Taylor Swift shilling for the PTB?

What is clear to me when reading you is that you are a bunch of geezers.

I always remember in these cases the philosopher's exposition on youth:

«Today's youth loves luxury. She is poorly educated, despises authority, does not respect her elders, and gossips while she should be working. Young people no longer stand up when older people enter the room. They contradict their parents, brag in society, devour desserts at the table, cross their legs and tyrannize their teachers.

Socrates

:-D

In the end, almost everything you are saying is your personal tastes or preferences based on your personality, which is quite normal.

What this singer does is something more complex and malicious or disastrous.
 
Today's youth loves luxury. She is poorly educated, despises authority, does not respect her elders, and gossips while she should be working. Young people no longer stand up when older people enter the room. They contradict their parents, brag in society, devour desserts at the table, cross their legs and tyrannize their teachers.

Socrates
"If you don't eat your meat, you can't have any pudding. How can you have any pudding, if you don't eat your meat?!"

- Pink Floyd, masters of teaching basic logic

BHelmut is right that our own music generations were equally corrupted. Anyone who's ever read David McGowan's book, "Weird Scenes Inside the Canyon: Laurel Canyon, Covert Ops & The Dark Heart of the Hippie Dream" would know this (and I highly recommend that book. It provides insights very applicable today to understanding the Taylor Swift phenomenon). But at least OUR music was actually well done and creative, standing the test of time! Even if the lyrics might not, the beat endures!!
 
But at least OUR music was actually well done and creative, standing the test of time! Even if the lyrics might not, the beat endures!!
Our music...

That of Africa (with differences in each of its countries), that of India, that of China, that of Russia, that of France...?

You see, when this youth of today reaches your age (if third density lasts that long), they will say exactly the same thing about the music their children like.
 
This thread is the only reason I listened to the first Taylor Swift song in my life.
I don't think there's any point in arguing about taste (in the ancient Greek sense), I can add to the conversation as a European who is completely out of this TS madness, after the first song, that TS is probably a talented composer who is easy to shape. (Personal opinion.)
I prefer to listen to music without lyrics or classic rock music. But I am much more interested in the question of whether TS is a symptom of social consciousness or is she the one who shapes it. I vote for the former. The musical reform of the 60s/70s/80s seems to me much more like a kind of STO influence, while most of today's songs are more a symptom of the collective subconscious.
...
With all due respect, I'll stick with classic rock music.
Is it trending because everyone is doing it, or is everyone doing it because it’s trending? 🤔
 
Our music...

That of Africa (with differences in each of its countries), that of India, that of China, that of Russia, that of France...?

You see, when this youth of today reaches your age (if third density lasts that long), they will say exactly the same thing about the music their children like.
IMHO there's a deeper thing going on here, and looking back a bit into music history from my (limited) perspective, what I see at least since the early 20th Century are sharp progressions from one style of music to another each generation that becomes more pronounced over time, but I don't think it was always so.

Maybe it extends back further in time (I'm not a music historian) but perhaps it has always been that each generation of musicians strives to set it self apart from their predecessors. From the little I know, my impression is that music styles once evolved from a basic foundation and steadily improved on that foundation over time, eventually reaching an apex of evolution for that genre before seeding new musical forms, and it took considerably longer than one generation for that to occur back then.

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That progression took about 900 years!

Nowadays it seems to me that each generation has a sudden and sharp sonic "disconnect" from the previous generation, as each succeeding generation seeks to create a musical stamp to identify itself with. This is a rough visual (or audial?) of what I'm trying to describe here (and I'm aware I'm missing a lot of music styles, this is a generalization) - In the 20th Century, musical styles exploded and diversified immensely, going from:

classical > ballroom > big band > rock and roll/country/jazz > heavy metal > punk/disco > rap/hip-hop > grunge > techno etc.

Notice how the shifts in musical tone and style change more and more abruptly over time, especially the last 70 years or so?

My main point is, what I am seeing is that music itself has been used as a way to divide and conquer people, acting on generational (and racial) levels mostly (I'm talking about the USA mostly here; I'm aware this musical stratification doesn't occur in every country). As people grow up and see that what is happening in the real world is so warped and hard to understand, they look to other avenues for identity and amusement, including music, and that's how you eventually wind up in Taylor Swift clown world, IMHO.

I'm sure others here who are real musicians can take what I wrote and make more sense of it, but that's my take.
 
I like old music too and appreciate a well composed song regardless of the era it was done in. And by saying that, I sometimes compare old vs new and find that some of the newer music is also really good, in fact sometimes better, due to the advancement of tech in the music instruments and overall experience and maturity of the singer. If you love music enough, you will eventually come out of the "I like the music I grew up listening" mindset and appreciate everything else outside of that narrow selection. I have sometimes listened to East Asian music where I don't understand the lyrics but I get the gist of it occasionally and appreciate the melody. Music and singing, when done well, will touch the soul, regardless of the language.
 
I don't listen to or watch TS, but I understand the emotional hooks that can be present in music esp when they address some kind of suffering.

Recently a friends fiance died. He was too young and it was extremely sad. I'd only met him maybe three or four times and liked him. I thought it was a good sign that her kids liked him too. One of the times I'd met him was at my friends birthday that I'd travelled to and stayed over night. That night he sang a song to her and his performance of it was brilliant. He had taken singing lessons to prepare for singing this song to her for her birthday. I couldn't tell you the artist or the name of the song, but his rendition was both touching and beautiful. I couldn't attend his funeral, but watch the video of it later and the last song played at the service was this song that he'd sang to my friend and my friend was breaking down during the service. Now I couldn't get the song out of my head. So I decided to look it up and found a YT clip and watched the performance of the song, it was part of a soundtrack for a movie. So I looked up the movie to find out who the artist was......and it was Lady Gaga! Biden supporting spirit cooker! Damn, not music I'd ordinarily listen to but still getting that song out of my head was hard.

At the beginning of her carreer, a large part of her fans were teens and she was everything a girl wanted to be: "talented", beautiful, famous, fearless... Many of her songs were about her bad experiences with men (manipulator, liar, cheater or just being left on the shelf, you name it.) and this is something most of girls can relate to. Were things get concerning is that gradually her songs' topic became a lot about how she got even with these men, and basically anyone who annoyed her, how she rose from her ashes and became this famous, dazzling superstar, how she wasn't afraid to use her beauty and wealth, and could just have her pick ... Add the context where women are told they are perpetual victims, where real men are "toxic" and all the Woke thing... You got a generation of young women for whom Taylor Swift is a model, a real woman, a woman who made it.

So a bunch of young people going through a difficult period in their development, hormones changing, the challenges of finding love in the world and good partners, the excitement and heartbreak is a theme that transcends age groups. Everyone probably has memories of similar experiences and it's pretty much a universal theme. So tie that with airplay and exposure that has a lot of financial backing and the approval of the PTB and there you have it. The perfect hook.
 
50’s Taylor Swift = Elvis. Elvis was a natural reaction to the bland “drink your bourbon and martinis, pursue the American dream, and STFU” embodied by Perry Coma, Brenda Lee, Dean Martin, Doris Day etc. Elvis the pelvis was the spearhead of a rebellion from traditional values and a release from pent up societal repression. Personally, I detested Elvis’ music but I was only 7 when I started hearing him on the radio and I was a weird kid.
I agree that Elvis was very much a product. The story goes that the producers were looking for a "white man to sing black music". It's also common to present him as the "inventor of Rock'n Roll", which isn't true at all. That all came through the blues and black musicians like Robert Johnson and Chuck Berry.

However, I do have to say that even if I think that the songs performed by Elvis were quite mediocre and boring, he was a wonderful and talented singer with an intense charisma on the stage that you rarely hear or see today. Based on the little I've heard and seen Swift, you can't even compare the two (besides, vocals today are always processed and "enhanced" digitally).

Written by someone who's daughter is a great Swift fan! :scared::-D
 
More on the topic of modern music (session from 2015):

(Perceval) They said there are some types of music that are listened to by certain types of people... Certain types of emo music or whatever that certain types of young people listen to, like outsiders or loners and that kind of thing, and those people could be tracked as candidates for "use"...

A: The 70's were the time of development of such concepts and technologies. The 80's were the period when implementation became more widespread. At present 90 percent of broadcast music has corrupting elements.


Q: (Pierre) So we have to listen to old music. Music from before the 70's. Or classical music.

(L) Obviously we need to be paying much closer attention to our musical tastes, and analyzing what it is about songs that we like. And obviously, we need to pay a lot more attention to what we listen to in the background. But that means I'm safe since I only listen to old classic rock like Bob Seger, whose music is the best! [laughter]

A: Yes. Goodbye.

My personal impression has been that more and more music has some kind of unidentifiable "sharp energy" to it - I don't know how else to describe it. I noticed this even with "new remasters" of older songs, that there is some new energy there that seems "wrong" somehow. There is almost no new popular music that I liked from around 2000 onwards. And even the few new songs that I find catchy I cannot listen to much, unlike older songs and music.
 
What is clear to me when reading you is that you are a bunch of geezers.
Hey Buddy, is this a cheap shot? IF I can find my cane, I'll give you a whuppin'! (JK LOL!)

Hey, Ketone, for the record, I saw the Who live on my 18th birthday do My Generation. Amazing. And how about "Young Man Blues"?! Wow would that create sparks these days?! Back when pop music OPPOSED the PTB.

So this thread is about culture warriors and entertainment as part of the programming and who is a modern sell-out to the Imperial Regime, So here is one for y'all. I have always loved the Pretenders. Chrissie Hynde is a one of a kind original. The Antithesis of Taylor Swift. She broke through in the late 70's and here is a half way decent recent real live original. So this speaks to the geezer thing, as well as pop music in general. She is in that class of someone who still has "it", obviously writes her own stuff (no 15 man team with AI backing) and keeps creating. (she is in her 70's!) check this first verse: (the song actually starts about 1 minute into the vid) Vive Les Geezers.

Losing My Sense of Taste
I must be going
Through a metamorphosis
Pre-senile dementia
Or some kind of psychosis
I don't even care about rock and roll
All my old favourites seem tired and old
My whole collection
Now feels like a waste
I'm losing my sense of taste


I must be going through
A huge transition
I noticed last night at an exhibition
I found myself feeling
Nostalgic and sad
Like the best of
The culture's been had
Beardsley, Rothko
And the modern S.Clays
I'm not interested in art these days

I must be going through
A terrible shift
You say 'elevator' and
I call it a 'lift'
We speak the same language
But neither do well
Spout utter nonsense
About fish to sell
I'm losing my sense of smell

I must be going through
The motions at best
I thought of you so much
That it caused me unrest
But I realise
Should you bother to call
I'd probably just leave the phone
To ring off the wall
The beginning, the middle
The end must be nearing
Or maybe I'm losing my
Sense of hearing
I'm losing my sense of hearing
 
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I agree that Elvis was very much a product. The story goes that the producers were looking for a "white man to sing black music". It's also common to present him as the "inventor of Rock'n Roll", which isn't true at all. That all came through the blues and black musicians like Robert Johnson and Chuck Berry.

However, I do have to say that even if I think that the songs performed by Elvis were quite mediocre and boring, he was a wonderful and talented singer with an intense charisma on the stage that you rarely hear or see today.

Yeah, I don't really buy the whole "all music of the 60s/whenever was programming" narrative. I also don't buy the "white men stole black music" stuff, or that *everything* is stage-managed... There are elements of truth in there of course, but overall, I judge music on its merits and how it speaks to my soul, no matter when it was made or where the artists took their inspiration from, or who their manager was (well the personality and character of the artist is a factor for me too). But one thing is true, and the Cs' answer seems spot-on here IMO: the 70s were when the dedicated effort to completely control the "mainstream airwaves" kicked into high gear. Notice however that according to the Cs, even by the 1990s not *all* "airplay" music contained corrupting messages. So, it comes back to our own responsibility and soul-perception; no narrative that sorts artists into good and evil can replace that.

My personal impression has been that more and more music has some kind of unidentifiable "sharp energy" to it - I don't know how else to describe it. I noticed this even with "new remasters" of older songs, that there is some new energy there that seems "wrong" somehow. There is almost no new popular music that I liked from around 2000 onwards. And even the few new songs that I find catchy I cannot listen to much, unlike older songs and music.

Absolutely. For one thing, the loudness war destroyed the dynamics of recorded music. But also, beginning in the 2000s, there is this annoying bass-heaviness. Even folk songs have this super-heavy bass these days, and as you said, the remasters too in many cases. Even in the 90s, music was mixed much "softer" with an emphasis on getting the mid frequencies to shine; now it's all harsh treble and nauseating bass.

This sounds like an old man rant (and it is LOL), but there are some out there on YouTube that have analized how music has changed over time in the last 40 years, and its exactly that, formulaic and unmemorable for commercial reasons.

Not only that - I mean, there's many songs with 3 chords that are awesome, so it's not just complexity that is missing. In fact, the Cs advised once to keep it "simple and beautiful" when making music together (though in a different context).

I think what's missing is artists who are in touch with their souls, and with reality. This is the precondition to writing lyrics (and music!) that can actually touch those with half a soul still firing, expressing a deeper truth. The rest is "just" talent, hard work etc., but without the foundation, what can you do?

I mean, what to expect from artists who believe Biden is awesome, get your vax, electric cars save the climate, gender fluidity is cool, etc. etc.? Not that you need to check all boxes of "correct opinion" to be a great artist, and obviously many greats in the past weren't exactly well-informed. But then, the level of programming wasn't so crazy back then either. But if you believe so many disastrous lies, a tipping point is reached eventually where you are "cut off" from the well of true creativity so to speak.

And you end up with this:

Your grand nieces say that the reason they love TS is because she shares the experiences of her life and journey, but the songs of hers I've heard on the radio are all about toxic relationships. Lyrics such as:

Put another way, why should I listen to people telling me about their relationships, their wrestling with reality, their view of the world etc. if they believe all these asylum-level lies?

Among NPCs it must be cool to not stand out, to embrace greatest-common-denominatorhood. "See, I'm just as trivial as all you guys, lol", it's a way to be inclusive I guess.

With regard to Taylor Swift fans, it's maybe more something like "see, I'm harmless, I'm a good one, so please don't hurt me!" Which is kind of a natural reaction to the state of the world I guess, expressed unconsciously. But it is also very counter-productive, because it sets you up for harm. Instead, you should fight the abuser, and this requires tons of knowledge and smarts.
 
Yeah, I don't really buy the whole "all music of the 60s/whenever was programming" narrative. I also don't buy the "white men stole black music" stuff, or that *everything* is stage-managed... There are elements of truth in there of course, but overall, I judge music on its merits and how it speaks to my soul, no matter when it was made or where the artists took their inspiration from, or who their manager was (well the personality and character of the artist is a factor for me too). But one thing is true, and the Cs' answer seems spot-on here IMO: the 70s were when the dedicated effort to completely control the "mainstream airwaves" kicked into high gear. Notice however that according to the Cs, even by the 1990s not *all* "airplay" music contained corrupting messages. So, it comes back to our own responsibility and soul-perception; no narrative that sorts artists into good and evil can replace that.

Totally agree.

Absolutely. For one thing, the loudness war destroyed the dynamics of recorded music. But also, beginning in the 2000s, there is this annoying bass-heaviness. Even folk songs have this super-heavy bass these days, and as you said, the remasters too in many cases. Even in the 90s, music was mixed much "softer" with an emphasis on getting the mid frequencies to shine; now it's all harsh treble and nauseating bass.

Good point.

Not only that - I mean, there's many songs with 3 chords that are awesome, so it's not just complexity that is missing. In fact, the Cs advised once to keep it "simple and beautiful" when making music together (though in a different context).

Indeed! There are many relatively “simple“ songs that are just great and deep. So obviously, there seems to be a lot more going on. Music is complex and there are many things playing into it, that we can’t really explain from a “left brain“ perspective alone.

Maybe the character of the musicians themselves and/or what they are channeling is somehow sensed by people and that can have a lot to do with how we experience a piece of music?
 

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