Seeking Advice on How to Reach Spiritual/Moral Bankruptcy in Order to Progress

Shelby

The Force is Strong With This One
Hi! Through this post, I am asking for a mirror, different perspectives that I may be blind to, and for advice! Thank you so much in advance! I look forward to your responses and widening my perspective and knowledge.


To give some perspective on the point of this post…. I started out on this journey towards knowledge on January 1st, 2019.. it has been a little over 6 months, so I am still pretty brand new to all of this! I have read the first 5 books of the Wave Series in that amount of time, plus I am lucky enough to have my best friend (who is the one who planted the seed of curiosity in me about 4 years ago) who is always there to have open conversations with me about all of this stuff. He helps me process and understand the things I am learning and gaining knowledge about.


Something I’ve realized along the way is that in order to progress along this path towards “awakening”, at some point I have to reach that point of complete spiritual and moral bankruptcy… the point of realizing everything I’ve ever known and believed in is all a lie, really FEELING into the fact that all I’ve been doing this entire time is feeding the predator and doing exactly as it wants, and realizing all of the lies I’ve told myself about who I am, completely stripping away the mask and pretty much everything I ever believed was true about myself.


As I was Re-reading chapter 27 of the third book in the Wave Series “Stripped to the Bone” …. this part jumped out to me as I have been trying to grasp the idea of exactly what spiritual bankruptcy was and how to reach it in order to accelerate my progress.. (The excerpt from the book is in bold)



—— A correspondent recently wrote of his despair when he realized that what the Cassiopaeans were saying truly did do a better job of explaining the order of the universe and the meanings behind the experiences and symbols of reality.


“[Tonight] we had a … big annual fireworks presentation that is synchronized with a radio broadcast … the whole thing is massive and hyped up. There’s lots of flashing lights (people even joined in and flashed their house lights), lots of aerial traffic and lots of flashing fireworks. All this backed by a radio broadcast that is impossible to escape since everyone is playing it. As beautiful as it is, I got immensely depressed. All that I know so far, all the knowledge in me just caused me to [be unable to] escape the awful feeling of alienation and despair.


All these people, the kids, the elderly, the mothers and grandparents–they are all screwed–most likely including me. We’re like sheep–we’ll be happy with a bunch of flashing lights and then we’ll go off to earn more money. To run the program. I think the most disturbing moment was when I saw this really gorgeous boy–five maybe seven. He had an incredibly smooth face; he was watching the fireworks and clapping his hand in happiness. Pity that Lizzies might eat him tomorrow. … It’s just too much to handle on your own!


We will be taken over with no problems at all. This is our destiny and only a small percentage of us worldwide will have any clue as to what is happening when the sky turns red. The rest will get burned in the packed-out churches. And what can I do?


Well, not much … it’s like one of those prophetic dreams–they happen and you can’t change anything. Yeah, I tried but my acts led to the dream FULFILLING it. So either way–whether you do something or not, little difference will be made. It makes no difference how many people I help. It makes no difference how many old ladies’ days I make. It makes no difference how many books I read and how many riddles I solve. It is all predestined anyway. I’m tired of giving already!


And so the night goes on. I am alone, with no one to truly see what I mean in a face-to-face conversation. All the people I’ve ever met had something wrong with them (and there’s literally thousands of them). No amount of unconditional love could turn them normal. I’m running out of possibilities here (maybe there’s something wrong with ME then). I’m tired of fighting, asking, probing, observing and not being able to share properly. It’s a doomed existence and I’m here to watch. Whatever happened to love, compassion and understanding? Where on Earth (HELL) has the internal beauty gone? Is all this bickering ever going to end? Enough already! [Name of correspondent withheld for privacy]”


Indeed! And how passionately eloquent. Having been there, more than once, my heart bled for him. And, which is worse: to see what he is seeing as a young man with his whole life before him? Or to see what there is to see in middle age, with five children for whom you have given most of your life; seeing not only that you have been lying to yourself by believing lies and deception, but that you have conveyed those same lies to the people you love the most? What do you do when you realize that most of your life you have given away your free will and, at the same time, have taken away the free will of those dearest to you? More horrible still, what do you do when you realize it has all been done in the name of love?


Is there light at the end of this tunnel? Is there “Balm in Gilead”?


Yes, many times I experienced what my correspondent described so well. And it is only in the past few years that I am able to see it for what it was: a series of initiations. Step by step I was led through one level after another, stripping away all my beliefs and expectations until I had no more illusions in which to hide. And what I was being taught by the universe was the deepest and most essential thing to know–about myself.


When the last illusion was stripped away and I was left with nothing but the skeleton of my being, I reached what Kafka describes as “Von einem gewissen Punkt gibt es keine Rückkehr mehr. Dieser Punkt ist zu erreichen.” There is a point of no return. This point has to be reached.


When you have been stripped of all your illusions, when you have nothing left to believe in, there is no one there at all but yourself. It felt rather like falling endlessly in icy, black, meaningless space. No rhyme nor reason, no truth nor beauty, no anything that I had ever believed in could be seen anywhere. I had peeled away the layers of all the warm, fuzzy, comforting beliefs and found that it was all a lie, a deception, a mask for feeding and manipulation. And by believing the lies, I had participated in the feeding and manipulating to so great a degree that my grief and regret became an ocean in which I was drowning. No wonder we resist giving up our beliefs. Without them, we have to face the truth about ourselves. And, as much as we think we are loving, caring, giving beings, when we see the truth, when we see that most of our ideas about loving and caring and being have been manipulated to deprive us of our free will and to pass the infection on to those we love the most, it is like looking into the pit of Hell.


And when you look into the pit of Hell and realize that you have been feeding that black and bloody, sucking and gaping gore-filled maw waiting to swallow you, and that you have taught those you love to feed it as well, the horror of the realization is enough to drive you mad with grief and despair. And you search for a meaning, some little point of illumination, and there is no light anywhere, not even a single candle to dispel the darkness. ——




I read it over twice, the first time realizing that this is what spiritual/moral bankruptcy must be. And the second time, trying to really feel into it, and feel the despair and heartache, and see the ugliness of it all, with no hope.


So that point of this post is this: While re-reading it, I read it slowly and really WAS actually feeling how terrible it all really is. I just can’t shake the feeling that there IS HOPE! It’s not all darkness and despair. This is how it’s SUPPOSED to be. Without darkness, there could be no light! So the darkness and despair is not without purpose!


But… it’s not that I don’t see the despair in it all also. It IS depressing that we are here, being herded like cattle. Doing the same things everyday, running the program. Feeding the predator. Doing exactly as it wants. And even once we finally start to become even a little bit aware, we start wanting to rebel against it and make our own choices and not feed it anymore, but even then it’s nearly impossible to get out from underneath its grip on us because its all around us and its the foundation to all we’ve ever known. Culture, religion, our values & beliefs, social structure, everything.. we don’t know anything different. It is depressing and chilling. I do see that part, and I do feel the ugliness and darkness of it all.


But the part that I can’t ALSO stop seeing long enough to reach that point of bankruptcy is the HOPE. The hope that it’s all a cycle, we are learning our lessons and going along at exactly the rate we are supposed to be. And even if we don’t learn all of our lessons in this cycle, it’s not the end for us. We get to go to 5th density, and then go back in and continue learning until we’ve learned the lessons we’re supposed to learn in order to graduate. There is no condemnation and judgement from some god about whether or not we learned what “we were supposed to learn” and did everything exactly the way “we were supposed to.”


I think that part of my problem comes from the way I was raised. I was raised in a VERY strict Christian home, went to church every single Sunday, and my parents did their best to live their Christian faith out in every area of their lives. I was taught that if I am not “living for Jesus” and have not “asked for forgiveness of my sins” and “asked Jesus to be my Savior because I am a worthless and terrible sinner and He is my only hope for my eternal soul” … then I will go to Hell for eternity and be in constant pain and torture and burn forever and never be able to quench my thirst and will be in mental, emotional, and physical misery for all of eternity forever, it will never end. I lived with this fear for 25 years of my life. It ate me alive most nights, it was always in the back of my head that “I better shape up or else Im going to burn for eternity.” It was torture.


So it’s hard for all of this to not feel like a relief, like a weight lifted off my shoulders. THIS IS HOPE to me. The fact that if I don’t get everything figured out in this life, my soul will NOT be damned for ALL OF ETERNITY IN HELL AND MISERY. I get another chance. It’s all a cycle, you’re never in one place for eternity. It makes the pursuit of knowledge and awakening something that I WANT to do by my own choice, not something that I am burdened with feeling like I HAVE to do or else I’ll go to hell. I actually want this. That feels like something positive to me, the fact that it’s my own choice, not forced upon me by fear tactics.


And although this 3rd density here is pretty much screwed, and we ARE just cattle being herded, this is not all there is. There is a whole scope of things BEYOND 3rd density and we only see our small little teensy tiny little world.


Maybe part of my “archetype” is that I am positive to a fault. I have a hard time seeing ugliness for what it is. It is very hard for me to feel hopelessness and despair. Very rarely in my life have I ever felt hopelessness or despair, I’ve hardly ever really been depressed! I always get over things so fast, I’m able to let things go and move on from painful things faster than most people.


In the Enneagram Personality test, I am a 9, which is a peacemaker. The core function of a 9 is pretty much doing anything to keep yourself in a state of peacefulness, and always seeing the bright side of things. I know this is just my personality, my mask, my program, the thing I need to get out from under, so I’m sure this has a lot to do with why it is difficult for me to reach that point of bankruptcy. Because of my personality, I shove down painful feelings and push aside unpeaceful thoughts so that I can stay living in my happy and positive little state of mind without being disturbed. It is, i’m sure, what’s currently keeping me from reaching that point of bankruptcy. Because I KNOW and I can see what there is to be hopeless about in this world, but I still always find hope and see the positive side of things, and I don’t know how NOT to.


I’m not exactly sure how to move past this part of who I am in order to reach that state of bankruptcy, that point of no return that must be reached, as Laura says. And when I think about it, I also don’t entirely understand why the hope that I feel and see is “wrong” (or at least keeps me from progressing)… because it doesn’t seem like it’s wrong. It IS true that there is so much darkness and evil and I SEE that, but it is ALSO true that without darkness there could be no light! Isn’t that true?? It IS true that we are all on our own cycle of learning. So why is it necessary to feel hopeless and become spiritually bankrupt in order to be able to graduate? I just don’t get it, and I also don’t know how to NOT see hope.

Again, thank you so much for taking the time to read this and for your responses!
 

genero81

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
So it’s hard for all of this to not feel like a relief, like a weight lifted off my shoulders. THIS IS HOPE to me. The fact that if I don’t get everything figured out in this life, my soul will NOT be damned for ALL OF ETERNITY IN HELL AND MISERY. I get another chance. It’s all a cycle, you’re never in one place for eternity. It makes the pursuit of knowledge and awakening something that I WANT to do by my own choice, not something that I am burdened with feeling like I HAVE to do or else I’ll go to hell. I actually want this. That feels like something positive to me, the fact that it’s my own choice, not forced upon me by fear tactics.
No doubt! It's a great big freedom to get past such a subversive, fear based, psychological mind job. It's an enigma of sorts that getting rid of illusions and facing reality with all of it's aspects both light and dark, produces greater freedom. Feeling the very real oppressive nature of the objective reality we find ourselves in, and at the same time the personal liberation that it brings to finally see things clearly with all of the opportunities that that affords.
I’m not exactly sure how to move past this part of who I am in order to reach that state of bankruptcy, that point of no return that must be reached, as Laura says. And when I think about it, I also don’t entirely understand why the hope that I feel and see is “wrong” (or at least keeps me from progressing)… because it doesn’t seem like it’s wrong. It IS true that there is so much darkness and evil and I SEE that, but it is ALSO true that without darkness there could be no light! Isn’t that true?? It IS true that we are all on our own cycle of learning. So why is it necessary to feel hopeless and become spiritually bankrupt in order to be able to graduate? I just don’t get it, and I also don’t know how to NOT see hope.
Even when Laura was experiencing such an intensely bleak reality while seeing how people were feeding on the energy of others, she asked the C's about it and they said that it wasn't really natural to see things in only that way. I don't have the transcripts at my disposal to quote. The point was; it was an initiation for someone who was forging a path for others like you and me. Everyone is different. Our personal 'dark night of the soul' will occur in different ways. You seem like you're right where you need to be to me.
 

Gruchaa

Padawan Learner
Hi Shelby!
Thanks for the post and for courage to talk about it :)

I will touch the end of your post:
It IS true that there is so much darkness and evil and I SEE that, but it is ALSO true that without darkness there could be no light! Isn’t that true?? It IS true that we are all on our own cycle of learning. So why is it necessary to feel hopeless and become spiritually bankrupt in order to be able to graduate? I just don’t get it, and I also don’t know how to NOT see hope.
This is true - To see light, you need to know how darkness looks like. To know good, you need to know what is evil. Additionally life is suffering (mostly ;)). Without suffering your learning curve would be flat.. why? I think when you suffer - you feel that something is not right. When you feel that something is not right, you are starting to search what causes that and you learn. When you learn you can graduate and learn more. That is how I understand this. If the life would be without suffering, who would care to fix something? So, everything would be mostly stagnant.

Jordan Peterson talks a lot about these matters, if you haven't watch/read his videos/books I would recommend it to you. He has this ease in speaking loudly about the knowledge which is hidden and unspoken in each of us ;)
 

MirAd

A Disturbance in the Force
The dark night of the soul moment will come naturally, I think. And on your own pace. No need to do anything special besides being open-minded and learning every day.

As Cs love to say knowledge protects.
 

Beau

Administrator
Administrator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
I don't think there's anything wrong with feeling hope as long as the reality of our world is still kept in one's mind. We shouldn't be attempting to excise that feeling from the body. The Work has room for hope in it, so don't despair! If it wasn't for hope I think Laura might have quit this long ago.

In reading your story, it actually sounds like you reached a sort of bankruptcy due to your experiences growing up in a strict religious home. Maybe you think that you need to FEEL something, a change in you, that signals a bankruptcy, but I don't know that that is how it works although it can be like that for some people.

Does one have to get to a point where they are curled up in a ball feeling nothing but despair in order to progress? For some people, that might be true. Although if you still desire certain 3D experiences then that probably means that a true bankruptcy has not occurred yet, so I guess it depends on how you look at the world right now and what you are seeking from it. A lot of people think they want to give up those "A influences" until they actually do and then they might realize there are things in this world they desire that don't fit with "being in this world but not of it." So that's a bankruptcy different from where one realizes that other spiritual paths are dead ends for them, and it's particularly hard for younger people since there are so many things that they haven't done yet.

As you say, you are very new to this. I wouldn't push too hard to "advance" although I can understand the urgency looking at the world today. We can't force ourselves to become morally bankrupt. It should be a natural progression for someone who no longer wants the regular life.
 

Doug

The Force is Strong With This One
I also agree that you don't necessarily have to see the whole world in darkness to have your awakening. For some it may occur quite dramatically and rapidly and for others it may take a longer period of time. I think a healthy dose of life-experience, maturity and, positive lifestyle routine would play a big part in how it plays out. My 'Dark Night of the Soul' seemed to be quite dramatic, dark and lasted for a period of a few years but that was because I was a hopeless up-and-coming young adult to start with.

If you have responsibilities such as school, career, family ect... I would not recommend comprising your psychological health by pursing the dramatic version of the 'Dark Night of the Soul'.
 

Pashalis

Ambassador
Ambassador
FOTCM Member
Everyone is different. Our personal 'dark night of the soul' will occur in different ways. You seem like you're right where you need to be to me.
The dark night of the soul moment will come naturally, I think. And on your own pace. No need to do anything special besides being open-minded and learning every day.

As Cs love to say knowledge protects.
Maybe you think that you need to FEEL something, a change in you, that signals a bankruptcy, but I don't know that that is how it works although it can be like that for some people.
For some people, that might be true.
As you say, you are very new to this. I wouldn't push too hard to "advance" although I can understand the urgency looking at the world today. We can't force ourselves to become morally bankrupt. It should be a natural progression for someone who no longer wants the regular life.
I also agree that you don't necessarily have to see the whole world in darkness to have your awakening. For some it may occur quite dramatically and rapidly and for others it may take a longer period of time.
I agree with the above. You can't force yourself to have a spiritual/moral bankruptcy. As far as I understand it, it is a natural process that you can neither artificially push nor enforce. I think the C's alluded to that a number of times. Also, as others have already mentioned above, how this might play out for any given person can be very different. I think the C's also alluded to the fact at some point that for some people realizations like that turn out to be rather sudden and full-blown/dramatic while for others it is a slow step by step process. We are all very different and the lessons of each person are also often very different. So I wouldn't rule out that for some types something like a moral bankruptcy isn't needed in the way it is for others. There might also be other lifetimes at play in which certain things were already realized to some extent.

It also seems to me that you don't have to worry over this any longer since you seem to have made quite some progress in understanding already. It might be a good idea to slowly but surely ask yourself what you could do with those positive steps in order to be better able to help others.
 

Andrew

Jedi Master
Hi Shelbs!

Ok, I may be way off base here and would recommend you defer to more experienced members here.

My response would be that, as long as you’re able to ‘see’ and accept that ugliness IS part of this world, and this world isn’t all just Sunshine and Rainbows, you’re doing fine. As others have said, you can’t force it. I think there WOULD be a problem if you were shoving the ugly under the rug and pretending it didn’t exist. Which would be placing a judgement on Creation by not accepting the other (negative) half of it.

Ideally, I think the goal is to be able to get to a consistent state where positive emotions are primarily what's chosen over the negative ones, without excluding them from reality.

I think Spiritual/Moral Bankruptcy is in part like a starting marker that one has exhausted their sources of trying to find answers through traditional channels. Then coming to the realization that the answers simply aren’t there.

For the majority of people, this realization could create a ‘bankruptcy’ because they may have spent a lifetime following these pathways to only learn it isn't true. Imagine how devastated your mom would be to learn her reliance on Christianity and Religion and everything she preaches and tries to put on you and your siblings has been for nothing and has had the opposite effect of what she intends? That she's been 'Duped by the Devil'?

This assumes however, one has the capacity to come to this realization. Denial is a powerful thing. Depending on the individuals capacity and potential, this could potentially allow one to then be open to finding answers from a higher source of knowledge, without reliance on traditional 3rd density understandings getting in the way. This also assumes one even has the desire/will to seek these answers in the first place. Although, there is still the degree to which one is ‘programmed’ that will have to be dealt with of course to fully make use of this knowledge.

Perhaps you don’t need such a 'dark night of the soul' to the severe extent you seem to assume is necessary? Maybe your ‘spiritual bankruptcy’ isn’t to the degree that other peoples are, and may have undergone it already without realizing it?

I do think Beau brought up some good points to consider though:

In reading your story, it actually sounds like you reached a sort of bankruptcy due to your experiences growing up in a strict religious home. Maybe you think that you need to FEEL something, a change in you, that signals a bankruptcy, but I don't know that that is how it works although it can be like that for some people.
Although if you still desire certain 3D experiences then that probably means that a true bankruptcy has not occurred yet, so I guess it depends on how you look at the world right now and what you are seeking from it.
A lot of people think they want to give up those "A influences" until they actually do and then they might realize there are things in this world they desire that don't fit with "being in this world but not of it." So that's a bankruptcy different from where one realizes that other spiritual paths are dead ends for them, and it's particularly hard for younger people since there are so many things that they haven't done yet.
With this I would have to ask, do you feel you’ve reached a position where you no longer feel 3rd density can offer you what you’re seeking? Are there still aspects/experiences about 3rd density you still crave or want?

If so, some of what Beau said above may apply. I think if you reach a point to where you can honestly sit down with yourself and realize this world simply no longer can offer you anything, you may not have yet reached THAT aspect of Bankruptcy. When/if you do, that's when "Being in this world but not of it" will become clearer. OSIT.

Just my 2 cents. Could be way off so take this with a grain of salt! :)
 

Jones

Jedi Council Member
The work isn't just about moral or spiritual bankruptcies, which may be necessary if you've 'crystallised on the wrong foundation'. It's also about the struggle between 'yes' and 'no' that creates a transformative 'heat'. Bankruptcies may or may not occur as a result of that struggle .

Next is somewhat of a generalisation based on your self identification so may or may not be accurate.

Since you identify with Enneagram type 9, then it's possible that the struggle between 'yes' and 'no' for you will be in sticking to your own chosen goals without being pulled off course by going along to get along with others to keep the peace, protect the inner sense of peace and avoid conflict - which can show up as having poor boundaries and the expression of unidentified anger and resentment through passive aggressiveness. Through all of that the lesson for type 9 is about self narcotisation - putting yourself to sleep to your own goals and choices that are meaningful to you.

Have you heard this song?

 

mkrnhr

SuperModerator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
I don't think this state of moral bakrupty is something that you aim to attain. Usually it occurs at some time, without it being specifically anticipated. Also, hope does not prevent despair, and despair doesn't prevent hope. We are emotionally rich enough to experience both with no contradiction. It's like being in despair for the illness of a child, and being hopeful (while doing everything possible) for it to be better. Knowledge provides despair and hope, each fueling the other in a loop that leads transformation and action. OSIT.
 

Shelby

The Force is Strong With This One
It's an enigma of sorts, that getting rid of illusions and facing reality with all of it's aspects both light and dark, produces greater freedom. Feeling the very real oppressive nature of the objective reality we find ourselves in, and at the same time the personal liberation that it brings to finally see things clearly with all of the opportunities that that affords.
I appreciate this perspective Genero! It is a hard thing to wrap your head around for sure. It is despairing yet liberating and full of hope at the same time. I'm glad to know that I am not "wrong" in feeling this way. Thank you for your response!
 

Shelby

The Force is Strong With This One
Without suffering your learning curve would be flat.. why? I think when you suffer - you feel that something is not right. When you feel that something is not right, you are starting to search what causes that and you learn. When you learn you can graduate and learn more. That is how I understand this. If life would be without suffering, who would care to fix something? So, everything would be mostly stagnant.
I guess I had not thought about this before in relation to myself, as I have never felt like I've endured much suffering in my life. But now that you said this, I guess in a way I HAVE through the way I was raised, and that is what made me open to the objective reality of this world when it was brought to my attention.

I always felt while growing up, that Christianity was not for ME. I never "felt" it like everyone around me did. It never really made sense to me and I was never able to accept it fully on a soul-deep level no matter how hard I tried, which always made me feel like there was something WRONG with me and that I was definitely going to hell because of that. I guess, that was a form of suffering and me seeing that something was not right, by not being able to accept it and being fearful that I was damned and going to hell. So thank you so much for bringing this up and helping me see this!

Jordan Peterson talks a lot about these matters, if you haven't watch/read his videos/books I would recommend it to you. He has this ease in speaking loudly about the knowledge which is hidden and unspoken in each of us ;
I've only watched one of Jordan Peterson's videos in the past and he is pretty great, so I will look into videos from him on this topic too! Thanks for the recommendation!
 

Shelby

The Force is Strong With This One
A lot of people think they want to give up those "A influences" until they actually do and then they might realize there are things in this world they desire that don't fit with "being in this world but not of it." So that's a bankruptcy different from where one realizes that other spiritual paths are dead ends for them, and it's particularly hard for younger people since there are so many things that they haven't done yet.
So just to clarify, because if I'm understanding right, I can actually relate to what you're saying a lot. You're saying that there can be a difference between a "moral bankruptcy" and a "spiritual bankruptcy"? Because if so, that seems like where I'm at. Spiritually, I can see that all of the spiritual paths are a "dead-ends" like you put it, although this is something I have felt for a long time before ever coming across any of this. I thought for a long time after being raised the way I was, that any sort of religion and/or spiritual paths were all a big joke and I wanted nothing to do with any sort of spirituality of any kind.... until I started learning about all of this and it began to click and make sense.

Whereas, in terms of moral bankruptcy, if I'm being completely honest with myself, that is the part that I don't think I've reached yet. I find myself often desiring things of this world. And although I am aware for the most part when those things come up that I am just falling back into the trap, I still long for those things often, and often give in. I wish it weren't so, I'd like to come to the point where I could see that there is nothing for me in any of those worldly things and the desire would stop, but the truth is that I have not reached that point fully in all aspects, only maybe a few.

Thank you for your response and perspective Beau!
 

Shelby

The Force is Strong With This One
There might also be other lifetimes at play in which certain things were already realized to some extent.
Great point! I had not thought of this!

It also seems to me that you don't have to worry over this any longer since you seem to have made quite some progress in understanding already. It might be a good idea to slowly but surely ask yourself what you could do with those positive steps in order to be better able to help others.
Thank you for this shift in perspective 🙌🏼
 
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