, erroneous information designed to sell their products. Its all...well...its generally a quagmire of chaos. What is real? What is authentic?

I came here to this forum, as I was tracking down (unrelated to dirty-power) promising info in support of an ET Presence lecture I'm writing for an upcoming conference to be hosted in San Francisco in late March. Perusing around, I just happened to see the post about EMF and the SMPS subject. As I've said before EMF is a subject that interests me, not to denegrate it as some here mis-presume, but to clarify the realities. Wave off the cloud of BS obscuring the authentic issues, hidden in the details of things that non-tech folks can't see well. Hell, I can't see well, and I'm a smart guy.

So, but I know from past experience, all of the above won't mean squat, because you'll like see my posts as being negative wrt your belief systems. Its not my intent. I'm just working the problems as I find them, and I'll post summary info regardng my findings. I would go into specific details but this website chatroom software does not support math symbology nor inline jpgs, so it'll have to be summary text briefs.

Re; Capacitive coupling, that's a dead-end, I've expended two weeks doing math-physics, it doesn't work. I've tried four different models, 1) using the school-room plans, and 2) the other three my living room. I also worked a theoretical thought-atmosphere model, based on a 10ft x 10ft x 10ft room, ideally in a zero EMF environment (such as might be found in the empty-quarter of the Arabian desert). The hypothetical room, wired using thinwall conduit (node 0) and three 12 ga AC power-wires (measured inductance at 10ft and acting as a single wire RF dipole, with common mode capacitance). One simple three wire circuit to a duplex socket, and one conduit/three wire cieling lamp fixture. Was unable to determine how the electrostatic charge capacitive could pass through the conduit to a Human torso that is electrically isolated from the AC circuit. Where is the dielectric material? The Human body+atmosphere? If so, where are the plates? And for the frequency of the dirty power, the capacitance value is SOO LARGE, if it did pass AC signal, it would be attenuated to below ELF frequencies. It just doesn't work. However, in my minature configurations and using my three axis magnetometer (Speak) for EMF, Intek E-Field meter for electric field, two HP8116 function generators (for dirty-power source synthesis) and my HP8568B spectrum analyzer (for broad-band frequency detection), I was unable to verify any coulombic charge transfer, while I was able to verify an E-field and EMF field coupling from the conduit to the center and to where a Human might be standing. As time permits, I'll do more testing regarding capacitive coupling, but its my opinion at this juncture that its a dead-end.

But in the above effort I made certain presumptions, and having re-read the posts here, I realize that I've been made some serious mistakes in reasoning. There is a problem, and to solve the problem, I must ask some questions. The question is, how does a remotely located electrical circuit, not directly and physically connected to a Human body, affect the biology?

1. what is the required minimum energy (can do work) level that will cause bio-compound-chemistry change?
2. what is the interface coupling?
some examples:
a. electric field
b. electro-magnetic
c. electro-static (coulombic) charge
d. thermal
e. radiative (photonic)

These are the primary questions that need be answered. Once we know the energy level, then we can back-track to a cause.

So any papers anyone knows of that describe the atomic physics and how they verified the levels, I'd be interested to know about.

Re; the GS meter. Working from a different direction, I've been working feverishly studying the Grahm-Stetzler Meter. I don't own one of these meters and no one has taken the cover off of one and photographed the insides or drawn a schematic of a production unit. I've been using the patent file schematic that is posted on the Stetzler website for the model data.

I've been studying the various subsections of the patent schematic and comparing the modeled information to the patent embodiment description to try to understand what it is that the GS meter discloses. I want to know EXACTLY the electrical function it serves. To accomplish this, I've been using the Berkeley University Spice3 modeling program and also, the Linear Technology LT SpiceIV program.

For the opamp, I'm using the Texas Instruments TL0x1 series OpAmp spice model. The Grahm patent spec's a TL081, but I'm using the family series TL071, there is a 3nanoAmpere/Hz slew difference between the two which is outside the test parameters....ie doesn't affect anything.

Its been interesting to see how the meter works. I've expended five days at 10hrs/day studying the meter. The hardest part is simulating the types of suspected power-line noise that the meter supposedly detects. Descriptions by folk using the meter don't seem to match what I'm seeing in the models. I suspect that the production GS meter is likely made VERY DIFFERENT from the patent schematic. That would explain the behavioral differences.

Using only the patent information, here is what I've determined so far:

1) GSPM (GS Patent Meter) is directly connected to the AC power-line.
2) GSPM does not measure POWER nor display power readings.
3) GSPM is a non-linear (input voltage-shape is not accurately amplified) expanded range-volt-meter.
4) GSPM divides the input voltage by 10, so that 115.07Vac becomes 11.507Vac input into the filter meter section.
5) GSPM pass-band filters ACV input 30Hz ~ 100Hz (attenuates) down by ~-10dB, I'll post graphs later

I am still studying the GSPM meter models, the GSPM circuit may actually perform as patent claims, however, production model may not in fact be the same as the patent embodiment. In any case, I'll post my study later, gotta take my gal right now to her finger-nail doctor, a monthly ritual.

plutronus
ET Investigator
 

plutronus

The Force is Strong With This One
LQB and All,

It'll be a few more days before I can have some time to post a bit of the GSPM behavioral model data findings. Sadly, early this morning (Monday, Jan 26, 2015), my oldest's significant-other of 12 years was found laying in their hallway, cold and blue. :(

(heart-attack on the way to the can).

Now another belongs to the ages....

plutronus
ET Investigator
 

Voyageur

Ambassador
Ambassador
FOTCM Member
plutronus said:
LQB and All,

It'll be a few more days before I can have some time to post a bit of the GSPM behavioral model data findings. Sadly, early this morning (Monday, Jan 26, 2015), my oldest's significant-other of 12 years was found laying in their hallway, cold and blue. :(

(heart-attack on the way to the can).

Now another belongs to the ages....

plutronus
ET Investigator
That is very upsetting, plutronus. My deepest condolences. :(
 

3DStudent

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Shijing said:
I'm sorry to hear that plutronus, and my condolences to you and your family as well. :(
Me too, I'm sorry for your and your family's loss plutronus. My condolences. :(
 

LQB

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Shijing said:
I'm sorry to hear that plutronus, and my condolences to you and your family as well. :(
Same here plutronus - very sorry to hear about this. What a sudden blow.

On the grid noise, it might be good to review more of the work that has been done on the subject by scientists/engineers/professors. For instance, David Stetzer has used a digital oscilloscope to measure directly the coupled noise on the human body - this is easily repeated although it only measures those frequencies that ride on the skin less than about 2KHz (it cannot measure the higher frequencies that are absorbed in the flesh). A small amount of current does flow due to residual ion content in the air.

If the home wiring is not enclosed in metalized conduit, then the electric field will be present in the environment. Even if shielded via conduit, the e-field will appear at sockets where the wire contacts are exposed. If that circuit carries current under load then the socket will measure as a point source of magnetic field due to apparent net current that arises due to the separation of the wires at contact points. This mag field will measure strongly at 60/50 Hz but also carries the grid noise.

Here are some references from a paper I wrote on the general EMF problem:

4. Denis Henshaw, Professor Emeritus (retired), School of Physics, University of Bristol
5. Milham, Samuel, Historical evidence that electrification caused the 20th century epidemic of ‘‘diseases of civilization”, Medical Hypotheses 74 (2010) 337–345.
6. Havas M, Stetzer D. Graham/Stetzer Filters Improve Power Quality in Homes and Schools, Reduce Blood Sugar Levels in Diabetics, Multiple Sclerosis Symptoms, and Headaches, International Scientific Conference on Childhood Leukemia, London, 2004.
7. Radiation from a cell antenna is a transverse electromagnetic wave (TEM) propagating in free space. Both electric and magnetic field directions are orthogonal to the direction of propagation. Reactive EM coupling can involve a radial component to the field in the direction of propagation making it behave more as a sound or percussive wave phenomena (longitudinal wave propagation).
8. Havas M, Stetzer D. 2004. Dirty electricity and electrical hypersensitivity: Five case studies. World Health Organization Workshop on Electrical Hypersensitivity. 25–26 October, Prague, Czech Republic, available online at: http://www.stetzerelectric.com/filters/research/havas_stetzer_who04.pdf.
9. Reines, R.S., M. A. Cook, J.D. Loock. 2000. Cornell Cow Model, White Paper, Public Service of Wisconsin
10. Reilly, J.P. 1992. Applied Bioelectricity: From Electrical Stimulation to Electropathology, Cambridge University Press.
11. Graham-Stetzer socket filters are designed by Professor Graham and David Stetzer and offered for sale by Stetzer Electric, see http://www.stetzerelectric.com/ for more information on the GS meters and filters.
12. Milham, S, Morgan, L, A New Electromagnetic Exposure Metric: High Frequency Voltage Transients Associated With Increased Cancer Incidence in Teachers in a California School, Am. J. Ind. Med. 2008.
13. Richard Box’s ‘FIELD’ (http://www.richardbox.com ), February 2004 Photo: Stuart Bunce.
14. Riley, Karl, Tracing EMFs in Building Wiring And Grounding – A practical guide for reducing magnetic fields due to wiring errors as well as current grounding practices, 2nd Edition 2007 by ELF Magnetic Surveys.
15. Powerwatch.org, http://www.powerwatch.org
16. Henshaw, DL Ward, JP Matthews, JC, Can disturbances in the atmospheric electric field created by powerline corona ions disrupt melatonin production in the pineal gland? Journal of Pineal Research 2008, vol 45, pages 341 – 350. (see also: http://www.electric-fields.bris.ac.uk/grouppublications.html)
17. Gouhier, Catherine, Le Ruz, Pierre, Citizen’s Survey, Living with a Very High Voltage Power line?, Centre de Recherche et d’Information Indépendantes sur les Rayonnements Electromagnétiques 2009 (see also http://www.stop-tht.org/IMG/pdf/090219_living_with_a_very_high_voltage_power_line.pdf).
This list is not comprehensive, just representative. I highly recommend visiting Prof Denis Henshaw's web pages at Univ of Bristol and download some of his papers and presentations. Also the epidemiological evidence for the negative health effects of grid noise is a very large body. On mag fields in the home, Riley's book (above) is excellent.
 

3DStudent

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Anyone have experience with shielding a wifi modem or router? Accorning to this video the best to use is aluminum foil, then wire mesh, and lastly mylar. But this video shows a phone being mostly shielded with mylar. Although it seemed he used a few layers of mylar.

I'm wondering because my old wired modem died and Comcast issues wireless routers. I disabled the wireless, but the LED light is still on. I think there is some open wifi that you can turn off on the website. I can feel wifi after a few seconds and the modem is in my room. I will be turning it off at night and have ordered a wired only modem. That should arrive next week. I bought some heavy duty foil to wrap it with, but haven't done so. I think with the cords in the back, a total seal would be hard to get. Any thoughts?
 

LQB

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
3D Student said:
Anyone have experience with shielding a wifi modem or router? Accorning to this video the best to use is aluminum foil, then wire mesh, and lastly mylar. But this video shows a phone being mostly shielded with mylar. Although it seemed he used a few layers of mylar.

I'm wondering because my old wired modem died and Comcast issues wireless routers. I disabled the wireless, but the LED light is still on. I think there is some open wifi that you can turn off on the website. I can feel wifi after a few seconds and the modem is in my room. I will be turning it off at night and have ordered a wired only modem. That should arrive next week. I bought some heavy duty foil to wrap it with, but haven't done so. I think with the cords in the back, a total seal would be hard to get. Any thoughts?
If you turn the wireless off through software (PC access), the transmitter should be shut down. But if it isn't you can set it in a corner about 1 foot off the ground, then take a 2'X2' cardboard foil-backed, and bent 90 deg so that you box it into the corner. That should reduce radiation in the room by more than an order of magnitude.
 

3DStudent

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
LQB said:
If you turn the wireless off through software (PC access), the transmitter should be shut down. But if it isn't you can set it in a corner about 1 foot off the ground, then take a 2'X2' cardboard foil-backed, and bent 90 deg so that you box it into the corner. That should reduce radiation in the room by more than an order of magnitude.
Thanks. I put foil on the three horizontal sides of a box and put the modem in it. I noticed near immediate relief, as I was getting a headache. I just put another strip of foil to cover the top and bottom sides, for a total of 5. The only non covered side is the opening and it's "aimed" out of the house. Is there an amplification "bounce" factor in the event that the seal is not perfect, and if so would it help to do another layer of foil around the gaps?
 

LQB

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
3D Student said:
LQB said:
If you turn the wireless off through software (PC access), the transmitter should be shut down. But if it isn't you can set it in a corner about 1 foot off the ground, then take a 2'X2' cardboard foil-backed, and bent 90 deg so that you box it into the corner. That should reduce radiation in the room by more than an order of magnitude.
Thanks. I put foil on the three horizontal sides of a box and put the modem in it. I noticed near immediate relief, as I was getting a headache. I just put another strip of foil to cover the top and bottom sides, for a total of 5. The only non covered side is the opening and it's "aimed" out of the house. Is there an amplification "bounce" factor in the event that the seal is not perfect, and if so would it help to do another layer of foil around the gaps?
No, you should be fine with what you did - good job.
 

hlat

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Were you able to turn off the wireless? The http address should be printed on the modem itself.

3D Student said:
LQB said:
If you turn the wireless off through software (PC access), the transmitter should be shut down. But if it isn't you can set it in a corner about 1 foot off the ground, then take a 2'X2' cardboard foil-backed, and bent 90 deg so that you box it into the corner. That should reduce radiation in the room by more than an order of magnitude.
Thanks. I put foil on the three horizontal sides of a box and put the modem in it. I noticed near immediate relief, as I was getting a headache. I just put another strip of foil to cover the top and bottom sides, for a total of 5. The only non covered side is the opening and it's "aimed" out of the house. Is there an amplification "bounce" factor in the event that the seal is not perfect, and if so would it help to do another layer of foil around the gaps?
 
Top Bottom