Where Troy Once Stood

[axj]

On another note, a Pole shift during Younger Dryas shouldn't be discarded yet in my opinion

The C's have said that there was both an axial tilt change and some crustal displacement during the Younger Dryas cataclysm (about 12,000 years ago) - with the previous geographic North Pole being somewhere in South-Central Canada, maybe close to Hudson Bay.

They also said that a larger axial tilt change of about 20 degrees happened just around 5000 years ago.

 

[palestine]

I had a look in the book, and I found something interesting.

Here is the plot:

Odysseus ransacks Ismara, a city, and that's when his troubles begin. When leaving the city, a storm catches his ships.

" Thence we sailed on with aching hearts, glad to be clear of death, though missing our dear comrades ; yet the curved ships did not pass on till we had called three times to each poor comrade who died upon the plain, cut off by the Ciconians. But now cloud-gathering Zeus sent the north wind against our ships in a fierce tempest, and covered with his clouds both land and sea ; night broke from heaven. The ships drove headlong onward, their sails torn into tatters by the fury of the wind."

He wanders and reaches a faeric place, where the mind becomes dizzy:

"on the tenth we touched the land of Lotus-eaters, men who make food of flower ... whosoever of them ate the lotus' honeyed fruit wished to bring tidings back no more and never to leave the place"

He leaves and reaches the Cylops:

"Thence we sailed on with aching hearts, and came to the land of the Cyclops, a rude and lawless folk"

He fights the cyclop, and when leaving in a hurry, the cyclop throws rocks at his boat:

"...tearing off the top of a high hill, he flung it at us. It fell before the dark-bowed ship a little space, but failed to reach the rudder's tip. The sea surged underneath the stone as it came down, and swiftly toward the land the wash of water swept us, like a flood-tide from the deep, and forced us back to shore"

"...once more picking up a stone much larger than before, the Cyclops swung and sent it, putting forth stupendous power. It fell behind the dark-bowed ship a little space, but failed to reach the rudder's tip. The sea surged underneath the stone as it came down, but the wave swept us forward and forced us to the shore"

Here is a session mentioning cometary bombardment + water:

Session 16 April 2016

(Pierre) One last question: about the frozen mammoths. During the last session, we suggested that the cause of the flash-frozen mammoths was a Super Derecho like a giant thunderstorm that deflected the jet stream down towards the Earth's surface, and that's what flash-froze the mammoths. You said, "Close enough." So that's not exactly what happened. What are we missing here?

A: Impact sending enormous stream of heat and matter upward, creating a vacuum, followed by induction of super cooled air.

Precisions:

Session 16 September 2017

(Pierre) Let's shift to a more cheerful topic: cometary bombardments. So we discussed the death of the woolly mammoths due to a cometary bombardment. I would like to know about the transfer of water from Mars to planet Earth, when did it occur relative to this cometary bombardment? How many years before, how many years after?

A: Within 40 years more or less.

Q: (Pierre) So cometary bombardment, and then Mars water transfer?

(L) And how did that happen?

A: Electric arc of cosmic proportions.

A: Mars was much closer temporarily. Tales of gods fighting in the sky and castration of Chronos relate to this event.

Q: (Pierre) So, this massive inflow of water from Mars reaching Earth...

A: Much of it precipitated as snow at poles, and was released into oceans gradually. Water moving through space is not liquid.

(Pierre) Well, that's answered my question I think. I was about to ask is this water transfer why sea levels raised about 50 meters during the Younger Dryas while the temperatures were dropping?

A: Yes

Figuratively speaking, it would match, in the sense of "impact & water". But reality was a transfer of water from Mars, to Earth, manifesting as snow, at poles.

The cyclop episode may be a match.

Session 29 December 2018

(Joe) When you asked years ago about the Clovis people being wiped out and stuff, you asked a few questions about it. Last month they discovered this Greenland crater that they're dating to roughly 12,000 BC that wiped out the I didn't find anything in the sessions where you asked how many space rocks or chunks actually impacted the planet? Do you know?

(L) Oh yeah, but if you read about that, you know that there were several big ones. And there were lots and lots of small ones, like the Carolina Bays. Those were overhead explosions.

(Joe) But it's not accepted that that's what it is.

(L) Not by mainstream science.

(Joe) They're gonna have to start looking at it now with the discovery of this crater.

(L) And the people who've theorized about it, they say that a really big chunk hit the Greenland ice sheet and went into the Hudson Bay or something. Another one went into Lake Superior or Lake Michigan... I forgot which one. So, it seems that there were at least three big ones.

The problem is that the cyclop sends two rocks - and here there is a mention of three main comets. Was the cyclop episode a representation of the main comets? Or else? Even, nothing?

If correct, who was the cyclop? The last session (November 1st) explains that Odysseus wasn't a real person:

Session 1 November 2025

Q: (Joe) Was Odysseus a real person?

A: No

The standard physical framework, based on a history, stops here. No Odysseus. So... No cyclop? No island?

Who was Odysseus, and so, "what" to frame within "a fight, from a ship, against a cyclop, on an island, sending rocks"?

The Odyssey precisely relates Odysseus' travels - at least from the start, up to after the cyclop episode. It's quite precise and we can count the days. I am taking note of this but it is not over yet. I would hope that we may use this, but I am not sure.

-

An interesting perspective is that the events in the Odyssey are relating to a past event, and this is mostly about the destruction of Atlantis.

Session 13 January 2024

Q: (seek10) C's mentioned three destruction events for Atlantis. So does Edgar Cayce. 'Cayce Atlantis' book suggests three destruction event years are around 50K BCE, 28K BCE, and 10K BCE. C's already confirmed the last one is close to 8498 BCE (10 December 1994 session). Are the first two destruction years Cayce suggested, correct?

Atlantis got destroyed in three steps, and the Odyssey thus seems to relate one of those three.

What's interesting is that Indian texts refer to the same events:

Session 18 December 2021

(Sid) What was the real motivation behind the mythological Indian texts of Mahabharata and Ramayana?

A: Record events of great significance.

Q: (L) Okay. And the second part of the question:

(sid) Are there any factual events or just adaptations of Odyssey, etc?

A: Odyssey was part of the same phenomenon.

Q: (L) So the Odyssey was another group of people recording the same sort of events?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) But recording it in their particular way?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) So, you don't have to say that one was the derivation of the other - just that there was something significant enough going on for people to get upset about it and write about it in the only way they could. They didn't have the scientific language that we have. They had to write about things in the way that they were able.

And so, while the Odyssey seems restricted to the last destruction of Atlantis, several Indian texts may be descriptives of the first two events (and the third one of course); here is an example:

https://cassiopaea.org/forum/threads/session-6-july-2024.54848/

(seek10) When were the bits and pieces of information packaged into the Vedas? Was it before the Younger Dryas Event around 16,000 BCE?

A: Yes

Would be interesting to compare the Odyssey with "the Indian text relating the third stage of the destruction of Atlantis" (which one it is, I don't know!). There could be two or three rocks, possibly sent by a "character".

In addition, Atlantis got destroyed, from two factors:

- crystals turning autonoms (and nuts)
- several armies fighting "the Atlantis army"

Can we find this in the Odyssey?

Session 29 July 2023

(Ze Germans) If Russia's karmic role is an adversary of Atlantis, who was playing this role back then before the final destruction of Atlantis?

A: Same locale, different names. Read The Iliad and Odyssey for clues.

Session 23 August 2025

(Navigator) Yeah, just a real quick one. In a previous session, the Cassiopaeans mentioned that we should look into the Iliad and the Odyssey for references to the people that once opposed Atlantis. Are these Phaecians, these guys that were against Atlantis?

A: Close.

To sum up:

1) Odysseus ransacks Cicones, and this triggers a reaction from Zeus. An anthropocosmic connection of some sort? Troubles begin starting here.

2) This starts a storm:

cloud-gathering Zeus sent the north wind against our ships in a fierce tempest, and covered with his clouds both land and sea ; night broke from heaven

Sky is obscured.

3) Then, Odysseus lands in the lotus eaters, where it's kind of like a dream. Kind of drugged, alternative reality etc.

4) After this, he meets the cyclop and two rocks are thrown in the sea.

This would be a short chunk, matching the reality of the Younger Dryas, and the Odyssey. I wouldn't pretend it to be objective, and this could be representative of minor events.

The whole plot is organized around "ship sailing from point X to point Y". If Odysseus wasn't a real person, what were those trips?

 

[Gaby]

On another note, a Pole shift during Younger Dryas shouldn't be discarded yet in my opinion, and sorry for being a bit dense here but that event/comet(s) could've brought a massive disruption upon Earth, a once in a lifetime event even. Correct me if I'm wrong here, but if not a crust & mantle displacement, perhaps we could consider an actual core shift?

I agree, as the discussion brought up in the session doesn't necessarily reflect the research of the core/mantle shift, i.e. it doesn't necessarily commit to such polar wander events every thousands of years or so, and it doesn't refer to crustal slippage per se, nor does it revolve around a magnetic pole shift specifically.

McCanney also seems to be pretty convinced about a true polar wander event in the remote past, of the "mantle around core" type. But for him, a big gravitational wave coming from Venus seems the missing factor. It seems that there are several factors involved, of which the Cs just confirmed two:

- ECDO theory (specifically, that Earth's core and mantle dynamics drive periodic rotational instabilities, leading to true polar wander events). Cs answered, "Partly involved, yes."
- A big comet like Venus, sending a big gravitational wave. No direct impact here, just "action at a distance".

Presumably, the Earth was already primed with the first factor.

Other factors might involve the "human cosmic connection". Atlantis was pretty much destroyed, but not the world per se. Kantek was literally pulverized. It seems there are "physiological" mechanisms on Earth that allows for "physiopathological" disease/destruction. Its levels of severity depend on the occasion and on several factors. And there's science to support this.

I think it's food for thought that this could be a "Very close!" answer by the Cs:

Thread 'Session 27 September 2025'

Sep 29, 2025

Session Date: September 27th 2025

Laura and Andromeda at the board

Niall, Joe, Gaby, Ark, Possibility of Being, Chu, Scottie, Princess Leia, Falkor, Bella

FOTCM Members attending via Zoom:

3DStudent, A Jay, Adobe, Aeneas, aimarok, Alana, Alejo, Aliana, Altair, aluminumfalcon, AnaHuitzil, Anamarija, anartist, Ant22, Anthony, Approaching Infinity, Aragorn, Arwenn, Aya, Bluefyre, Bobo08, Breton, Cosmos, daddycat, Deliverance, dugdeep, Eboard10, Ennio, Expedition26, fabric, finduilas495, France, Gawan, Glenn, Gottathink, Gwenllian, Harmony99, herondancer, Hesper, hesperides, honzap...

• Laura
• Replies: 394
• Forum: Cassiopaean Session Transcripts

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Loss of current influence in the position of our geographic North Pole

Increase in sea surface temperature and in the Earth's axis of rotation

Shift in the planet's rotation around its maximum axis (the denser mantle)

Increasing the chances of a True Polar Wander event with an axis of gyroscopic moment based upon the African blob.

It should humble humanity. Who knows, maybe the Kantekians never thought their planet could be destroyed.

My 2 cents.

 

[Ruth]

The whole plot is organized around "ship sailing from point X to point Y". If Odysseus wasn't a real person, what were those trips?

A map? Or sailing instructions? Specifically for Celtic navigators, in addition to being a 'rollicking good story', they may have had a practical purpose, as well as a potential mythical (as in 'The Mysteries') type purpose.

In the book "Where Troy Once Stood", a comparison is made to what the UK calls "Admiralty Pilots":

ADMIRALTY Sailing Directions

Information to support port entry and coastal navigation including details on pilotage, regulations and navigational hazards. Covering the world's main commercial shipping routes and ports.

www.admiralty.co.uk

 

[palestine]

@Ruth



Thank you for the screen shots! The author really saw something.

"The place are of astonishing precisions"

In my view, this could be relating to the efforts of Homer, to convey precise informations. The author of "Where Troy once stood" may be conveying the idea that because it's very accurate and it's a sailor's story - the precise locations "have to be bound to real places", and "so we must try to track down the road of Odysseus". I would rattach "the precision phenomenon" to something different, but who knows?

Days of rest between cataclysms?

Well - this shows that the Odyssey conveys the idea of a motion of a guy, over the sea - while there may be another complete different "basis". It's difficult to get out of "the sailor" framework! How far does this consideration go - and what in the world would we have to consider? I am having hard times to even foment any single idea.

If not "a guy moving on the water" - then a fixed guy.

If not "a guy" - then, it's a woman, or a body of individuals. A civilization? One single country? The world?

"The guy is moving" - when in fact he's not. So, is it a basic mapping of various locations? The Odyssey could represent different snapshots, and the sailing would be akin to "now let's move on to see how Egyptians dealt with the cataclysm". "Now let's move on the the X tribe, to see what happened at their place"... Like a historian.

That's what I come up with - but I don't know if this makes any sense.

The author states that "the Odyssey fulfills the function of a maritime chart"; this is interesting. My above two-cents try to convey the idea that the grounds were very different than what we would think of, so that we would have to reconfigure the basic landscape, to understand what the Odyssey was really about (all the "it was fix/stable/no-motion").

The "maritime chart" pops up. This is a 3D element. The question could be: is it really a glue to the reality of the events? What would be the requirement to have "a motion", during the reality of cataclysmic events? People moving to save themselves? The historical description of the whole cosmic phenomenon moving from one location to another?

But there is the maritime element; difficult for me to put it in perspective with "Odysseus wasn't a real person", so as to preserve the maritime aspect. I could think of El Nino, or that the cataclysms have been reconfiguring the maritime landscape, or that the sea was really a bigger deal than the earth. EDIT: pole shifts? Chapters, or days would be old/new coordinates?

 

[palestine]

From "cometary encounters", by Pierre:

In summary, Firestone’s bombardment scenario goes as follow: a massive
comet approached Earth and fragmented into bolides of various sizes. Five
cometary fragments were particularly massive and reached the surface of
the planet.The five impacts happened virtually at the same time, which suggest they
were all part of the same cometary swarm. The fact that the first impacts in
the list above hit a very specific location (Northern America) suggests that
the comet fragmented into four pieces shortly before impact. The fifth
crater located in Finland suggests that, before the final fragmentation, an
earlier fragmentation had occurred, separating the body that hit Finland
from the rest of the cometary body.

In Richard Firestone - "the cycle of cosmic catastrophes":

And

Here are Odysseus' trips:

Odysseus's trips, two back & forth, on the left (first one > Gibraltar, second one >Lotophages) could be equivalences for some of the streams that the illustration of R. Firestone shows.

In addition, if you look at the main impact zone (R. Firestone), there seem to be four streams; one goes to Asia, etc. If one looks at the Cyclopes area midst of Italy: this area looks like the same "concept". But this is subjective.

The starting point for Odysseus' travel, located in Troy, in Turkey. "A starting point".
<>
"A cometary impact", leaving streams, with a starting point located somewhere (in this case, North Europe).

The first illustration of R. Firestone, along with Pierre's text, show five big impacts.

The North European impact does not match (we can see Europe in the above illustration).

The book from R. Firestone says:

After we found long streaks of meteorites across the American Great Plains,
we wondered whether they also existed in Europe, since our Event theory
suggests that impacts or bolide explosions occurred in Europe at the same
time as those in North America.

We propose that those dates and that meteorite pattern are the footprint
of a colossal explosion over northern Europe that blasted debris as far away
as Africa. If it happened from 16,000 to 13,000 years ago, as we believe,
the impactor would have exploded over the Scandinavian ice sheet, blasting
out an immense volume of ice and debris in the same way that such impacts
send rock debris flying into the air. When the airborne ejecta landed on
three continents followed by the debris-laden shock wave, the effects on the
people and animals living there would have been equivalent to thousands of
nuclear bombs. If so, we might still see visual evidence of the impacts.

I assume that a big debris did the North Europe impact.

 

[palestine]

I had a look at R. Firestone's articles; a recent one studies the presence of nanodiamonds, and he was able to produce a map, for the identification of cometary impacts.

Nanodiamond-Rich Layer Across Three Continents Consistent with Major Cosmic Impact at 12,800 Cal BP
"Nanodiamond-Rich Layer Across Three Continents Consistent with Major Cosmic Impact at 12,800 Cal BP"

Figure 1. Map showing 24 sites containing Younger Dryas Boundary (YDB) nanodiamonds. The solid line defines
the current known limits of the YDB field of cosmic-impact proxies, spanning 50 million km2 (Wittke et al. 2013),
including the study of Mahaney et al. (2010) in Venezuela (open circle). Numbered sites are from this study: (1) Lake
Cuitzeo, Mexico (Israde-Alca´ ntara et al. 2012b); (2) Daisy Cave, California; (3) Arlington Canyon, California (Kennett
et al. 2009b); (4) Murray Springs, Arizona (Kennett et al. 2009a); (5) Lindenmeier, Colorado; (6) Bull Creek, Oklahoma
(Kennett et al. 2009a); (7) Blackville, South Carolina; (8) Topper, South Carolina (Kennett et al. 2009a); (9) Kimbel
Bay, North Carolina; (10) Newtonville, New Jersey; (11) Melrose, Pennsylvania; (12) Sheriden Cave, Ohio; (13) Gainey,
Michigan (Kennett et al. 2009a); (14) Chobot site, Alberta, Canada (Kennett et al. 2009a); (15) Lake Hind, Manitoba,
Canada (Kennett et al. 2009a); (16) Kangerlussuaq, Greenland (Kurbatov et al. 2010); (17) Watcombe Bottom, Isle of
Wight, United Kingdom; (18) Lommel, Belgium; (19) Ommen, Belgium; (20) Lingen, Germany; (21) Santa Maira, Spain;
(22) Abu Hureyra, Syria. In addition, independent researchers have reported NDs at six sites, indicated by letters,
four of which are in common: (a) Indian Creek, Montana (Baker et al. 2008); (b) Bull Creek, Oklahoma (Madden et
al. 2012; Bement et al. 2014); (c) Sheriden Cave, Ohio (Redmond and Tankersley 2011); (d) Newtonville, New Jersey
(Demitroff et al. 2009); (e) Lommel, Belgium (Tian et al. 2011); (f) Aalsterhut, Netherlands (van Hoesel et al. 2012).
A color version of this figure is available online.

Comparison:

It is difficult to me to understand if this article is a new study overriding A. Firestone's previous findings ("five big impacts"). I don't think so; this would be another angle of study, based on "the presence of nanodiamonds", and yielding the above distribution (but I am not sure). And so, this could be relating to secondary fragments only.