Malaysian Airlines Flight 17 Crashes in Ukraine

Today SOTT carries an RT article about a new court case against Ukraine brought to the European Court of Human Rights by four Germans (with an overview of other cases pending):

https://www.sott.net/article/324581-Failed-to-protect-life-European-court-green-lights-MH17-relatives-lawsuit-against-Ukraine

The European Court of Human Rights has given the green light to a lawsuit filed by relatives of MH17 passengers against Ukraine. It alleges that Kiev intentionally kept airspace over the war-torn eastern Ukraine open and failed to protect the passengers' lives.

The European Court of Human Rights (ECHR), Europe's major court authority, has communicated the lawsuit to Ukraine which appears as a defendant in the lawsuit filed by four relatives of passengers who died in the Malaysian Airlines MH17 crash two years ago. The case was communicated to Ukraine in July but the ECHR published the papers related to the case only in early August with its Factsheet.

Four applicants named Tim Lauschet, Elena Ioppa, Chris Kenke and Denise Kenke, all German nationals, claim that the Ukrainian authorities "failed to protect the relatives' life by not completely closing the airspace above the ongoing armed conflict in the region through which the MH17 flight passed."

continued...
 
Source: http://www.straitstimes.com/world/europe/mh17-criminal-probe-out-next-month-dutch-prosecutors

MH17 criminal probe out next month: Dutch prosecutors

Published Aug 19, 2016, 7:13 pm SGT

THE HAGUE (AFP) - Initial results from a criminal probe into the downing of a Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 over war-torn Ukraine two years ago will be revealed next month, Dutch prosecutors said on Friday (Aug 19).

The results are expected to shed light on the exact type of missile used to shoot down the jetliner on July 17, 2014, killing all 298 passengers and crew on board, and exactly where it was fired from.

"We have informed victims' relatives that we will have a new meeting on Sept 28 where the results of the criminal investigation will be unveiled," said Mr Wim de Bruin, spokesman for the Dutch public prosecutor's office.

The information specifically relates to "which weapon was used and from where it was fired," said Mr De Bruin, whose office is leading an international team of investigators.

Next month's meeting, to be held in Nieuwegein outside Utrecht in central Netherlands, will be open to relatives only in the morning, followed by a press conference in the afternoon, Mr De Bruin said.

Relatives last month marked the two year anniversary of the incident when the Boeing 777 was shot down during a routine flight between Amsterdam and Kuala Lumpur. The majority of those on board were Dutch citizens.

An international inquiry concluded last October that the plane was downed by a Russian-made BUK missile fired from a zone held by pro-Russian separatists, but stopped short of saying who was responsible.

Separatist authorities deny responsibility for the disaster, saying Ukrainian forces were responsible for the attack.

The European Union in early July formally extended damaging economic sanctions against Russia by six months due to lack of progress in resolving the conflict in eastern Ukraine.

EDITED to add:
the following blog post http://ukraineatwar.blogspot.nl/2014/07/launch-location-detected-of-missile.html claims to already know the missile type and the launch site, it being a SA-11 Surface-to-Air 'BUK' missile launched from a place called Snizhne.
 
Source: http://www.nltimes.nl/2016/08/31/mh17-survivors-turn-eu-help-getting-information/

MH17 survivors turn to EU for help getting information

Posted on Aug 31, 2016 by Janene Pieters

Relatives of MH17 victims asked the European Union for help in getting more information on the plane crash in eastern Ukraine in July 2014. They want the EU’s foreign policy chief Federica Mogherini to put pressure on those involved to release, among other things, missing radar images, ANP reports.

The family members wrote a letter addressed to Mogherini. They state that Russia, the Ukraine and the United States still have not released all “relevant information”.

The letter writers believe that Prime Minister Mark Rutte has limited space to act in this instance because he can not interfere with the criminal investigation into the disaster. But they hope that the EU can play a role in getting the outstanding information. According to them, there is a difference between interfering in the investigation and ensuring the adequate cooperation of all countries concerned.

The missing radar images have been a sore point for the relatives since some stationary radar images of the disaster was anonymously emailed to Stichting Vliegramp MH17, the foundation that represents the victims’ relatives, in January. Following this the government stated that it would not file an international complaint for these images, as there is enough available information to conduct the criminal investigation. The first results of the criminal investigation will be released late next month.

Flight MH17 was shot down with a BUK missile over eastern Ukraine on July 17th, 2014. All 298 people on board were killed, including 196 Dutch.

Similar report here: http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2016/08/mh17-relatives-urge-brussels-for-help-in-getting-radar-satellite-images/
 
Source: http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2016/09/dutch-government-feared-social-unrest-after-mh17-disaster-according-to-secret-documents/

Dutch government feared social unrest after MH17 disaster, according to secret documents

September 1, 2016

Top civil servants feared social unrest in the Netherlands in the days following the MH17 plane disaster, newly-released papers (in Dutch) reveal.

After monitoring social media in the wake of the downing of the Malaysian Airlines flight from Amsterdam in July 2014, killing 298 people, officials warned that this kind of ‘anger and impotence can lead to social unrest,’ reports the NOS (in Dutch).

People were frustrated by the fact that professionals did not have access to the disaster area where 196 Dutch citizens died, after the plane was hit by a missile over eastern Ukraine.

Public documents have been released by court order, after a successful freedom of information (WOB) request from the Volkskrant paper, NOS and RTL Nieuws broadcasters. Some parts of these documents had been redacted – with parts of the text blacked out – and others were previously unreleased. The NOS reports that many are still secret.

The documents show that civil servants prioritized victims’ families in all public ceremonies and meetings rather than dignitaries, says NOS.

ANP adds (also Dutch) that they also show the Dutch government assumed that Russian separatists were behind the crash from day one, and instantly assumed that ‘given the images of the crash, the probability of survivors is nil’. Their preference was to bring the perpetrators to court in the Netherlands.

Earlier this week, families of the victims said they had written to the European Union to try to find out more information about the crash, saying no authorities had yet found ‘all the relevant information’.

Similar, but different: http://www.nltimes.nl/2016/09/01/more-mh17-docs-released-dutch-govt-assumed-russian-separatist-to-be-responsible/

More MH17 docs released; Dutch govt. assumed Russian separatist to be responsible

Posted on Sep 1, 2016 by Janene Pieters

A court forced the Ministry of Security and Justice to publish more documents on the disaster with flight MH17 thanks to a joint call on the Freedom of Information Act by broadcasters NOS and RTL Nieuws and the Volkskrant. A number of new details were revealed, including that the Dutch government assumed from the first that Russian separatists were behind the downing of the plane.

The documents released are the interpretation in reports of the National Coordinator for Counterterrorism and Security written shortly after the disaster. It involves facts over what happened, the perpetrators and large problems expected to follow. RTL Nieuws published the documents on their website, they can be seen here (PDF, in Dutch) and here (PDF-2, in Dutch).

The Dutch government quickly realized that no one could have survived the crash and that there were probably many Dutch victims. They were right – 196 of the 298 victims were Dutch. “Given the images of the crash, the probability of survivors is nil”, the documents read. And: “(…) it is very likely that some of the victims are of Dutch nationality. Given the holiday period it is likely that there were several children on board.”

Officials also worried about major emotional unrest the disaster will cause. “The event will cause a lot of emotions given the high number of (Dutch) victims… If there are children among the victims that will increase the emotions… If there are signs that the plane was shot down, this will create an additional shock, especially if it was done intentionally.” The government held a close eye on opinion polls, the media and comments on social media.

The reports also reveal that senior officials initially wanted prosecution of the perpetrators to happen in the Netherlands. “Prosecution in the Netherlands is desirable.”

The documents also reveal how the government handled the aftermath and the problems they faced from day one, for example difficulties with the repatriation of victims. “The Netherlands is at risk of becoming a pawn in the propaganda war”, can be read in a Security and Justice report titled Risks and threats.

On July 23rd, six days after the disaster, the National Coordinator sent a piece to the crisis team of ministers that read: “The unguarded state of the disaster state and the reported compromise of wreckage reaffirm that investigation into the circumstances of the disaster will be difficult. There may also be need to take into account the possibility that not all bodies or body parts will be found or identified.”

The Day of National Mourning is also discussed in the documents. On July 22nd officials were discussing holding the mourning day on September 25th. It was also proposed to only have a dozen victims carried from Eindhoven Airbase to Hilversum in hearses, the rest in simpler coffins with army vehicles, “otherwise it will take too long”. But by shortly afterwards the Ministers decided to have the Day of National Mourning the next day, July 23rd. All arrangements for the ceremony were made in less than 24 hours.

The documents make clear how important the government found it to have family members centrally involved at all meetings.

The reports on meetings of the Special Ministerial are still completely confidential, according to RTL. The country lawyer that released the documents stated that the unity of government policy would be jeopardized if these reports were released. It would also make Ministers more hesitant to speak freely if the content of their confidential discussions are made public. The three news agencies therefore decided to continue their lawsuit against the government.
 
Struggling Malaysia Airlines slashes prices on long-haul routes from London and gives away free flights as customers and crew desert it following twin disasters video
_http://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/travel_news/article-2736560/Struggling-Malaysia-Airlines-slashes-prices-long-haul-routes-London-gives-away-free-flights-customers-crew-desert-following-twin-disasters.html
State-owned airline giving away flights in 'My Ultimate Bucket List' promotion
Malaysia Airlines has slashed its prices for long-haul routes and is giving away flights as it struggles to hold onto customers and crew following two air tragedies that killed hundreds of people.

The beleaguered airline is offering a sale from London Heathrow Airport to Kuala Lumpur and nine other destinations in Malaysia, with return economy class flights selling for as little as £570 on select dates.

It is also offering cut-price deals to customers in Australia and New Zealand, and is reportedly giving away 12 return flights to Kuala Lumpur, the Malaysian capital, as part of a competition called ‘My Ultimate Bucket List’.
Malaysia Airlines is cutting its prices amid reports that its passenger numbers have dropped and nearly 200 cabin crew have resigned, causing crew shortages, in the wake of this year’s disasters.

Customers appear to be deserting the airline as photos posted on social media show nearly empty cabins.

In July, 298 passengers and crew were killed when Flight MH17 was shot down over eastern Ukraine – in an area controlled by pro-Russia separatists – while it was en route to Kuala Lumpur from Amsterdam.
And 239 passengers and crew are missing and presumed dead after Flight MH370, travelling from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing, veered far off course and disappeared over the Indian Ocean in March. No wreckage

The Australian and Malaysian governments have agreed to share the £28m price tag for the new phase of the search for Flight MH370, which is thought to have crashed 1,100 miles off Australia's west coast.

Meanwhile, the state-owned airline is set for a shakeup, with analysts predicting that it will slash jobs, drop money-losing routes to Europe and China and replace top management in an announcement that is expected tomorrow.

It was already struggling when the twin disasters occurred, losing nearly £1bn since 2011. Malaysia Airlines regional senior vice president Lee Poh Kait told news.com.au that the sale aimed to help rebuild trust.

He said: ‘We would like to thank our passengers for their support during what has been a difficult period.

‘We are committed to regaining the confidence of our customers and sending them on memorable holiday experiences as a trusted five-star carrier.

‘With unbelievable savings these deals are a very competitive offering as we build a stronger Malaysia Airlines.’
 
Thanks for finding and sharing c.a.

Earlier this year they already withdrew from Amsterdam-Schiphol airport completely and cut back on other European destinations as well.

They seem to be doing worse ever since.
 
Palinurus said:
Thanks for finding and sharing c.a.

Earlier this year they already withdrew from Amsterdam-Schiphol airport completely and cut back on other European destinations as well.

They seem to be doing worse ever since.

Agreed, flying has become something of a crap shoot these days. So, can't blame one for being well informed thus staying Vigilant.
"These are the days of Many wonders"
_https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h1ki3AbK8tM
http://avherald.com/
Friday Sep 2nd 2016
 
5th Episode of MH-17 Inquiry: 'It Was a MiG' Aug 30, 2016
http://russia-insider.com/en/politics/5th-episode-mh-17-inquiry-it-was-mig-video/ri16248
The 5th episode of MH-17 Inquiry has just been released, and it looks like a blockbuster.
MH17 Inquiry
Contrary to all speculation heretofore that Malaysian airlines flight MH-17 might have been shot down by a SU-25 - an aircraft primarily intended for the ground attack role - the producers of this documentary advance a different theory
The MiG-29 has the speed, operational ceiling, and armament to shoot down a Boeing 777. And Ukraine has plenty of the fighters in its inventory.

screen_shot_2016-09-02_at_3.45.32_pm.png

MiG-29s of the Ukrainian Air Force (Russia Insider)
 
Again, thanks for finding and sharing c.a. :thup:

I checked the whole topic and found several previous mentions by different authors of the possibility that it could've been a MiG-29 who shot down MH17 with air-to-air missile(s) and on-board cannon(s):

August 13, 2014 (Reply #298)

November 14, 2014 (Reply #352)
November 15, 2014 (Reply #364)
November 15, 2014 (Reply #365)
November 16, 2014 (Reply #372)
November 16, 2014 (Reply #373)
November 20, 2014 (Reply #378)

December 28, 2014 (Reply #397)

No other mentions since then, which is kind of weird... :/

This MH-17 Inquiry channel you came up with is very interesting indeed, and I'm awaiting their next episode(s) eagerly -- but without anticipation of course. ;)
 
For archiving purposes -- SOTT catching up:

https://www.sott.net/article/327395-MH-17-inquiry-Episode-5-It-was-shot-down-by-a-MiG

https://www.sott.net/article/327394-More-MH17-docs-released-Dutch-assumed-pro-Russian-separatists-responsible
 
Today SOTT carries an article about new documental evidence up for auction, concerning the likely possibility of Ukrainian BUK-missiles stationed in the area where MH-17 was shot down:

https://www.sott.net/article/328004-Ukraine-did-it-Leaked-documents-implicate-Kiev-in-MH17-shoot-down

<snip>

The asking price at the auction, http://newauction.ru/offer/dokumenty_mo_ukrainy-i45208172711697.html - 900 000 руб, is quite exorbitant, considering the limited range of documents, of which the coded telegram signed by Muzhenko redeploying the 3rd Battalion of the 156th Air Defense Missile Regiment to Zaroshchenskoye, is the most valuable one. That Buks belonging to that regiment were located on the Donbass was in principle established without Muzhenko's help: http://colonelcassad.livejournal.com/2738278.html.

And of course the biggest treat is that the the regiment's Buk and the "Russian" Buk which, according to the Kiev junta, shot down the Boeing, have the same tactical number. Muzhenko's document in this case debunks the long-standing lie that there were no Ukrainian Buks in the area at all, a lie that has for the longest time been the key argument used by Ukrainian propaganda. Is this confirmation worth 900 thousand rubles? I doubt it.

In the comments, this one from thorbiorn:

Latest bid 1,000,000

When I looked it appeared there is a bid of 1 million Ruble. It is still 20 days from the closing date. Let's see how high it will go.
Sun, 11 Sep 2016 16:08 UTC
 
Today SOTT carries an RT article (English video embedded) with criticisms allegedly from BUK manufacturer Almaz-Antey toward Western media distortions --mainly fed by Bellingcat reporting-- about the types of BUK missiles possibly used to down MH17 (original in Russian from Novaya Gazeta newspaper):

https://www.sott.net/article/328398-Russian-arms-producer-challenges-media-distortion-of-its-MH17-crash-inquiry

<snip>
The Dutch Safety Board (DSB) eventually concluded last October that the plane had indeed been shot down by a Russian-made BUK system - but with an older 9M38M missile series and 9N314M warhead.

Almaz-Antey carried out its own experiments last year, after which it said the weapon fragments found on the wreckage of MH17 came from an older rocket of type 9M38 with a 9N314 warhead. This weapon had been decommissioned by Russian forces, but is still in the arsenal of the Ukrainian Army.

continued...
 
Thanks for keeping up with developments and News on this Flight MH17 crash, Palinurus.

With Dutch prosecutors set to publish the second part of their probe into the July 17, 2014 crash of Malaysia Airlines Flight MH17 in east Ukraine on September 28, a team of Russian volunteers and bloggers have come up with additional facts breaking down the lies and half-truths about that tragedy.

Anti-Bellingcat Reports Debunk Myths about MH17 Crash and Russia's Hand in It
https://sputniknews.com/russia/20160917/1045405756/mh17-lies-report.html

Sputnik earlier wrote about a leaked report about the MH17 tragedy, allegedly prepared by Russia’s Almaz-Antei company, and which appeared in a recent issue of Novaya Gazeta.

A team of Russian volunteers and bloggers earlier published their first findings about the July 17, 2014 crash, aptly titled “Anti-Bellingcat Report.”

The analysis of the Bellingcat investigation shows that from the very beginning the so-called “independent experts” chose followed a pro-Ukrainian version of militiamen’s guilt for the crash. In the introduction of their report the Bellingcat authors unambiguously state that “within hours, the world became aware of the general circumstances that led to the tragedy: a group of pro-Russian separatists shot down the passenger plane with a Buk anti-aircraft missile”. According to the authors of the “anti-Bellingcat report,” however, this statement actually rules out any need for any further investigation into the crash.

First off, most of the photo and video evidence, used by self-styled researchers, were downloaded to the Internet on the day of the crash, but the authors of these photos still remain anonymous.

Based on so-called “fair evidence” presented by Ukrainian politicians, the so-called independent investigation by Bellingcat advocated the version of US military intelligence officials about the missile launch site of the Buk launcher.

It is worth mentioning, however, that neither before nor afterwards, was there any information about the use of Buk missile launchers by independence supporters. One of Bellingcat's charges concerns a satellite image showing a white transport truck carrying the Buk missile allegedly used to shoot down flight MH17.

However, this image was proven to be a fake because three of the vehicles Bellingcat claims were part of the Buk convoy are actually pictured going in the opposite direction of the site the missile was allegedly launched from.

In an interview with Komsomolstaya Pravda, Yuri Kotenok, a leading author of the “Anti-Bellingcat Report,” said that there were lots of discrepancies in the Bellingcat’s version.

“In their July 17 video we see a Buk convoy passing by a gas station in Makeyevka. A good clean road, but in a Hot News video posted on June 15 we see a road severely dented by caterpillar trucks we don’t see in the July 17 video. Meaning that in a wartime situation they had taken just one day to fix it! This is a fake, no doubt about that,” Kotenok added.

Thus all Bellingcat claims that the Boeing was downed by a Buk missile transported on a white trailer simply hold no water.

Next, the "Anti-Bellingcat Report" effectively proved that the photo showing the smoke trail from a Buk missile allegedly launched by independence supporters had either been digitally altered or taken on a different day since other photo and video evidence from July 17 have confirmed that the weather in the area was cloudy, not clear, as claimed by Bellingcat. Yuri Kotenok also said that on July 17, 2014 the sky in the area of the MH17th crash was overclouded and not clear as in the Bellingcat photo.

“This means that you simply couldn’t see any traces of a missile launch. The Bellingcat photographs provide no particular time frame of when they were made and their volunteers tend to disappear in a very mysterious way,” Kotenik said.

This means that there was no missile launch from Snizhne (an area controlled by independence supporters) and that the photos of a white smoke trail against a clear blue sky used in the Bellingcat report were forged.

In additional proof of this, Mikhail Malyshevsky, an adviser to Almaz-Antei Concern’s chief designer, flatly denied allegations that the missile that shot down the Malaysian airliner had been fired from Snizhne because in this case the right side of the plane would not have remained intact.

“All they want everyone to believe is that the missile had come from Snizhne, but this is not true because if fired from there it could not have reached the aircraft under that angle. If they agree [that the missile been launched from the territory controlled by Ukrainian armed forces] then their entire version will fall through,” Malyshevsky said.

As to the crucial Bellingcat claim – that MH17 was hit by a single Buk SAM in the hands of the Donbass militia, the report reiterated that this is a practical impossibility, since the detection range of a single Buk is limited to 120 degrees in azimuth and 7 degrees in elevation, and its effectiveness of fire is limited.

A single Buk system can guard only a pre-assigned airspace sector with knowledge of its potential targets' parameters, up to and including enemy flight time (that is, to wait in 'ambush' mode). Without this information, normally provided by support systems elsewhere in the military command, a single Buk is not capable of precisely locating and then hitting its target. The authors of the "Anti-Belligcat Report" will continue their work to debunk the myths and falsifications being spread by the Bellingcat “experts.”
 
Thanks angelburst29 for this new article. It's an apt complement to the current discussion in Russia I think, full of background tidbits.
 
SOTT now carries another installment from RT (again new English video embedded) about the criticisms of BUK manufacturer Almaz-Antey concerning the evidence of BUK particles hitting MH17, based on a different original Russian source:

https://www.sott.net/article/328546-Dutch-experts-refused-to-see-Russian-MH17-experiments-and-analysis-wrong-about-key-parameters-of-crash

<snip>
The video alleges that the Dutch investigators pointed to the wrong type of warhead, having found just a couple of butterfly-shaped holes on the cockpit of the Malaysian Boeing downed over Ukraine. Meanwhile, one of the experiments by Almaz-Antey with same payload has produced dozens of such holes, which suggests that the international experts made a mistake in establishing the exact type of rocket that hit the plane.

The angle at which Flight MH17 was hit, and therefore the place from where a missile was launched, were also calculated wrongly by the Dutch investigators, Almaz-Antey said.

continued...
 
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