Richard C Hoagland predicts Moon Structure/Possible ET Disclosure in WEEKS.

[knowledge_of_self]

It is so true and i would even say that the word "sad" is not strong enough to describe our feeling when we realize that.

It is like that all our world was falling in small pieces and that after that we have to rebuild it piece by piece.

"Gutwrenching" is how I would put it.

And to look out at the world and see everyone going on with no idea of what is awaiting them. I have friends who are expecting a baby in December. It isn't easy at times to share their enthusiasm. Even if there are no comets, the planetary lockdown is coming at us faster and faster. What a world in which to have a child!

It is the exact same for me. I know a few people who are having a baby soon and when we talk they ask me when I will have a baby of my own and I say probably not in this life-time, and they get all upset. WHY? they ask- and I say because of personal views about our life on planet Earth. They kind of get quiet and change the subject which is understandable. I don't mean to put people on the spot, but I really don't think it's the best time to bring a child into this world. Especially if you're narcissistic, and you know it-- and you know that narcissism passes down from generation to generation, so really what is the point unless you are sure that at LEAST you have gotten rid of the narcissism within yourself.

I admit, my approach may not be fully externally considerate, especially when I see the faces of the expecting mothers. So I try really hard not to say anything, and pretend to be excited for them, but deep down inside, I'm thinking... "poor kid that will be brought up in a world such as this." And of course this thought is "gutwrenching" to say the least.

Also, I recall when I first came across the C's material. There were some points during my reading that I would cry for hours after having my illusions about religion/life after death etc.. shattered. As if all your life you have been fed lies and finally when you hear the truth, and the world of lies (the only world you have ever known) shatters all around you. You feel like you can't even breath-and at that point, truth doesn't seem like your best friend, but in the end it is the truth that will set you free-- that is why I chose that as the 'quote' below my avatar.

 

[wanderer]

My first grandchild is due in a few months, so I've had to come to terms with this issue too. Having observed how fully formed (in some ways) my children were when they were born, how much of their essence was already formed from their first moments, I believe that there is a choice that they made to be born into this world at a specific time and circumstance, or at least a karmic force that led them here. Children being born now are here now for a reason, IMHO.

 

[Rick]

It is so true and i would even say that the word "sad" is not strong enough to describe our feeling when we realize that.

It is like that all our world was falling in small pieces and that after that we have to rebuild it piece by piece.

"Gutwrenching" is how I would put it.

And to look out at the world and see everyone going on with no idea of what is awaiting them. I have friends who are expecting a baby in December. It isn't easy at times to share their enthusiasm. Even if there are no comets, the planetary lockdown is coming at us faster and faster. What a world in which to have a child!

Same thing for me and i just can not sincerely share their enthusiasm. One of them knows that it is not going so well on this planet and she told me that she wanted to live that experience before it is too late.

Geew, what about the child?

Do we really know comets are going to hit us in the foreseeable future? Do we really know there's going to be a "planetary lockdown"? There are many terrible things that can happen to us tomorrow besides getting hit in the noggin by space rocks. Why not share in their enthusiasm? Or if not enthusiasm, at least share the joy of a new life? What about the child? Has the child known anything before it's born? We're not born slaves. We choose to be slaves. This is what perplexes me at the moment. If we had known the hardship that we endure once we're born would we have chosen it? Is it a choice? It doesn't seem so clear cut to me.

 

[anart]

Do we really know comets are going to hit us in the foreseeable future?

Judging from the data that we do have, I'd have to say it is quite probable, if not certain. I think you're aware of this as well.

Do we really know there's going to be a "planetary lockdown"?

Judging from the data that we do have, I'd have to say it is quite probable, if not certain. I think you're aware of this as well.

There are many terrible things that can happen to us tomorrow besides getting hit in the noggin by space rocks.

That's very true. I would think the only difference is that the 'many terrible things' would be surprises, whereas the space rocks and lock down are high probabilities, if not certainties.

Why not share in their enthusiasm? Or if not enthusiasm, at least share the joy of a new life?

I think those are positive things, but I don't think ignoring reality in order to do so is very wise, if one intends to pay attention to objective reality right and left to become the reality of the future.

What about the child? Has the child known anything before it's born?

It would depend on the child. According to currently available data, some do know and some do not.

We're not born slaves. We choose to be slaves. This is what perplexes me at the moment. If we had known the hardship that we endure once we're born would we have chosen it? Is it a choice? It doesn't seem so clear cut to me.

I don't think it's clear cut to anyone who is looking at all available data, but there are certain extremely strong trends that indicate the 'man behind the curtain', as it were. As far as being born slaves, I'd have to disagree with your contention that we are not. It is my sincere understanding that we are born as a food source, much like cattle and that is as close to a slave as I can imagine.

It is also my understanding that we chose this, in one form or another, at one time or another, for reasons that I can't see from my vantage.

So, it seems to me that you should be familiar enough with all of this to know these things as well, or at least to understand the basis of the working hypothesis. So, it appears these posts that you've quoted have triggered something in you - a reaction - perhaps born of identification? Just a thought - fwiw.

One thing I do know, for certain, is that pretending that things are not how they are, because it is too painful to consider the reality of the situation, is entropic.

The key seems to be to learn how to See objective reality in all its beauty and horror, while still being able to share in the joy of life - but this takes a complete removal of identification and an understanding that encompasses the Universe as it is - not how you want/need it to be.

The crux is that to get to that understanding one must absolutely observe objective reality right and left - and that is something that identification prevents; especially when it is so painful to See the horror of our collective situation, that we start to look the other way and hedge our bets to think 'do we really know' - instead of thinking 'all signs point to this - and strongly' and keeping eyes wide open to see the truth. Of course, this is my current understanding, which is always open to growth and change.

 

[Jacques]

Do we really know comets are going to hit us in the foreseeable future?

No we don't but the probabilities are pretty high.

Do we really know there's going to be a "planetary lockdown"?

No we are not sure but if you look at the state of the world, if you connect the dots, it does not smell very good.

There are many terrible things that can happen to us tomorrow besides getting hit in the noggin by space rocks. Why not share in their enthusiasm? Or if not enthusiasm, at least share the joy of a new life?

Sorry if i am not able to do that but seeing the state of the world, seeing what it is coming, i just can not share the enthusiasm to bring a new child on this planet at this moment in time.

What about the child? Has the child known anything before it's born? We're not born slaves. We choose to be slaves.

I think we are born machines and until we work on ourselves, we stay and operate as a machine. And i might even say that when we have chosen to go for the gold many years ago, going from 3d STO to 3d STS, we took an option as slaves. Now we have to work pretty hard to regain our liberty.

This is what perplexes me at the moment. If we had known the hardship that we endure once we're born would we have chosen it? Is it a choice? It doesn't seem so clear cut to me.

Why not. Maybe we are here to help and to learn how to be a good candidate for the STO world.

fwiw

 

[Third_Density_Resident]

I know several people expecting babies or who have just had babies. And my thoughts are similar to those which have already been expressed in this thread. One part of you wants to warn people who you know are just thinking about having children to wait about 5 years; but then you know that it's not really your place to do this. Every person who has access to the internet has little excuse not to know what's going on in this world and what is extremely likely to happen in the near future. People choose, on some level, what information they accept and what information they reject. All you can do is guide them with subtle clues and hints from time to time, and hope for the best.

 

[Laura]

I can only say that if I knew then what I know now, I would not have had children. Now, can we say that it is a "good thing" that I didn't know then what I know now? After all, I have learned a LOT from my children and from the drive that was born in me to learn about this world in the fullest way possible so that I could teach my children... and the result is the work we do now, including the existence of this forum.

Okay, there's that.

On the other hand, when I go out and about and see little children, babies, pregnant women, I KNOW that 99% of those parents do not have a clue that they are "food for the moon" and they have perpetuated the "feeding of the moon" by having children in ignorance. They are, essentially, just food producers - their children are offerings on the altar of their ignorance.

But the drive to reproduce is strong.

I remember once somebody arguing for a baby, saying "it's such a miracle... childbirth... babies..." and my mother looked at this girl with something akin to horror and said: "It's not a miracle... dogs and cats do it all the time." And she was right. People with monstrous personality disorders rape women and reproduce their sicknesses all the time. Is that a miracle?

So, what is so miraculous about someone with a narcissistic need to be adored by an infant producing one?

Sure, we can say that children being born right now have "chosen" at some level to do so. That's a nice, cozy justification. I can use it myself. After all, before I had a clue about anything, I had already produced five of them. (Two were accidents born while using birth control... isn't THAT a miracle?!)

On the other hand, the Cs do not necessarily promote the "spiritualize everything" point of view that a lot of New Age fundies get into. The Cs point out that the material world exists and will continue to exist and it has its place and purpose. Those who pay strict attention to reality, right and left, become the reality of the future. Doesn't that include having children?

And didn't the Cs once say to me:

Here comes a shocker for you... one day, in 4th density,
it will be your descendants mission to carry on the
tradition and assignment of seeding the 3rd density
universe, once you have the adequate knowledge!!!

So, how do we know that some of the children being born now are not part of that future?

And remember, the Cs once described a world where 3rd density was in alignment and under the guidance of 4th density STO. So isn't that the future we are looking forward to? Isn't that what the breathing and meditation program are foundational to? Isn't that what "Creating a New World" as discussed in a thread by that name is about?

The key factor in all of this seems to me to be KNOWLEDGE.

I don't think I can share in the enthusiasm for having babies of people who I know haven't got a clue about what is going on and never will, nor will their children. But what I CAN do is continue to work as hard as I can - with the network - to try to generate the knowledge that can underpin a reality where such people are shepherded with consideration for their particular abilities (or lack thereof).

The future IS open, but the likelihood of certain things happening in that future still exist. The story of Noah is still instructive. He had a "warning" and he undertook to "build an Ark" and he and his family survived a global cataclysm. With knowledge, we can prepare for the worst, hope for the best, and take what comes. I just don't think that those people who have some realization that the next few years might be rather "interesting" - to understate the matter - are being knowledgeable and responsible by having babies right now. It's really hard to be of service to others AND the Universe when your instincts are focused on a single individual (or two or three). Having children is a very great weakness to those who seek to do things for humanity at large because you can be stopped in your tracks by a threat to your child.

 

[RyanX]

The future IS open, but the likelihood of certain things happening in that future still exist. The story of Noah is still instructive. He had a "warning" and he undertook to "build an Ark" and he and his family survived a global cataclysm. With knowledge, we can prepare for the worst, hope for the best, and take what comes. I just don't think that those people who have some realization that the next few years might be rather "interesting" - to understate the matter - are being knowledgeable and responsible by having babies right now. It's really hard to be of service to others AND the Universe when your instincts are focused on a single individual (or two or three). Having children is a very great weakness to those who seek to do things for humanity at large because you can be stopped in your tracks by a threat to your child.

Funny, I had a similar thought a few days ago. I had two children at quite a young age (first child when I was 20) and this was before I knew anything about anything either. This is not to say I understand everything fully now, but it seems like I've come a long way. However, the fact that I have two young children makes me an easy target whether from 4D or 3D STS. They know this and know that I don't have the ability to really DO anything at this moment at least in terms of helping humanity at large. Then again, maybe I'm not seeing the situation clearly either.

I wonder if people with young children can even play a role in the helping of others? It seems like more often than not, those with young children end up being the recipients of help from others. Like the expression, "it takes a village to raise a child", I've found this to be somewhat true. I don't know if it's possible for parents of young children to truly help others in any meaningful sense without sacrificing the time and attention need to properly raise a child. Would it not be a form of Family Narcissism of putting the needs of others before the needs of one's own children? I seem to recall a couple examples of this sort during my reading on Narcissism, but I can't recall the details offhand. I suppose most times what people consider "helping others" is just another way of helping themselves or "getting ahead" or furthering their own status in some way, so in that sense it does become putting one's own needs above the needs of a young child.

This is kind of sobering, to put it mildly. I think for myself the best I can hope to accomplish is perhaps to continue Working and learning and especially learning how to raise my daughters in a proper way so that THEY can participate in a better reality if and when that time comes in the future. I've just begun reading Gurdjeif's Meetings With Remarkable Men where he discusses his own upbringing and some of the role models he established in his formative years. Everything he went through was in some way relevant to what he became later in life. I recall the C's saying in one session something to the effect of "spiritual development begins in childhood". No kidding! Not just for spiritual development, but any sort of development for that matter!

 

[ScioAgapeOmnis]

They know this and know that I don't have the ability to really DO anything at this moment at least in terms of helping humanity at large. Then again, maybe I'm not seeing the situation clearly either.

I agree with others that we're better off not having children now that we know what kind of world this is, but I don't think that already having them is necessarily "all bad". As Laura said, she did benefit from her children to a great degree. Although they put her into a more vulnerable position, that was only one side of it, but on the other hand she learned from the experience and became wiser and stronger for it.

This is kind of sobering, to put it mildly. I think for myself the best I can hope to accomplish is perhaps to continue Working and learning and especially learning how to raise my daughters in a proper way so that THEY can participate in a better reality if and when that time comes in the future.

Which puts you into a more risky position than those without kids, but also provides potential for growth. All the insight about human interaction and psychology you gain from raising your daughters, the patience and perspicacity needed to address all their curiosities, issues, and attempts at manipulating you to get what they want, and so much more. I think if you can get through this in one piece, with the help of a group and care/caution on your part, you are in a great position to be able to help others. So hang in there, and that goes for everyone who has kids!

One thought I had is that although "something wicked this way comes" as far as the planet is concerned, you are still safer knowing what you know and being with a group like this, than being a clueless parent. Just remember what the C's said about always expecting attack, knowing the modes of same, and knowing how to counteract same, and apply that to the context of having children.

 

[Adaryn]

I wonder if people with young children can even play a role in the helping of others?

Well that's what Laura did, didn't she? I mean, by learning all she learned during all these years WHILE still continuing to care for her 5 children, learning from them and learning what proper education meant, she's become able to Do so much and contribute so much in helping others for… well, quite a few years now. :)

 

[Jacques]

I wonder if people with young children can even play a role in the helping of others?

Well that's what Laura did, didn't she? I mean, by learning all she learned during all these years WHILE still continuing to care for her 5 children, learning from them and learning what proper education meant, she's become able to Do so much and contribute so much in helping others for… well, quite a few years now. :)

And i can tell you that there are some women in this group that are helping as much as they can without sacrificing the time for their children.

 

[RyanX]

[quote author=SAO]Which puts you into a more risky position than those without kids, but also provides potential for growth. All the insight about human interaction and psychology you gain from raising your daughters, the patience and perspicacity needed to address all their curiosities, issues, and attempts at manipulating you to get what they want, and so much more. I think if you can get through this in one piece, with the help of a group and care/caution on your part, you are in a great position to be able to help others. So hang in there, and that goes for everyone who has kids![/quote]

[quote author=Lúthien]Well that's what Laura did, didn't she? I mean, by learning all she learned during all these years WHILE still continuing to care for her 5 children, learning from them and learning what proper education meant, she's become able to Do so much and contribute so much in helping others for… well, quite a few years now.[/quote]

SAO & Lúthien, you are correct about children being a potential for growth and I don't know why this slipped my mind when writing my post. Laura would not be in the position she is in today had she not had children of her own. There are many things that I simply would not have bothered to learn or investigate had I not had children to care for either. This has been especially true for me when it comes to diet, health, allergies, etc.

However, from what I've observed from friends, family and the general population is that people tend to not meet the needs of their children, let alone help others except for possibly themselves. It takes a special type of person to be able to handle the personal sacrifice needed to help their children as well as others on a large scale. I think this gets back to the point Laura makes in her post that the key factor is KNOWLEDGE. Most people/parents are just clueless and drift aimlessly through life.

[quote author=Bohort]And i can tell you that there are some women in this group that are helping as much as they can without sacrificing the time for their children.[/quote]

I can imagine it must quite the experience for these children observing their parents interacting with this group. Teaching children how to properly Network and Self Remember would seem to be one of the most positive life lessons for any child or any person for that matter.

 

[knowledge_of_self]

And remember, the Cs once described a world where 3rd density was in alignment and under the guidance of 4th density STO. So isn't that the future we are looking forward to? Isn't that what the breathing and meditation program are foundational to? Isn't that what "Creating a New World" as discussed in a thread by that name is about?

The key factor in all of this seems to me to be KNOWLEDGE.

I couldn’t agree more that the key factor here is knowledge.

But speaking as someone who has not had children, am I evil/bad for thinking well if 3D ever becomes STO or if this “new world” is ever actually created by us THAN I’ll have kids. I’m not saying already expecting parents or people who are already parents should give up on their kids or should regret having kids. I know if I had kids I wouldn’t regret having them because after all, they are your children. And isn’t it a completely narcissistic act to regret having them? I follow you though, because I do understand how kids can help you learn so much (best example being Laura) BUT and here is a big but… not everyone is like Laura. Most people couldn’t care less about telling the truth to their kids, as a result of ponerization, passed down from generation to generation…

I think what gets to me the most is how people look down on me for not wanting to have kids. I just want to say to them, well you have your choice and I have mine… but it’s really not that simple.

Also my mom always comments about how one day she wishes for me to give her a ‘grandchild’ and if I even hint at not wanting to, she becomes almost hysterical. It just really gets to me… and I’m willing to admit that this topic is kind of emotional for me.

 

[Adaryn]

But speaking as someone who has not had children, am I evil/bad for thinking well if 3D ever becomes STO or if this “new world” is ever actually created by us THAN I’ll have kids.

Well it's not having kids that is "bad" per se, it's just that having them in this world especially when you know about the situation and what is awaiting us seems irresponsible and cruel. Maybe you'll want to re-read the Baby thread

I think what gets to me the most is how people look down on me for not wanting to have kids. I just want to say to them, well you have your choice and I have mine… but it’s really not that simple.

Yeah it's really annoying, this pressure on all women to HAVE kids, otherwise they're not real women, are they??

Also my mom always comments about how one day she wishes for me to give her a ‘grandchild’ and if I even hint at not wanting to, she becomes almost hysterical. It just really gets to me… and I’m willing to admit that this topic is kind of emotional for me.

To give her a grandchild? Gasp

 

[knowledge_of_self]

I think what gets to me the most is how people look down on me for not wanting to have kids. I just want to say to them, well you have your choice and I have mine… but it’s really not that simple.

Yeah it's really annoying, this pressure on all women to HAVE kids, otherwise they're not real women, are they??

Yes!! That is exactly how I feel when I talk to people like that. As if the reputation of my womanhood is at stake. As if everything I am supposed to be in this world is a "vessel for new life" and nothing more.

Also my mom always comments about how one day she wishes for me to give her a ‘grandchild’ and if I even hint at not wanting to, she becomes almost hysterical. It just really gets to me… and I’m willing to admit that this topic is kind of emotional for me.

To give her a grandchild? Gasp

Yes, her comments make me gasp too. That’s why I try my best not to even bring the topic up—but whenever we watch a movie or something about pregnancy or someone having a baby is mentioned somehow the question of when I will be a mom rises up. I’ve just begun to lie now for the sake of argument, “yes mom, one day when I’m ready I will have a kid” all the while thinking – not in this lifetime. And of course she makes me feel as if I would be the worst daughter in the world if I chose not to have a child of my own. Of course, I can’t blame her since like many others –it’s part of her narcissistic trait passed down to her from her own mother/father.