The Kybalion - Hermetic Philosophy

[shijing]

Now that I've had a chance to review this a bit, I remember that when I read the Kybalion a bit over a year ago, I really liked it -- of course, I really like double-fudge deep forest chocolate cake too, but that doesn't mean it's good for me ;) Jacksun, thanks for posting the summaries of the sections up, because it makes it easier to discuss without having to necessarily quote from the book. I think the points obvyatel zeroed in on point out one of the most important things here, and that is that the best disinformation mixes in a generous helping of truth. There are large parts of each section above that probably are true (my personal favorite is the one about vibration, which aligns fairly well with both the C's and Gurdjieff's description of densities -- of course, this is a common theme in a lot of general new age fare as well). But there is a line in each that gives away the fact that all is not as it should be.

The people that Laura mentioned do give off red flags of various kinds, although for me the most obvious case is Paul Foster Case. One thing that sticks out to me, partly via the Hermes Trismegistus reference (this is Hermetic lore, after all) is that there is a whiff of Stargate Conspiracy inherent in the flavor of the book. There seems to have been a real effort on the part of Cosmic COINTELPRO (beginning at least as early as the nineteenth century, possibly before) to legitimize ancient Egypt as a seat of the occult and esoteric knowledge, an attitude that is firmly entrenched today in both popular culture as well as the New Age movement more specifically. I think that this is one red flag in and of itself.

I actually recommend reading the book, because it really is fascinating, just as long as its done with discernment. When I can steal the time to do so, I want to go through it again myself, and I'm interested to hear other members' continued thoughts on it.

 

[JAKSUN]

I actually recommend reading the book, because it really is fascinating, just as long as its done with discernment. When I can steal the time to do so, I want to go through it again myself, and I'm interested to hear other members' continued thoughts on it.

Kybalon may indeed have a nefarious past. But when it is taken in the context of Gurdjieff's and Mouravieff's information on The Ray of Creation, and the Octave model of the Worlds according to eastern esoteric teachings; there is an obvious expansion of information on tools of the Mental aspects of our experience. These I think, which are encapsulated in the 7 laws of the Kybalion model, if combined conditional on an STO perspective (e.g. exchanging the word control with the word influence or a phrase like collateral good), using our own creative imaginations; could be very similar to the abilities we will use in our new lives.

My fascination at present is the idea that a 4th dimensional world will present new responsibilities, and with them new, more powerful ways of Doing.

That I think, is my motive for presenting this material.

Bless you all

 

[obyvatel]

I scanned through the entire document pretty fast and it reinforced my first impression on reading the principles chapter. The whole text can be intellectually appealing - specially if someone has not encountered these principles before. I have read about these principles earlier - so instead of the novelty of those ideas, I could focus my reading on the overall feel of the text. IMO it shows one sided intellectual development with an undeveloped emotional center. There is a thinly veiled veneer of intellectual superiority in the entire text along with a contempt for common earthly life.
The authors state that the meaning of the term Kybalion has been lost since centuries. I remembered a Sanskrit term "Kaivalya" or "kaibalya" which sounds similar to Kybalion. The world "kaivalya" is used to denote a state of loneliness - the type of isolation which is attributed to "enlightenment" - where one looks with detachment at the various aspects of creation having separated himself from it. I don't know for sure if this applies to the Kybalion but the coincidence with the STS feel of the text is remarkable.

[quote author=Kybalion]
So, do not feel insecure or afraid — we are all HELD FIRMLY IN THE INFINITE MIND OF THE ALL, and there is naught to hurt us or for us to fear. There is no Power outside of THE ALL to affect us. So we may rest calm and secure. There is a world of comfort and security in this realization when once attained. Then "calm and peaceful do we sleep, rocked in the Cradle of the Deep" — resting safely on the bosom of the Ocean of Infinite Mind, which is THE ALL. In THE ALL, indeed, do "we live and move and have our being."[/quote]

The above when applied to the context of 3D earth in its present state can only intensify the deep slumber which the emotional center is under.

[quote author=Kybalion]
Good and Bad are not absolute — we call one end of the scale Good and the other Bad, or one end Good and the other Evil, according to the use of the terms. A thing is "less good" than the thing higher in the scale; but that "less good" thing, in turn, is "more good" than the thing next below it — and so on, the "more or less" being regulated by the position on the scale.
[/quote]
Completely unilevel view of good and bad - there is no invocation of the context (or law of 3). As I wrote in my earlier post, this is similar to post modernist relativism.

[quote author=Kybalion]
A knowledge of the existence of this great Hermetic Principle [polarity] will enable the student to better understand his own mental states, and those of other people. He will see that these states are all matters of degree, and seeing thus, he will be able to raise or lower the vibration at will — to change his mental poles, and thus be Master of his mental states, instead of being their servant and slave.
[/quote]
Once again, a unilevel view of reality.

[quote author=Kybalion]
"To destroy an undesirable rate of mental vibration, put into operation the Principle of Polarity and concentrate upon the opposite pole to that which you desire to suppress. Kill out the undesirable by changing its polarity." — The Kybalion.

This is one of the most important of the Hermetic Formulas. It is based upon true scientific principles. We have shown you that a mental state and its opposite were merely the two poles of one thing, and that by Mental Transmutation the polarity might be reversed. This principle is known to modern psychologists, who apply it to the breaking up of undesirable habits by bidding their students concentrate upon the opposite quality. If you are possessed of Fear, do not waste time trying to "kill out" Fear, but instead cultivate the quality of Courage, and the Fear will disappear. Some writers have expressed this idea most forcibly by using the illustration of the dark room. You do not have to shovel out or sweep out the Darkness, but by merely opening the shutters and letting in the Light the Darkness has disappeared. To kill out a Negative quality, concentrate upon the Positive Pole of that same quality, and the vibrations will gradually change from Negative to Positive, until finally you will become polarized on the Positive pole instead of the Negative. The reverse is also true, as many have found out to their sorrow, when they have allowed themselves to vibrate too constantly on the Negative pole of things. By changing your polarity you may master your moods, change your mental states, remake your disposition, and build up character. Much of the Mental Mastery of the advanced Hermetics is due to this application of Polarity, which is one of the important aspects of Mental Transmutation.

[/quote]
A completely unilevel view of esoteric progress and ultimate transmutation. It is not about the "degree of something " that gets changed but the very nature of it. That is the essence of alchemy. So fear does not slide along the same line and become courage but the very nature of fear is transformed. For example, in the beginning there may be only fear for one's own self preservation - but that fear may get modified into an altruistic fear for others - maybe humanity at large. That IMO would be the path towards transformation.

[quote author=Kybalion]
The Hermetic Teachings are that Man may use Law to overcome laws, and that the higher will always prevail against the lower, until at last he has reached the stage in which he seeks refuge in the LAW itself, and laughs the phenomenal laws to scorn. Are you able to grasp the inner meaning of this?
[/quote]
Mouravieff talks about the General Law and the Law of Exception and how one can free oneself from one and fall under the influence of another consciously. But having done so why would someone "laugh the phenomenal laws to scorn" ? This indicates a hatred towards creation which is very characteristic of STS.

The goal is to
[quote author=Kybalion]
"escape the pains of the lower planes by vibrating on the higher"
[/quote]
Now either that would lead to a STS method of ascension or more likely it would be the case of sheep imagining themselves to be magicians. OSIT
fwiw

 

[obyvatel]

Kybalon may indeed have a nefarious past. But when it is taken in the context of Gurdjieff's and Mouravieff's information on The Ray of Creation, and the Octave model of the Worlds according to eastern esoteric teachings; there is an obvious expansion of information on tools of the Mental aspects of our experience. These I think, which are encapsulated in the 7 laws of the Kybalion model, if combined conditional on an STO perspective (e.g. exchanging the word control with the word influence or a phrase like collateral good), using our own creative imaginations; could be very similar to the abilities we will use in our new lives.

Hi Jacksun,
You want to read the text with your own corrective interpretations. But the kind of word replacements you are talking about are like sugar-coating a bitter pill imo. Reading texts with corrective interpretation is a potential slippery slope if one does not have a very well-developed sense of discrimination. I have read texts like this with my own corrections in the past without having a strong sense of discrimination. Off course my self importance told me at that time that I already had developed perspicacity but it was false. I believe that the end result was a detrimental effect on my slumbering emotional center - it was not conducive to waking up. But that is just my experience. It is your choice - take my input fwiw.

 

[Laura]

Probably the safest attitude to take when reading any text is to assume that it IS disinfo and actively look for it. Kinda like Gurdjieff's attitude about people: assume they are dog poo and let them prove otherwise.

 

[Biomiast]

Hi to all,

I can't help thinking that those things can be interpreted differently when I read obyvatel's analysis since we simply don't know the intentions of the authors. When he mentioned potential red flags, since they are dangerously close to truth(like by changing your vibration, you diminish STS choices in the system and more free will is available as a natural result, as I "interpreted", yet he thought it was changing someone elses' vibrations with manipulations ;)), one falls into the danger of misinterpreting them. I think in such a case, the best thing to do is check the background instead of interpreting the text.

When I take a look at the website, Hermes Trimestigus reference made me think that this is just another book that claims to know the secrets of Hermetic knowledge while they don't know much or spread disinformation. I think this is a more healthy attitude than just interpreting the text while you know nothing about authors and project your thinking onto the book.

From what I have read so far, this is just another book that provides some basic knowledge of esoteric teachings, and apply the knowledge with their own bias, osit.

Just my two cents, fwiw.

 

[obyvatel]

Hi to all,

I can't help thinking that those things can be interpreted differently when I read obyvatel's analysis since we simply don't know the intentions of the authors.

It is possible to gain a fairly good idea about intentions of people from what they write or say or even how they write about a topic. As far as I understand, that is one of the basic premises on which this online forum works.

When he mentioned potential red flags, since they are dangerously close to truth(like by changing your vibration, you diminish STS choices in the system and more free will is available as a natural result, as I "interpreted", yet he thought it was changing someone elses' vibrations with manipulations ;)), one falls into the danger of misinterpreting them.

Can you please quote the specific text that your are referring to in this case? Then we can discuss any potential misinterpretation.

I think in such a case, the best thing to do is check the background instead of interpreting the text.

I agree that if credible data is available on the background of the authors then it helps. That data adds to the information gained from the text itself. If the case is such that the forum has already done the research on some website or author and found them to be disinfo agents then off course there is little need for interpreting the text except for personal learning and polishing discernment skills -osit.

When I take a look at the website, Hermes Trimestigus reference made me think that this is just another book that claims to know the secrets of Hermetic knowledge while they don't know much or spread disinformation.

Why do you think so? Do you have any solid credible information on Hermes Trimestigus?

I think this is a more healthy attitude than just interpreting the text while you know nothing about authors and project your thinking onto the book.

Can you please give specific examples where you think I am projecting my thinking onto the book? I did not have any preconceived notion about the text or authors when I started reading the book. What I did was to present my analysis to the forum for feedback and correction if required. Can you please let me know why you think this is a "less healthy attitude" ?

From what I have read so far, this is just another book that provides some basic knowledge of esoteric teachings, and apply the knowledge with their own bias, osit.

Bias in esoteric teachings is often a dangerous thing. It is important to understand what the bias is and how it affects the value and integrity of the whole document. What do you think the bias is?

 

[Biomiast]

Hi obyvatel,

First of all, let me say that I don't think you are projecting your thinking onto this book. It was not my intention to imply that, maybe I couldn't convey myself or properly explain my point. What I was trying to point out was NOT you who is projecting, but those who may think the book is in agreement with the knowledge that is present here. And I used your interpretation as an example that if a person is really projecting they can dismiss your interpretation with their counter interpretation. That is, if they don't want to see, their reading of the text would be flawed, and in such a case, it is better to look at the background of authors. Because by knowing how authors behave, you may project less than before.

It is possible to gain a fairly good idea about intentions of people from what they write or say or even how they write about a topic. As far as I understand, that is one of the basic premises on which this online forum works.

I have no objection of interpreting a text. I was merely saying if a person is projecting(not you, a hypothetical person) then their analysis of that text will be skewed.

Can you please quote the specific text that your are referring to in this case? Then we can discuss any potential misinterpretation.

I am in agreement with your analysis. I was just saying if a person doesn't want to see, they can interpret something that you consider a red flag and find it in agreement with their view. Here it is:

And all are simply degrees of the same thing, as you will see if you will but think a moment. And, more than this (and considered of more importance by the Hermetists), it is possible to change the vibrations of Hate to the vibrations of Love, in one's own mind, and in the minds of others.

and you said: And at that level, would there be a desire to change hate to love in the minds of others for a person of STO orientation?

Again, I am not against you analysis, I was saying others with their bias may read this differently.

Why do you think so? Do you have any solid credible information on Hermes Trimestigus?

This is from a C's session, Ana posted it in this thread, but for the sake of context:

Q: (L) Who was Hermes Trismegistus?
A: Traitor to court of Pharaoh Rana.
Q: (L) Who is Pharaoh Rana?
A: Egyptian leader of spiritual covenant.
Q: (L) In what way was Hermes a traitor?
A: Broke covenant of spiritual unity of all peoples in area now known as Middle East.
Q: (L) Who did Hermes betray?
A: Himself; was power hungry.

Can you please give specific examples where you think I am projecting my thinking onto the book? I did not have any preconceived notion about the text or authors when I started reading the book. What I did was to present my analysis to the forum for feedback and correction if required. Can you please let me know why you think this is a "less healthy attitude" ?

See above. I didn't mean to say you were projecting, I didn't think you were. I tried to say(and obviously failed) that those who project(which is not you) should stop and follow a more healthy attitude, learning as much as they can from authors' background.

Bias in esoteric teachings is often a dangerous thing. It is important to understand what the bias is and how it affects the value and integrity of the whole document. What do you think the bias is?

I think you made a good analysis of the bias of the authors, there is no need for me to repeat. What I thought was they don't think much about the fact that they can be deceived and used by evil forces, which is the bias stood out for me. If you thought that I was implying a bias of you, this is not true, I don't think you have any bias.

My apologies for the confusion obyvatel. I should have posted an externally considerate post, and I should have realized that not everybody reads my posts the same way I do. I hope that clarifies a little bit.

 

[obyvatel]

OK, thanks for the clarification Biomiast.

 

[Iron]

I have read the Kybalion years ago, and thought not much of it. It is a presentation of some principles of esoterica, has some air of prepotence and I have a feeling that it tries to lure the reader into accepting the ideas of the book with promisses of power.

 

[LQB]

I have read the Kybalion years ago, and thought not much of it. It is a presentation of some principles of esoterica, has some air of prepotence and I have a feeling that it tries to lure the reader into accepting the ideas of the book with promisses of power.

Similar impression here. To me, it appeals to the intellect - but upon deeper assessment, it appears there is little there. Yep, yep, yep, but at the end ... so what?

 

[abeofarrell]

Initiation Into Hermetics and Kybalion

Although there seems to be much opposition to the "occult" (the word actually just means Secret Knowledge, which is what this site is all about in many ways), these 2 books are what lead to me coming here.

The Introduction of Initiation into Hermetics is good as it looks at VIBRATION and how there are the different levels of density, very similar to the ideas presented by Laura and the Cs.

The Kybalion also presents the world as being MENTAL, everything being a mental creation of THE ALL, and discusses again the densities. Both of these ideas can be found in Laura's High Strangeness.

They Kybalion was the book I read which finally made sense as to who I am, where I am going, HOW we came to be. I highly recommend it.

 

[obyvatel]

Re: Initiation Into Hermetics and Kybalion

Hi abeofarrell,
You can find a discussion on Kybalion in this thread .

 

[abeofarrell]

Re: Initiation Into Hermetics and Kybalion

Hi abeofarrell,
You can find a discussion on Kybalion in this thread .

Thanks. I already read it, and also the discussion on IIH.

My philosophy is to read everything with clarity and to find even a grain of truth that can lead you somewhere. Although there are lies, mistakes and STS ideas in these writings, still, they lead me to where I am today, HERE. For that I am grateful. Now I am moving on from there to new things.

Thank you.

 

[Laura]

I've merged the threads.