opiate withdrawal

quick note on aa.i have been to meetings,and have always veiwed it as organized religion.if u have ever been to church and aa,u will see what i mean.i have taken responsibility for my actions,but i think it is silly to go into the past and possibly causing more harm to someone u care about,when it would seem to be a matter of karma.beleive me,i have been working through a lot of bad karma in this life,and i dont think the word "sorry" is ever gonna change that.thank you again for your thoughts.
 
the one thing i would love to try is [removed by moderator].i wish it was available to me.to scott and anyone else interested,there is a great video on the net called [removed by moderator] "it actually creates a new receptor in your brain for about 4 months and blocks all the symptoms of withdrawal while putting you on a psycedelic journey that makes you examine yer life and depending on yer frame of mind,will help you figure out the root of yer addictions.quite an amazing thing.if anyone knows how to obtain it in canada without travelling or shelling out many thousands of dollars,please let me know.thnks again.

[references to controlled substance removed by moderator, please see forum guidelines - while this substance may have hypothetical therapeutic potential, at the current time it is illegal]
 
stevie,i hear you,and i think it is worthwhile if it works for you.my best friend was the worst kind of addict(we called him a garbage can)and he just celebrated his eleventh year clean from everything.he still goes at least once a week.im not sure i beleive him,but he says he couldnt have done it without aa.i think it is just a personal thing.personally though i think it works if you give yerself fully to the program,but if i could do that,then why couldnt i give myself fully to quitting on my own?not sure if i itterated that properly,but i just wanted to clear up my last post about it.ty
 
Hi davey72,

I've removed your email address from your signature block to protect your privacy. To upload a picture or avatar have a look at this topic called How do I add an avatar?

By the way welcome to the forum. :) We recommend all new members to post an introduction in the Newbies section telling us a bit about themselves, and how they found their way here. Have a read through that section to get an idea of how others have done it. Thanks.
 
As a drug and alcohol nurse I am very interested in what the C's have to say about opiate addiction and addictions in general.

Opiate Treatment Services usually work under the banner of harm reduction. In short, by the person obtaining a maintenance dose of opiate, reduces the need for most people to deal, steal or prostitute to obtain drugs off the street. This has flow on benefits for the person, their family and the community.

Davey 72 I don't wish to comment directly about your situation but in general I have found that: 1. you need a plan; 2. reduce off as slowly as you can; 3. do it inconjunction with a drug and alcohol counsellor; and 4. have all other areas of your life in order before stopping completely.

Good luck, aaron.
 
Davey72, an additional tip would be to check out the EE meditation technique. Probably the best thing you could do for yourself. Cheers mate, aaron
 
I'll be really interested in hearing what the C's say on the issue as well.

I think with all the research connecting diet to mental health, that more connections will be made to diet and substance abuse as well. I think many addictions may start as self medicating some deficiency in the body. I don't doubt there are connections to trauma as well, but diet doesn't have the prominence in recovery that it should have either. And besides a cursory 'take care of yourself by eating well' I don't think it's known at all in the addiction and recovery fields. I did a short stint as a recovery case manager, and when I would bring up the topic with others in the field, it was met with blank stares. And now with the DSM-V classifying eating healthy as a mental illness, I wouldn't doubt if some of my co-workers now think I'm ill!

Davey, I'd suggest doing some reading in the diet forums, as this might provide for some useful material in your recovery. Best wishes to you.
 
ty arron and shane.both very helpful.i agree with arron about her general assessment.i will definately look into diet,and as far as ee;i did start learning it,but for some reason i seem to kind of forget about my passion for the truth with the distractions of my life for periods of time,then,like waking from a dream,i come back to it.i also have roomates,but i already have the desire to commit to the meditation.
 
i would also like to say that im realizing that i have some chronic pain issues that are becoming pretty acute in the last week.for the people with medical knowledge.im at 25 mgs.going down by 5mg/week,but am gonna reduce it to 2mgs/week
 
RyanX said:
anart said:
RyanX said:
Just as a disclaimer, I have no experience dealing with substance abuse, so this is just idol opinion:

At AA meetings, isn't the basic idea that one has to take full responsibility for one's actions and and the effects they've had on others? If one is still under the spell that the alcohol or the _______ decides one's actions, then there is no acknowledgment of responsibility, which implies that one has no control over the addiction itself.

Martha Stout says in the Myth of Sanity that those who recovered from DID by and large were patients who took responsibility for their actions, even those made outside of the awareness of their own personality. Maybe there is a parallel here between DID and other substance abuse addictions?

FWIW.
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Hi RyanX, it's my understanding that DID and substance abuse are two very different things. It's also my understanding that one doesn't recover from DID, though there are increasing levels of functionality.

I'm also quite interested in what the C's have to say about this.
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Yes, that is correct Anart, one doesn't recover from DID. It's been awhile since I read Myth of Sanity, but I recall Martha Stout describing how some patients were able to better deal with this disorder after taking responsibility for their condition; my memory could have betrayed me though. Whether this is the case with substance abuse or not I don't know, it just struck me that AA groups were essentially trying to do the same thing, that is, encourage one to take responsibility for one's condition and behavior. They could just be apples and oranges though, even though the concepts are similar.

I'll be very interested in what the C's have to say about this as well.
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It is my understanding that, as with DID, one doesn't recover from a substance addiction. One can learn to control it, live with it, but it doesn't go away. That is why most alcohol addicts for instance have to chose to not drink any alcohol anymore ever. There are very very few who can learn to drink in moderation without falling back into the addiction, but the majority just has to quit drinking alcohol forever. For me, that's not recovery, it is exercising control over it so it doesn't control you.
 
i agree with that.to mr spock about censoring my post-i dont know if it makes a difference,but it is legal here in canada.it is done on vancouver island,and in toronto in a clinical setting. i wont mention it again,but i think if you watch the video i recommended,u would see the value in letting people know about it.ty
 
davey72 said:
to mr spock about censoring my post-i dont know if it makes a difference,but it is legal here in canada.
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I'm not sure if you are referring to the post that was censored due to the mention of a certain substance. It was removed for the safety of the forum. The substance you mentioned is not legal everywhere and so it's important when we post to try and take that into consideration. If we were to be shut down for mention of said abuse, that wouldn't just affect you but everyone else. In short, when we post here, we try to take the needs of everyone into consideration. Hope that clarifies. :)
 
Hi Davey,
I'm in Ottawa and I've had my share if prescribed opiates over the years as a result of spinal nerve damage, failed back surgeries, fibromyalgia and rheumatoid arthritis (heh, I must have been something nasty in my last life an I'm clearing out a lot of karma in this one).

I was scheduled for methadone treatment as a form of pain relief, which I had been avoiding like crazy.

A couple of months ago, a transdermal patch was approved by both the FDA and Health Canada that boosts the value of the opiate considerably and yet the drug in the patch is considerably low dose (the patch, BuTrans, itself is measured in micrograms and systemic levels are measured in picograms and lasts a full week).

I went from taking 8 8mg hydromorphone (Dilaudid) tablets down to one or two every four hours. This is nothing short of a miracle, as my tolerance was only going to keep climbing. Now that I have been on this patch for a few months, I'm still getting the same level of pain coverage.

Regarding withdrawal symptoms, there are a few things one should know.

There's the 2 brain concept that says whenever we have a craving, the brain the wants to indulge grows at the expense of the rational, will based brain. If, however, one does not give in, the rational brain grows. Imagine if one has experienced years and years of giving into impulse and desire. The other brain is so atrophied that it can barely put up a fight. This explains why will power is so lacking when some of us need it the most. It just is so tiny, it can't fight. Therefore, one needs to grow that brain and shrink the other by refusing to give in to impulses. One could easily start with simpler impulses by purposefully placing oneself around minor temptation and resisting giving in. This helps build the rational, will power side.

The other thing, and I'm sure you know, is that it is easier to treat the withdrawal symptoms (nausea, hot/cold flashes, aches, etc.) in concert with gradually weaning off, than to wean off without such supports.

The weaning off triggers all sorts of things, including partial withdrawal and a return of whatever reason one was taking opiates.

If chronic pain is the reason, a chronic pain clinic should be sought. In Canada, this if free under your provincial health care, provided you are referred by your family doctor. There are many ways they can help with pain, including nerve blocks, meditation, etc.

If pain is no longer as severe, it may be possible to learn mental techniques of dealing with or blocking pain.

As mentioned earlier, the EE program, which is a series of breathing exercises (similar to yogic breathing) are really helpful. EE also helps with some of the symptoms of withdrawal.

Finally, I have found taking (he supplement 5-HTP quite beneficial. 5-HTP is a serotonin precursor. Since serotonin is the satisfaction chemical of our body, there is a strong connection between addiction and serotonin.

I hope some of the responses you have received offer you some comfort. I have a pretty good idea what you have gone through vis a vis withdrawal.

Oddly enough, I never had much withdrawal with hydromorphone, other than my brain increasing in pain perception to trick me into taking more. Morphine was the absolute worst though.

Kind regards,
Gonzo
 
yes,that is pretty much what i figured,and why i didnt mention the word again,but is it that cut and dry?just about everything is illegal somewhere,so im not sure i quite get it yet.ty
 
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