Session 4 July 2009

Avala

Dagobah Resident
gaman said:
I've found that I can feel some deep sense of "cared for" in Laura's voice and when I think about it, I start to tear up and will cry for no reason if I keep the audio running.
I find it very calming and "motherly" :)



Thanks to DRusak's link I realized what is maze dance.


It looks very similar to the folklore dancing which is common to almost any nation on the Balkans. On the ex-Yugoslav land it is called Kolo (or Oro in Macedonia). Kolo is a little archaic word and means circle or wheel.


In the Kolo formation of the dancers is not so important and it is not strictly written how to do it, in the meaning how it will look. There is a lot of room for improvisations; there are only a few simple rules: if possible dance in man-woman-man-woman . . . order, try to have all legs as one pair (which is of course impossible without practice) and if possible dance in circle. And all of that "if possible". Usually there are no lyrics; the whole thing is in the dance and the good mood.


I don't know for the Greek maze dance, but Kolo is very much alive in the celebrations through Serbia, Croatia, Bosnia, Macedonia, Bulgaria, Rumania . . . in the meaning that ordinary people dance it very often, not just trained folklore dance groups. Of course it is more beautiful to watch how professionals do it, but unfortunately they often must do it in open front formation, not in closed circle, just because of lack of the room on the podiums.


I am not so sure that dance has to do something with the old Greek mythology; I would opt for some old forgotten celtic string version (notice resemblances with the Irish Siamsa dance in some elements). It is also traditionally danced with pipe (called "Gajde") music playing for example in eastern Serbia, Bulgaria, Rumania or Istra in Croatia.


Here are some examples how professionals do it and how people on celebrations do it. Don't laugh at amateurs it's not so easy as it looks, I have tried and it is hard (although I am antitalented :)) you must keep your back straight and count rhythm with your feet, which was very hard for me.


Profesionals:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YFOU87LAnfM&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eisq2319P7U&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2zwHSJEPvs&feature=related


Amateurs:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0Dn-cBhecA&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKzWHUtW6Fw&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOc9akP_6wY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=694oIx3wIkY&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6x61K0t4jkI


Look improvisation of the guy in black shoes ;D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzszHDuqvH8&feature=related
 

Steve M.

Jedi Master
The reference to (your) Laura's voice is interesting. As I'm getting to know my self (not know, but know of) I usually have an underlying motive for everything. Most often it's for selfish reasons. Getting to the point.. it makes me wonder, since the heart chakra is at the area of the lungs as well, that if your heart is clear and bubbling over with love, with no selfish motivation then your voice would.. (I dunno, just trying to express it in some way,) not be compelled by greed but by giving.

A: The method has been used nefariously for millennia so what is wrong with FRV in a positive context?! The power of love is also FRV! Only nobody is using it of late.
I recently wrote something and wanted to share it. It's still in need of work but is edited to the best of my ability. I take no credit since it comes from the inspiration I've gained here through what has been shared. To me it represents some realizations I've had, due to my own but 'mostly others' perspiration from (C's/Laura, G,.. and others) inspiration.

"Love and thoughts on it"

What happened to them (adults) happened to me (a child) as well. And I learned to pass it on as well (parenting).

(Rule: Any reference to I, we, us or they, can be turned in reference to you, the self/Reader, them or 'others.')

We were born. We expected love. What happened to others and love happened to us. Like you, I got no love. How long has it escaped us? How out of tune are we to Love? How many generations has it been since we were able to love others, let alone ourselves?

A reference in the bible says, .."love thine enemy as thou lovest thyself"..

How many out there, people, human beings, would you like, enjoy, hope and or wish to beat the hell out of? How about Love, or are you/we just content with not sharing?

It's an interesting predicament. One few fathom. Is the realization of the lack of love what drives our youth, male or female to certain acts that end their lives?

Realizing the situation is like taking everything you know to a precipice only to, comparatively, see its end, to realize one is mostly nothing but greed and self centeredness. The precipice is a dividing line between one's self lies and are the opposite of one's Truth and Love.

In certain terms of our awareness we are so dulled down, and without exercising our mental machinery, we exist and persist in an-automatomical existence. A pearl acting Not within its own possibilities but as simple sludge. Due to our state we are potential pearls, the essence of our potential, drifted off in a sea of delusions and illusions.

Perplexing.

Wouldn't it be something to be fully on the other side of that precipice? Free of one's own subjectivity and not having any illusions about oneself in terms of how cool, rich, better, wealthier than anyone and consider being equal? The potential of Love is the promise of Universal Personhood. The need to wake up from the falsities of History and move forward as a species is a thankless drive, yet there is no greater call than the pursuit of Love. Of course it is difficult and takes stupendous effort, and a will to even look at one's own reflection.

Getting biblical again, the commandments were a call to great humanity, how did we as a species who've come this far allowed the creation and personification of Death and Destruction? Are there people out there who actually try to move to the frequency of awareness, hold position and truly pay attention to the call toward awareness, the awareness of "all you need is Love" and pursue it to its fullest? An answer worth pursuing, with an outcome of being in a less mechanical state and learn to fix and grow in awareness. Controlling at least one's own destiny, since it is you who is capable of controlling, and the only thing you can control is yourself. And by knowing oneself (child) one can learn to love oneself instead of like those failures who could not love the wounded child inside, who could, like myself neither love nor nurture that child (adult), for what happened to them as well (parent). There is no fault to be made, but Love to be learned. All of creation is calling for it.

Love, it can be as beautiful as being in a meadow on a summer day, any day, within one's self. No buttons available to be pushed, self control. The world becomes a great place of learning. Love.

Objectivity is a key in the growth toward awareness. Love is the motion and fulfillment of the desire for growth. One (awareness) propels another (love) toward the other. And opposites attract.

There must have been a time when the opposite was in effect. A time where the ego was not birthed/deformed, a time before men killed men, a time where greed and avarice did not rule the timeline. To have been born in such a time.. but this is no reason to be down, perhaps your timeless self actually has/did/will experience it. Which side of the spiral, ascending or descending do we choose? We have a freewill choice. Of course there are those who've been born creatures in human form (psychopaths). And their affect on normal's does/has exact(ed) a toll by making otherwise normal people sick (sociopaths/bipolar/schizoidal). What comes of that? The psycho's control, so the info of the sick sociopath acts/cruelty/fierce/ruthless creates a scenario where the populace is putting bars on their own windows. Where did love go? As a child coming home from school, I got home (the youngest) to an unlocked house.

Today; Bars on windows? And Love?

I wonder if those men and woman in the historic land of (STO) Love lived in absolute subjectivity. But of course not, cause if love were the at(in)tention no one would be less than another. It's dumbfounding to recognize or try and figure the potential of what was once is now lost. Have pathologicals somehow got us over on this side of this precipice? Can Truth and Love Be the same thing? Are they? Aren't they? Hierarchical thinking seems to be a major underminer in `love.' So a network/equality would be an essential. Is that possible? Or do feathers `have' to get ruffled, and the most (mentally ill) `alpha' fe/male or what not, have to have a pissing contest against the ego of some other alpha fe/male? And where is the love in that? Who cares if someone is faster or slower than another, so we have strengths and weakness's. They can be celebrated!

How'd we end up, instead, in a pissing contest of everyone against everyone? Dog eat Dog? Certainly not out by love! Love is not wishful thinking, but direct and discerning, since it is truth. Does truth need to lie sometimes? Of course! Depending on the circumstances of the situation. It can be said the devil is dispersion, yet the concept of love is unity. A pyramid scheme is not a round table. Sex, nature, the seasons, all have a rhythm. Of course none of this is understood, same as the situation of Love.

So what happened to the species? How did we get this far backward? Try and focus and really have a look at yourself. Are you trying to Love, or just looking out for your own self interests and greed while trying to create the illusion of loving?
 

PepperFritz

The Living Force
Pete02 said:
The comment the C's made about the USA kind of concerns me though. I've always imagined that if disaster was coming, it would take most of the USA with it and yet I have no plans on leaving. :( It seems I must plan on DOing much more if I plan on surviving huh?

Hi Pete02:

I'm not quite sure what you mean by the above. What is it that you think you should/could be "DOing" in order to "survive"? And "survive" in what sense? Physically, or...?
 

CEdicon

Padawan Learner
I got to say it feels pretty good to be rockin' LKJ and the SOTT team on my iPod!

Thanks for sharing, this made my day as it usually does!
 

The rabbit

Dagobah Resident
No great shock to hear that Laura´s words in sound form can do wonders , Her written words can do it also , as all long term members here can attest to.
Thanks for updates.
 
A: Yes but not only. The point is this: when you speak while merged, cosmic elements are transmitted via your voice. More than this, it has the power to heal those of similar goals who are not yet at the correct frequency. In short, through your voice we can set frequency resonance for those of "the blood."

So THAT'S what it was. :)

I had a remarkable sensation the first time listening to the audio. I can't for the life remember the details but it was comparable to first trying RV or the centerpointe Holosync cd. In fact it was probably more profound than that! I kept trying to get that sensation back with other sessions with the intro but 'no dice'. And to think July 4th was also the 6th anniversary of my introduction to Laura and the C's. Thank you so much Laura and the team for all that you've done over the years!

Belibaste said:
Carcosa said:
A: It is a common malady of the French to escape in2 illusion.
Were they speaking for all people who speak french or specifically for those born in France? :/
I took it as the people who were raised in a French cultural environment.

This escapisim sounds to me like intellectualism, or even hyper intellectualism where thinking, reasoning, making (valid or non valid) theories absorbs all the energy (and particularly the emotional energy) of the individual.

The intellec is not evil per se but it becomes detrimental when it grows so much that there is no more space for emotions. In this sense it's an escape from feeling.

It might be a narcissistic family coping mechanism where the victim learns to escape in reading, calculating, analyzing, thinking as soon as an uncomfotable emotion is luring around.

This disease is very developed in France because of several factors :
* historical : the "siècle des Lumières", all those briliant French intellectuals like Poincaré, Rousseau, Curie and of course Descartes : "I think therefore I am". Ironically if you only think, you will never feel and therefore you will never Be.
Being in a French environment I can attest that this definitely is the case in many ways. Ironically, the French are much more passionate (i.e. emotional) in demonstrating their 'calm reasoning'. Still I don't believe that this phenomenon is limited to the French by any means. I've seen it everywhere, particularly in school and in the workplace. Having a troubled life myself I often sought refuge in intellectual pursuit which helped buffer me from (incredibly painful) emotions and feelings but this IMO was a positive coping mechanism i.e. turning lemons into lemonade. Still I never got to the point where I desired to completely shut off all my feelings and became fortified with only my intellect and ego to keep me company (if that isn't hell I don't know what is).

It seems that a lot of people do this and you can tell by their clear programming, rigid, doctrinaire thinking and general self-absorbed and VERY self-satisfied narcissism covering over a very deep and profound insecurity. A strong, pungunt dose of misanthropy isn't far from the surface either. How else can they feel good about themselves but to look down at all those irrational creatures (or "ignorant masses" as someone at work once so elegantly put it) who can't control their feelings? A lot of self-proclaimed "atheists" and "skeptics" seem to fit the bill. They end up being just as closed minded and ideological as the very religionists or "tin foil hatters" they claim to have nothing in common with, which makes sense because how else do they protect their fragile ego (the only thing they have left at this point) if they never have to admit their wrong? Instead they're very, very proud of their abstract creations, all created by themselves in their "enlightened" heads, and will love nothing more than to force it upon you, like parents who just got pictures developed of their newborn. It doesn't matter that the abstracts creations are usually so dense or convuluted that you can count the number of people who would "get their genius" on one hand. It usually will never occur to them that people couldn't care less about their intellectual onanism and care as much about it as the some godawful monstrosity made from a self-absorbed artist who lost touch with reality a long time ago.
 

mkrnhr

SuperModerator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
I can attest the strong effect Laura's voice have. I thought when I heard her voice in the postcasts that I was just a sort of associating because I already knew her style from her writings, but the listening to the Éiriú Eolas breathing exercise recording convinced me that there was something more to that.

I just read this thread now, and some references are freaking me out! I went to the beach (it's winter here and very cold) to exercise breathing and I saw some funny clouds (I always observe clouds since childhood) that seemed to me like a stream following a particular route. While walking back I was followed by a funny bird who had a broken leg and was jumping on one single leg (I don't know what to think about it, maybe a bad sign?). I felt he wanted to tell me something and I thought "if only you were a crane one could think of the labyrinth story".

When we try to express everything with words, we constrict possibilities, and we tend to view reality literately. It affects all but it seems that the french are particularly attached to the literal and analytical description of the world. Maybe this escapism comes from here?
 

seek10

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
mkrnhr said:
I can attest the strong effect Laura's voice have. I thought when I heard her voice in the postcasts that I was just a sort of associating because I already knew her style from her writings, but the listening to the Éiriú Eolas breathing exercise recording convinced me that there was something more to that.
thank you laura for posting. I too feel there is some thing in the voice that calms me down. I do breathing exercises while driving, due to long drive. I find my self driving slowly and calmly at the speed limit in the right line . These breathing exercise energises me and also it calms down my groaning emotional pain, when I breath.
 

dant

The Living Force
A: Yes but not only. The point is this: when you speak while merged, cosmic elements are transmitted via your voice. More than this, it has the power to heal those of similar goals who are not yet at the correct frequency. In short, through your voice we can set frequency resonance for those of "the blood."
Is the above quote taken to mean that deaf, hearing-impaired,
or otherwise handicapped people are out of luck, if one cannot
physically see or hear the "voice" or is this beyond human physicality
and more towards that which can only be "seen", "heard", and/or "felt"
through one's own "FRV"?

FWIW,
Dan
 

D Rusak

Jedi Council Member
{aside}
re:Avala

Yes, dancing kolos and oros are quite hard, at least for me. But the difference is that I grew up on American music, which is usually in 4 beats to a measure, with the strong beats on 1 and 3. I happen to play in two groups that do a lot of Balkan music, and I STILL can't figure out a lot of the dances (daichovo, elinino, basically anything other than a simplified kolo. the daichovo is in 9 and elinino is 7).

Anyway, I'm happy to help if music is ever required, the celtic stuff seems to me like it would be kind of weird for the dancing stuff (but sounds exactly right to set the mood for breathing! awesome job guys). I play a couple of instruments, funny you mention it a friend just asked me today if I'd like to learn gaida since she has one sitting around the house. I'll be able to work on it starting late August.

{aside over}

I also feel something peculiar when I listen to Laura's voice; it's definitely NOT what I had originally expected it to sound like. The sensation I have is often one of discomfort, which upon introspection as to why that is, usually ends up with me feeling like here is one who is intensely following a Path- why am I wandering around so much? Then afterward I usually pick my intensity up in studying or working (little or big W's) at least for a bit.

On the breathing tape though I feel like I am being lead by someone who is quite assuring, I feel trust in this voice.

I am interested in the follow-up to Dant's question for sure!
 

go2

Dagobah Resident
session 4 July 2009 said:
Q: (A**) Is it curable?

A: Anything is curable with the right action within and without.

Q: (A*l) So what can we do to help him?

A: It's up to him to decide.

Q: (Allen) Since I recommended reading Bernie Siegel, would the stuff that he suggests help?

A: Absolutely. But that will not be so simple for P** who tends to escapism.

Q: (DD) Will the chiropractic help him?

A: Chiropractic will help a little. Meditating in the way you are preparing to teach will help a lot especially with the intentional assimilation of the "Prayer of the Soul."

Q: (C) What about chemotherapy - is it necessary?

A: If he wants to check out sooner.

Q: (A**) What about getting angry? Would it help him to get angry at his {childhood abuse} in a real way, or is it too late for that?

A: It's not too late but that is not the problem at the deepest level.

Q: (L) What is the problem at the deepest level?

A: Grief for not being protected and cherished. He needs to grieve
Thank you for including the personal questions---I find this very helpful .

The Cassiopaean's clear healing recommendations seem to follow up the earlier comments on emotional blockage.

Anything is curable with the right action within and without,
It's up to him to decide
He needs to grieve

I certainly relate to the problem of escaping the pain of loss, betrayals, and failures, both real and imagined leading to general bankruptcy of spiritual, physical, mental, and social health. For me, the decision to sit with the full measure of grief avoided for a lifetime, no matter the time or depth of descent led to five months of suffering as I examined and experienced realities I was afraid to experience in full until death spoke to me. After five months of emotional pain, I woke on the morning of April 3, 2005 with the pain and suffering gone. It was as if I were a different man. Shortly after that I stumbled upon this Work and have been learning right action within and without, slowly it seems and with a lot of mistakes. I hope P** and others are encouraged by my experience of grieving opening the door to a way to life before death.

Do you think grieving is close to what Gurdjieff meant when he speaks of conscious suffering or can grieving be mechanical as well?
 

RedFox

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Thanks to all involved for another great session.

The points go2 highlights really struck a cord with me too.....
go2 said:
Anything is curable with the right action within and without,
It's up to him to decide
He needs to grieve


I certainly relate to the problem of escaping the pain of loss, betrayals, and failures, both real and imagined leading to general bankruptcy of spiritual, physical, mental, and social health. For me, the decision to sit with the full measure of grief avoided for a lifetime, no matter the time or depth of descent led to five months of suffering as I examined and experienced realities I was afraid to experience in full until death spoke to me. After five months of emotional pain, I woke on the morning of April 3, 2005 with the pain and suffering gone. It was as if I were a different man. Shortly after that I stumbled upon this Work and have been learning right action within and without, slowly it seems and with a lot of mistakes. I hope P** and others are encouraged by my experience of grieving opening the door to a way to life before death.
It seems I am just embarking on this....although I have been dealing with my pain for some time....its only just now I realise I need to grieve (in the right way).

go2 said:
Do you think grieving is close to what Gurdjieff meant when he speaks of conscious suffering or can grieving be mechanical as well?
I am not fully sure about this...but from my own observations grieving can be entirely mechanical. The difference it seems is the intent and conscious observation behind it. Unless your aim is to fully experience it (with the goal of letting it go at the end, not wallowing in and taking secret pleasure from your suffering) and being consciously present to experience it.....I think it is not proper grieving (hence mechanical), because it is just feeding self pity and not healing.
With the right aim and observation, combined with the eiriu eolas last night and it is a pretty intense (in a good way) experience.

dant said:
A: Yes but not only. The point is this: when you speak while merged, cosmic elements are transmitted via your voice. More than this, it has the power to heal those of similar goals who are not yet at the correct frequency. In short, through your voice we can set frequency resonance for those of "the blood."
Is the above quote taken to mean that deaf, hearing-impaired,
or otherwise handicapped people are out of luck, if one cannot
physically see or hear the "voice" or is this beyond human physicality
and more towards that which can only be "seen", "heard", and/or "felt"
through one's own "FRV"?

FWIW,
Dan
I think this would be good to add to the Ask the C's section :) Perhaps you can put it there dant?
fwiw I would suggest that her "voice" would still effect your "FRV".....but I am not sure of the technical aspects of it, or if any alterations are required to make it more effective for those that are deaf/hard of hearing.
Perhaps a subtitled video of the audio sessions, so that the words go with the voice is what is needed?
I would really like to know the answer to this also!
 

Gaby

SuperModerator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
RedFox said:
go2 said:
Anything is curable with the right action within and without, It's up to him to decide. He needs to grieve [...] Do you think grieving is close to what Gurdjieff meant when he speaks of conscious suffering or can grieving be mechanical as well?
I am not fully sure about this...but from my own observations grieving can be entirely mechanical. The difference it seems is the intent and conscious observation behind it. Unless your aim is to fully experience it (with the goal of letting it go at the end, not wallowing in and taking secret pleasure from your suffering) and being consciously present to experience it.....I think it is not proper grieving (hence mechanical), because it is just feeding self pity and not healing.
Jungian therapist Russell A. Lockhart was concluding something similar after observing the dynamic in cancer patients. He wrote: If this 'sacrifice' is not made willingly, that is, consciously and with full conscious suffering of the loss, the sacrifice will occur unconsciously. One then will not sacrifice to growth, but be sacrificed to growth gone wrong.
 

PepperFritz

The Living Force
go2 said:
I certainly relate to the problem of escaping the pain of loss, betrayals, and failures, both real and imagined leading to general bankruptcy of spiritual, physical, mental, and social health. For me, the decision to sit with the full measure of grief avoided for a lifetime, no matter the time or depth of descent led to five months of suffering as I examined and experienced realities I was afraid to experience in full until death spoke to me....

Do you think grieving is close to what Gurdjieff meant when he speaks of conscious suffering or can grieving be mechanical as well?
I think what you have described above eloquently describes the difference between "conscious grieving" and "mechanical grieving". In my experience, what many people experience as "grief" is really anger -- anger at those who "took" from them, at the universe for depriving them of a loved one, etc. And its a kind of buffer against experiencing real grief, which is to experience fully and consciously the loss itself, and all of the ramifications of that loss. As I recall, Jung described it as the difference between "real suffering" and "neurosis". And for some, being stuck in that unresolved "anger" phase, manifests as illness in the body.
 
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