Income Tax Scam=Truth About Congress (On A Red-State Reading Level)
- Thread starter JGeropoulas
- Start date
mudrabbit
Jedi Master
In this country, before you get a job you must fill out an I-9 and a W2. The I-9, which you present two forms of identification if you are a citizen, usually a social security card (not just the number, you must present the card), and a driver’s license (or birth certificate, or passport). If you are a registered alien permitted to work in this country, you must show your green card.
The W2 is the form that tells the government how many dependants/deductions you are stating. It tells you how to calculate this, by its own standards. It is also, IMO, a covert document and upon signing it, you are agreeing to pay FICA (federal) and SS/Med. taxes (social security and medicare = 7.46% of your check). If you do not present the proper documents for the I-9 and do not sign the W2, you will not be hired.
There are ways out there to work where your services are directly paid for, with no middleman. It’s a type of self-employment where you have to apply for the book of coupons and calculate your own taxes, then send in the check with the coupon. It usually implies there is a business license, and registered information with the state and Federal Government. What some people do, from my own observations, is they work in jobs, (usually part time), where the paycheck is minimal enough to pay in some taxes, then they work outside jobs (no licensed business), “under the tableᾠ, where the payment is cash on the spot, and pocket that. They do not apply for a license, and do not have a legitimate business. But their services are much needed and they seem to have no end to the jobs they can do. Lawn services fall in this category.
One of the best jobs up until almost 20 years ago, was waiting tables. Before the 80’s you paid taxes on the hourly wage (waitstaff gets paid here half of the minimum wage, just about), and kept your tips. With the advent of so many people using credit cards, the IRS got a gander at what servers were REALLY making, so they made a new rule, which is what I had to implement as a manager. At that time, they had to pay taxes on 8% of the adjusted revenue (dinner checks minus any freebies, comps or coupons), or the total of their charged tips, which ever was more.
Now we see a larger amount of business done with credit, so it’s been a very long time since servers got to keep most of what they made, tax free. Often, a server’s nightly intake is 75% to 90% charges. And now the law/rule has changed again to provide more access to those taxable tips by the IRS. Now I’m observing in restaurants up here in Western NC, that servers have to claim most of their tips. It’s a rare ten-spot these days that you can just pocket. Many places have the gratuity added on, so there’s no hiding it should the business get audited. Therefore the business has a responsibility to see that all the taxes on the tips are recorded. So as an aside, leave your tips in cash if you really liked the service you got, and don’t short them less than 18% of the check. Some places pool their tips, so the manager knows how much is made and how much everyone got from the pool. In places like that, chances are you are paying taxes on 100% of the tips you made. Which really sucks if you have one lazy person letting the others do all the serving and side work.
In the long run, it seems that the responsibility for being creative is squarely put on our own shoulders. How creative can we be? That depends on the talents and experiences one uses to make a living.
Not paying your taxes will eventually catch up to you when you need to apply for certain things. If you want to buy a house or car, you have to show that you make enough for the loan. If you don’t claim any of your income, it will work against you. If you are trying to get a credit card, it may work against you, because you have no recorded income and therefore not enough credit history. If you wind up in the emergency room, chances are you will be denied much needed care or receive sub standard care….since no job means no insurance, no social security, and no medicare/medicaid supplements. And if you don’t have a credit card, they will push you off into a corner somewhere to rot on the gurney. I know this because it happened to me, and I PAID my taxes! If you pay for your own health insurance, yet do not claim taxes, the IRS will eventually want to know where you got that money.
Eventually it may be, that they won’t be watching what you earn, as much as what you spend. I think credit cards fall into this little scheme. I could be wrong.
It seems that no matter what we do, the PTB will find a way around it and into our pockets. When I filed this year, there was a notice with my paperwork. It states that you are allowed a certain amount to live on. In other words, they allow a certain amount for your groceries, monthly bills, etc, and no more. So if you need to show that you made JUST enough to get by, and it’s not falling into the allowable amounts that THEY say is enough for you to live, you’re out of luck, and they’re going to make you pay taxes on it. Turn off the heat, eat less, mend your own clothes, and get rid of the cable. They don’t care.
But until something else comes along, we all must learn to deal with it. I also see it as a huge dragnet to get anyone and everyone complaining about having to pay taxes on a list. In this case, I think the more noise you make, the more it brings their eye around to you.
The W2 is the form that tells the government how many dependants/deductions you are stating. It tells you how to calculate this, by its own standards. It is also, IMO, a covert document and upon signing it, you are agreeing to pay FICA (federal) and SS/Med. taxes (social security and medicare = 7.46% of your check). If you do not present the proper documents for the I-9 and do not sign the W2, you will not be hired.
There are ways out there to work where your services are directly paid for, with no middleman. It’s a type of self-employment where you have to apply for the book of coupons and calculate your own taxes, then send in the check with the coupon. It usually implies there is a business license, and registered information with the state and Federal Government. What some people do, from my own observations, is they work in jobs, (usually part time), where the paycheck is minimal enough to pay in some taxes, then they work outside jobs (no licensed business), “under the tableᾠ, where the payment is cash on the spot, and pocket that. They do not apply for a license, and do not have a legitimate business. But their services are much needed and they seem to have no end to the jobs they can do. Lawn services fall in this category.
One of the best jobs up until almost 20 years ago, was waiting tables. Before the 80’s you paid taxes on the hourly wage (waitstaff gets paid here half of the minimum wage, just about), and kept your tips. With the advent of so many people using credit cards, the IRS got a gander at what servers were REALLY making, so they made a new rule, which is what I had to implement as a manager. At that time, they had to pay taxes on 8% of the adjusted revenue (dinner checks minus any freebies, comps or coupons), or the total of their charged tips, which ever was more.
Now we see a larger amount of business done with credit, so it’s been a very long time since servers got to keep most of what they made, tax free. Often, a server’s nightly intake is 75% to 90% charges. And now the law/rule has changed again to provide more access to those taxable tips by the IRS. Now I’m observing in restaurants up here in Western NC, that servers have to claim most of their tips. It’s a rare ten-spot these days that you can just pocket. Many places have the gratuity added on, so there’s no hiding it should the business get audited. Therefore the business has a responsibility to see that all the taxes on the tips are recorded. So as an aside, leave your tips in cash if you really liked the service you got, and don’t short them less than 18% of the check. Some places pool their tips, so the manager knows how much is made and how much everyone got from the pool. In places like that, chances are you are paying taxes on 100% of the tips you made. Which really sucks if you have one lazy person letting the others do all the serving and side work.
In the long run, it seems that the responsibility for being creative is squarely put on our own shoulders. How creative can we be? That depends on the talents and experiences one uses to make a living.
Not paying your taxes will eventually catch up to you when you need to apply for certain things. If you want to buy a house or car, you have to show that you make enough for the loan. If you don’t claim any of your income, it will work against you. If you are trying to get a credit card, it may work against you, because you have no recorded income and therefore not enough credit history. If you wind up in the emergency room, chances are you will be denied much needed care or receive sub standard care….since no job means no insurance, no social security, and no medicare/medicaid supplements. And if you don’t have a credit card, they will push you off into a corner somewhere to rot on the gurney. I know this because it happened to me, and I PAID my taxes! If you pay for your own health insurance, yet do not claim taxes, the IRS will eventually want to know where you got that money.
Eventually it may be, that they won’t be watching what you earn, as much as what you spend. I think credit cards fall into this little scheme. I could be wrong.
It seems that no matter what we do, the PTB will find a way around it and into our pockets. When I filed this year, there was a notice with my paperwork. It states that you are allowed a certain amount to live on. In other words, they allow a certain amount for your groceries, monthly bills, etc, and no more. So if you need to show that you made JUST enough to get by, and it’s not falling into the allowable amounts that THEY say is enough for you to live, you’re out of luck, and they’re going to make you pay taxes on it. Turn off the heat, eat less, mend your own clothes, and get rid of the cable. They don’t care.
But until something else comes along, we all must learn to deal with it. I also see it as a huge dragnet to get anyone and everyone complaining about having to pay taxes on a list. In this case, I think the more noise you make, the more it brings their eye around to you.
mudrabbit
Jedi Master
This is not what we are about. We do not condone not paying income tax. ALL I was saying is that there are things to consider when one chooses to fight the system. This forum isn't about teaching others to break any rules or laws, and it's not what we are all about. It's also NOT what we want to associate ourselves with.
Or have you not read the previous posts?
Peg
Or have you not read the previous posts?
Peg
I have read the previous posts, and the site I mentioned teaches you how to lawfully avoid paying income tax, and does not break any rules or laws. If anything, it adheres strictly to the law. which has made it so successful. In fact, perhaps you should have gone to that sight to see for yourself what it's all about.
And it does not condone violence or lawlessness. Nor do I, and I have never condoned or encouraged violence or lawlessness on this forum. And don't talk down to me mudrabbit. You have no justification for doing so, so until you come up with tangible proof that such is the case, keep your petty authoritarian rants to yourself.
And it does not condone violence or lawlessness. Nor do I, and I have never condoned or encouraged violence or lawlessness on this forum. And don't talk down to me mudrabbit. You have no justification for doing so, so until you come up with tangible proof that such is the case, keep your petty authoritarian rants to yourself.
anart
A Disturbance in the Force
Or perhaps not. I am completely ignorant of the income tax laws in Canada - but I must point out that if there is an income tax law then - how can not paying it be lawful? It matters not - this is not the forum for such discussions. This has been pointed out far too many times to be lost on anyone at this point. Thus, this indicates an agenda, if someone continues to push this issue.Redrock12 said:
Now, at this point, you have become insulting and rude. That will get you removed from this forum, without question. For the very last time - this forum is not for the dissemination of short sighted and ultimately self-destructive information. If you have a problem with that, please go elsewhere. If you continue with this line of commentary and with this level of insulting and rude statements, you will be prevented from posting further.Rr said:
Azur
The Living Force
Something that has not even been mentioned in this whole thread is WHY it would be important to retain a few more Zorkmids, err, dollars, at the expense of putting yourself on the "radar" of the PTB.
For posterity? To go down in flames while shaking your fist, just so some others can cheer you on, while they quietly play along with the system because they are not ready to foolishly burn at the base of the Windmill?
Exactly what would be achieved?
A few more shopping binges at the "dollar store" to buy even more trinkets produced under unregulated slave labour from China? (And boy, if people really knew what it took to make that Pez dispenser. It's frightening. Even more frightening is that their little wish is sated because someone else's physical plight to survive is so remote, or should I say, "removed" or "distracted" from conscious thought.)
"Well, lookee here: I don't pay taxes so now I can buy even more stuff!"
A salient point is that people are in a position that they NEED to buy to survive, and beyond that, they are driven to BUY junk for a myriad of reasons.
So: having a few more buckaroos could be good, but it wholly depends on how they are to be used, and the COST associated with the avenue of "liberating" them from an imposed sinkhole had better be justified wisely for the trouble it would bring. (There's an Energy economy here, and you had better start understanding how it works outside of the "stated" rules that are peddled to the sleeping ones).
This particular undertaking might not be an endeavor by some just to become more liquid, it might be a stand against a contrived structure (as has been the undercurrent of the thread here), but it must be understood that this avenue is a blind alley.
If people were taxed at ZERO percent, things would be the SAME!
Capice?
For posterity? To go down in flames while shaking your fist, just so some others can cheer you on, while they quietly play along with the system because they are not ready to foolishly burn at the base of the Windmill?
Exactly what would be achieved?
A few more shopping binges at the "dollar store" to buy even more trinkets produced under unregulated slave labour from China? (And boy, if people really knew what it took to make that Pez dispenser. It's frightening. Even more frightening is that their little wish is sated because someone else's physical plight to survive is so remote, or should I say, "removed" or "distracted" from conscious thought.)
"Well, lookee here: I don't pay taxes so now I can buy even more stuff!"
A salient point is that people are in a position that they NEED to buy to survive, and beyond that, they are driven to BUY junk for a myriad of reasons.
So: having a few more buckaroos could be good, but it wholly depends on how they are to be used, and the COST associated with the avenue of "liberating" them from an imposed sinkhole had better be justified wisely for the trouble it would bring. (There's an Energy economy here, and you had better start understanding how it works outside of the "stated" rules that are peddled to the sleeping ones).
This particular undertaking might not be an endeavor by some just to become more liquid, it might be a stand against a contrived structure (as has been the undercurrent of the thread here), but it must be understood that this avenue is a blind alley.
If people were taxed at ZERO percent, things would be the SAME!
Capice?
mudrabbit
Jedi Master
When one takes measures to PROTECT the group/forum, it never ceases to amaze me how others will take it personally.Redrock12 said:
RR, this was not an attack, nor was I talking down to you. What I was attempting to do was to safeguard this forum. What you posted could get the wrong people on our backs. Please think about it?
Peg
First our Vision for this forum: to create an environment for the stimulation, development and then the alignment of objective consciousnesses as defined and described by Georges Gurdjieff.
And further down in the “rules" section, the following first two guidelines:
One, don't maliciously harass people, or flame them, or really make them want to flame you. If the moderators detect malice or manipulativeness (and they ARE experienced), and invitations to overcome such issues does not result in resolution, you will be deleted.
Two, please don't post messages about your illegal pastimes and habits. Signs of the Times does not wish to appear to condone such practises, for reasons that should be pretty obvious if a little common sense is applied. If you do post such stuff, expect it to be deleted immediately.
j0da
Jedi Council Member
Ok, let's talk about this group of people who supposedly avoid taxes in a succesfull and legal manner. In my opinion every system can tolerate some limited number of folks, who behave like that - they are a small percentage and do not harm it in some significant way. To the contrary, they may be useful to the system, which probably lets them have a little "victory" and keeps them like "scapegoats in storage". Should some financial problem arise, be it shortages in elderly pensions, malfunction in health care services, etc - those people are perfect ones to put the blame on and direct general public fury on them. What's more, most people feel uncomfortable paying taxes, so it's very easy to manipulate those who pay them that the taxes are so high, because there are those "unfair, selfish citizens" who decline bearing "obvious" civil responsibilities. Options are many, one could probably imagine many ways how a system would find such "tax avoiders" usefull.redrock12 said:
Other thing to consider is law itself. Even if it has loopholes which enables tax avoidance - it can be changed any minute, momentarily incriminating those who thought they evaded tax legally. You think law doesn't work backwards in time? Think again. Once the upgraded legislation is in place, every one of those "lucky ones" will find himself incarcerated or at least fined with painfully big sum of money.
The idea that tax avoidance as a form of rebellion is workable is pure fantasy. It doesn't harm the system when only a limited number of folks do it. It WOULD be dangerous for the PTB only in case when the whole general public denied paying taxes. To achieve this some robust mass communication means would have to be put in work, coupled with deep knowledge of human psychology, for people are so confident that taxes are "obvious and absolutely neccesary", that it would take significant effort to convince them otherwise.
Another, more local or personal perspective - this time we can take a hypothetical situation when someone who is doing The Work buys into this "tax avoidance" stuff. I have a question for proponents of this "rebellious" idea - Have you felt the pressure of General Law already? Did you experience the situation when all of a sudden EVERYTHING starts to fail? Your car stops working, your computer doesn't start, your parents are suddenly in desperate need of attention, your tooth starts to give you horrible headaches, your work suffers from some market turbulence, you've been denied credit, etc? Now, imagine you also started the procedure of evading tax and out of the blue you receive significant attention and harrasment from tax revenue officials, police, courts?
Is it some extremely unlikely and dark scenario? No, in the case of anyone working to wake up IT IS NOT. Contrarily - it's VERY PROBABLE. Such scenario GUARANTEES that such "rebel wannabe" would have to spend all his energy and resources on simply surviving the day. The Work would have to be relegated to "the future"...
Do you see how irresponsible is to promote this idea in general, and among our forum members in particular?
But wait, there's more. This forum, but more importantly it's owners do not function somewhere "over the rainbow", in the land of peace and safety. They live in a system just like everyone else. France may be not as oppresive as USA (for now), nevertheless, you can be sure those who rule the local chessboard pay strict attention to what's going on here. Would they happily tolarate the promotion of "tax avoidance" on their own ground? Would you want SOTT team to be put in the situation when their right to live in France is revoked? Hmm? We are balancing on the rope here!
So, it's really a matter of responsibility. Every forum member is expected to be responsible, not only for himself, but to take some responsibility for the safety of this forum, for the safety of it's owners, admins, mods and members. It concerns especially older members - those who are here over a year should know it already. OSIT.
mudrabbit
Jedi Master
I think it eventually becomes apparent to most people looking for objectivity that the PTB have their own ways of finding out who you are. Those who look for objectivity and Truth are a danger to the PTB. How do we think they deal with it? Well, I think that first they have to know who you are. And what better way to do that then to strike a note that you resonate with. Examples being the war on Iraq, pollution, cruelty to animals, the gas crisis, income taxes, et al. None of which directly address the real issues of this world.
Laura stated elsewhere and more than once, that there is a website designed for each and every one of us to engage us in endless circles and keep us from learning objective Truth. I would assume that goes for organizations as well.
In some cases, they simply stroke that particular note that you resonate with and you’re hooked. Sign a petition, now they have your name and email, or IP number. If you think the service providers here in this country are safeguarding your identity and whereabouts, think again.
Another way they can do it is through the snail mail, and I only know this because it is a personal experience. When I lived in Florida, I used to get junk mail that asked me to become involved in different Moslem organizations. It was obviously assumed that because of my last name that I am affiliated with the religion, and that I speak Arabic. Nothing could be further from the truth. Why would they send me this stuff?
They have pictures of starving waifs and mothers with soulful eyes, staring at the camera. Perhaps if this was happening in a country that I came from, I might feel compelled to join or donate to any of these various organizations. It’s just too easy to see if one just opens their eyes. They’re stroking heart strings in you that “theyᾠ do not possess.
I think this whole tax thing with Ed and Elaine Brown is designed to hook more of us. Right through the gut. Why else would they make such a big deal out of it, and hardly mention Scooter Libby’s pardon? My own opinion is that they are testing the waters. Can you imagine? All those armed marshals waiting to shoot at you? Hiding in the bushes outside your house? Just try to imagine for one minute how you would feel in the same position? And let’s talk about this house he has. Can you honestly say that anyone that didn’t have an agenda would build it and stock it as he did?
So now the PTB want to test the waters, see how we all respond, gauge their chances, because they’re running out of time. Wouldn’t want to be on their list.
Perhaps there’s a big change coming up and they’re trying to see how it will go for them if they implement, or see if perceived ethnic groups will rebel by sending money elsewhere to hide it. Just speculation, but it’s just too darned coincidental that notice arriving with my papers stating I’m only allowed so much to live on before having to pay taxes on the rest. I’ve never seen one of those before, and never have avoided paying taxes.
I remember that Don Juan cautioned to Carlos Castenada how important it was to remain invisible. I don’t think he meant that literally.
Then we have the teachings of this man, Jesus, who cautioned us to be in the world, not of it, and to render unto Caesar what is Caesar’s. Very good advice, IMO, because we can’t DO much if we’re out in the front lines, with raised fists and rebellious hearts. They’re the first ones to get shot.
Peg
Laura stated elsewhere and more than once, that there is a website designed for each and every one of us to engage us in endless circles and keep us from learning objective Truth. I would assume that goes for organizations as well.
In some cases, they simply stroke that particular note that you resonate with and you’re hooked. Sign a petition, now they have your name and email, or IP number. If you think the service providers here in this country are safeguarding your identity and whereabouts, think again.
Another way they can do it is through the snail mail, and I only know this because it is a personal experience. When I lived in Florida, I used to get junk mail that asked me to become involved in different Moslem organizations. It was obviously assumed that because of my last name that I am affiliated with the religion, and that I speak Arabic. Nothing could be further from the truth. Why would they send me this stuff?
They have pictures of starving waifs and mothers with soulful eyes, staring at the camera. Perhaps if this was happening in a country that I came from, I might feel compelled to join or donate to any of these various organizations. It’s just too easy to see if one just opens their eyes. They’re stroking heart strings in you that “theyᾠ do not possess.
I think this whole tax thing with Ed and Elaine Brown is designed to hook more of us. Right through the gut. Why else would they make such a big deal out of it, and hardly mention Scooter Libby’s pardon? My own opinion is that they are testing the waters. Can you imagine? All those armed marshals waiting to shoot at you? Hiding in the bushes outside your house? Just try to imagine for one minute how you would feel in the same position? And let’s talk about this house he has. Can you honestly say that anyone that didn’t have an agenda would build it and stock it as he did?
So now the PTB want to test the waters, see how we all respond, gauge their chances, because they’re running out of time. Wouldn’t want to be on their list.
Perhaps there’s a big change coming up and they’re trying to see how it will go for them if they implement, or see if perceived ethnic groups will rebel by sending money elsewhere to hide it. Just speculation, but it’s just too darned coincidental that notice arriving with my papers stating I’m only allowed so much to live on before having to pay taxes on the rest. I’ve never seen one of those before, and never have avoided paying taxes.
I remember that Don Juan cautioned to Carlos Castenada how important it was to remain invisible. I don’t think he meant that literally.
Then we have the teachings of this man, Jesus, who cautioned us to be in the world, not of it, and to render unto Caesar what is Caesar’s. Very good advice, IMO, because we can’t DO much if we’re out in the front lines, with raised fists and rebellious hearts. They’re the first ones to get shot.
Peg
mudrabbit Peg wrote: << I think this whole tax thing with Ed and Elaine Brown is designed to hook more of us. Right through the gut. Why else would they make such a big deal out of it, and hardly mention Scooter Libby’s pardon? >>
I don't think they're making a big deal out of it at all -- not on the national scale. The mainstream media aren't covering this much except for Plainfield's local TV station in NH. I noticed that YouTube videos on the subject have vanished, etc. CNN will put stuff about it on their website but not on TV, etc. At least that's what I've noted.
I don't think they're making a big deal out of it at all -- not on the national scale. The mainstream media aren't covering this much except for Plainfield's local TV station in NH. I noticed that YouTube videos on the subject have vanished, etc. CNN will put stuff about it on their website but not on TV, etc. At least that's what I've noted.
mudrabbit
Jedi Master
Apologies Ad,
I saw it on more than a dozen websites, and a cable station had something on it here in NC. I was't paying too much attention to note which station it was, channel surfing after work, late at night.
There's also been extensive posting on other groups, and sites like what*really*happened has shaken it to death like a dog with a bone.
Perhaps it just seems to be in my periferals.
Peg
I saw it on more than a dozen websites, and a cable station had something on it here in NC. I was't paying too much attention to note which station it was, channel surfing after work, late at night.
There's also been extensive posting on other groups, and sites like what*really*happened has shaken it to death like a dog with a bone.
Perhaps it just seems to be in my periferals.
Peg
Well, you're right there, Peg, it's a big deal in the rarified margins, the Patriot circuit, RBN, etc., I've seen a lot of it. We were just talking two different contexts. I imagine the mainstream will cover it only if something "happens."
mudrabbit
Jedi Master
It's almost like they bombard you with the media of choice, guess to see who's watching where. Then it slowly fades, while something else similar to the ilk of Paris Hilton makes news. Then I wonder if they sit back and follow where it goes and who reacts.
I would imagine the PTB would be highly interested in seeing how much news on the internet is payed attention to as opposed to the MSM. If they were looking to see how coverage spread on the internet, this one sure did it.
Peg
I would imagine the PTB would be highly interested in seeing how much news on the internet is payed attention to as opposed to the MSM. If they were looking to see how coverage spread on the internet, this one sure did it.
Peg
I am truly sorry for my rude and insulting behavior on this forum. I certainly overreacted to mudrabbit's reply, and I would like to offer him my apologies.
However, on a more positive note, the posts on this topic has certainly caused me to reassess the anti-tax movement and it's motives.
In any case, the last thing I want to do is jeopardize SOTT or compromise anyones welfare that is involved in this work. I can't begin to describe how Laura's books and writings on have increased my understanding of reality and have been of personal benefit. Again, my sincerest apologies.
However, on a more positive note, the posts on this topic has certainly caused me to reassess the anti-tax movement and it's motives.
In any case, the last thing I want to do is jeopardize SOTT or compromise anyones welfare that is involved in this work. I can't begin to describe how Laura's books and writings on have increased my understanding of reality and have been of personal benefit. Again, my sincerest apologies.
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