Organic Portals: The Other Race

Beau

Administrator
Administrator
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FOTCM Member
doviine said:
I've experienced the growth of my own conscience. Where would that fall in?
Maybe what you have experienced is the opening of your emotional center. If you have just started to feel emotions for others(empathy), then it's quite possible you previously had a sleeping emotional center. Are there any experiences of late which could be the catalyst for this?
 

doviine

The Force is Strong With This One
beau said:
doviine said:
I've experienced the growth of my own conscience. Where would that fall in?
Maybe what you have experienced is the opening of your emotional center. If you have just started to feel emotions for others(empathy), then it's quite possible you previously had a sleeping emotional center. Are there any experiences of late which could be the catalyst for this?
Hi beau....

The growth I'm talking about has been an ongoing process that began at age 14.
1977 was the crucial year. At that time I was a psychopath in the making. I was confronted (internally) with a choice. I chose sanity/reality but continued to behave anti-socially for another 2 years.

My life had become so uncomfortable I sought help. While in-patient I experienced some "seeding." Slowly my moral consciousness grew... but feelings were slow to catch up.

I'm much better now but as time goes on hindsight reveals horrors that before seemed insignificant. This, I believe is AQUIRING of emotions - not awakening, as they were killed around age 7. It's more like a process of re-learning, like having to learn how to walk again - one doesn't have one's walking center re-activated, they learn from "scratch."

This took a lot of force of will on my part. Learning was vicarious and then had to choose to internalize and act on the recognition of reality.
 

doviine

The Force is Strong With This One
DonaldJHunt said:
If you have a conscience, then you are not a psychopath. There are non-psychopaths whose consciences are not functioning, the C's call them damaged souls. Non-psychopaths have a potential soul and conscience but that doesn't mean they have a functioning one at a particular point in time.

So judging by your signature, you say as a teenager you were a psychopath but have since developed a conscience. That's probably not that unusual but the process is interesting. Care to elaborate about how it happened for you?

doviine said:
I've experienced the growth of my own conscience. Where would that fall in?
Hi DonaldJHunt...

I am a (self-proclaimed) recovering narcissist/psycho-sociopath. I've experienced the planting of seeds in my life and went years searching but not realizing I simply had to water/nurture them... and expose to light/others.... and then practice. It's been a long, heartbreaking journey.
I'm more than happy to share about it.
 

Ruth

The Living Force
doviine said:
I am a (self-proclaimed) recovering narcissist/psycho-sociopath. I've experienced the planting of seeds in my life and went years searching but not realizing I simply had to water/nurture them... and expose to light/others.... and then practice. It's been a long, heartbreaking journey.
I'm more than happy to share about it.
Hi doviine, the mind (and perhaps the brain also) is a very complex, not very well understood and even controversial area from what I've seen.

Medicine, of which Psychiatry is a part; tends to be conservative on the whole. Nobody (my opinion only) should have the 'final say' on it, regardless of their qualifications as it seems to me that this area needs to be a booming, dynamic area; full of ideas, controversies and different approaches. From what I've seen (student nurse - clinical experience only) psychiatry tends to emphasise the medical/scientific over spiritual and other potentially influencing things. So, nobody's got 'all the answers'.... and as as my Dad used to say... psychiatrists, they're all a bit weird, don't you know? I think he felt that it 'helped' them understand people struggling with their difficulties, but it may have been that psychiatrists too struggle with difficulties (as we all do).

You seem to have 'aquired' a label of sorts 'narcissist/psycho-sociopath'. Well, the question I would have is does that describe your behaviour or your soul?

These two are seperate things. The fact that you refer to your journey as 'heartbreaking' suggests that you feel emotion (which, according to my own beliefs, a psychopath is unlikely feel - they're not 'big' on that).

I'm not sure if this forum has any real psychiatrists (although it may have one or two psychopaths), but you need to be aware of what a dynamic and interesting area you are involved in. You also need to be aware that 'trusting' people is always risky and that you (ultimately) have control of your own develpment, which includes questions and interations, as you do your future (like everyone else). Make the best of it!!
 

Third_Density_Resident

Jedi Council Member
Organic Portals, the "Second Death", Reincarnation, NDEs

C's transcript said:
Q: Do "organic portals" go to fifth density when they die?

A: Only temporarily until the "second death."
This conversation, and its implications, has bothered me for quite some time, and only now have I formulated a series of questions that I hope people on this forum can help answer. I didn't know where else to post this, as it seems to cover a variety of topics, so I ended up choosing this forum (obviously).

The first, most obvious question that arises is, "What is the second death?" Is it a dissolution of "soul essence" back into the soul pool from which an organic portal being sprang? If so, then why the need for this soul essence to migrate first to Fifth Density? Wouldn’t it be easier for the soul essence to dissolve upon death? I would also be interested to know "how long" after death does the second death occur, and whether the personality of the individual is retained between first and second death?

Are all those people who report profound experiences after clinical death ("near-death experiences") souled individuals? If we hypothesise that both souled and non-souled individuals migrate to 5th Density after death, one could conclude that both OPs and non-OPs are able to have NDEs. I have read some accounts of people who were met by loved ones or an "angel of light" who told them that once they step beyond a certain point, they would never again be able to manifest with the same personality on earth. This to me seems indicative of an OP's "second death" – they would lose their individuality and "dissolve" into the light, which in their case could represent the "soul pool", even though most describe it as "God". On the other hand, one could argue that those individuals who report having a life review are indeed non-OPs, otherwise what use would information about their previous life serve if their individuality was about to disappear? I guess, however, that it could be hypothesised that "life review" information would still contribute to the expression of "Prime Creator" or "God" or whatever you want to call it, irrespective of whether one's individual nature was about to disappear or not.

As for reincarnation, it seems reasonable to conclude that only souled beings will ever be able to report past lives, because unsouled beings "dissolve" at the end of each life.

So far, I have not found much information at all from the C’s relating to the nature of 5th Density. What precisely is the "recycling zone", and why would it be located "above" 4th Density? It just seems a little strange that after we die we skip 4th Density and go straight to 5th. One thing I can recall is that the C’s mentioned something to the effect that once we have evolved enough, we no longer recycle once in 5th Density, in other words, reincarnation is no longer a requirement.
 

JGeropoulas

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Organic Portals, the "Second Death", Reincarnation, NDEs

I have wondered about many of these things myself and will try to respond more sustantively soon, but in the meantime, let me recommend 2 books that have "found" me recently. For me, both of these books have served to fill in the kind of details you've inquired about.

Power Vs. Force by David Hawkins, M.D., Ph.D. is a discussion of fascinating research into consciousness and is one of my most-cherished books for which I'm deeply grateful. (That category also would include Laura's "stellar" gift to us of her voluminous articles about the C's material.)

Hawkin is a gifted teacher who writes very clearly about complex matters -- and about that which he's actually experienced. The research he shares in this book was inspired by his own unexpected (as a farmer's son in Minnesota in the 1940's), transforming experiences of enlightenment at 3 and 12 years of age. In fact, his research is based upon what could easliy be considered another form of "channeling" (i.e. tapping into higher levels of consciousness). In this case, this kinesiology-related technique discovered by others, involves a distinct, easily-detected bodily response which indicates whether a stated proposition is "true" (i.e. life enhancing) or "false" (i.e. life diminishing)! As he proposes in the Preface or the Introduction (don't skip either!), "What if I could show you a technique by which you could always know if a statement was true or false? How might that transform your world? Think of the impliications of that one thing!" (i.e. the C's mantra, "Knowledge protects")

In a beautifully-controlled demonstration, Hawkins taught this technique as part of a seminar presentation. He then he randomly divided up 100 volunteers into 50 pairs. He handed out one sealed envelope to each pair. (Each envelope contained either vitaman C powder or the artificial sweetener aspartame; and each envelope was unmarked except for a reference number on the outside linking the envelope to a master contents list to be used for verification and statistical analysis.) He didn't tell them anything about the contents at all. He instructed them to practice the newly-learned technique to rate the truth of this proposition: "The contents of this envelope are good for me", and write down "True" or "False" on the envelope. After a verbal tally was taken by calling out their reference numbers, Hawkins told them to open the envelopes and do a taste test (if rated "True" the powder should taste sour, and "False", sweet). These novices' ratings were 100% accurate, and there was 100% reliability when this experiment was repeated numerous times at subsequent seminars!

Using this technique (e.g. "if 1000 is total enlightenment, 'Pride' is less than 500? [T]...less than 200? [T]...less than 100?" [F]), Hawkins has established a logorithmic reference scale from 0 ("Non-Being") to 1000 ("Total Enlightenment") as a relative map of the levels of consciousness 20 is "Apathy", 50 is "Shame", on up through "Guilt", "Desire", "Anger" to 190, "Pride" which is the highest level of the Negative frequencies. He discovered that 200, "Courage" ("a willingness and openness to the unknown"), is the first step on the staircase up into the Positive frequencies of consciousness.

Using this scale as a reference point, Hawkins has organized, calibrated, and mapped out many things in the realms of metaphysics, quantum physics, and consciousness (e.g. abstract qualities like truth; religions, original and degraded; the human race as a whole; progress across reincarnations; etc.). In fact, he even proof-read this book's manuscript with this technique and found content errors -- not typos (e.g. John Lennon did not belong a list of those who'd "self-destructed" because he was murdered)! He even rates each of his chapters on the 0-1000 scale (range from 840-890!).

Interestingly, Hawkins has "inquired" (using this kinesiological technique) about the state our earthly population. Not surprisingly, he learned that 85% of humanity is below 190 -- not even open to expansion of consciousness (as Jesus (rated 1000) pointedly stated in one of those rare portions of the Bible that escaped the disinformation process, "the road to destruction is broad and many will travel it, but the road to life is narrow and few there are who will find it.") Hawkins findings are that the average frequency level of consciousness for humanity as a whole has been stuck at 190 ("Pride") for centuries, but around 1998, humanity's frequency of consciousness inched upward to 207! (see Laura's pondering about the significance of the year 1998 in the last third of her article "The Beast and His Empire").

He goes into some interesting findings about the logarithmic superiority of high frequency consciousness when weighed against low frequency consciousness: 1 being at 1000 can offset the entire negativity of the rest of humanity on earth; 12 beings at the 700 level equal 1 at 1000, etc. (similar to the C's comments in Chapter 13 of The Wave Series where they said "yes,"there are beings who have come to earth at this time into human form to anchor the frequency, so that when the wave comes enough of us will be ready, the frequency will be set, and the the change in the planet can take place as it has been planned.

Hawkins also discusses the quantum physics concept of "attractor patterns" that shape our invisible energies positively or negatively (i.e. STO or STS). He even describes Jesus much as the C's do, enlightened one who makes available to those who ask his own "attractor pattern" (i.e. the C's call it a "soul template"). He says humanity's problems all stem from masses of low frequency (i.e. low energy) beings siphoning off each others' energies. Thus, true Love (500) is nearly absent in this world, because it only can exist when people rise to a high enough frequency that can serve as a conduit through which Absolute Consciousness can flow into others.

[Look for article review I'll post soon regarding recent success scientists have had in slowing down light enough to utilize it for telecommunications vs. physical wires or fiber optic cables. This promises to be 1000 times faster than fastest technology]

Overall, I found Hawkins book completely harmonious with the C's material, but zoomed in to a greater level of detail pertaining to our human experience. Thus, this book provides rich potential for actively applying these findings -- and this very simple "channeling" technique -- in our daily lives as we seek to increase our frequency of consciousness (i.e. enlightenment).

Treat yourselves to this wonderful book which seamlessly integrates quantum physics complexities, metaphysical mysteries, and religious abstractions to provide a practical tool with vast potential to accelerate your personal expansion of consciousness. I see this and other rays of light beaming into our decaying, fascist culture as the continuing approach of the The Wave. Surf's up! ;)

The other book that "found" me recently was Original Christianity by Peter Novak

Let me begin by saying that I've been around the block more than a few times with Christianity, church, faith, conversion, etc.; I've long ago abandoned any illusions about the "inerrancy, infalliability, inspiration" of the "Holy" Bible; and I've read all Laura has written from the C's info and her own studies on the disinformational nature of the Bible.

But that said, I found this book intriguing because Novak discusses the meaning of those "lost" first-century documents that were unearthed in Nag Hammadi, Egypt in 1945. These 35+ "other gospels" contain the metaphysical teachings of Jesus that are only alluded to in the "official" Bible (of disinformation and political power). He does a great job introducing the basic plot of censorship and transformation of the Roman military machine of oppression into the Roman Christian church of oppression (as in book- and people-burning). Possession of any of these documents was grounds for death, which is a pretty good way to expunge writings from planet earth back then. Fortunately, some brave soul buried his library that interestingly was discovered just when the lights started going out in in 1945 (WWII, Hiroshima, USA becomes world power, NSA, CIA, Roswell).

More importantly, his thesis is simple and well-developed: the oldest doctrine on earth is the Binary Soul Doctrine (BSD) as it's been termed. He does a great job of demonstrating this is the central tenet discovered by all enlightened beings through the ages and reflected in all true "religions" prior to their corruption by later unenlightened literalists who followed. Novak begins by taking the reader through the oldest piece of literature on earth, The Epic of Gilgamesh . Without any contortions, he shows the clear themes of the BSD contained in the characters and plot. From there, he quickly moves forward through all major religions, through original Christianity, and all the way up to modern times with Freudian concepts (e.g. conscious, unconscious) and neurological concepts today (e.g. left brain, right brain), tracing the central tenets of the BSD.
This also brings to mind the discussion of Laura and the C's regarding the "Fall" of mankind being related to our DNA being tweaked so that now we are dominated by the other (i.e. "wrong") side of our brain.

Novak goes on to demonstrate convincingly that all cultures have embraced the key tenet of BSD of reincarnation, including early followers of Jesus, as evidenced in these "lost" documents, which is why they were banished. Reincarnation eliminates the one looming judgement day concept of monotheism, which is the leverage needed by the "official" church where any knowledge or or access to personal power could not be permitted (i.e. religious fascism).

This BSD was completely new to me, but after a first reading of it, it seems to harmonize with the C's information. The central challenge contained in the BSD is for us to seek to unite the divided parts of ourselves while in this current life, whatever we want to call these (conscious, unconscious; soul, spirit; ying, yang; etc.). In other words, we must face the dark part of ourselves, the truth about ourselves--and God and the universe--because this truth sets us free from continual reincarnations without any accrual of wisdom (i.e. retaining memories of each life), thus the C's admonition once again is relevant "knowledge protects." This process also reminds me of Laura's discussions of consolidating our magnetic centers, etc. a la Gurdjieff, Mouravieff, Ouspensky's writings

I think you'll find this book provides some rich material to consider regarding your concerns and questions. Below are several pages from the book that introduce the BSD if you want more details.

Despite the machinations of the official church, it remains clear that at least some early Christian groups originally believed in reincarnation. The question is, how did they reconcile this with resurrection, Christianity's single most fundamental and central belief? The whole promise of Christianity relied on the Resurrection. Jesus rose from the dead, and thanks to Him, it was declared, everyone else could. But if early Christians already believed that people regularly came back from the dead, returning to reincarnate again lifetime after lifetime, what need could they have seen for a general resurrection of the dead at Judgment Dayor, for that matter, for any savior's self-sacrifice to guarantee that resurrection? This has remained a long-standing mystery. For the past 1,500 years, it has not been understood how both beliefs could be held simultaneously. Thanks to church censorship, no documents existed that would explain it. With the rediscovery of the lost scriptures of Nag Hammadi, however, it has finally become possible to tackle this mystery. With these ancient works in hand, we are no longer totally dependent on the adulterated data stream the official church has been feeding the human race for the past 1,500 years.

But we still have work to do. These recovered scriptures do not paint as clear and direct a road to our goal as we might have preferred. Virtually all the texts found at Nag Hammadi are filled with mysterious and obscure passages; although scholars have been studying these works for decades, huge portions have defied comprehension. It is no secret why this is so; these works openly identify themselves as Jesus' secret teachings, not meant to be read, and certainly not meant to be understood, by all. The Bible itself says that Jesus had two separate and distinct sets of teachings-one for the masses, and quite another for His closest disciples:

The disciples came to him and asked, "Why do you speak to the people in parables?" He replied, "The knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them." (Matt. 13:10-11)

These "heretics" considered themselves devout Christians, yet they believed in both reincarnation and resurrection. This mystery has never been explained. Some have suggested that Original Christianity only believed in reincarnation, and not resurrection, but we have enough evidence to rule out such suggestions. In the Gospel of Thomas, for instance, Jesus repeatedly praises the religious knowledge of Judaism, and those Judaic scriptures clearly prophesy a coming Universal Resurrection at Judgment Day. There is no doubt, then: Mysterious elements in the early church believed in both resurrection and reincarnation. But how?

There is an answer. A very popular and widespread theology once existed within the Roman empire that would explain this mystery (along with many other mysteries within Christianity), and this theology is readily apparent in the rediscovered scriptures found at Nag Hammadi. This ancient belief system is virtually unknown to the modern world, however. As one might suspect, it failed to survive the 1,500-year editing and censorship campaign of the official church.

The Binary Soul Doctrine

Thousands of years ago, numerous cultures all over the globe believed essentially the same thing about death and the afterlife. They thought that human beings possess not one, but two souls, which usually would divide at death, each going off to a very different sort of afterlife. These ancient cultures often described those two souls in very similar ways, frequently referring to them in the same way modern psychology now describes the two halves of the human psyche. One soul was thought to contain one's free will and intellect, while the other contained one's emotions and memory. The intellectual soul was said to possess the person's life force and could not leave the person's physical body without resulting in death. The emotional soul, however, was deemed capable of wandering free from the body and was said to commonly do so during sleep, disease, or mystical experiences.

Although these two souls were tied closely together inside a person's heart during life, they were generally believed to divide from one another at death, literally ripping the person's nonphysical essence apart into two disconnected fragments. After this division, which was often called "the second death," the intellectual half of the person was often believed to reincarnate, while the emotional half was generally thought to become trapped in a dark and dreary dreamlike netherworld.

The Second Death: A Journey Written in Stone

Ancient Egypt is one of the best-documented examples of a culture that believed in this "binary soul doctrine" (BSD). It devoted huge amounts of its resources to the problem of death and the afterlife, and its most famous monument reflects this obsession. The interior of the Great Pyramid of Cheops, with its multiple chambers and forking passages, seems specifically designed around the binary soul afterlife theology. Just as Egyptians believed the living possess three elements: a body, a soul (Egypt's ka), and a spirit (Egypt's ba). The pyramid has three unique chambers that seem to mirror the expected afterlives for each of these elements. Similarly, the passageways between these chambers closely reflect Egypt's vision of the processes and changes thought to occur along the journey from life to death.

Fifty feet above the base, the pyramid's entrance opens into a steeply descending, claustrophobically narrow corridor that descends almost to ground level, then forks into two branches. One branch plummets farther, to an underground chamber known as "the pit," while the other branch ascends again. This ascending passage eventually forks into two branches as well, one leading to the "Queen's Chamber" and another to the "King's Chamber." The first fork in the pyramid's corridor seems to represent the "first death," the initial change people experience upon their demise, when their mind and body disengage and go their separate ways. Similarly, the second fork seems to reflect the "second death," when the spirit and soul disengage as well, fracturing the mind.

At the first fork, one branch continues downward under the monument until it reaches a rough-hewn cave containing nothing but a shallow, empty pit. Crudely carved out of the actual bedrock, this grave-like cell is small, dark, and airless, perfectly symbolizing the end of the physical body at death. Meanwhile, the ascending branch rises just as sharply upward again, appropriately symbolizing the hopeful promise of the mind's survival as it separates from its failing corpse. The very beginning of this upward passage is blocked, however, by a thick granite plug, an appropriate reminder that nothing physical can escape the inevitable descent into death. Of the three components Egyptian theology credited a living person as possessing, only the two nonphysical elements, the ba and ka, could hope to pass into this ascending corridor.

On the other side of that granite plug, the person's ba and ka could continue together, proceeding through the passage until they reached the place where it also forks off into two directions…

Some BSD cultures taught that the after-death division of the soul and spirit was inevitable, but a few believed that it was possible to avoid it. Those nations believing that the second death could be avoided, such as Egypt and China, focused most of their religious efforts on helping people escape it. Those convinced the division was inevitable, on the other hand, tended to emphasize the importance of one soul and devalue the other, which made their imminent division seem less threatening. But until Christianity came along, the second death was thought to be irreversible and permanent. If the second death caught you, all hope was lost. The person you had been in that lifetime, that "self," would be ripped completely apart and would never truly exist again. Even though it was widely believed that half of one's being might yet go on to reincarnate after the second death, this seemed small consolation for the perpetual loss of memory and identity lifetime after lifetime, and the endless suffering of the other half of one's being in its mindless netherworld prison.

This binary soul doctrine was the cultural mindset when Christianity was born. And, despite what the official church later maintained, Christ does not seem to have refuted this story. Instead, He added a new chapter to it. For the most part, Original Christianity assumed the same assumptions and spoke the same language as all the BSD cultures around it, only adding one new element to the story line-it was now possible to overcome the second death: "He who overcomes will not be hurt at all by the second death" (Rev. 2: 11).

If Jesus had come bearing an entirely new and unfamiliar message, telling the citizenry of the Roman Empire to discard everything they had previously believed to come and follow Him instead, few would have listened. But that's not what happened. Instead, His movement picked up followers at an amazing rate throughout the empire because He and they were already on the same page in their underlying cultural beliefs. Christ provided a solution to a problem everyone already knew they had, a solution no one previously had thought possible. This was the great message that won so many converts to Christianity, the unprecedented breakthrough the world had been waiting for: Even if someone died and suffered the second death, it was now possible for them to live again. 'Jesus said, 'I am the resurrection. He who believes in me will live, even though he dies'" (John 11:25).

No one had ever said this before. Although a few cultures claimed to know the secret of avoiding the second death before it struck, no one had had the audacity to claim that he could reverse its effects after the fact.

As we will see, a number of the lost Christian scriptures found at Nag Hammadi are unmistakably based on this ancient dual-soul religious system. Until now, the theology of these scriptures remained undeciphered; the Gospel of Thomas, for example, begins with a challenge, declaring that the whole book points to a single mystery, and if one can identify that mystery, one will never die. Until the rediscovery of the BSD, no analyst or theologian had been able to identify that common denominator in Thomas' passages. In addition to deciphering the Gnostic Gospels, the forgotten theology of the BSD explains a plethora of other mysteries about early Christianity; it immediately explains, for example, how the early church could simultaneously believe in both resurrection and reincarnation: While one soul might incarnate again and again, the other was thought to remain trapped in a static heavenly or hellish dreamworld reality after death, and so still needed to be rescued via resurrection. In book after book, and passage after passage, these Nag Hammadi scriptures demonstrate that the BSD was the original foundation of Christ's teachings.
 

Third_Density_Resident

Jedi Council Member
Organic Portals, the "Second Death", Reincarnation, NDEs

Thankyou for your reply.

I have just done a little bit of research on David Hawkins and his use of "applied kinesiology" (AK), and my findings aren't positive. It appears that there is very little, if any, scientific evidence for the merits of this so-called science. Now, don't get me wrong here: I am well aware that there are websites out there such as "Quackwatch", "Skepdic", and the "JREF" (that's James Randi's "educational" foundation) dedicated to not really doing any proper scientific research at all but rather to suppressing potentially breakthrough science which does not conform to the mainstream materialistic paradigm. Naturally these sites are skeptical and dismissive of applied kinesiology. However, what I have very often found with my research in the past into other "alternative" medicines is that there will nearly always be numerous sites that contain well-researched, independent data from reliable researchers that supports such alternative science, such as Homeopathy. Sadly, this is not the case with applied kinesiology. (And also note: many proven alternative sciences often have webpages that direct the enquirer to various research papers which show the validity of said sciences. One of the main pages for AK has few links, none of which try in any way to counter the claims of its skeptics -- another bad sign.)

However with that said, I do believe that some forms of dowsing do work (there is too much evidence to dismiss it outright), and it is my understanding that AK is a type of dowsing; a questioning of the body. With that in mind, I concede that it is still possible that there is a small kernel of truth in what Hawkins is doing, but I think his methods and also underlying purpose are highly suspect.

For instance, the idea of "rating" a person on a scale of 1 to 1000 immediately struck me as being similar to the methods of Scientologists. I have done a lot of research into Scientology, and one of their main goals is to get people into their cult and "clear" them -- "clear" is a level of being which is free from all "alien attachments" -- things which supposedly cause disease, and other emotional stress. Beyond "clear" there are many more levels which can be reached, and the higher one goes, the less "negative" someone becomes, and the more "spiritual" they are. While Hawkins may not be removing supposed attachments from people, he takes it for granted that someone with a higher "rating" is closer to spiritual enlightenment, without ever confirming, with a different methodology, to see whether a person really does appear to be enlightened. In other words, he believes that his methodology is infallible, which reeks of cultic behaviour.

As for the person himself, it is not hard to find damning, verifiable information about him. The first piece of damning information is his assertion that women cannot reach full enlightenment and need to reincarnate with a man's body, because women would not be able to "handle" such an energised state. More From Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_hawkins

In 2005, Hawkins stated that Condoleezza Rice is probably the most brilliant person in Washington, D.C., and that he would vote for her for President of the United States.

Hawkins considers television host Bill O'Reilly of the Fox News Channel to be a model of integrity.
Need I add more? I don't think so.

(And while Wikipedia is not necessarily reliable, the above statements are independently verifiable.)

Moving right along...

This book, Original Christianity by Peter Novak, seems more promising. While I will shortly endeavour to do some research, just looking at the excerpt you provided, it does seem to be consistent with some of what the C's have said, as well as research into Near Death Experiences (by the way, much can be learned from research into NDEs (contrary to the beliefs of some), because the collective data taken from them is just another source of information which can be used to corroborate other data, especially relating to more esoteric concepts such as Organic Portals and even "Food for the Moon"). Case in point:

Peter Novak said:
But until Christianity came along, the second death was thought to be irreversible and permanent. If the second death caught you, all hope was lost. The person you had been in that lifetime, that "self," would be ripped completely apart and would never truly exist again.
This is very interesting indeed, as it certainly is consistent with some NDEs, as well as the idea of Organic Portals. Continuing:

Even though it was widely believed that half of one's being might yet go on to reincarnate after the second death, this seemed small consolation for the perpetual loss of memory and identity lifetime after lifetime, and the endless suffering of the other half of one's being in its mindless netherworld prison.
I don't know about "endless suffering", but this is suggestive of the "Food for the Moon" doctrine. I wonder what link the source of this material has with Gurdjieff?

Well thanks again for the reply. Hopefully I've enlightened you with regard to David Hawkins, and your information relating to the Second Death will hopefully enlighten me also.
 

stardust

Jedi Master
Organic Portals, the "Second Death", Reincarnation, NDEs

Third_Density_Resident said:
So far, I have not found much information at all from the C’s relating to the nature of 5th Density. What precisely is the "recycling zone", and why would it be located "above" 4th Density? It just seems a little strange that after we die we skip 4th Density and go straight to 5th.
I suggest you to see the "Tree of Life" re-designed by Laura which shows the links between each densities ( it is in her Book " The secret history of the world" but I don't know if you could find it on this site)
The position of the fifth density is special, a kind of crossroad between the second, third, forth and sixth D. Don't think in term of "linearity". The fifth is not really "above" the forth D.

In my experience of kinesiology, I must say that I find very suspect this story of rating a person about his/her supposed enlightenment...
As in a lot of thing , I think kinesiology can be able of the best and of the worse...all depend of WHO practice, and HOW it is practiced. Believe me if I say that I have seen incredible results with this technic for example on allergy, pain reduction, or emotionnal stress...
But it is necessary to have some "safeguards" because it is easy to derive and test anything.
You talked about a "so-called science" , I talked about "experiments". As the C's experiment , with a oui-ja board , nevertheless you don't question that : the work is made seriously and doesn't focus only with the answers of the C's . A technic like kinesiology should be practice in the same state of mind, in my opinion.
Since several weeks , I make an experiment in Health Kinesiology on myself about the concept of STS/STO answers. I can't absolutely say where it will lead me, neither if it is possible to my body (physical-emotionnal-psychic) to make a difference ( as we are STS even we expect to be STO), but what I've observed it is a big difference with the way of working. It is as if a sort of verbiage had disappeared. And certains obsessions too.

I don't know David Hawkins and his AK , but what is sure is there are crooks everywhere... It is not because one egg is rotten that the others are too ;)
 

ScioAgapeOmnis

The Living Force
Organic Portals, the "Second Death", Reincarnation, NDEs

Can somebody say what this technique is? I keep hearing "his method" or "his technique". We have a technique to see if something is true or not - look for data and evidence and apply critical thinking. What other technique is there? Some New Agers talk about "feeling" the "vibrational frequencies" of a statement to "feel" if it is true, but that's verifiable nonsense. It just sounds to me like whatever technique it is, it sounds like a shortcut that tries to cut out the necessary work to discern the truth. In other words, it just sounds fishy.
 

ark

Administrator
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Organic Portals, the "Second Death", Reincarnation, NDEs

You learn this technique by applying it. It is much like learning to drive your car. You err, you correct the course. So, listen to the voice within, listen at each turn, and learn how it feels when the voice tells you: "you are ok". Ar first it is difficult to hear this voice at all. So, some kind of a "directed meditation" may help. And when I say "directed", I mean "meditation with a specific purpose".
 

manitoban

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Organic Portals, the "Second Death", Reincarnation, NDEs

JGeropoulas said:
Power Vs. Force by David Hawkins, M.D., Ph.D. is a discussion of fascinating research into consciousness and is one of my most-cherished books for which I'm deeply grateful.
I first came across this book when I attended a lecture by Wayne Dyer a few years ago. During the lecture, this book was promoted by Wayne, and it was available for sale along with many of Wayne's books. I haven't read the book, so can't comment on it, but if I am not mistaken, Wayne Dyer is a well known proponent of the "You create your own reality" school of thought, so I thought I should mention this connection, which makes me wonder about it.
 

Third_Density_Resident

Jedi Council Member
Organic Portals, the "Second Death", Reincarnation, NDEs

stardust said:
I suggest you to see the "Tree of Life" re-designed by Laura which shows the links between each densities ( it is in her Book " The secret history of the world" but I don't know if you could find it on this site)
The position of the fifth density is special, a kind of crossroad between the second, third, forth and sixth D. Don't think in term of "linearity". The fifth is not really "above" the forth D.
Yes, I have read The Secret History of the World and was especially intrigued by the Tree of Life section, so much so that my avatar picture used to depict the Tree of Life. (And on a subconscious level, I guess that explains why my new picture is a group of literal "trees of life".) I'm well aware that 5th Density is not really "above" 4th, which is why I used quotation marks around the word above in my previous post. However, I can't deny that I found this section of the book rather tricky, and so I plan on reading it again soon, possibly after I've acquired some more knowledge. I know that all these Densities are hypothesised to actually interpenetrate one another, but I was of the understanding that it is in fact FOURTH density that links 1st, 2nd and 3rd with 5th, 6th, and 7th; after all, 4th Density is purported to be half etheric and half physical; whereas 1st-3rd are completely physical and 5th-7th are completely etheric. And this is why I have trouble understanding why a recycling zone would exist entirely within the etheric -- wouldn't it make more "sense" if the recycling zone contained elements of both the physical and the ethereal? I know it's absurd for me to be telling the universe that it's got it all wrong, and that in reality this just reflects that I don't understand enough, and that there is not enough data available to any of us at present to make "sense" of it all.

stardust said:
You talked about a "so-called science" , I talked about "experiments". As the C's experiment , with a oui-ja board , nevertheless you don't question that : the work is made seriously and doesn't focus only with the answers of the C's . A technic like kinesiology should be practice in the same state of mind, in my opinion.
I did acknowledge that there is probably a kernel of truth in what David Hawkins was doing, since it is basically a type of dowsing, and I have read scientific data that validates the effectiveness of dowsing (when done properly by a competent dowser). However after reading about Hawkins himself, I suppose I transferred his suspect nature upon applied kinesiology as well (guilt by association type of thing) without firstly realising that it's a form of dowsing, and that dowsing works, and so AK should work also (when done competently). As for questioning the C's, well Laura already did all of that; it took her literally years of research and channelling to decide that they were genuine, benign entities.

manitoban said:
I first came across this book when I attended a lecture by Wayne Dyer a few years ago. During the lecture, this book was promoted by Wayne, and it was available for sale along with many of Wayne's books. I haven't read the book, so can't comment on it, but if I am not mistaken, Wayne Dyer is a well known proponent of the "You create your own reality" school of thought, so I thought I should mention this connection, which makes me wonder about it.
I have always been suspicious of Wayne Dyer, simply because of this "you create your own reality" mentality. That Wayne Dyer endorses a book by someone with exceptionally questionable views only confirms for me my suspicions.
 

stardust

Jedi Master
Organic Portals, the "Second Death", Reincarnation, NDEs

ScioAgapeOmnis said:
Can somebody say what this technique is? I keep hearing "his method" or "his technique". We have a technique to see if something is true or not - look for data and evidence and apply critical thinking. What other technique is there? Some New Agers talk about "feeling" the "vibrational frequencies" of a statement to "feel" if it is true, but that's verifiable nonsense. It just sounds to me like whatever technique it is, it sounds like a shortcut that tries to cut out the necessary work to discern the truth. In other words, it just sounds fishy.
You can go to www.subtlenergy.com/articles/articles/clinical_abstracts.htm

You will find clinical datas about "manual muscle testing" which is the base of all kinesiology methode.

This technique was first developped by a chiropractor who find there was a link between each muscle and energetic systeme ( acupuncture meridians) .
An other important data in K. is that the body has a memory, all events of your life are recording , and not only by brain. I give you an example : You got an accident with physical trauma. Even after many years , and "total" remission, you can always have for example a difficulty to stay in a certain position or you will avoid inconsciously to be in this particular position, the position you was when the accident arrived. The big emotionnel stress, fear, + physical trauma is sufficient to create a reaction of defense , and the body will automatically avoid to be an other time in the same position. It's really "pavlovian".

So kinesiology in this case will work on the emotionnal component to undo this kind of reaction because sometimes, it is very uncomfortable for the person who can't understand why he/she feels bad when in certains circumstances.

It's true there is a part of feeling or intuition in Kinesiology, but the purpose is to verify it with others ways, and I know some kinesiologists who are physiotherapists, or doctor at base, and who never listen their intuition in working in K. No one can say if they obtain better results that the others.
 

JGeropoulas

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Organic Portals, the "Second Death", Reincarnation, NDEs

ScioAgapeOmnis said:
Can somebody say what this technique is? I keep hearing "his method" or "his technique". We have a technique to see if something is true or not - look for data and evidence and apply critical thinking. What other technique is there?
When I get my book back in the next few days, I'll make a separate post and include the verbatim directions Hawkins provides for this very simple technique (which he cites as having been discovered by someone in recent decades). Basically it involves a distinct muscle reflex that goes weak in the presence of any thing/idea that's toxic, unhealthy, or false.

Interestingly, I told a nurse friend of mine about this last week and she remarked that she'd heard about that 10 years ago in nursing school. In fact, she said they did a class exercise using the technique and it was 100%
accurate in detecting who was lying to their exercise partner!

As I understand it, Eastern medicine conceptualizes the body in terms of energy systems with and "inner-to-outer" schematic (vs. the "physical function" schematic of Western medicine systems, such as "respiratory"). In contrast, Eastern medicine systems each would include a particular chakra, with related organs, muscles, nerves, and skin surface areas. This is the basis of acupuncture in which manipulation the outer affect certain inner organs. And conversely, an inner organ might express itself in a rash on the outer skin.

I'm eager to research which chakra and inner organ the muscle utilized in this technique is linked to. Suppose it's the pineal gland or the pituitary gland, which the C's have confirmed link to us to higher psychic realms. Suppose it's the Brow Chakra, which is linked to clairvoyance, enlightenment, and access to the Akashic Records of all knowledge.

In pondering this today, I realized that this technique and Laura's channeling technique both involve the same indicator muscle and both require two people working together in unision who are at least at a 200 level of consciousness, which is the first rung of positive energy. Then I thought of the odd tradition of "arm wrestling," a physical event that seems to hinge on the strength of this same muscle which is isolated in the physical posturing involved in arm wrestling. If so, then it would make perfect sense that perhaps that odd contest may have originated as a means of settling disputes because whoever was lying, guilty, etc. would be prone to weaken and lose. And then there's dowsing, which also would involve this same muscle group (at least the forked-branch version). Just some thoughts that "came to me" ;)

Stay "tuned"
 
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