True but then again - remembering the words of Éomer in the film of LOR when he tells his sister Éowyn that 'War is the province of men', I can't help but feel pity for the young women in Ukraine who are now being conscripted into the Ukraine army to fill the bullet sized holes left by their dead menfolk, all in the name of feminism, equality, and Marvel film inspired supernatural physical powers. Let's see how long that false idea lasts in the face of a wall of falling steel, 24/7.
Putin Recognizes Donbass Republics, Sends Russian Military to 'Denazify' Ukraine
- Thread starter bjorb
- Start date
True but then again - remembering the words of Éomer in the film of LOR when he tells his sister Éowyn that 'War is the province of men', I can't help but feel pity for the young women in Ukraine who are now being conscripted into the Ukraine army to fill the bullet sized holes left by their dead menfolk, all in the name of feminism, equality, and Marvel film inspired supernatural physical powers. Let's see how long that false idea lasts in the face of a wall of falling steel, 24/7.
There's no better way to exemplify that knowledge protects, ignorance endangers.
Not sure if in this case there's any feminism involved, although I can't be too sure, I just feel like they need to have bodies in uniforms in order to continue to receive the money and weapons they're selling in the black market, at which point.. they ran out of men, and children and old folk, so, send in the women, then the girls.. and then, they will finally concede defeat.
And this is the eloquence with which the leaders speak about the death they are delivering to the Ukrainian people
Russian forces pummel Ukrainian army’s command centers over week — top brass
Russian forces repelled three Ukrainian army attacks in the Zaporozhye area, destroying more than 425 enemy troops over the past week, the ministry reported
Donbass
Christelle Néant:
"When I began investigating the kidnapping of children in Artiomovsk by Ukraine, I had no idea of the extent to which I would uncover trafficking on an international scale and the sordid methods used to supply children to paedophile networks and organ traffickers.
Flashback. In April 2023, I interviewed a refugee from Artiomovsk, Yulia, who told me that as well as having mined and blown up their building, Ukrainian units called “Phoenix” and “White Angels” were kidnapping children in the town. This information immediately caught my attention, and I decided to investigate further to find out why Kiev was taking children away from their parents in this way.
On the very day I was conducting this interview, Russian colleagues were interviewing a little girl from Artiomovsk, whom the “White Angels” had tried to kidnap from her grandparents, claiming that her mother was dead, and that they were to take her to Germany. It was clear to me that these children kidnapped by Ukraine in Donbass were then sent abroad for all sorts of sordid trafficking, from organ trafficking to paedophile rings. Because the inhabitants of Donbass have never been able to assert their rights in the face of the war crimes committed against them by Ukraine since 2014 within the international justice bodies, Kiev enjoys total immunity at the ICC and the ECHR with regard to the crimes it may commit against the children of the region.
A few days later, other refugees from Artiomovsk confirmed the child abductions, and I discovered that the same methods were being used in other towns such as Avdeyevka (and now similar information is coming in from Kupiansk).
The last refugee from Artiomovsk we interviewed, Katia, confirmed the abduction of children by the “White Angels”, and explained that when the parents of abducted children called them to find out where they were, they claimed not to know anything about it.
Katia also told us that before the battle of Artiomovsk, they had never seen organisations like the “White Angels” in the town. These child abduction units only appeared once the fighting had started. In other words, once the city was in a state of general chaos, and the inhabitants could no longer turn to the courts to assert their parental rights. An ideal situation for traffickers of all kinds.
And their modus operandi was revealed at the 27 July 2023 conference on Ukraine’s crimes against the children of Donbass, held in the DPR (Donetsk People’s Republic). A woman, Liliya, and her daughter, Kira, gave evidence of how, at the start of the special military operation, around ten children were taken from a school in Chtchastye (then under Ukrainian control) in the LPR (Lugansk People’s Republic) to western Ukraine by the headmistress of the school, on orders from Kiev, without informing their parents.
The children were even forbidden to call their parents to tell them where they were. But Kira knew her mother’s telephone number by heart and managed to call her to let her know that they were in Lvov and then Khoust. Thanks to Liliya’s determination to find her daughter (she went to look for her in western Ukraine), we discovered how Kiev ‘exports’ the children it abducts.
The children taken from the school in Chtchastye had been taken away without any identity documents (they were not yet old enough to have passports, and their birth certificates were with their parents). When she got her daughter back, Liliya discovered that they had produced a new “original” birth certificate for Kira, who had been declared an orphan (even though her mother is alive and well)! According to Kira, the group of children with the new documents were to be sent to Poland!
Without the perseverance of Kira and her mother, no one would have known where and how the children had been taken. This is how Ukraine makes the children it abducts disappear, preventing anyone from finding out what happens to them: the parents are not informed of anything, the children are forbidden to contact them, and they are given false papers (that’s the best way to describe it, given that it’s impossible for the authorities to produce an original birth certificate when it’s in the hands of the parents) and declared to be orphans, before being sent abroad.
This is surely what happened to the children of Nikolayevka, who were taken to a holiday camp to “shelter” them, but whose parents now have no news of them.
Why use such illegal methods if the real aim is simply to shelter these children from the war? Well, because there is nothing legal about the real aim.
At the conference, Vassily Prozorov, a former employee of the SBU (Ukrainian intelligence services) explained that one of his investigations had revealed that some of the children abducted by Ukraine are sent to paedophile networks in Great Britain, via a whole network of Ukrainian and British officials or former officials who work together. At the heart of it all is one man, Sergei Borissov, a former SBU agent who was arrested in 2020 for kidnapping entrepreneurs for ransom! Strangely enough, he and his entire gang were released on bail in 2021, and here he is again, trafficking Ukrainian children to the UK! On the British side, members of MI6 and the Foreign Office are involved.
This is hardly surprising when you remember that in recent years there have been several scandals involving networks exploiting children in Great Britain, and paedophiles in the British establishment (such as Sir Jimmy Savile, whose crimes were covered up for years). And in 2021, the UK’s National Crime Agency (the NCA) stated that there would be between 550,000 and 850,000 paedophiles in Britain! In other words, there’s no shortage of customers, including very high-ranking people, for the paedophile rings that kidnap children in Ukraine.
Another investigation carried out by Vassily Prozorov revealed that several organisations registered in EU countries are also involved in ‘exporting’ children from Ukraine under the pretext of providing them with shelter. These organisations take unaccompanied Ukrainian children out of Ukraine. What happens to them afterwards is unknown. However, as early as 2022, several Western media, including Deutsche Welle and The Guardian, reported that Ukrainian children “evacuated” abroad had disappeared.
It is not only in the UK that Ukrainian children are at risk of falling into the hands of paedophile rings. In May 2023, a 52-year-old Ukrainian refugee was arrested in Poznan, Poland, for renting out children in her care to paedophiles. She adopted 10 children aged between 4 and 16. Investigators discovered that the woman rented out the children to paedophiles in Ukraine and Poland. Worse still, while the clients were abusing the children, she stood next to them to make sure they kept to the time limit (the sessions lasted 20 minutes).
In April 2022, a group of around thirty Ukrainian children disappeared in Spain on their way to the Canary Islands. That same month, an investigation was opened in Lithuania into potential child trafficking at a private Ukrainian orphanage, Perlinka, from which 43 children had been evacuated to the Baltic country. Several of the children, including girls, had complained of threats to send them to work in brothels, or that there were plans to send them to other countries, including the United States. When Ukraine demanded the return of these children, several sought asylum in Lithuania for fear of reprisals or being sent who knows where.
And paedophile networks are not the only threat hanging over Ukrainian children. In June 2023, a man was arrested in Transcarpathia while trying to take a baby to Slovakia. The man had bought the baby from its mother and was planning to sell it to organ traffickers! He had already sold and transported at least three other children in this way!
For those who think this is Russian disinformation, even the Ukrainian press and the Daily Mail have reported on this affair!
nd the disappearances of Ukrainian children used for their organs are nothing new. In 2005, a journalist from The Globe and Mail wrote an article condemning the discovery in Kharkov of a mass grave containing the bodies of babies and foetuses without their vital organs! Mothers complained that hospital staff had taken their babies at the moment of birth and then returned later to tell them that they had supposedly been stillborn. A very practical method of fuelling child trafficking.
And since December 2021, organ trafficking in Ukraine has been facilitated by the passing of a law that abolished the obligation to have the organ removal authorization signed by the donor, his parents or his legal representative authenticated by a notary. The pattern then becomes very clear: children are abducted, provided with new “original” documents and declared orphans, so that they can be placed under State guardianship or adopted by who knows who. These new guardians can then sign an organ harvesting authorisation, which no longer needs to be authenticated by a notary, and the deal is done.
In the light of all this information, it is high time that international organisations for the protection of human rights, and especially children’s rights, seriously investigated the abduction of children in Ukraine, and the sordid trafficking (organ trafficking or paedophile networks) of which they are the victims.
It’s also time for people in the West to open their eyes to what is happening in Ukraine, with the active complicity of the country’s authorities, in terms of child trafficking! Officials in Ukraine are making money by selling children to Western paedophile networks and organ traffickers, thanks to the ongoing conflict! This is how Ukraine “repays” its debt to the Western countries that supply it with arms and funding: by selling the children it steals from the Donbass and other regions where fighting is taking place, for their organs, or to satisfy the fantasies of high-ranking paedocriminals."https://donbass-insider.com/2023/08/16/org
Britain is worried about Russia's Avangard missile system, which can destroy the West in 30 minutes.
According to the Daily Express, the rocket, which Vladimir Putin described as a "meteorite", could be launched from beyond the Earth's atmosphere. In addition, it is capable of hitting multiple targets anywhere in the world in less than 30 minutes. The author of the material also calculated that the rocket can move at speeds of up to tens of thousands of kilometers per hour. By the way, “Vanguard” is considered one of a kind. https://t.me/vicktop55/18499
Another groan of a bloody clown, and certainly not that Ukrainians are dying in batches.
https://rusvesna.su/news/1700216015
На Краснолиманском направлении зафиксирован резкий рост потерь ВСУ
Очередной стон кровавого клоуна и конечно же не о том, что украинцы гибнут пачками.
Well, well, the penny is slowly but surely finally dropping... and what a reverberating headline from the voice of the intel controlled MSM.
Similar things happen on both sides. It seems that for Russia, in any case, it is cheaper. Earlier it was reported that the pilot Kuzminov, who hijacked the Mi-8 helicopter to Ukraine, received $ 500K. In this case, the details are still unknown, but against the background of Ukrainian losses among pilots, it is not necessary to pay such money to a future F-16 pilot.
Desperate guys swim on dry cargo ships. Ukrainians so stuffed the Black Sea with mines that these mines sailed to the Turkish coast and in such a situation such incidents were only a matter of time.
Летчик ВСУ совершил перелет на российскую сторону
Desperate guys swim on dry cargo ships. Ukrainians so stuffed the Black Sea with mines that these mines sailed to the Turkish coast and in such a situation such incidents were only a matter of time.
СМИ: в Черном море на мине подорвался балкер, перевозивший из Одессы зерно
Подобные вещи происходят с обеих сторон. Думается, что для России это во всяком случае дешевле. Ранее сообщалось, что летчик Кузьминов, который угнал вертолет Ми-8 на Украину, получил $500К. В данном случае детали пока неизвестны, но на фоне украинских потерь среди пилотов такие деньги будущему пилоту F-16 платить не обязательно. Отчаянные ребята плавают на сухогрузах. Хохлы так нашпиговали Черное море минами, что эти мины доплывали и до турецкого побережья и в такой ситуации подобные инциденты были только вопросом времени.
Air defense forces destroy Ukrainian drone outside Moscow — Russian Defense Ministry
Air defense forces on duty destroyed an UAV over the Bogorodskoye municipality outside Moscow," the ministry said in a report
MOSCOW, November 19. /TASS/. Air defense forces took down a Ukrainian drone over the Moscow Region, the Russian Defense Ministry said.
"At 1:00 a.m. Moscow time on November 19 (10:00 p.m. GMT on November 18), an attempt by the Kiev regime to carry out a terrorist attack on facilities on Russian soil with the use of a UAV (unmanned aerial vehicle - TASS) was foiled. Air defense forces on duty destroyed an UAV over the Bogorodskoye municipality outside Moscow," the ministry said in a report.
Earlier, Moscow Mayor Sergey Sobyanin reported the downing of a drone in that municipality, located east of the Russian capital. There were no casualties or damage, he said, citing preliminary data.
Emergencies services are working at the scene.
Good detail finally allows us to see what happens to houses when 500 kg of cast iron falls in the middle of the street - at least three out of four houses are covered by a blast wave. If anyone was in the basements, that’s where they will remain.
Another point is that the second bomb does not fly nearby, but falls exactly at the intended support in the forest belt.
The video is published by our neighbors from the 33rd Regiment of the 20th Division. The guys also note that according to reconnaissance data after the strike, we can talk about the loss of enemy manpower before the platoon and a large number of wounded."
Wishful thinking by The Institute for the Study of War
understandingwar.org
Nov 15, 2023 - ISW Press
The positional war in Ukraine is not a stable stalemate. It is not the result of fundamental realities in modern warfare that can only be changed with a technological or tactical revolution, as was the First World War’s stalemate. Neither does it rest on a permanent parity in military capacity between Russia and Ukraine that will continue indefinitely regardless of Western support to Kyiv. It results, on the contrary, from self-imposed limitations on the technologies the West has been willing to provide Ukraine and constraints on the Russian defense industrial base largely stemming from Russian President Vladimir Putin’s unwillingness so far to commit Russia fully to this war. The current balance is thus, in fact, highly unstable, and could readily be tipped in either direction by decisions made in the West.
Air defense forces on duty destroyed an UAV over the Bogorodskoye municipality outside Moscow," the ministry said in a report
MOSCOW, November 19. /TASS/. Air defense forces took down a Ukrainian drone over the Moscow Region, the Russian Defense Ministry said.
"At 1:00 a.m. Moscow time on November 19 (10:00 p.m. GMT on November 18), an attempt by the Kiev regime to carry out a terrorist attack on facilities on Russian soil with the use of a UAV (unmanned aerial vehicle - TASS) was foiled. Air defense forces on duty destroyed an UAV over the Bogorodskoye municipality outside Moscow," the ministry said in a report.
Earlier, Moscow Mayor Sergey Sobyanin reported the downing of a drone in that municipality, located east of the Russian capital. There were no casualties or damage, he said, citing preliminary data.
Emergencies services are working at the scene.
Good detail finally allows us to see what happens to houses when 500 kg of cast iron falls in the middle of the street - at least three out of four houses are covered by a blast wave. If anyone was in the basements, that’s where they will remain.
Another point is that the second bomb does not fly nearby, but falls exactly at the intended support in the forest belt.
The video is published by our neighbors from the 33rd Regiment of the 20th Division. The guys also note that according to reconnaissance data after the strike, we can talk about the loss of enemy manpower before the platoon and a large number of wounded."
Wishful thinking by The Institute for the Study of War
Institute for the Study of War
The positional war in Ukraine is not a stable stalemate. It is not the result of fundamental realities in modern warfare that can only be changed with a technological or tactical revolution, as was the First World War’s stalemate. Neither does it rest on
The positional war in Ukraine is not a stable stalemate. It is not the result of fundamental realities in modern warfare that can only be changed with a technological or tactical revolution, as was the First World War’s stalemate. Neither does it rest on a permanent parity in military capacity between Russia and Ukraine that will continue indefinitely regardless of Western support to Kyiv. It results, on the contrary, from self-imposed limitations on the technologies the West has been willing to provide Ukraine and constraints on the Russian defense industrial base largely stemming from Russian President Vladimir Putin’s unwillingness so far to commit Russia fully to this war. The current balance is thus, in fact, highly unstable, and could readily be tipped in either direction by decisions made in the West.
A little observation, what i see or it looks like that to me.
In Ukraine they were bringing some " stuff", like a "help" from the Western countries.
And now it looks like it is stopped to some extent.
Maybe because of Gaza, because of what is happening in Palestine.
In Ukraine they were bringing some " stuff", like a "help" from the Western countries.
And now it looks like it is stopped to some extent.
Maybe because of Gaza, because of what is happening in Palestine.
Yeap, it seems they're about to hit Ukraine with the good ole "it's not you it's me"
Even if he comes to power, Trump will not end conflict in Ukraine — former PM
Nikolay Azarov warned that the US authorities will be doing their utmost to keep the conflict going
Military Situation In Ukraine On November 19, 2023 (Map Update)
The AFU fired Tochka-U missile in the Belgorod region and damaged several houses; Russian strikes destroyed an ammo depot near...
southfront.press
As he wrote to us here,
Firstly, as I wrote almost 2 years ago
On the Russian side, the mistake was an incorrect assessment of the quantity and quality of "brainwashed" in Ukraine. Here I have to sprinkle ashes on my head and admit that I was also in error. I will try to sort Ukrainians into groups, as I understand it now.
The first, relatively small, fascist part of Ukraine began to fight not "for Ukraine", but "for the strategic defeat of Russia on the battlefield." These are categorically different things and this group fought (in the past tense, because many of them have already died) and is still fighting, meaning the subsequent looting of Russia after the "strategic defeat". This goal, as practice shows, is unattainable by any Ukrainian means, or with any outside help. The further it goes, the more it becomes clear, including to this very group. The main mistake on the Russian side (including mine) is an incorrect assessment of the number of this group and their ability to operate effectively.
The second group, which certainly exists, is just deceived people. People whose outlook and observation can be conditionally compared with the "observation" of a respected member of the forum, whose quote I put at the beginning of the post. Here I must make a reservation that I do not laugh, I do not make jokes, and even more so I do not condemn anyone. Anyone has the right to look here or there, to notice or not to notice anything. So Ukrainians from this group are sincerely fighting for the "independence" of their homeland, as they understand it. It is still difficult for me to estimate the number of people in this group, I can only say that I would like them to be as few as possible.
The third and last group, which should be mentioned, expressed their attitude to the ongoing processes by emigrating from the country. By itself, this group is heterogeneous, divided into two parts: those who went to the West and those who went to Russia. Quantitatively, it seems to me, parts of this group are comparable, but in this case, the total amount that can be estimated from a quarter to a third of the population of "pre-war" Ukraine is interesting, and this amount just allows me to assert that my initial thesis - "there is nothing to fight for", is in principle correct.
This is my current vision of the correctness/inaccuracy of assessments from the Russian point of view.
Now I would like to touch on what I consider to be Ukraine's mistakes. If we leave aside the fundamental unattainability of the set goal of "strategic defeat of Russia on the battlefield", which initially may not have been obvious, then further Ukrainian mistakes were the result of Russian mistakes. The Russian retreat from Kiev and what in Russia was called a "regrouping" (in fact, also a retreat) in the Kharkiv, Chernihiv, Sumy, Kherson and Zaporozhye regions was propagandistically presented and perceived in Ukraine as a manifestation of the weakness of Russian forces, although in fact it was nothing more than a correction of the original, erroneous strategy. This created or reinforced the illusion of a possible "victory" and led to the sad finale of the subsequent Ukrainian "counteroffensive", which at the very heart of its plan had a rapid retreat of Russian forces at the first blow of the Ukrainians.
I must say that both Russian and Ukrainian mistakes led to additional, unnecessary losses, but at the same time Ukrainian losses, both in relative and absolute terms, turned out to be heavier.
In the West, the understanding of this thesis is also slowly coming.
The war from the Russian side is becoming less and less "comic", but of course we are far from the Israelis with their total approach.
Russia also use old T-62 and even T-55 thanks, but they are more or less prepared in factory conditions for modern requirements.
I also want to write a little observation.
Firstly, as I wrote almost 2 years ago
I still think so, but as they say, there is a nuance. This notorious nuance lies in the erroneous assessment of some things and concerns all parties to the conflict.
On the Russian side, the mistake was an incorrect assessment of the quantity and quality of "brainwashed" in Ukraine. Here I have to sprinkle ashes on my head and admit that I was also in error. I will try to sort Ukrainians into groups, as I understand it now.
The first, relatively small, fascist part of Ukraine began to fight not "for Ukraine", but "for the strategic defeat of Russia on the battlefield." These are categorically different things and this group fought (in the past tense, because many of them have already died) and is still fighting, meaning the subsequent looting of Russia after the "strategic defeat". This goal, as practice shows, is unattainable by any Ukrainian means, or with any outside help. The further it goes, the more it becomes clear, including to this very group. The main mistake on the Russian side (including mine) is an incorrect assessment of the number of this group and their ability to operate effectively.
The second group, which certainly exists, is just deceived people. People whose outlook and observation can be conditionally compared with the "observation" of a respected member of the forum, whose quote I put at the beginning of the post. Here I must make a reservation that I do not laugh, I do not make jokes, and even more so I do not condemn anyone. Anyone has the right to look here or there, to notice or not to notice anything. So Ukrainians from this group are sincerely fighting for the "independence" of their homeland, as they understand it. It is still difficult for me to estimate the number of people in this group, I can only say that I would like them to be as few as possible.
The third and last group, which should be mentioned, expressed their attitude to the ongoing processes by emigrating from the country. By itself, this group is heterogeneous, divided into two parts: those who went to the West and those who went to Russia. Quantitatively, it seems to me, parts of this group are comparable, but in this case, the total amount that can be estimated from a quarter to a third of the population of "pre-war" Ukraine is interesting, and this amount just allows me to assert that my initial thesis - "there is nothing to fight for", is in principle correct.
This is my current vision of the correctness/inaccuracy of assessments from the Russian point of view.
Now I would like to touch on what I consider to be Ukraine's mistakes. If we leave aside the fundamental unattainability of the set goal of "strategic defeat of Russia on the battlefield", which initially may not have been obvious, then further Ukrainian mistakes were the result of Russian mistakes. The Russian retreat from Kiev and what in Russia was called a "regrouping" (in fact, also a retreat) in the Kharkiv, Chernihiv, Sumy, Kherson and Zaporozhye regions was propagandistically presented and perceived in Ukraine as a manifestation of the weakness of Russian forces, although in fact it was nothing more than a correction of the original, erroneous strategy. This created or reinforced the illusion of a possible "victory" and led to the sad finale of the subsequent Ukrainian "counteroffensive", which at the very heart of its plan had a rapid retreat of Russian forces at the first blow of the Ukrainians.
I must say that both Russian and Ukrainian mistakes led to additional, unnecessary losses, but at the same time Ukrainian losses, both in relative and absolute terms, turned out to be heavier.
In the West, the understanding of this thesis is also slowly coming.
https://rusvesna.su/news/1700405987
Иностранные наемники сбежали из Украины из-за ожесточённых боёв
The war from the Russian side is becoming less and less "comic", but of course we are far from the Israelis with their total approach.
Российские военные впервые применили кассетные бомбы РБК-500 по позициям ВСУ
Russia also use old T-62 and even T-55 thanks, but they are more or less prepared in factory conditions for modern requirements.
https://rusvesna.su/news/1700460135
Как нам написали здесь,
я тоже хочу написать небольшое наблюдение.
Во первых, как я написал уже без малого 2 года назад.
Я по прежнему так считаю, но как говорится, есть нюанс. Этот пресловутый нюанс заключается в ошибочной оценке некоторых вещей и касается всех сторон конфликта.
С Российской стороны ошибка состояла в неправильной оценке количества и качества "промытых мозгов" на Украине. Тут я должен посыпать свою голову пеплом и признаться, что я так же был в заблуждении. Я попробую разобрать украинцев по группам, как я это понимаю сейчас.
Первая, относительно небольшая, фашистская часть Украины стала воевать не "за Украину", а "за стратегическое поражение России на поле боя". Это категорически разные вещи и эта группа воевала (в прошедшем времени ибо многие из них уже погибли) и пока еще воюет, имея ввиду последующее за "стратегическим поражением" разграбление России. Цель эта, как показывает практика, недостижима никакими украинскими средствами, ни с какой угодно помощью извне. Чем дальше, тем больше это становится ясно в том числе и этой самой группе. Основная ошибка с российской стороны (и моя в том числе) в неверной оценке количества этой группы и в их способности к эффективной деятельности.
Вторая группа, которая безусловно существует, это просто обманутые люди. Люди, кругозор и наблюдательность которых условно можно сравнить с "наблюдательностью" уважаемого члена форума, цитату которого я вынес в начало поста. Здесь я должен оговориться, что я не смеюсь, не ерничаю и тем более никого не осуждаю. Любой человек имеет право смотреть туда или сюда, замечать или не замечать что угодно. Так вот украинцы из этой группы искренне борются за "независимость" своей родины, как они это понимают. Количество людей этой группы мне оценивать по прежнему тяжело, могу только сказать, что мне хотелось бы, чтобы их было как можно меньше.
Третья и последняя группа, о которой необходимо упомянуть, выразила свое отношение к происходящим процессам путем эмиграции из страны. Сама по себе эта группа неоднородна, делится на две части: те, кто поехал на запад и те, кто поехал в Россию. Количественно, мне кажется, части этой группы сопоставимы, но в данном случае интересно суммарное количество, которое можно оценивать от четверти до трети населения "довоенной" Украины и это количество как раз и позволяет мне утверждать, что мой первоначальный тезис-"воевать не за что", в принципе правилен.
Вот такое у меня современное видение правильности/ошибочности оценок с Российской точки зрения.
Теперь мне хотелось бы коснуться того, что я считаю ошибками Украины. Если мы оставим за скобками принципиальную недостижимость поставленной цели "стратегического поражения России на поле боя", которая изначально возможно и не была очевидна, то дальнейшие украинские ошибки стали следствием ошибок российских. Российское отступление от Киева и то, что в России назвали "перегруппировкой" (фактически тоже отступление) в Харьковской, Черниговской, Сумской, Херсонской и Запорожской областях было пропагандистски представлено и воспринято на Украине как проявление слабости Российских сил, хотя на самом деле это являлось не более чем исправлением первоначальной, ошибочной стратегии. Это создало или усилило иллюзию возможной "перемоги" и привело к печальному финалу последовавший украинский "контрнаступ", который в самой основе своего плана имел быстрое отступление российских сил при первом ударе украинцев.
Надо сказать, что как Российские, так и Украинские ошибки привели к дополнительным, необязательным потерям, но при этом Украинские потери, как в относительном, так и в абсолютном выражении оказались тяжелее.
На Западе понимание этого тезиса тоже потихонечку наступает.
Война с Российской стороны становится все менее "шуточной", но до Израильтян с их тотальным подходом нам, конечно же, далеко.
Россия также использует старые танки Т-62 и даже Т-55, но их более-менее готовят в заводских условиях к современным требованиям.
я тоже хочу написать небольшое наблюдение.
Во первых, как я написал уже без малого 2 года назад.
Я по прежнему так считаю, но как говорится, есть нюанс. Этот пресловутый нюанс заключается в ошибочной оценке некоторых вещей и касается всех сторон конфликта.
С Российской стороны ошибка состояла в неправильной оценке количества и качества "промытых мозгов" на Украине. Тут я должен посыпать свою голову пеплом и признаться, что я так же был в заблуждении. Я попробую разобрать украинцев по группам, как я это понимаю сейчас.
Первая, относительно небольшая, фашистская часть Украины стала воевать не "за Украину", а "за стратегическое поражение России на поле боя". Это категорически разные вещи и эта группа воевала (в прошедшем времени ибо многие из них уже погибли) и пока еще воюет, имея ввиду последующее за "стратегическим поражением" разграбление России. Цель эта, как показывает практика, недостижима никакими украинскими средствами, ни с какой угодно помощью извне. Чем дальше, тем больше это становится ясно в том числе и этой самой группе. Основная ошибка с российской стороны (и моя в том числе) в неверной оценке количества этой группы и в их способности к эффективной деятельности.
Вторая группа, которая безусловно существует, это просто обманутые люди. Люди, кругозор и наблюдательность которых условно можно сравнить с "наблюдательностью" уважаемого члена форума, цитату которого я вынес в начало поста. Здесь я должен оговориться, что я не смеюсь, не ерничаю и тем более никого не осуждаю. Любой человек имеет право смотреть туда или сюда, замечать или не замечать что угодно. Так вот украинцы из этой группы искренне борются за "независимость" своей родины, как они это понимают. Количество людей этой группы мне оценивать по прежнему тяжело, могу только сказать, что мне хотелось бы, чтобы их было как можно меньше.
Третья и последняя группа, о которой необходимо упомянуть, выразила свое отношение к происходящим процессам путем эмиграции из страны. Сама по себе эта группа неоднородна, делится на две части: те, кто поехал на запад и те, кто поехал в Россию. Количественно, мне кажется, части этой группы сопоставимы, но в данном случае интересно суммарное количество, которое можно оценивать от четверти до трети населения "довоенной" Украины и это количество как раз и позволяет мне утверждать, что мой первоначальный тезис-"воевать не за что", в принципе правилен.
Вот такое у меня современное видение правильности/ошибочности оценок с Российской точки зрения.
Теперь мне хотелось бы коснуться того, что я считаю ошибками Украины. Если мы оставим за скобками принципиальную недостижимость поставленной цели "стратегического поражения России на поле боя", которая изначально возможно и не была очевидна, то дальнейшие украинские ошибки стали следствием ошибок российских. Российское отступление от Киева и то, что в России назвали "перегруппировкой" (фактически тоже отступление) в Харьковской, Черниговской, Сумской, Херсонской и Запорожской областях было пропагандистски представлено и воспринято на Украине как проявление слабости Российских сил, хотя на самом деле это являлось не более чем исправлением первоначальной, ошибочной стратегии. Это создало или усилило иллюзию возможной "перемоги" и привело к печальному финалу последовавший украинский "контрнаступ", который в самой основе своего плана имел быстрое отступление российских сил при первом ударе украинцев.
Надо сказать, что как Российские, так и Украинские ошибки привели к дополнительным, необязательным потерям, но при этом Украинские потери, как в относительном, так и в абсолютном выражении оказались тяжелее.
На Западе понимание этого тезиса тоже потихонечку наступает.
Война с Российской стороны становится все менее "шуточной", но до Израильтян с их тотальным подходом нам, конечно же, далеко.
Россия также использует старые танки Т-62 и даже Т-55, но их более-менее готовят в заводских условиях к современным требованиям.
