price of silver and gold after the dollar crashes

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immortalphoenix

Guest
just wondering after listening to both podcast on the coming economic apocalypse which talks about the coming crash of the U.S and the dollar.
How much would gold and silver be worth (using valve in dollars would be easier to understand) (dollars per once) and what kind of purchasing power will they have
 
immortalphoenix said:
just wondering after listening to both podcast on the coming economic apocalypse which talks about the coming crash of the U.S and the dollar.
How much would gold and silver be worth (using valve in dollars would be easier to understand) (dollars per once) and what kind of purchasing power will they have
That's not the real issue. There's both liquidity and price. You could end up with high priced gold and silver that has become very illiquid because it has been made illegal to hold. Where you have to engage in backdoor or under-the-table transactions if you want to buy anything with your illicit yellow stuff.

There's two precedents for gold becoming illegal - John Law and the Banque Generale, and FDR and the Great Depression. Of the two, John Law's (or Jean Lass's, depending on whether you spoke French or not) Banque Generale is more relevant. BTW, Banques are not called Banques anymore in France due to him - they've used the word "Credit" ever since. Credit Mayonnaise, er, Credit Lyonnaise, for example.

If you're talking about probable price targets, well, $850 gold in 1980 is about $2000 in today's dollars. That gives you a rough estimate. I'd do your own research before buying gold. And if you've never bought anything that has large price swings, I'd find some other way to deal with what's coming. Gold is not for the faint of heart.
 
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immortalphoenix

Guest
well i was thinking of buying silver and secondly i live in Australia so i do not have the same legal issues as the americans do in the purchasing of gold and silver

P.S- if want to get silver and not have to worry about them tracking you (for the parnoid) buy the silver in the form of a coin collection (make sure it is pure silver)
 

wodasi

Jedi Master
I have been buying silver ( one ounce coins ) from 11.00 to 14 apiece US$ and simply hope they keep
that value at least ... I watch a country like Jamaica that has went from 8 to 1 (8 jamaican dollars to one US$
in 1991 to 65 to 1 in 2006 and wonder what a a local in the carribean would have if he bought silver
with his dollars back then ? better than 65 to 1 heh ? ( a simple boom box radio costs them a sack of JA dollars) but I think food is still resonable
I am talking about buying bullion only not collections ( reminds me of antiques roadshow on pbs,
if the dollars crashes all that collectable *hit will not buy anything ) . . .
 
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immortalphoenix

Guest
i see your point although a pure silver coin collection can go down in value the silver itself does not so in the event the that the U.S dollar crashes silver will still maintain or increase it purchasing power and it wealth
 
immortalphoenix said:
i live in Australia so i do not have the same legal issues as the americans do in the purchasing of gold and silver
Yes, perhaps, but in regards the Pathocratic PTB inflating the currency into worthlessness and making Gold or Silver illegal to hold, this possibility is just as real in Australia, and just as likely, as in the U.S. or anywhere else, IMHO.

wodasi said:
I watch a country like Jamaica that has went from 8 to 1 (8 jamaican dollars to one US$
in 1991 to 65 to 1 in 2006 and wonder
Based upon what we know of the pathocratic regimes in power today, a scenario like this seems more like a certainty than a possibility, I think.

immortalpheonix said:
i see your point although a pure silver coin collection can go down in value the silver itself does not so in the event the that the U.S dollar crashes silver will still maintain or increase it purchasing power and it wealth
I think that you guys are making the distinction between a Bullion silver collection (value based upon the current commodity value of silver) and a Collectible or Numismatic silver collection (which is valued upon other factors besides the bullion value of the commodity).
 
Silver is even MORE volatile than gold. I know as I am a futures silver speculator. Remember silver has both a monetary and industrial commodity aspect to it. I also do not see how the pathonitwits could enforce a ban. Even in the 30s with a more trusting population, they did not go door to door to confiscate and if a gigantic currency devaluation does happen, their focus would be on other power preserving matters than a small group of fanatical gold bugs and widespread "illegal" barter trades on the black market that the population will engage in to survive. Remember ultimately gold is to preserve your wealth THROUGH a crisis till you get to the other side of a new system of order where you will have the means to help rebuild. Of course you may need to part with some before things stabilize to buy needed goods or services, get across that border..., etc.

Anyways, thought I'd post this article from GoldMoney on the dangers of holding only "paper" gold and silver.

Wake-Up Call

Less than one year ago REFCO, a New York based financial services company, collapsed. Last week the London Metals Exchange took the extraordinary step to postpone what looks like the inevitable default of contracts in its nickel market. What do these two events have in common?

The customers of these firms who thought they owned metal in fact didn't. The defaults made clear to these firms' customers that they owned someone's promise to deliver metal to them, but they did not own the metal itself.

Both of these events are 'wake-up calls' and should be heeded by everyone who owns 'paper gold' instead of gold itself. The same logic applies to silver. I highly recommend reading the very informative essay by Ted Butler analyzing the LME's pending default. The implications he makes for 'paper silver' are also relevant to 'paper gold'. His essay can be found here:
http://news.silverseek.com/TedButler/1156198042.php

We are in an environment where people increasingly demand ownership of things in preference to promises. People are opting for tangible assets in preference to financial assets. As a result it is inevitable that there will be more defaults in the future. The nickel fiasco explains why. The promises to deliver nickel are greater than the amount of nickel available for delivery. There is not enough metal available to enable the shorts to deliver under their contract to meet their obligation.

Importantly, the same situation exists in gold and silver. Though the gold and silver shorts are not yet in such dire straits as the nickel shorts, they are in the same predicament. There are more promises outstanding to deliver gold and silver than the amount of physical metal available at the current price. A higher price in both precious metals as well as nickel is needed to bring their markets back into balance. The only other way to achieve that balance is a default by the shorts, reducing the size of their delivery obligation, which is where the LME is headed.

This imbalance between longs and shorts is like musical chairs. When the music stops - as it does from time to time - someone is inevitably left standing. Don't let that be you. Do not get caught on the wrong side. Own metal, and not someone's paper promise.

Examples of 'paper gold' are gold certificates issued by banks and mints, pool accounts, futures accounts and GLD, the NYSE listed exchange-traded fund. With these products you own a piece of paper rather than gold itself. Own physical metal and not a certificate purporting to be metal.

Examples of physical metal that you can own are coins, bars, high-karat jewelry and of course, GoldMoney. With GoldMoney you own physical metal. We simply place your gold and silver in a specialized bullion vault and insure it for you with Lloyd's of London. GoldMoney is not 'paper gold' because each customer retains title to the metal he/she owns, as explained in VIII(C) of our User Agreement. And if anything were to happen to GoldMoney, your gold and silver is still safe. Section VIII(C) also explains that ASL Financial & Commercial Services Limited, a regulated trust company in Jersey, British Channel Islands, will "promptly arrange distribution from the Vault of the bars" of gold and silver "to the various GoldMoney Users."

If you use someone else other than GoldMoney to store your gold and silver for you, be sure they meet the same high standards that GoldMoney achieves. Ask for the audit of the gold and their operating systems. Look for their insurance certificate. In short, compare their governance procedures to those of GoldMoney to ensure that they provide the same assurances of integrity.

Use the REFCO and LME events as a reason to take a close look at your portfolio of precious metals. Evaluate your exposure to paper, and take the safe alternative. Replace those paper promises with physical metal.

Gold should be viewed as the bedrock asset in your portfolio. In view of its importance, do not take any risks with it. So for this reason, be sure to own physical metal, and not just someone's promise.
___________________________________________

Published by GoldMoney
Copyright
 
A

artichoke

Guest
What a deal these GoldMoney people are offering! You lend your gold bullion to them (place it in their vault) and pay them a small maintenance fee.

What they don't tell you is, that lending gold is like lending Federal Reserve Notes or any other type of money. You should get interest! In the case of precious metal it's called a Lease Rate.

So the Gold Money have a whole bunch of people deposit gold in their vault. They charge a high price for some type of maintenance. They can then use this gold to securitize other transactions, even if they keep their word and keep every ounce of bullion in their vaults. (How would you even know if they didn't?) Using this gold as collateral, they can earn close to the lease rate themselves on your gold!

If this is popular, we should do this ourselves. Tell you what, I'll charge only half the maintenance fee that GoldMoney does, whatever that is. :D
 
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immortalphoenix

Guest
i think that the GoldMoney is a way for them to earn money and to take your gold off you went the second great depression comes i say get yourself a safe or safes (a good lockbox will do the same job) lockup your gold and hide it well the money place it is hidden the better (dont put all your gold eggs in one basket)
 
Yes do not keep all in one basket and this also means geographically by national boundaries. IME monitoring gold discussion boards, people go out of their way to hide their fiz but overlook the fact that it is all within one national jurisdiction with no escape plan if the local authorities go complete patho totalitarian.
 

Mr. Premise

The Living Force
on_strike_usaexpat said:
Silver is even MORE volatile than gold. I know as I am a futures silver speculator. Remember silver has both a monetary and industrial commodity aspect to it. I also do not see how the pathonitwits could enforce a ban. Even in the 30s with a more trusting population, they did not go door to door to confiscate and if a gigantic currency devaluation does happen, their focus would be on other power preserving matters than a small group of fanatical gold bugs and widespread "illegal" barter trades on the black market that the population will engage in to survive. Remember ultimately gold is to preserve your wealth THROUGH a crisis till you get to the other side of a new system of order where you will have the means to help rebuild. Of course you may need to part with some before things stabilize to buy needed goods or services, get across that border..., etc.
I don't think they will need to spend much energy on confiscation. All they would have to do is control the food and water supply for a few months and all the gold and silver will flow right into their hands.
 
Many USA gold bug types are survivalist/head for the boondocks/self-sufficient/grab-a-gun Alex Jones types.

Cutting off food and water will not effect them like the general population which essentially has no gold and silver at all to part with.

Don't think a series of Wacos and Ruby Ridges fits the cost-benefit structure of the more intelligent pathocrats.

Much much easier and vastly more profitable and lucrative to seize CRIMEX (I mean COMEX) stocks, international owned gold under the NY Fed, MATS in Delaware, and other warehouse and warehouse-like stockpiles held by banks and corporations.
 

Mr. Premise

The Living Force
Survivalism only works if very few other people are trying to survive off the land. If 5-10 million in an urban region have no food, there aren't going to be very many squirrels left after a few days ;)

Plus there really aren't that many survivalists and they don't have much gold. Also, I am not talking about cutting off food and water, just that in an emergency the government will take control of the food distribution system (they already control the water distribution system). They will still sell food for either ration coupons or bullion. Soon no one will have any gold left and they can issue a new currency

on_strike_usaexpat said:
Many USA gold bug types are survivalist/head for the boondocks/self-sufficient/grab-a-gun Alex Jones types.

Cutting off food and water will not effect them like the general population which essentially has no gold and silver at all to part with.

Don't think a series of Wacos and Ruby Ridges fits the cost-benefit structure of the more intelligent pathocrats.

Much much easier and vastly more profitable and lucrative to seize CRIMEX (I mean COMEX) stocks, international owned gold under the NY Fed, MATS in Delaware, and other warehouse and warehouse-like stockpiles held by banks and corporations.
 
More reason to NOT be in the USA and instead relocate to a low pop density, food surplus/export region.

Take heed folks and get off yer arses; what is the difference between an established immigrant vs. a desperate, starving refugee with nothing? - TIMING!
 
A

artichoke

Guest
on_strike_usaexpat said:
More reason to NOT be in the USA and instead relocate to a low pop density, food surplus/export region.

Take heed folks and get off yer arses; what is the difference between an established immigrant vs. a desperate, starving refugee with nothing? - TIMING!
I'm new here so forgive me if you've posted this all before, but where are you and what's your story? I like your nickname. As I drone along at work I find myself dreaming of taking some cash and retiring to a cheap place near the Caribbean.

I visited Caracas a couple years ago. It's got a wonderful climate, because it's near the equator but at 3000 feet elevation. Perfect weather 365 days a year (except for leap year when it's 366). It's an interesting city. And it's a one-hour or less ride over a mountain range to the Caribbean. But it's probably not the best place right now for a gringo who wants to live off of stored cash: the Chavez regime is doing various things to transfer wealth to the poorest people there.
 
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