visibility of the 4th density

enlightened

enlightened

A Disturbance in the Force
I have carefully read "the high strangeness" and now am reading the 1st book of the RA material.
And I just realized that I am missing the main point about 2nd, 3rd and 4th densities.
Say animals are 2nd, humans are 3rd and others are 4th, all occupying the Earth.
The 4th density vibrations are already starting.
What I don't understand, is why we can see animals and vise versa, but we can not see or or otherwise perceive the 4th density beings?
Are they present on the same Earth? Are these in traditional words - good and evil spirits?
Do they have time? Do they have bodies?
I am much confused here...
 
enlightened said:
I have carefully read "the high strangeness" and now am reading the 1st book of the RA material.
And I just realized that I am missing the main point about 2nd, 3rd and 4th densities.
Say animals are 2nd, humans are 3rd and others are 4th, all occupying the Earth.
The 4th density vibrations are already starting.
What I don't understand, is why we can see animals and vise versa, but we can not see or or otherwise perceive the 4th density beings?
Are they present on the same Earth? Are these in traditional words - good and evil spirits?
Do they have time? Do they have bodies?
I am much confused here...
Click to expand...

Hi,

One can only "see" what is beneath them, which is why 3D cannot see 4D. Have you read Laura's Wave series? Maybe you may want to read it before you get into the Ra stuff since a lot of what is discussed on this forum centers around it.
 
Mrs. Peel said:
One can only "see" what is beneath them, which is why 3D cannot see 4D.
Click to expand...

Then how come 2D (animals) can see us? This has confused me since I started reading the materials.

With all due respect, I'm still not convinced that we (humanity) don't have "2D" and "3D" rankings backwards out of sheer conceit.
 
Guardian said:
Then how come 2D (animals) can see us? This has confused me since I started reading the materials.
Click to expand...

I think it has something to do with densities 1, 2, and 3 sharing the same "realm". I remember reading something like this but am not sure if I understand it. We share Earth with the other two densities and are able to all see each other, although subjectively and not as we really are.
 
The way I've been thinking of it - this is just conjecture - is: Perhaps animals don't see us in the way we understand...they might only perceive a small cross section of what we think of as reality - like how a 2d rectangle can only "touch" one face of a 3d cube at a time.. To a snail, your two hands might seem to be two separate phenomena (not necessarily solid objects!).

So perhaps we do see a small part of 4th density, also in a way which we don't understand. The C's said something like - that what we experience as weather is just the 3rd density part of something happening at a higher level.. Sorry, can't find the relevant session, just this short quote:

http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/hurricane.htm
Those of you who are frequent visitors to these pages have already have an idea about the Cassiopaean perspective on weather phenomena, i.e. that it is a reflection of, or an actual "intrusion" of, 4th density phenomena into our 3rd density world.
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Maybe rocks percieve humans as the rock equivalent of weather? :)

It's probably all way more complex than that....there's also what the C's say about 4th density having variable physicality.
I second the recommendation on reading The Wave!
 
If you have the time and interest, Ouspensky's Tertium Organum covers the idea of 1st/2nd/3rd/4th densities, though he calls them dimensions, in much depth. He exhaustively analyzes 1st and 2nd density critter's perceptions of 3rd density and uses that as a basis to discuss 3rd density perception of 4th density. Unfortunately I don't have a copy (I borrowed mine from the library), but there is some really excellent discussion in there.

Though, as other's have said, I would read The Wave first, it sort of lays the ground so to speak.
 
Puck said:
If you have the time and interest, Ouspensky's Tertium Organum covers the idea of 1st/2nd/3rd/4th densities, though he calls them dimensions, in much depth. He exhaustively analyzes 1st and 2nd density critter's perceptions of 3rd density and uses that as a basis to discuss 3rd density perception of 4th density. Unfortunately I don't have a copy (I borrowed mine from the library), but there is some really excellent discussion in there.
Click to expand...

It's available (for free) at the sacred text archives.
http://www.sacred-texts.com/eso/to/index.htm

I remember reading it years ago, but he lost me when I got to the part where he says animals can't form concepts because they don't have "speech, " the ability to understand levers and fulcrums, etc.

That man has never watched beavers build a dam. :rolleyes:
 
3D Student and brandon make interesting points.

I actually think that all beings in all densities are able to ''see'' each other according to their current level of awareness and maybe "position". I could be very wrong here though..

(I think it's better to read the Wave as there is also an excerpt from Tertium Organum.)
 
From what I understand 4th density is the first one with true "variability of physicality", meaning inhabitants of 4th density need not exist in the physical realm. "Seeing" in the way you mean, I believe, refers to using our eyes to observe the physical realm. Apparently 4th density inhabitants can occupy the physical realm when it is desirable for them to do this, but it is difficult for them to remain for long periods of 'time'. This is why the "greys" are used as cybergenetic drones that more easily occupy 3rd density. I believe that is the current hypothesis.

This might help:
http://www.cassiopedia.org/glossary/4th_Density



edit: Also, as far as 2d animals being able to "see" us. I'm not so sure that they are fully aware of us in the way we are aware of them, really they are only aware of the consequences of our presence. Perhaps we can "see" the consequences of 4D activity but are just not aware that this is the source. For example, the C's said that violent weather storms are a result of 4D "battles".
 
brandon said:
The way I've been thinking of it - this is just conjecture - is: Perhaps animals don't see us in the way we understand...they might only perceive a small cross section of what we think of as reality - like how a 2d rectangle can only "touch" one face of a 3d cube at a time.. To a snail, your two hands might seem to be two separate phenomena (not necessarily solid objects!).
Click to expand...

Yeah, what I meant is that while 2D can 'see' us, they can't think and perceive on our level.
 
Woah, I totally missed brandon's post but that is pretty much how i see it too. If you've read Flatland, you can get an idea of how different the perception levels may be. This is in line with brandon's analogy of the 2d surface in a 3d cube.
 
Puck said:
If you have the time and interest, Ouspensky's Tertium Organum covers the idea of 1st/2nd/3rd/4th densities, though he calls them dimensions, in much depth. He exhaustively analyzes 1st and 2nd density critter's perceptions of 3rd density and uses that as a basis to discuss 3rd density perception of 4th density. Unfortunately I don't have a copy (I borrowed mine from the library), but there is some really excellent discussion in there.

Though, as other's have said, I would read The Wave first, it sort of lays the ground so to speak.
Click to expand...

Actually Laura quotes from Tertium Organum in the Wave series when she discusses this very topic. I can't remember exactly where, but I'm pretty sure it is within the first 1/3 of the Wave. Enlightened, if you haven't already, do read The Wave in full as a lot of these kinds of questions are answered there.
 
Densities seems to be related to modus and depth of perception and consciousness.

There are interesting speculations (as Puck already mentioned) regarding the way animals in 2D perceive the world around them (compared to our own characteristic modus of perception), in P.D. Ouspensky "Tertium Organum". His reflexions are quite logical and informed, as well as surprising.

Of course he works via reduction, meaning he deduces the logic of perception simplifying the problem, considering 1D and the progression to 2D and then to 3D, and finally 4D.

However, Ouspensky is talking about 3D and 4D in the classical and scientific manner, being 4D the aggregate of 3D plus time. This is not what we understand as 4D.

Is there a kind of barrier between 1D, 2D, 3D and 4D?. There is no doubt animals and us share the same physical realm, though certainly we do not perceive it in the same way. Maybe the differences in perception capability between 3D and 4D inhabitants make impossible to we, citizens of 3D to even realize they exist, we simply cannot perceive them.

Indeed there seems to be a difference in the transition from 3D to 4D.
 
Mrs. Peel said:
Yeah, what I meant is that while 2D can 'see' us, they can't think and perceive on our level.
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How do we know that? Perhaps they can think and perceive on our level, and are just disgusted by us?

Animals (undomesticated ones) live in harmony with their environment. They don't take more than they need. They live simply for the sake of living, in a system of balanced interconnectedness we can only envy.

What but our egos and our own skewed perceptions make us think we are somehow more "aware" and "evolved" than the other beings we share this planet with? Even a lowly tit mouse knows not to poop in its water source, but for some reason humanity has yet to grasp this very basic concept of survival.

Just because we like to think we're superior creations to the rest of the animal kingdom...doesn't make it true.
 
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