Self Worth versus Self Importance

[obyvatel]

Self importance is frequently manifested in contempt which could be covert or overt. According to Miller, this is also a consequence of the contempt that one is subject to in childhood from people holding authority. Like previously stated, nothing can correct the past wrongs. Even an intellectual understanding about manipulations one is subjected to in childhood cannot change the contemptuous attitudes that one has inherited from parents or authority figures which will stay on in the unconscious and continue to manifest in one's behavior.
[quote author=DOTGC]
The function all expressions of contempt have in common is the defense against unwanted feelings. Contempt simply evaporates, having lost its point, when it is no longer useful as a shield - against the child's shame over his desperate, unreturned love; against his feeling of inadequacy; or above all against his rage that his parents were not available. Once we are able to feel and understand the repressed emotions of childhood, we will no longer need contempt as a defense against them. On the other hand, as long as we despise the other person and over-value our own achievements (he can't do what I can do), we do not have to mourn the fact that love was not forthcoming without achievement. Nevertheless, if we avoid this mourning it means that we remain at bottom the one who is despised, for we have to despise everything in ourselves that is not wonderful, good and clever. We despise weakness, helplessness, uncertainty - in short the child in ourselves and in others.
[/quote]

Some forms in which covert contempt can be manifested
[quote author=DOTGC]
There are some people who never say a loud or angry word, who seem to be only good and noble, and who still give others the palpable feeling of being ridiculous or stupid or too noisy, or at any rate too common compared with themselves. They do not know it and perhaps do not intend it, but this is what they radiate: the attitude of their parents, of which they have never been aware.
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Then there are people who can seem very friendly, if a shade patronizing, but in whose presence one feels as if one was nothing. The convey the feeling that they are the only ones who exist, the only ones who have anything interesting or relevant to say. The others can only stand there and admire them in fascination, or turn away in disappointment and sorrow about their own lack of worth, unable to express themselves in these persons' presence. These people might be the children of grandiose parents, whom they as children had no hope of emulating - but later as adults they unconsciously pass on this atmosphere to those around them.
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Quite a different impression will be given by those people who as children, were intellectually far beyond their parents and therefore admired by them, but who also therefore had to solve their own problems alone. These people, who give us a feeling of their intellectual strength and will power, also seem to demand that we too, ought to fight off any feeling of weakness with intellectual means. In their presence one feels that one can't be recognized as a person with problems - just as they and their problems were unrecognized by their parents, for whom they had to be strong.
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[anart]

Self importance is frequently manifested in contempt which could be covert or overt. According to Miller, this is also a consequence of the contempt that one is subject to in childhood from people holding authority. Like previously stated, nothing can correct the past wrongs. Even an intellectual understanding about manipulations one is subjected to in childhood cannot change the contemptuous attitudes that one has inherited from parents or authority figures which will stay on in the unconscious and continue to manifest in one's behavior.

Hi obyvatel, I think this may not be the 'whole story'. It's my understanding that deep emotional healing absolutely can 'correct past wrongs' and free one from the contemptuous attitudes. It really does come down to being the 'driver' of your carriage and when one reaches an emotional understanding (not just an intellectual understanding) of how past abuses or neglect affect everything, it is possible to heal it and 'correct past wrongs', as it were. I also think that EE goes a long way toward facilitating and speeding up this process. fwiw.

 

[Andrew]

[quote author=DOTGC]
Because grandiosity is the counterpart of depression within the narcissistic disturbance, the achievement of freedom from both forms of disturbance is hardly possible without deeply felt mourning about the situation of the former child.
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Both the depressive and grandiose person completely deny their childhood reality by living as though the availability of parents [who would love them unconditionally for who they are] could still be salvaged: the grandiose person through the illusion of achievement, and the depressive through his constant fear of losing love. Neither can accept the truth that this loss or absence of love has already happened in the past and that no effort whatsoever can change this fact.
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This ability to grieve - that is to give up the illusion of his "happy" childhood, to feel and recognize the full extent of the hurt he has endured - can restore the depressive's vitality and creativity and free the grandiose person from the exertions of and dependence on his Sisyphean task.
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[/quote]

These dynamics of looking for redressing the past loss of love through surrogate means is visible in the forum as well. The network in general and Laura in particular become the surrogate parent on whom one unconsciously projects the subjective impressions and expectations. I know I have done that - after writing a post I would come back and check how people have responded to it and a positive response would make me feel downright sanctified. On the other hand when a post does not meet the "expected" response, then it would first cause a depressive mood which would sometimes change into an attitude of grandiose defiance and questioning of the competence of the network. I know I have mentally played out this dynamic in the other aspects of life as well. I could recognize this as self-importance and struggled with it and kept it from coming out in the open - at least as far as the forum is concerned - osit. I have also seen this dynamic played out by some other forum members - many of whom left for good. But I did not understand the sequence of this typical pattern till I read Miller. It is really bizarre when one sees it - but such is the nature of the predator's mind I guess.

Hi Obyvatel,

I agree with this section and can validate it from my own experiences when posting here on the forum.
When I first started posting on the forum, all I wanted was to be praised and admired for who I was,
validated and accepted without question, and hoped that everyone would see my greatness..yadayadayada.

I always hoped that Laura would come in and save the day, and make me feel accepted, even loved
for the lack of, that I received during childhood and adolescence. I most certainty projected the idea of
the surrogate parent onto Laura to try and further validate my shaky and false self-image.

Interestingly, as you pointed out above, whenever the responses received didn't meet my 'expectations'
it would hit me like a ton of bricks!
I would either get really defensive or depressive and slump into a
self-pity program where all was lost and hopeless, and I was just to worthless to understand or even
bother trying to continue on.

I still find these same patterns manifesting today; Self-Importance has had me for a long time.
Thx for posting your thoughts on this.

 

[Luis Miguel]

Self-worth = knowing that you are special
Self-importance = expecting others to think so too!

From Trapped in the Mirror intro:

There is a group of unsung victims whose number is very great. They often do not seek the help they need because they do not recognize that they suffer from a problem for which there is a solution. These are the children of narcissistic parents. I know their plight from the inside since I am one of them.

A friend asked me, "What are narcissists? Aren't they people who think themselves special?" The answer to this is yes and no. All healthy people regard themselves as special, unique beings capable of achievement and worthy of love, and it is no coincidence that this is exactly the way their parents saw them during their formative years. People who are relatively free of narcissistic traits (most of us have some) do not attempt to place themselves above others. They are unconcerned with such comparisons. They stay in touch with their feelings and try to do their personal best. Their standards are internal and realistic since they have a good idea of who they are and what they can accomplish (such objectivity is not insignificant). They are not free of idealistic wishes and dreams.

Narcissists are wholly different. They unconsciously deny an unstated and intolerably poor self-image through inflation. They turn themselves into glittering figures of immense grandeur surrounded by psychologically impenetrable walls. The goal of this self-deception is to be impervious to greatly feared external criticism and to their own roiling sea of doubts.

This figure of paradox needs to be regarded as perfect by all To achieve this, he or she constructs an elaborate persona (a social mask which is presented to the world). The persona needs an appreciative audience to applaud it. If enough people do so, the narcissist is relieved that no one can see through his disguise. The persona is a defensive schema to hide behind, like the false-front stores on a Western movie set. When you peer behind the propped-up wall, you find . . . nothing. Similarly, behind the grandiose parading, the narcissist feels empty and devoid of value.

 

[obyvatel]

Self importance is frequently manifested in contempt which could be covert or overt. According to Miller, this is also a consequence of the contempt that one is subject to in childhood from people holding authority. Like previously stated, nothing can correct the past wrongs. Even an intellectual understanding about manipulations one is subjected to in childhood cannot change the contemptuous attitudes that one has inherited from parents or authority figures which will stay on in the unconscious and continue to manifest in one's behavior.

Hi obyvatel, I think this may not be the 'whole story'. It's my understanding that deep emotional healing absolutely can 'correct past wrongs' and free one from the contemptuous attitudes. It really does come down to being the 'driver' of your carriage and when one reaches an emotional understanding (not just an intellectual understanding) of how past abuses or neglect affect everything, it is possible to heal it and 'correct past wrongs', as it were. I also think that EE goes a long way toward facilitating and speeding up this process. fwiw.

Hi Anart,
I absolutely agree with what you wrote - my understanding is very much the same. When I wrote that "nothing can correct past wrongs", I was paraphrasing Miller in the context of externally seeking redressal for past incidents of abuse and neglect. Miller talks about internal mourning as an essential step towards emotional healing. In my first post in this thread I had quoted this
[quote author=DOTGC]
Both the depressive and grandiose person completely deny their childhood reality by living as though the availability of parents [who would love them unconditionally for who they are] could still be salvaged: the grandiose person through the illusion of achievement, and the depressive through his constant fear of losing love. Neither can accept the truth that this loss or absence of love has already happened in the past and that no effort whatsoever can change this fact.
........................

This ability to grieve - that is to give up the illusion of his "happy" childhood, to feel and recognize the full extent of the hurt he has endured - can restore the depressive's vitality and creativity and free the grandiose person from the exertions of and dependence on his Sisyphean task.
[/quote]
My second post was a continuation from this point where I had left off.