Hope, fear and the future

[quote author= Lilyalic]and not understanding why I'm here and why we're all here.[/quote]

Theoretically I think we can answer that. But to understand it on a practical level is something else entirely.

But honestly speaking I think big concept such as in the transcripts below does not really answer your question. Why we are here, simply translates into empathy and lessons I think. We care about others, but we cannot help others if we don’t learn. So we must learn in order to be of help. Empathy is the only true and pure driving force of creation. STS just as STO offers the necessary lessons for this. That’s why 'evil' exists.



[quote author= Lilyalic]but without the "evil" or both sides of the ying-yang so to speak, there would be nothing to see. I could even go as far as, there wouldn't be much to learn. [/quote]

True, until everyone in creation has completed their lessons, Union with the One is what follows.


[quote author= November 12, 1994 ]Q: (L) So it is necessary to have a pathway of service to self in order for the pathway of service to others to exist?
A: Yes. [/quote]

[quote author= November 26, 1994]Q: (L) But you say it is a natural thing or part of a natural grand cycle. Is this natural grand cycle just part of the interaction between light and darkness which just simply must be?
A: Yes. We are at "front line" of universe's natural system of balance. That is where one rises to before reaching total union of "The One". 6th level. [/quote]

[quote author= January 11, 1995 ]Q: (Barry) What do the Cassiopaeans gain from this contact?
A: By helping you, we are moving toward fulfilling of our destiny of union with you and all else, thus completing the Grand cycle. [/quote]

[quote author= April 4, 1997 ]Q: Okay, what is the distinction? You say that objectivity is the ATTEMPT on the part of the observer to leave prejudice at the door.
A: Without consciousness, there is neither objective or subjective!!
Q: So the crux is the attempt to leave prejudice at the door in the same manner as one would be non-anticipatory in order to create?
A: Yes.
Q: Well, that is a VERY tricky... (A) Is consciousness objective?
A: Consciousness is objective, until it has the capacity to choose to be otherwise.
Q: What is the stimulus for the change, for the giving of the capacity to choose?
A: The introduction of prejudice.
Q: In a cosmic sense, cosmic consciousness, in the sense of The One Unified Consciousness, what is the stimulus there for the ability to choose?
A: When the journey has reached union with The One, all such lessons have been completed. [/quote]

[quote author= May 31, 1997 ]A: No. 7th density is "union with the One."
Q: What is the distinction between union with the One and God?
A: Only at 7th density is God unified.
Q: When God 'disunifies,' or 'destabilizes,' or 'disperses,' where, and I know 'where' is not the right term, what density is then manifested?
A: Wrong concept totally.
Q: What is the RIGHT concept?
A: Well, first of all, God does not destabilize or disperse, for that matter. Purge the linear inner concept.
Q: Okay, I am purging. All just simply is. At 7th density there is union with the One. At 6th density there is... what? An equal balance of dark and light, or being and non-being, is that correct?
A: Pure consciousness no need to physicalise.[/quote]

Ego divides/seperates us from each other, that’s why 'God' (all of us) is fragmented. Ego wants to own others in ways for the self, hence the seperation. It cannot unconditional love and see others as they are. But without subjectivity/ prejudice /Ego we are not separated. Empathy/love applied with knowledge connects. That’s what binds us together. And if everyone in creation would truly learned there lessons and understand this. Union with the one is what follows.



[quote author= January 27, 1996 ]A: Yes. And no, Pk, we were 3rd density beings in fact we are you in the "future!" We were you, and we are you, and we were 3rd density. Do you understand the significance of the last statement, or would you rather just brush it off? We are you and we were you and we were 3rd density but we are not now 3rd density and you are not yet 6th density.
Q: (L) How do you spend your 'time?'
A: Teaching, sharing, assisting.
Q: (L) What do you do for fun? A: That is fun! [/quote]

When everyone in creation has learned their lessons. There would be no need to teach, share and assist others either. That’s when we all become one.

It may sound a bit dull not wanting to experience anything for the self at all. But consider as you may, old behavior of yourself you no longer feel the need to follow through. Old behavior that was delusional, immature, selfish, etc. So it’s fair to say that you now feel relieved that you no longer want to experience that. I think it’s somewhat the same with all our programs. When all our programs are stripped away, we feel relieved and are in peace with ourselves. And when everyone in creation learned the same. Creation/ God will be in peace with itself. Becoming one.

Until some 'inner conflict' (want to experience something STS) arises in 'God' and separation occurs and the whole thing start over again. (Big bang, our perspective) Ofcourse this happened/happens from a timeless perspective. So it already has happened, is happening and will happen.


[quote author= October 18, 1994 ]Q: (L) Is there only one ultimate creator of the universe
A: All is one. And one is all.
Q: (L) From the one what was the first division?
A: Mass division and disbursement.
Q: (L) Was this simultaneous?
A: Yes.
Q: (L) Was this what we refer to as the "Big Bang?"
A: Yes. Q: (L) Is there any reference to this event in terms of time?
A: Always.
Q: (L) Can we say that all that exists in the material universe is, say, "x" number of years old?
A: No. It is the eternal now. Not only did happen, is happening and going to happen. The expanded presence. [/quote]

Some other transcript below that are related to the question 'why are we here' But again, is any of it practical of giving your answer? I think these transcripts offer some clues what it means to be STO. And how STS 'happened' or exists. But only some clues, that's all. And it can give us some insight into the grander scheme of things. After all, the question 'why we are here' is not a small question.


[quote author= September 9, 1995 ]Q: (L) Everything, I guess.
A: You are "Prime Creator."
Q: (L)Well, we know we are... (RC) We are creators, but we aren't the Prime Creator...
A: Prime Creator Manifests IN you. [/quote]

[quote author= January 13, 1996 ]Q: Next question: How does one determine if they are channeling a 3rd density dead dude, or a higher density being?
A: Corrections and clarifications needed: "Dead Dudes" are 5th density beings. Either they are stuck in 3rd density, or they are communcating from 5th density, not 3rd density!! They are not 3rd density! 1st density includes all physical matter below the level of consciousness. 6th density is uniform in the level pattern of lightness, as there is complete balance on this density level, and the lightness is represented as knowledge. 7th density is union with the one... it is timeless in every sense of the word, as its "essence" radiates through all that exists in all possible awareness realms. The light one sees at the termination of each conscious physical manifestation is the union, itself. Remember, 4th density is the first that includes variable physicality!! Ponder this carefully!!! And, remember, there is only one "God," and that the creator includes all that is created and vice versa!
Q: (L) Okay, if you are in fourth density, for example, does everything move at the speed of light and is that why there is no time there and no gravity?
A: No. That is an incorrect concept... [(T) There is no speed of light, light is everywhere.] Precisely. There is no speed of light in fourth density because there is no need for any "speed." Speed, itself, is a third density concept. You remember, all there is is lessons. That's it! There's nothing else. It is all for your perception. For our perception. all consciousness. That's all there is. [/quote]

[quote author= September 9, 1995]Q: (L) What is it that limits our awareness?
A: Your environment. And it is the environment that you have chosen. By your level of progress. And that is what limits everything. As you rise to higher levels of density, limitations are removed.
Q: (L) What creates this environment of limitation?
A: It is the grand illusion which is there for the purpose of learning.
Q: (L) And who put the illusion into place?
A: The Creator who is also the Created. Which is also you and us and all. As we have told you, we are you and vice versa. And so is everything else.
Q: (L) Is the key that it is all illusion?
A: Basically, yes.
Q: (L) So, essentially...
A: As we have told you before, if you will be patient just a moment, the universe is merely a school. And, a school is there for all to learn. That is why everything exists. There is no other reason. Now, if only you understood the true depth of that statement, you would begin to start to see, and experience for yourself, all the levels of density that it is possible to experience, all the dimensions that it is possible to experience, all awareness. When an individual understands that statement to its greatest possible depth, that individual becomes illumined. And, certainly you have heard of that. And, for one moment, which lasts for all eternity, that individual knows absolutely everything that there is to know.[/quote]

[quote author= October 7, 1997]A: As we have stated, the greatest danger has passed for now. And, as we have stated, there is resistance to the awareness of the fact that sensitivity is greater and power potential is greater, and ability is greater, that the soul is stronger because it has experienced more incarnations, and all of these other factors. This is a difficult time, as it is for all in 3rd density at this stage of life, as there are pressures coming from elsewhere in 3rd density and 4th density. And, this is the final stage of the blossoming of the soul in each incarnation. Therefore, there is resistance, even resistance to these words. It is all part of the learning process.
Q: Well, I have observed that whatever we resist seems to cause us to suffer.
A: This is true, but suffering comes in differing degrees.
Q: And, it all seems to relate to our resistance to who and what we REALLY are and to doing things from a higher level of direction rather than the emotional programming.
A: That is true. All is lesson, and each lesson is one more step on the road to union with the One.
Q: I feel that my learning is at a standstill.
A: Standstills are not really of great concern as long as they are merely rest stops on the pathway to greater knowledge or growth. We have told you before, and others, to watch the signposts along the way, to read the signs and understand their meanings. If you do that, you will be far ahead of the battle. And, "battle" is the appropriate term, because battle is what results from attack, attack that is resisted in a progressive and positive manner. Therefore, one wants to be ahead of the battle if at all possible, and the tools for that are the signposts, and the signposts are EVERYWHERE! Intuition is one, synchronicity is another. You have enough power, knowledge and awareness already to recognize the signposts. It is only the emotions that can cause them to be clouded over. And this is only if the emotions which are a natural state of being for 3rd density existence, serve as a hindrance instead of an assistant. And that is the primary lesson for now: to take those emotions, which are perfectly natural, and employ them as assistance. Once emotions have been used positively, progress to 4th density STO is possible. The existence of emotions will moderate as progression through 4th density STO occurs. While that may not seem possible to you, or something that you can grasp at this time, you will understand it eventually. [/quote]

Thank you so much for starting this thread, Joe. And for all the insightful responses by other members.

I don't know if my thoughts about this subject are exactly co-linear or not. But I thought I'd share them and find out from you all where I'm off base. So here goes.

Trust-Faith-Hope: I don't know why I feel this total trust that DCM is in charge of the Universe so I don't need to be. And I don't feel a need to know whether I'll remain in 3D or graduate to 4D. I'm ok with either or neither. What I do feel a need to do is learn the simple karmic lessons of 3D. And because I really do love learning, learning really IS fun.

Future: I enjoy the mystery of NOT knowing what my future will bring. I like it to be a surprise. Even when I used to do astrology, I was never really interested in finding out the future so much as attempting to understand what makes us tick. It was more about learning about the psychology and archetypes and symbols and stories that charts tell. Not whether I would meet so-&-so or finding answers to most of the other mundane questions so many people are interested in answering.

As for the World's & everyone and everything else's Future, I think any of you would be better qualified to answer that question. Based on what we CAN see, on what the C's have said, on past cycles & history & research galore, I'm still leaving that up to DCM. I'm not sure that our AIM or PURPOSE is to change the balance of 3D STS reality as 3D STS beings. It seems to me that WE have learned our best lessons in this 3D STS world BECAUSE it IS primarily and predominantly STS. And my understanding is that the short cycle requires enough STS energy in order for us to learn more quickly — because it's more painful — and pain and suffering are what catapults us to learn — because it hurts and we want it to stop hurting. And that motivates us to learn. And the more out-of-balance it has become, the more people are waking up and the more motivated they seem to be to want to find out what the heck's gone wrong with their World. But, as Sitting says, I could be wrong.

Suffering: I'm ok with my own suffering. Little more difficult to deal with others' suffering, but only because I can't help feeling their pain too. Not as if it's my own pain but just because it's our nature to comfort and console and wish to alleviate or ameliorate or de-stress whatever discomfort or pain others encounter. I actually feel blessed and graced that we are provided so many opportunities to serve others in this way. Maybe our suffering is a way of serving others?

Witnessing: There's a distinct sweetness that accompanies feeling compassion and empathy towards others that is precious in its own right. Maybe because suffering & compassion seem to create a connection and bond between myself and others that is sweet. I don't think I'm here to eliminate their suffering. I can comfort and console and be present for them and witness their pain. I can't take it away from them or remove it for them or magically dissolve it for them. I can only be present for them — to hold space for them to feel it themselves — & move through it if they can.

That works for people I'm in contact with. For all the people suffering outside my immediate influence, that's actually more difficult. I've cried rivers for their plight. I've felt furious at what's being done to them. I've felt furious at those who are doing mean things to them. I've felt beyond enraged at my own country and myself as a member of this country that pursues such vicious agendas which cause so much suffering for others.

Limits: If I do not see a way to be present for those others in order to assist them in their hours of need, then I try to focus on where I can put my energy to helping those closer to me. I am trusting that if I will do my teeny weeny little part for those close to me, then there will be others who are closer to those others who will be doing their teeny weeny little parts to help them too. This may be wishful thinking on my part. And a cop-out as well. But I am NOT DCM and CANNOT be everywhere simultaneously. I am trusting that DCM SEEs what is necessary and mirrors accurately whenever and wherever needed.

Perspective: It helps me to remind myself that I am one little nano part of the whole, but that this little nano part is capable of doing its little nano particle's best with whatever skill, talents, abilities she has . . . and so she will. Like that little Legend of the Song Bird I wrote about in a couple of other posts on other threads.

Summation: What helps me most to help others is whenever I can achieve a separation of I from all those other Little i's. That state opens up so much space inside my mind that it seems to create a huge spaciousness for me to be available for others. And besides the space aspect, it alters my experience of time as well. There's a timeless present . . . as if Now is so expanded and huge that normal time has become irrelevant. It's all just one huge eternal Now moment. That can probably only make sense to anyone who has experienced that phenomenon him/her-self.

I apologize if I've de-railed most of the previous discussion because I've focused so much on the 'feeling' aspects rather than the intellectual and philosophical and scientific aspects of this subject. Probably 'cause I just don't have a very developed Intellectual Center — but I'm working on it — mostly by reading and pondering posts by others who do have a much more developed Intellectual Center — for which I thank all of you who do. :)

13 Twirling Triskeles said:

I apologize if I've de-railed most of the previous discussion because I've focused so much on the 'feeling' aspects rather than the intellectual and philosophical and scientific aspects of this subject. Probably 'cause I just don't have a very developed Intellectual Center — but I'm working on it — mostly by reading and pondering posts by others who do have a much more developed Intellectual Center — for which I thank all of you who do. :)

Click to expand...

On the contrary, the feeling part is really the most important, because it is through feelings or emotions that we suffer most, and through them that we can also, in theory, come to understand and know, and therefore lessen, the suffering. So thank you for the input, it was very insightful.

Joe said:

13 Twirling Triskeles said:

I apologize if I've de-railed most of the previous discussion because I've focused so much on the 'feeling' aspects rather than the intellectual and philosophical and scientific aspects of this subject. Probably 'cause I just don't have a very developed Intellectual Center — but I'm working on it — mostly by reading and pondering posts by others who do have a much more developed Intellectual Center — for which I thank all of you who do. :)

Click to expand...

On the contrary, the feeling part is really the most important, because it is through feelings or emotions that we suffer most, and through them that we can also, in theory, come to understand and know, and therefore lessen, the suffering. So thank you for the input, it was very insightful.

Click to expand...

Yes! This is exactly why psychology is so important. We need to get in touch with our emotions in order to truly be in touch with reality. No matter how much we intellectualize, until we feel it, we will not truly "know". In the flipside, as explained in the wave, emotions can make us believe in lies/subjectivity and override our logic.

http://cassiopaea.org/2012/03/27/the-wave-chapter-70-you-take-the-high-road-and-ill-take-the-low-road-and-ill-be-in-scotland-afore-ye/

Divide By Zero said:

Joe said:

13 Twirling Triskeles said:

I apologize if I've de-railed most of the previous discussion because I've focused so much on the 'feeling' aspects rather than the intellectual and philosophical and scientific aspects of this subject. Probably 'cause I just don't have a very developed Intellectual Center — but I'm working on it — mostly by reading and pondering posts by others who do have a much more developed Intellectual Center — for which I thank all of you who do. :)

Click to expand...

On the contrary, the feeling part is really the most important, because it is through feelings or emotions that we suffer most, and through them that we can also, in theory, come to understand and know, and therefore lessen, the suffering. So thank you for the input, it was very insightful.

Click to expand...

Yes! This is exactly why psychology is so important. We need to get in touch with our emotions in order to truly be in touch with reality. No matter how much we intellectualize, until we feel it, we will not truly "know". In the flipside, as explained in the wave, emotions can make us believe in lies/subjectivity and override our logic.

http://cassiopaea.org/2012/03/27/the-wave-chapter-70-you-take-the-high-road-and-ill-take-the-low-road-and-ill-be-in-scotland-afore-ye/

Click to expand...

Thank you Joe and Divide By Zero for your responses. And thanks for the link DBZ -- giving me another opportunity to review that Wave Chapter 70 again.

Yes. For sure we don't need our emotions overriding our logic. Or we run into the problem of our Emotional Center Usurping our Intellectual Center.

And we don't need our logic overriding our emotions either. Or we run into the problem of letting our Intellectual Center Usurp our Emotional Center.

Either override leads to disaster for the Being — certainly disasterous for fusing a Magnetic Center.

Which is something I discovered that I've been doing my entire life — both sides of the equation. This Forum has helped me with working on refraining from allowing my Intellectual Center to usurp my Emotional Center via that thread Depression as a Stepping Stone (to Soul Growth). Who knew it would be such a simple exercise to DO? I still can't get over how amazing the results of using that process has been for me.

I think I now need to do some research on how to address the opposite. Meaning allowing my Emotional Center to Usurp my Intellectual Center. Maybe that Dabrowski thread about Thinking Fast and Slow would be a good place for me to start. For all I know at the moment, developing my Intellectual Center may depend on applying the information contained in that thread. We shall see. :)

There's just no getting around it. Not that I'd want to anyway. All the centers are important and need developing. Good. That suits my own personal sense of balance and harmony.

One thing I'm definitely noticing is that Self-Importance Program kicking in -- about being offended at the deeds and mis-deeds of others. And piggy-backing onto that is the Right Man Syndrome. It is SOOOO easy for my mind to rationalize and justify how "right" I am. Aaargh! But I asked myself a question the other day when I noticed I was running that old tape again -- addressing myself -- "Would you rather be right or would you rather change?" That stopped me cold. Because I realized that being right just isn't at all important after all. It's totally irrelevant. It doesn't matter. Why did I even think it ever did? So bizarre.

Anyway, carry on. Your discussion has given me lots to think about — and in my case, thinking is something I'd like to become better at doing. :)

I truly admire all you Thinkers on the Forum. Honestly, I am in awe at the way your minds Work. It's actually aesthetically joyful for me to read all your posts and replies. So thank you very much. :)

13 Twirling Triskeles said:

I think I now need to do some research on how to address the opposite. Meaning allowing my Emotional Center to Usurp my Intellectual Center. Maybe that Dabrowski thread about Thinking Fast and Slow would be a good place for me to start. For all I know at the moment, developing my Intellectual Center may depend on applying the information contained in that thread. We shall see. :)

There's just no getting around it. Not that I'd want to anyway. All the centers are important and need developing. Good. That suits my own personal sense of balance and harmony.

One thing I'm definitely noticing is that Self-Importance Program kicking in -- about being offended at the deeds and mis-deeds of others. And piggy-backing onto that is the Right Man Syndrome. It is SOOOO easy for my mind to rationalize and justify how "right" I am. Aaargh! But I asked myself a question the other day when I noticed I was running that old tape again -- addressing myself -- "Would you rather be right or would you rather change?" That stopped me cold. Because I realized that being right just isn't at all important after all. It's totally irrelevant. It doesn't matter. Why did I even think it ever did? So bizarre.

Anyway, carry on. Your discussion has given me lots to think about — and in my case, thinking is something I'd like to become better at doing. :)

I truly admire all you Thinkers on the Forum. Honestly, I am in awe at the way your minds Work. It's actually aesthetically joyful for me to read all your posts and replies. So thank you very much. :)

Click to expand...

Yeah, I have the same problem of self-importance. In the last Sott radio show, I was upset in chat that this whole thing going on feels like a cold war 2.0 drama. Somehow, I feel like I deserve better to not have to be a part of this drama. But like you said, being right isn't important at all. Now the hard part is trying to reign in this anger/annoyance/aggravation and use it to feel like I am working on something.

Yes, we work on ourselves, but still - it's just so frustrating to see that what is going on now- has happened and will happen. I guess my main annoyance is this feeling- or perhaps a narrative "what makes me think that it will be different THIS TIME AROUND?". The more I think about it, the more it feels like I'm trapped. I know it's not what we should feel, and I have to work it out because when this feeling comes up, it is such torture!

Divide By Zero said:

13 Twirling Triskeles said:

I think I now need to do some research on how to address the opposite. Meaning allowing my Emotional Center to Usurp my Intellectual Center. Maybe that Dabrowski thread about Thinking Fast and Slow would be a good place for me to start. For all I know at the moment, developing my Intellectual Center may depend on applying the information contained in that thread. We shall see. :)

There's just no getting around it. Not that I'd want to anyway. All the centers are important and need developing. Good. That suits my own personal sense of balance and harmony.

One thing I'm definitely noticing is that Self-Importance Program kicking in -- about being offended at the deeds and mis-deeds of others. And piggy-backing onto that is the Right Man Syndrome. It is SOOOO easy for my mind to rationalize and justify how "right" I am. Aaargh! But I asked myself a question the other day when I noticed I was running that old tape again -- addressing myself -- "Would you rather be right or would you rather change?" That stopped me cold. Because I realized that being right just isn't at all important after all. It's totally irrelevant. It doesn't matter. Why did I even think it ever did? So bizarre.

Anyway, carry on. Your discussion has given me lots to think about — and in my case, thinking is something I'd like to become better at doing. :)

I truly admire all you Thinkers on the Forum. Honestly, I am in awe at the way your minds Work. It's actually aesthetically joyful for me to read all your posts and replies. So thank you very much. :)

Click to expand...

Yeah, I have the same problem of self-importance. In the last Sott radio show, I was upset in chat that this whole thing going on feels like a cold war 2.0 drama. Somehow, I feel like I deserve better to not have to be a part of this drama. But like you said, being right isn't important at all. Now the hard part is trying to reign in this anger/annoyance/aggravation and use it to feel like I am working on something.

Click to expand...

AFAIK, that is not what you said in the chat room DBZ, but maybe this is the crux of the matter? Your self-importance is getting in the way. Maybe you could name this particular 'I' the self-important 'I' and every time you notice this you remind yourself of its name. Someone gave this piece of advice in another thread, but I don't know which one. Sorry. It helps putting this 'I' in its proper place, back where it belongs. :)
I have started doing this myself and it seems to be working. Also, people give a lot of useful suggestions in the chat room. I think it would be worth your while if you think about their ideas more deeply and leave that self-importance by the door. :)
FWIW.

Divide By Zero said:

Yeah, I have the same problem of self-importance. In the last Sott radio show, I was upset in chat that this whole thing going on feels like a cold war 2.0 drama. Somehow, I feel like I deserve better to not have to be a part of this drama. But like you said, being right isn't important at all. Now the hard part is trying to reign in this anger/annoyance/aggravation and use it to feel like I am working on something.

Yes, we work on ourselves, but still - it's just so frustrating to see that what is going on now- has happened and will happen. I guess my main annoyance is this feeling- or perhaps a narrative "what makes me think that it will be different THIS TIME AROUND?". The more I think about it, the more it feels like I'm trapped. I know it's not what we should feel, and I have to work it out because when this feeling comes up, it is such torture!

Click to expand...

Maybe you should focus on the fact that you don't and can't know what way things will play out. That's far closer to the truth than any ideas that you know what is going to happen or you've 'seen it all before'. Maybe your feeling of being trapped has more to do with what is going on personally within you than what is going on in the world at large, and you project it outward. If you change you inner state; your habitual thinking, feeling and actions through conscious PRACTICE, then your perception of the world outside, in all ways, changes also.

Joe said:

Divide By Zero said:

Yeah, I have the same problem of self-importance. In the last Sott radio show, I was upset in chat that this whole thing going on feels like a cold war 2.0 drama. Somehow, I feel like I deserve better to not have to be a part of this drama. But like you said, being right isn't important at all. Now the hard part is trying to reign in this anger/annoyance/aggravation and use it to feel like I am working on something.

Yes, we work on ourselves, but still - it's just so frustrating to see that what is going on now- has happened and will happen. I guess my main annoyance is this feeling- or perhaps a narrative "what makes me think that it will be different THIS TIME AROUND?". The more I think about it, the more it feels like I'm trapped. I know it's not what we should feel, and I have to work it out because when this feeling comes up, it is such torture!

Click to expand...

Maybe you should focus on the fact that you don't and can't know what way things will play out. That's far closer to the truth than any ideas that you know what is going to happen or you've 'seen it all before'. Maybe your feeling of being trapped has more to do with what is going on personally within you than what is going on in the world at large, and you project it outward. If you change you inner state; your habitual thinking, feeling and actions through conscious PRACTICE, then your perception of the world outside, in all ways, changes also.

Click to expand...

DBZ, I understand you have been going through this for a considerable time. Self importance may have something to do with how you feel, but perhaps there are even deeper causes for your discomfort. This comes to mind:

It has been quite some time since most of us here understood on an intellectual level that things here on Earth are the way they are because it is necessary, and if things needed to be different than they currently are they would be. Understanding this is important, of course.

There is another side to our understanding of the world's situation which is referred to as our core-belief system. This part of us is much more difficult to change to a different belief from it's current belief than is our intellectual understanding capability. When our intellectual understanding and core-belief system are not aligned, such as when we deep down believe things should be different and intellectually we think the opposite, a tremendous amount of stress and cognitive dissonance is created. This seems to manifest in all sorts of emotional disturbances.

How do I know this is a valid and true description? It is because for quite some time I myself had this same difficulty of having these two opposite understandings bedeviling my own psyche. Fortunately, after some time my core-belief aligned with my intellectual understanding and all this stress disappeared. I can't begin to tell you how much more relaxed and unburdened I felt when I was free of this dichotomy.

It is not that I do not see the horror of the situation, the lies, murders, torturing, etc., but that I truly believe deep-down that it is necessary and all is actually right with the world. Yes, it saddens me greatly and sometimes I cry for all the people suffering, but at the same time I can also see all the good things happening too. Those who know me personally can probably see that I am very relaxed and have a real equanimity that seems to extend to just about every area of my life. I suspect that because I do not have this dichotomy in my belief system and continue to have faith that 'some day' things will change, life in general is easier and not such a burden.

I can't guarantee that this is actually something that is affecting you, but it is a good possibility it is and maybe for quite a few others here. Nor can I explain how I was able to accomplish aligning the two to give me peace and equanimity. As with many of the things in which we progress, we don't always know how or why things happen to us that change us. Maybe just understanding why we have a particular difficulty helps us to overcome it.

I sincerely hope that this is helpful to you and maybe for others.

(Edited for clarity)

Joe said:

Maybe you should focus on the fact that you don't and can't know what way things will play out. That's far closer to the truth than any ideas that you know what is going to happen or you've 'seen it all before'. Maybe your feeling of being trapped has more to do with what is going on personally within you than what is going on in the world at large, and you project it outward. If you change you inner state; your habitual thinking, feeling and actions through conscious PRACTICE, then your perception of the world outside, in all ways, changes also.

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Ok Joe, I get what you mean. It really is that simple.
Simple logically, not emotionally. I've always been super sensitive to things. It is my strength when I have to fix things or figure things out, but it also drains me when it comes to things that can obviously be done better, but are at the control of psychopathic garbage.

No, I can't just stop those emotions. Sometimes it seems that it's really twisted to think that we can be objective about it, when everything around us is subjective. Objectivity is a worthy goal, but it changes based on data. There are things that were right 10 years ago in the forum that are wrong now. It's confusing and I kind of feel like I can't just settle for "the best for now" sometimes. In fact, I kind of hate it, seeing how the majority settle for what they think is "the best for now". Who are we to say that we know better? Who are we to pretend like we are in tune with anything? What is exactly objective, when we are judging based on shadows that this reality casts?

I feel like I'm tired of it. I I I , yes, self importance. But it doesn't change how I feel. Self importance as we know is based on something deep down , it could be past life injustice, or present life stress/trauma. Since my normal life is not really stressful, I think in my case it is deeper than that.

Now I'm having tears, also seeing what Mariama and Richard wrote.
It's a frustration deep down, no control and not feeling that any of this drama here will show us anything more. Seen it all before is SOLID to me, it's history that shows that even Caesar tried and failed. Where the hell is the justice? Where the hell is the feeling that I belong to something real, a fight for something? No, I don't just mean fighting our own selves... I feel anger like I wish I could fight all of those pieces of crap who do this to humanity. Call me crazy, call me psycho, whatever- it's something I have to find out in myself, why do I feel this anger?

Maybe it's less about fighting:
I don't feel like I have the patience to deal with it. I don't feel happy with it. I feel like I'm here because of MY mistake.
It's like that saying "Be careful of what you wish for, you might get it". As the C's said, we asked for this. Some part of me wanted me to be in this, but this part of me NOW (not the super advanced whatever it is 5d/etc) is pissed off and tired. I'm not afraid of death, I feel like life is ok, but really would I want to come back to this same carousel of BS? No, but I did this time?

Maybe it is that simple as you say, project it out. But really, we do everything- work or not, based on a REWARD. Yes, even you do the work in order to be "objective". That's the annoyance, that deep down, everything we do is STS. And it is quite STS of me to be angry at that STS action.

Forgive the rantiness of this post, but it seems like it's the best way to express the emotions deep down that we learn cannot always be logical.

I really am not afraid of this state. I think even though it's torture, it might be a side effect of shattering some expectations. We don't have the history that goes way back to when the last wave supposedly happens, so we're going sort of on a blind faith. But on the outside, it's not much different than even recent history. The same drama of bad guys and good guys, both who are fighting- and the people who don't care. And we're the adamics, at a disadvantage in this world because we feel the problem deep down. I don't think I'm the only one who feels like sometimes I had enough. Even though that is probably the wrong feeling to have, what if it is the exact thing that is objective, that this reality as it is/was is a farce?

The final question which just popped in my head: how are we not wishfully thinking that things will be different this time? Even the C's say that most go to 4d through 5th density. So, what are we hoping for? A better world, that doesn't fight to be better? Or better to ask myself, why am I expecting more?

Divide By Zero said:

Maybe it is that simple as you say, project it out. But really, we do everything- work or not, based on a REWARD. Yes, even you do the work in order to be "objective". That's the annoyance, that deep down, everything we do is STS. And it is quite STS of me to be angry at that STS action. [...]

I really am not afraid of this state. I think even though it's torture, it might be a side effect of shattering some expectations. We don't have the history that goes way back to when the last wave supposedly happens, so we're going sort of on a blind faith. But on the outside, it's not much different than even recent history. The same drama of bad guys and good guys, both who are fighting- and the people who don't care. And we're the adamics, at a disadvantage in this world because we feel the problem deep down. I don't think I'm the only one who feels like sometimes I had enough. Even though that is probably the wrong feeling to have, what if it is the exact thing that is objective, that this reality as it is/was is a farce?

The final question which just popped in my head: how are we not wishfully thinking that things will be different this time? Even the C's say that most go to 4d through 5th density. So, what are we hoping for? A better world, that doesn't fight to be better? Or better to ask myself, why am I expecting more?

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I think it might be good for you to scale things down a bit. You know the 'big picture' theory, but you can't really directly influence or change that, and that realization is frustrating and angering you. But have you considered that you have set the bar too high, or misinterpreted where the bar should be? Like Richard said, there is maybe a disconnect between your unconscious and conscious beliefs, or even between your unconscious beliefs and what you are seeing as What Is. "No! it's not meant to be this way" (says your unconscious beliefs). But DBZ, that's What Is. No amount of ranting is gonna change it, better to align your beliefs with What Is.

Long ago you became invested in things changing, in being different than what they are, and you expected that you (or we) could or should have helped change things by now. But realizing things have not changed (in the way you expected) and at the same time anticipating where they will go and seeing it all as negative, you're angry. All of this points to a frustration about the lack of control or power you have over life on a grand scale, which you expected, or were promised, you would have, or so you interpreted it.

Remember "karmic and simple understandings"? Maybe focus on that, and let the world out there take care of itself. It's seems that it's going where it's going regardless of how angry you or I or anyone gets, or rants and raves, about it. So what's the point? Surely there are other more simple things to which you can consciously direct your focus and attention, at least for the next while. Remember also that you do have some control over the extent to which you suffer in this respect. We all can have a tendency to wallow in our suffering and do lots of 'woe is me', but realize that you don't HAVE to wallow in it. You CAN chose to put it aside and get on with life. There is objective suffering and subjective suffering as G said. The problem is, we tend to throw in lots of subjective suffering on top of the objective suffering that comes along, and in doing so prolong it. As I said, leave the big scale stuff to whoever handles that.

You might want to read this post.

Joe said:

I think it might be good for you to scale things down a bit. You know the 'big picture' theory, but you can't really directly influence or change that, and that realization is frustrating and angering you. But have you considered that you have set the bar too high, or misinterpreted where the bar should be? Like Richard said, there is maybe a disconnect between your unconscious and conscious beliefs, or even between your unconscious beliefs and what you are seeing as What Is. "No! it's not meant to be this way" (says your unconscious beliefs). But DBZ, that's What Is. No amount of ranting is gonna change it, better to align your beliefs with What Is.

Long ago you became invested in things changing, in being different than what they are, and you expected that you (or we) could or should have helped change things by now. But realizing things have not changed (in the way you expected) and at the same time anticipating where they will go and seeing it all as negative, you're angry. All of this points to a frustration about the lack of control or power you have over life on a grand scale, which you expected, or were promised, you would have, or so you interpreted it.

Remember "karmic and simple understandings"? Maybe focus on that, and let the world out there take care of itself. It's seems that it's going where it's going regardless of how angry you or I or anyone gets, or rants and raves, about it. So what's the point? Surely there are other more simple things to which you can consciously direct your focus and attention, at least for the next while. Remember also that you do have some control over the extent to which you suffer in this respect. We all can have a tendency to wallow in our suffering and do lots of 'woe is me', but realize that you don't HAVE to wallow in it. You CAN chose to put it aside and get on with life. There is objective suffering and subjective suffering as G said. The problem is, we tend to throw in lots of subjective suffering on top of the objective suffering that comes along, and in doing so prolong it. As I said, leave the big scale stuff to whoever handles that.

You might want to read this post.

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Thanks Joe for this reply and its useful points.

Yeah, sometimes the thought pops into my head that the main karmic and simple understanding is to remind myself that this is prison because I sure as hell don't want to recycle back. 30 years among the dead gave me that idea, in seeing how dying with a belief can attach ourselves to this world. But to want more, have a higher bar is kind of contradictory in myself. Why should I have a high bar, when I don't want to come back to achieve it, or don't feel like it's possible?!

Like the video which I was going to write a comment about (but instead included below) said about the high bar, it's a function of this depression- this evolutionary ability to sense that things are not right. But, as our body tries to make sense of it and use it for survival- it comes out as anger, frustration, tiredness. I still don't see a solution besides learning how to disassociate better. I'll up my meditation schedule, but sometimes I can feel tired and frustrated after EE! Baha doesn't give me a release like facing the facts- as sott radio sometimes does for me.


The post you linked is very interesting. But, it doesn't seem to help here. Beliefs can force us to dissapointment and frustration. But they can also give us respite from the same. In my case, I think I suffer from not being able to have strong beliefs as this article says about mixed handedness (which I have and made me understand why I was never able to get into religion, new age, or other dogmas):
https://www.sott.net/article/105980-The-secrets-of-human-handedness

Niebauer argues that in mixed-handers, a larger corpus callosum helps the right hemisphere revise its beliefs more frequently, updating the person's overall belief system and washing away entrenched ideas...

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So, to me, it feels like I can't depend on any belief, good or bad. The state of the world being messed up is not so much a belief but this observation- both globally and locally, we see how backwards in general things are.

I'm actually anti-superstitious too, like the session thread about the crystals- I don't see what is there to worry about sharing them with family no matter their "energy". A lot of times, I feel like superstition- things that are not conclusive, controlling our actions are taking away our power. Maybe that's where I get annoyed with the idea to give my trust and faith into something that instills unknowns into the equation? I see that now I sound like the architect of the matrix, creepy?

I do like your comments on values. With Putin, I do support him standing up for the fairness whether it comes to Syria or global policy. But, I don't see anything happy about China becoming the superpower. In fact, I see them as a USA in the making. As they say "absolute power corrupts absolutely". They don't show values to their own population, so how can I see them showing proper values if they were one of the big leaders?

Maybe I just need to find something that makes me think less. I'm not being sarcastic here- the thinking I sometimes go through is too much, it doesn't resolve anything. As we know a lot of our reality is in fact subjective through our senses and the chaos we call time, how can I hone it to be useful? I will re read some stoicism which I have recently picked up and see if there are answers.

I am seeing the point of G about objective suffering helping us focus on that though. Objective suffering would be doing something because I HAVE to. But the big problem with everyday life is that ego- which shows me that I really don't have to do half the things that I'm doing. Argh, more thought loops!

From your video post on depression:

Joe said:

Just listened to this 17 min Ted talk on depression. The guy has a really good point IMO, especially in the second half.

http://<iframe width="560" height="...so" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

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I like the statement of depression having feeling that things are absurd. I remember that Tolstoy wrote about the absurdity of life.
From what I read, he went deeper into a religious perspective. That doesn't seem to work for me. I just don't have that kind of faith to believe in things, even what the C's say- everything is open. It could be that nothing happens for hundreds of years, and life goes on. That possibility, I dread. I do see self-importance there, but I can't seem to pin it - besides the memory of being a child and seeing that things in life are generally too complicated and convoluted. It seems that I was always allergic to 3d, lol.

The end when he says the bar is too high applies to me. A lot of times, I can't sweep things under the carpet. I'm not exactly sure how doing this is beneficial, besides to be happy or live longer.
I don't care for either if they don't come with truth. But of course we don't know what might happen. But isn't that in itself sweeping things under the rug too???

Maybe the only truth is that we don't really have truth and justice, except for our own selves. But, as social beings, how can we NOT BE ANGRY at the bullshit and the excuses that our leaders give us in order to perpetuate a drama that never ends?

I think these are things that I should let go of, but I just don't know how. I don't disassociate easily, in fact my senses are always at full volume. Even things like the breathing into the mic or cutting out sound on the radio show would distract me. Maybe I just have a damaged brain. I thought the diet and iodine would change things, but I'm still the way I am. I'll try to find out more, maybe it has to do with MAO inhibitors, etc... chemistry, because it does seem cyclic when I get into these states. In fact, I'm so annoyed at what that Wave chapter explains, how our chemistry can change how we see reality. How stupid is it that consciousness is so addicted/attached to this temporary fleeting body and it's mundane conditions???

Dear Divide By Zero. I may be making a huge assumption here, but from what you've written so far in these last few posts, I'm feeling (yes . . . definitely 'feeling' -- LOL) as if you are in tremendous inner turmoil. Conflicts between what you objectively observe happening in the world, how you feel about that and how you want it to change.

Can I ask you a question? Pretend for a moment that the world is exactly and precisely the most perfect, just, happy, STO world you could imagine. Can you create a mental image picture of that? Then imagine how you might FEEL in that world. What emotions might you be feeling? Is there a connection between how you feel internally and what exists externally?

The reason I ask you these questions is because I have believed that my internal feelings/emotions were based on what is/was occurring in my life -- or in the world around me. That I was correct to feel how I felt because it made sense for me to feel that way vis-a-vis what I was observing around me.

But that didn't really explain how I could sometimes feel so totally calm, serene and at peace inside internally when the outer world was objectively the same as before. How could this be? Nothing had changed out there. The only change was within my own mind.

Which leads me to believe that my thoughts, feelings, emotions are not necessarily hinged to outer circumstances. That it is possible to sit within the eye of the hurricane with the world swirling about me chaotically and still maintain my inner equilibrium and equanimity. I'm not saying I can maintain this state continuously. Not at all. Only saying that I if I can do this even occasionally, then I have to re-examine my premises and what I think is true.

I'm going to go out on a limb here because it's seeming to me that maybe your Intellect is usurping your Emotions. I'm getting that you are a very sensitive being and that your circuits are getting way too overloaded and it's just feeling too overwhelming. Hence, the need to dissociate, yes?

Can I make a suggestion? Can you try out that exercise in that thread "Depression as a Stepping Stone (to Soul Growth)"? Don't let the title fool you. It's not necessarily about 'depression'. I wasn't feeling depressed at all when I first tried that exercise. I was full-on angry, resentful, outraged, vindictive, and wanted to punish someone for offending me (self-importance) and not being externally considerate towards me & others in my household.

I can sense and feel your frustration DBZ -- and I can so relate to how you're feeling and the thoughts you're thinking. I've been caught up in that maelstrom times beyond counting throughout my life. And it's debilitating. And no matter how much I talked about it to others -- and no matter how many times I talked about it to myself -- and no matter how many times I wrote about it -- it was just like a series of thought loops going round & round with no escape. I felt totally trapped and stuck and at my wits end -- wanting relief and to extricate myself from the mental anguish.

I don't think you can think yourself out of this confusion. I don't think logic and analysis and thinking with a hammer can help resolve the inner turmoil. Feelings are NOT logical. They won't be successfully suppressed, repressed, oppressed, or expressed. They have to be FELT in order to MOVE them. And I don't think you are actually FEELING them the way that Stepping Stone thread talks about. It seems to me that you're doing what I've always done with my own emotions and feelings -- thinking about them, trying to name them, trying to find the source of them, trying to resolve them, trying to think my way out of them. And the more I did all that, the stronger they became. Until I had a very short fuse and felt like a pressure cooker ready to explode -- or alternatively, fall into a depression.

The exercise outlined in that Stepping Stone thread has become my absolute GO-TO method of dealing with my emotions -- and I swear -- truly -- the results are right-on every time. That exercise works to move me out of my self-importance stance and conserve my emotional energies as well.

Anyway -- that's my suggestion -- because frankly it just hurts so much to see you in such pain and I really really care that you can, will and DO move through it. I keep seeing past this veil surrounding you as you REALLY are and that all this is just a bunch of stuff preventing you from being the BEING you truly are.

So -- as so many here have said -- FWIW. :)

Link to that Depression as a Stepping Stone (to Soul Growth):
http://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,2832.0.html

And here's a link to the original QFS article (with Replies & Comments included) -- from which the DSS thread was taken:
https://web.archive.org/web/20071018053505/http://quantumfuture.net/qfs/qfs_depression1.htm

My heartfelt wishes for a fun journey to the center of your emotions DBZ. Just see if negative emotions don't become something to look forward to feeling once you experience the positive purpose for experiencing them! :)

Thanks 13,
Btw, I always have great Friday the 13th's despite the joo-joo friends and co workers have around it, lol, go figure!?

I think what sets me off when I hear sott radio is that I'm tired of heroes. I don't think Putin is anything compared to Caesar or Malcolm X. I think I equate him with a businessman who is savvy and logical. He doesn't seem to have emotion to him and I am jealous of him in some ways, because I would not have his patience had I been in his situation.

But, patience is not always a virtue. Had he intervened in Syria earlier, many more people would not have died and there would not have been this quagmire of emigration. But, he kind of makes me think of this fake hero, who can sit there cool while people die.

In fact, I realized something now.... All through childhood I looked up to heroes from Comic Books, even this guy on 20/20 who would expose corruption (and later became a shill for Fox News). I'm tired of heroes. I think they take away our power. Nowadays, my childhood hero that I still relate to is McGuyver, who with his knowledge can adapt to situations and fix/negotiate his way out of things.

Politicians are scumbags to me now. Putin is as much to blame for his inaction as the praise for his action. That's my emotions AND logic speaking.

I'm not going to buy this whole good cop bad cop game anymore. I think it reeks of history.

DBZ, another angle to consider when dealing with the emotions that you're going through: they could be influenced by a fungal overgrowth or other type of pathogenic infection, as well as heavy metal toxicity, so it may be worth putting some energy in that direction to see if that changes how you feel and makes it so things aren't so hopeless or doom and gloomy.