Winter Storm Threatens East Coast? Batten Down the Hatches

[Ekios]

Oh crap ... I just felt on that now ... _http://www.youtube.com/v/9g8mjfPHFXw

 

[anart]

It might not be ridiculous if the utility company is privately owned.

We were on a co-op at the time, but our neighbors were on VEPCO (Virginia Electric and Power) and it took just as long for them.

The way it was explained to me is that they restore the lines that carry the highest voltage at first, then the 3 phase grid, then individual residences last.

What this means is that large businesses get their power back first (because they're 3 phase) and folks in rural areas are dead last.

I work in the electrical industry, not a utility- but we do work with high voltage feeds, indoor, motors, lighting, etc. It's been rough with our repairs, but nothing compared to what the utilities are going through!

First, they survey the damage and see what is salvageable. Then, damaged equipment has to be dismantled to make room to put up the new equipment and lines. Sometimes there is waiting for the proper materials and machinery to do the job, depending on the location.

After that, new construction is done and then things have to be coordinated to energize the lines properly and make sure they have the proper protection.

So it's like doing a new construction job, PLUS demolition of the old damaged equipment!

I remember when Verizon was here 2 years ago putting up fiber optics, it took them days to complete a few blocks at a time. They didn't have to deal with broken trees or having to pull out old cables and equipment.
I can't imagine how many times to multiply that time frame example by to give an idea of how much needs to be done.

Yep, this is exactly what I watched this summer when we were without power for almost 5 days. At first I thought, "what is taking them so long!" then I thought, "how can they ever get all this done?" because it is a block by block (often house by house) process of putting up new power poles, stringing new wires and slowly, slowly rebuilding what is downed. It's not a high tech business - it is wooden poles and electric wire just hanging there in the sky. It amazes me that our whole society is dependent on wooden poles and wires hanging between them - that's it. I was impressed with the guys working here last summer. It was over 100 degrees out there and they were doing it from sun up past sun down, slowly slowly block by block, usually house by house because they had to run wires to each house from the wires at the tops of the poles. Our whole electrically based society is really just hanging by a thread.

 

[Al Today]

What I'm surprised about is that people in the NYC area are being told this and also the fact that people just a few miles away have power. I don't understand the technicalities involved, but it still smacks of incompetence to me. Then again, that wouldn't be anything new.

Not only incompetence but GREED. Last summer millions were out of electricity as a massive storm ripped through usa. From observation our American Electric Power utility has been raking in the big bux hand over fist. One way they have been able to accomplish this is by not investing into equipment and manpower crews. Have you noticed that when the media talks of work crews coming in from all over the country, they are usually private contractors, not utility company crews.

So when that big storm blasted through, the electric companies knew they would not have the manpower to quickly remedy the situation. Oh I am sure that within their boardroom meetings they have numerous times discussed this lack of manpower and equipment. All I can figure is that they do not care. As long as profits are sustained, they don't give a rats ass about the common folk.

Power, greed and profit is what is happening within this corporate run so-called gubement.

 

[Andromeda]

Our whole electrically based society is really just hanging by a thread.

Yeah, we're living in a world where are 'civilized' lifestyle almost completely depends on hanging threads and plastic pipes. It really wouldn't take much at all to knock us all back to the stone age.

 

[anothermagyar]

I am on Staten Island which was hit pretty hard. There have been some deaths along the coast.We went out in trucks to rescue a few stranded people and animals along with the fire dept as was possible. In my home there was a lot of superficial damage, 52 bags of debris from trees. It took superhuman strength ,at least for me. I didn't think I had this much strength in me. I asked the universe is all I can say and it answered. What I also observed,and had me horrified and shocked, was the behavior of most neighbors. Not one person asked to help me, and I am alone with a pretty big piece of property to care for. Not even my tenant came out, and later on when he did, and I expressed my concern and need for help, there was no response. Literally, and these are people I know and have friendly relationships with. I moved a bunch of trees that fell across the street, and men were taking pictures of me.The millionaire next door gave me an old broken flashlight when I finally asked. I felt like i was in the twilight zone. I am not a whiner.What I observed was pshycopathy in action. Not only that, but there were definite programs and limitations in these people that were right in front of you that were like robots short-circuiting. This did not look human, there was something very out of whack here. I've seen this before, but not en masse and not as clear. Most just refused to acknowledge anyones plight. I thought that I could be going a little bonkers myself, and when I questioned my niece 2 houses down, she also said that the same people walked away from her on other occasions during short little pleasentries that she initiated in a neighborly way. Something prompted me to walk over to a worker that came to move trees, and he had told me that people all over were paying no attention to his directions, which could of meant life and death.I think I woke up a little more. And it doesn't matter where I am, these same people I would help if they asked, no matter what. I know its in times like these that show us who we choose to be, and though I'm a selfish being in 3D, my initial responses to disaster showed me this time, that not only the people, but the trees, and animals are as important to give thanks to as well as each other. I sang to those trees, as corny as it sounds and maybe crazy,but I thought of the respect the Indians of this country had. And I sang thanks to every one of them and touched them all. I didn't ask for protection, because they to have a will of there own that I have no business interfering in. I just thanked them for their wonderful gift they gave to so many of us on the land. And I sang LOUD. To heck with the neighbors!And the doggies were by my side all through the storm that raged.As I sit in HOME DEPOT, writing this I am grateful I can plug in here. And will have enough .duct tape, and hopefully enough batteries and blankets to stay warm. I'll be fine no matter what. People died,so my plight is nothing, and thanks to the connection of the people, YOU!,her, I have all I need. Thanks for listening. I'm comforted just to know you're all here .I will take pics if possible.

Sorry to hear that what you have to experience.

Staten Island is devastated:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/02/nyregion/staten-island-was-tragic-epicenter-of-new-york-citys-storm-casualties.html?smid=fb-share

A mother lost her two children during the storm.
My butcher told me yesterday his house in Coney Island had 7 ft. water level washed away almost everything in his house, no electricity yet.
He was noticing also people wasn't really cautious during the hurricane because last summer during hurricane Irene the media hysteria was bigger then the storm.
This time they weren't careful, this is why so many people got hurt.

 

[anothermagyar]

Shane, I'm glad you're all right, hope you don't have to be without electricity too long!

 

[LQB]

Our whole electrically based society is really just hanging by a thread.

Yeah, we're living in a world where are 'civilized' lifestyle almost completely depends on hanging threads and plastic pipes. It really wouldn't take much at all to knock us all back to the stone age.

Yes! One good blurp from the sun (like the Carrington event) might take out much of the grid/transformers and repairs may take years depending on production schedules for new transformers. This (and other reasons) is why I think its not a bad idea (if you can afford it) to put a simple one-panel solar system together that can run some lights (LED), fridge/freezer, etc. You can decide how you want to distribute the load when you need it. Basic costs are:

Solar Panel: 150-250 watts --$100-200
Charge controller: $75
Inverter (> 1KW): $150
Batteries (2 Pro deep cycle 12V for solar): $300
Misc wiring/switches/etc: $100

Don't buy those packaged systems that are all over the internet - do it yourself with quality components. A good place for most of the components is Alt-E.

 

[Chrissy]

We got our power back today. It really wasn't that bad living without it. We just made the best out of it and spent some good family time playing games, reading and talking. Also, the diet was extremly easy to follow. I simmered meats, fried bacon and even made bone broth on the woodstove.

 

[Renaissance]

Just checking in again. I have some pictures taken but didn't bring my camera with me and will upload them next time. It's odd because the town just 20 minuets away looks like they have hardly been hit. We're on a small mountain so that probably made a difference with the strength of the winds. Ten days is a while, particularly when so much of life revolves around electricity. My mother's dog grooming business is run out of the house, so that adds some extra work. I've also noticed generally how easy it is to make a mess of the living space and that the extra effort might be coming from the need to develop new behavior circuits in an environment without electricity. I'm betting that putting in the extra effort continually and right from the start makes a significant difference in your general state of mind. Funny enough I've been busier this past week than usual!

Most of our surrounding area has electricity, but we're apparently always last to get it and our road has had a number of trees that have fallen on lines. Someone told my mother that our area would be waiting for electricity for more like a month. I'm hoping that's just an evil rumor and since much of the area is already taken care of that we'll get service sooner than later. We got a pile of wood delivered and a wood-stove (with a cook-top!) is on it's way too. I'm feeling like a real homesteader! We're also getting a hook up for our generator to connect with our circuit breaker so our entire house will be 'plugged in' today or tomorrow, hopefully. Our land line stayed in service, so I may be able to connect using dial-up soon.

Many gas stations are now closed; yesterday I heard about lines that were miles long in New Jersey, and although we're about an hour and a half away many seem to have come to the area to get gas. Luckily I was able to fill up some gas cans this morning (although there was a guy in front of me who looked like he had 20-some gas cans in his truck!)

Our whole electrically based society is really just hanging by a thread.

Funny, I was just talking to someone about this same thing. It even looks like obsolete technology. It made me think of those ancient grids Laura wrote about in Secret History and how they were so far ahead of our time! But the strange thing here is that there have been so many technological advancements made, yet the infrastructure that it relies on is ready to go kaput at the drop of a dime.

Electric alternatives aren't great either. Gas will run out and solar isn't always reliable. I've barely seen the sun in a week (it's coming out a little here and there today which is nice).

 

[Horseofadifferentcolor]

I am on Staten Island which was hit pretty hard. There have been some deaths along the coast.We went out in trucks to rescue a few stranded people and animals along with the fire dept as was possible. In my home there was a lot of superficial damage, 52 bags of debris from trees. It took superhuman strength ,at least for me. I didn't think I had this much strength in me. I asked the universe is all I can say and it answered. What I also observed,and had me horrified and shocked, was the behavior of most neighbors. Not one person asked to help me, and I am alone with a pretty big piece of property to care for. Not even my tenant came out, and later on when he did, and I expressed my concern and need for help, there was no response. Literally, and these are people I know and have friendly relationships with. I moved a bunch of trees that fell across the street, and men were taking pictures of me.The millionaire next door gave me an old broken flashlight when I finally asked. I felt like i was in the twilight zone. I am not a whiner.What I observed was pshycopathy in action. Not only that, but there were definite programs and limitations in these people that were right in front of you that were like robots short-circuiting. This did not look human, there was something very out of whack here. I've seen this before, but not en masse and not as clear. Most just refused to acknowledge anyones plight. I thought that I could be going a little bonkers myself, and when I questioned my niece 2 houses down, she also said that the same people walked away from her on other occasions during short little pleasentries that she initiated in a neighborly way. Something prompted me to walk over to a worker that came to move trees, and he had told me that people all over were paying no attention to his directions, which could of meant life and death.I think I woke up a little more. And it doesn't matter where I am, these same people I would help if they asked, no matter what. I know its in times like these that show us who we choose to be, and though I'm a selfish being in 3D, my initial responses to disaster showed me this time, that not only the people, but the trees, and animals are as important to give thanks to as well as each other. I sang to those trees, as corny as it sounds and maybe crazy,but I thought of the respect the Indians of this country had. And I sang thanks to every one of them and touched them all. I didn't ask for protection, because they to have a will of there own that I have no business interfering in. I just thanked them for their wonderful gift they gave to so many of us on the land. And I sang LOUD. To heck with the neighbors!And the doggies were by my side all through the storm that raged.As I sit in HOME DEPOT, writing this I am grateful I can plug in here. And will have enough .duct tape, and hopefully enough batteries and blankets to stay warm. I'll be fine no matter what. People died,so my plight is nothing, and thanks to the connection of the people, YOU!,her, I have all I need. Thanks for listening. I'm comforted just to know you're all here .I will take pics if possible.

I just wanted to say your words stuck with me all this morning. I think it is awsome that you sang for the trees!!!!!! I wondered if I was to sing for trees, what would I sing? The only thing that came to mind was the song off of The Sound of Music movie "I go to the hills for the sound of music". Just was wondering what you sang to them?

 

[Divide by Zero]

What I'm surprised about is that people in the NYC area are being told this and also the fact that people just a few miles away have power. I don't understand the technicalities involved, but it still smacks of incompetence to me. Then again, that wouldn't be anything new.

With ConEdison's system, there are multiple paths to feed power, they call it a network system. This is unlike a normal utility that feeds an area in one place and then it goes to many houses. But, like when we had the crazy summer neighborhood outages, if one feeder only is connected, and the others are down, it ends up being overloaded and taking everything down. It can handle a failure or two in a section, but more than that- the others get overloaded.

When it comes to the NYC areas with underground power having no lights... I am angry at the incompetence. The maintenance that should have been done yearly has been overlooked to save money. Underground cables and transformers are sealed and run fine in water, if they have been regularly checked/maintained! The work done to seal in the high voltage requires a THICK level of rubber and other materials, designed to seal out water and insulate the high voltage.

Also, as we have experienced at work, some above ground equipment, like high voltage switchgear and breakers should have been designed to sit at a higher level FROM THE START. This equipment feeds the underground system, but it can't be sealed like the underground cables/transformers. Yet, somehow the engineers set up the contract plans to install it at ground level in some areas, where the water level can easily rise up even in a normal period of high rain! I blame the authoritarian follower mentality of the industry that tends to put their decisions in the hands of a few engineers. A lot of times, they don't ask the people who work on the equipment as to what would help us out in the future.

 

[Gimpy]

One thing that's bothered me through this whole mess...what's happened to the homeless population during Sandy? I have yet to see anything outside of one Sott article that even mentions them.

 

[Beau]

Meanwhile NYC is using 3 generators (2 live, 1 backup) to help power the NYC Marathon and a couple more are being used in a Manhattan neighborhood without power to film an SNL skit. If it wasn't clear before, it's obvious now - we live in a crazy insane world...

 

[1984]

Meanwhile NYC is using 3 generators (2 live, 1 backup) to help power the NYC Marathon and a couple more are being used in a Manhattan neighborhood without power to film an SNL skit. If it wasn't clear before, it's obvious now - we live in a crazy insane world...

Indeed, it's all about the money, as usual. The marathon brings in about $340 Million to the City itself.

 

[Gawan]

Meanwhile NYC is using 3 generators (2 live, 1 backup) to help power the NYC Marathon and a couple more are being used in a Manhattan neighborhood without power to film an SNL skit. If it wasn't clear before, it's obvious now - we live in a crazy insane world...

Indeed, it's all about the money, as usual. The marathon brings in about $340 Million to the City itself.

What? That's really insane. Also when it would be not possible to feed the normal power grid with these generators something more useful and helpful could be done nonetheless. It's eventually also a bit symbolic on what - energy - gets spend on.