Buffers, Programs and "the Predator's Mind"

[dannybananny]

You learn new things about yourself everyday from interaction with all types of people is it selfish to take what you have learned from a conversation with the mailman?

It depends on your intent in case of mailman and other stuff, but we live in a STS world always looking something for self so it's good thing to know why we do what we do.

If you are on the learning curve were you know about the work and can work on yourself everyday you will have opportunities to grow - life with give you these oportunitities. Its not selfish to take what’s given to you IMO

I agree with you but some thing you don't need to experience if you know where it leads to based on your instincts, but I also agree that experience gives weight to instincts!

 

[Menna]

Buffers Illusions and lies.

I have realized that I guess you can say I have gotten to the point where I notice buffers and notice when others create them. It frustrates me but I believe that it is ONE of the things that keeps people in illusions and lies because they don't see the truth. I feel buffers actually make life harder

 

[Aya]

I have realized that I guess who can say I have gotten to the point where I notice buffers and notice when others create them. It frustrates me but I believe that it is ONE of the things that keeps people in illusions and lies because they don't see the truth. I feel buffers actually make life harder

Hi Menna,

Are saying that buffers make your life harder because you are trying to become conscious, means learning to feel all at once everything including contradictory feelings? As it says in ISOTM, we all create buffers by ourselves involuntary so that we can live our lives normally without feeling, thinking, or seeing the impact of contradictions. - Otherwise we will feel the constant shocks of discomfort and suffering. As G says in ISOTM:

Awakening is possible only for those who seek it and want it, for those who are ready to struggle with themselves and work on themselves for a very long time and very persistently in order to attain it. For this it is necessary to destroy 'buffers', that is, to go out to meet all those inner sufferings which are connected with the sensations of contradictions. Moreover the destruction of 'buffers' in itself required very long work and a man must agree to this work realizing that the result of his work will be every possible discomfort and suffering from the awakening of his conscious.

Our goal is to get rid of our buffers and build our consciousness, therefore, I think it is not the buffers that is making our lives harder so I think you misunderstood something. But I agree that people have been taught lies and living in illusions of buffers we create, the situation is overwelming and it can frustrates us sometimes.

 

[Menna]

Yes this is what I am talking about but I do think that anything that keeps us in lies and illusions ultamitly makes our life harder wether it is cause and affect or a bi product of something else all in all its harder to see the truth with them. I can literally feel the contradictions and I forgot about that fact maybe I should go back and read ISOTM.

Then I think to my self what is IT that lets some people see this and other similiar things in themselves and others can't. I don't know if its "doing the work" per say I feel its more of an ability maybe you have to "do the work" to have this ability?

 

[Nienna]

Yes this is what I am talking about but I do think that anything that keeps us in lies and illusions ultamitly makes our life harder wether it is cause and affect or a bi product of something else all in all its harder to see the truth with them. I can literally feel the contradictions and I forgot about that fact maybe I should go back and read ISOTM.

Then I think to my self what is IT that lets some people see this and other similiar things in themselves and others can't. I don't know if its "doing the work" per say I feel its more of an ability maybe you have to "do the work" to have this ability?

How I understand things to be is that, yes, you cannot "see" the buffers/programs until you actually start doing the Work. This is what the Work is about. Actually seeing your buffers/programs at work. That's why Gurdjieff says that the very first thing you do is to observe yourself and watch how you act/react, learning to eventually see the buffers/programs at work. It takes time because you have to watch yourself closely. At first, you are already running the program. After awhile of observing yourself, you can see the program kicking in, but still you run the program. It's only after observing yourself and the program at work that you are able to see the program coming and are able to stop it in its tracks. It is not something that comes easily. It takes a lot of self-observation. And some buffers/programs take a LOT of time to see - and usually you can only see them with help from those who have already been doing the Work and have seen the same buffers/programs in themselves. That is why you need a network when doing the Work. You cannot see all of the programs by yourself, only the obvious one. There are many that are hidden from us as they are so inconspicuous.

So those who are not doing the Work do not even know that they are have buffers/programs that actually run them.

 

[Menna]

I understand and it is sad that others just can't see or don't know about this or I guess you can say arent ready to learn.

I have been "In my head" alot lately and the programs are more previlant but because of this I have noticed them more. When they are running they play the same script over and over again when this happens I try and go outside myself.

 

[ggen]

All of the reading on this thread thus far has been eye opening. I believe I'm definitely listening to and observing the chatter in my mind. As I'm objectively listening/watching though, another voice/program kicks in. I'll call it panic or anxiety. What I'm trying to get control of is the feeling that I should, need, have to be doing something other than what it is I'm doing in that present moment. At the same time, the observer is calmly 'saying' "You are okay. You are safe. You need not be anywhere but here. Now." Where is this coming from and how can I identify it!!?!!

 

[Menna]

A lot of it comes from the traumas in childhood...this is where the programs begin and the predators mind is able to hook in...I believe I read that when we are very young there are certain times when we are brain is very vulnerable and lets say a father is yelling at mother or another kids takes your toy = trama...the brain is rewired and we continue like this until we start the work start to clean up the mess and straighten everything out...Laura said you can spot a program by its rigidity among other things...There are other people here that can be more descriptive and give more clear and consise information as I am still trying to figure things out as well

And it sounds like you have started to identify it....But don't identify yourself as it...it is foreign to the body/mind can be done away with

 

[Buddy]

Yes this is what I am talking about but I do think that anything that keeps us in lies and illusions ultamitly makes our life harder wether it is cause and affect or a bi product of something else all in all its harder to see the truth with them. I can literally feel the contradictions and I forgot about that fact maybe I should go back and read ISOTM.

Then I think to my self what is IT that lets some people see this and other similiar things in themselves and others can't. I don't know if its "doing the work" per say I feel its more of an ability maybe you have to "do the work" to have this ability?

It takes time because you have to watch yourself closely. At first, you are already running the program. After awhile of observing yourself, you can see the program kicking in, but still you run the program. It's only after observing yourself and the program at work that you are able to see the program coming and are able to stop it in its tracks. It is not something that comes easily. It takes a lot of self-observation.

I agree with Nienna and would like to add that another reason why it takes time may be because for many people, and from the very start of work, they must begin thinking of energy in a new way. One benefits from at least experimenting with using diet, exercise, sexual abstinence, efficient movements, and any other available tool for accumulating and conserving personal energy.

From personal experience, observation and talks with other people, I've formulated the general notion that as energy accumulates, the conscious awareness seems to tighten up like a spring in coiling mode. It may take varying amounts of time and practice, but at some point, one starts noticing how sluggishly other people are performing their activities as well as their general dispositions seeming to project extreme boredom.

As for oneself, and metaphorically speaking, the coiled awareness sensation seems to place one close to the leading edge of the emotional center's reactions. One may even start to notice a new "fork" where Work can be applied. That is, a point where the body is about to react and you know what its about to do and you have a split-second opportunity to apply a "stop" or pattern interrupt. If this point is taken advantage of for Work purposes, real tension can be felt between that do and not do, yes and no, go and not go, etc.

If one applies discipline here and does something one has never done in that kind of situation before, one might feel a 'giddy' type of sensation, maybe feel some chills down the arms and back, and a little input of some strange energy from somewhere.

One might even feel an urge to go something like: Yes! I can do this, G** D*** it! :)

 

[Menna]

Ok...I am at the point where I react to something emotionally and then right when im done with the emotion I realize it was foolish...However if I am going into a situation and I expect it to bring out an emotion and I am aware it will happen I just stay silent and accept it for example with my chauffeur job when I drive at rush hour I am not bothered by traffic as I am aware it will be there and accept its a part of the process...I have not been able to stop myslef from a knee jerk emotional reaction that I am unaware will happen. That will take alot of awareness but I will look for the opportunity... Thanks for pointing out that is a possibility and that is another place where the work can be applied

 

[Buddy]

Thanks for pointing out that is a possibility and that is another place where the work can be applied

U whackum! :) This Work is Real, but it was simply theoretical for me for longer than I care to admit. Energy=Big Key for me. Maybe for you too.

 

[ggen]

I'm half way through In an Unspoken Voice. The read is helping me to to not only identify past traumas, but also to 'feel' when a program is kicking in. I 'think', I have at points, stopped a program and reversed in action what 'it' wanted to do...my trouble is in just feeling safe when there is no immediate threat... :(

 

[TOTEM36]

I was thinking about something today after reading Peter Levine when he mentions the tiger in nature getting tensed up for an attack then shaking afterwards to release the tension.
Ive noticed that people at heavy metal concerts get in touch with their angry feelings and the audience will crash into each other, headbanging etc.
I know this controversy on this forum about L.Canyon. But, there might be something in aggressive music and the associated movement that is similar in result to what Peter Levine talks about?

 

[obyvatel]

I was thinking about something today after reading Peter Levine when he mentions the tiger in nature getting tensed up for an attack then shaking afterwards to release the tension.
Ive noticed that people at heavy metal concerts get in touch with their angry feelings and the audience will crash into each other, headbanging etc.
I know this controversy on this forum about L.Canyon. But, there might be something in aggressive music and the associated movement that is similar in result to what Peter Levine talks about?

Levine talks about physiological reactions like shaking which happen as a consequence of people carefully revisiting their traumatic experiences and completing the normal biological response which had been thwarted at the time when the trauma occurred. It is done with awareness and intent.

Aggressive music and the type of reactions you are describing seem to be an externally induced trigger (maybe with some hypnotic components thrown in) which make people lose control and awareness of themselves. Or so it seems to me.

 

[Yas]

It takes time because you have to watch yourself closely. At first, you are already running the program. After awhile of observing yourself, you can see the program kicking in, but still you run the program. It's only after observing yourself and the program at work that you are able to see the program coming and are able to stop it in its tracks. It is not something that comes easily. It takes a lot of self-observation.

I agree with Nienna and would like to add that another reason why it takes time may be because for many people, and from the very start of work, they must begin thinking of energy in a new way. One benefits from at least experimenting with using diet, exercise, sexual abstinence, efficient movements, and any other available tool for accumulating and conserving personal energy.

From personal experience, observation and talks with other people, I've formulated the general notion that as energy accumulates, the conscious awareness seems to tighten up like a spring in coiling mode. It may take varying amounts of time and practice, but at some point, one starts noticing how sluggishly other people are performing their activities as well as their general dispositions seeming to project extreme boredom.

As for oneself, and metaphorically speaking, the coiled awareness sensation seems to place one close to the leading edge of the emotional center's reactions. One may even start to notice a new "fork" where Work can be applied. That is, a point where the body is about to react and you know what its about to do and you have a split-second opportunity to apply a "stop" or pattern interrupt. If this point is taken advantage of for Work purposes, real tension can be felt between that do and not do, yes and no, go and not go, etc.

If one applies discipline here and does something one has never done in that kind of situation before, one might feel a 'giddy' type of sensation, maybe feel some chills down the arms and back, and a little input of some strange energy from somewhere.

One might even feel an urge to go something like: Yes! I can do this, G** D*** it! :)

Indeed...

:)

Hi everyone,

I wanted to share some of my experiences which I think to be related to this topic (a very useful one, by the way)

I have been reading The Myth of Sanity and The Narcissistic Family lately, as well as some fragments of Trapped in the Mirror, and this lectures have moved quite a lot of forgotten stuff in me.

For some time already I have been doing the effort of observing my self more and more, and at one moment I felt exactly as Buddy said and I quoted above. This was good but it also gave me a false sense of 'I'm doing it so nicely, I'm superb' .... which finally demonstrated that I wasn't actually going anywhere.

Now, after some issues at home and the latest reading (this post included), I begun to really observe myself in a deeper way. The Narcissistic Family and The Myth of Sanity have given me so much information to better understand myself and how affected I am by my past and present. And so a lot of buffers, programs, mechanical behavior that I could observe but do nothing about them, appear more clear to me at this moment. This books give me a lot of understanding of the mechanisms of defense that I have built in the form of a huge iron wall inside myself, I understand better the concept of the little Is thanks to Martha Stout and this topic of course.

In some way, I think that is is long ago, while doing therapy, that I passed through the stage of remembering and recognizing that I lived in an abusive environment, with psychological and physical damage involved. But, yet, I couldn't recognize the extent of how it actually affected and conditioned me. I guess this was, in part, because I have this "nothing affects me" program so I tend to believe (and only believe) that everything is OK and I'm not the least affected by all this difficult environment.

Naturally, all that appeared to be very 'fuzzy' (things that I could understand in some way but I didn't assimilate), is much clearer now and I can see that with patience and discipline I can observe, heal and transform myself.

By now I feel as if I can suddenly observe much more of myself and better understand that which I observe. This is quite encouraging because before this I could just observe 'sensations' of anguish, fear, irritability, anxiety, etc. And this sensations just appeared and disappeared as nothing.

I realized that most of them come from self defense mechanisms which might very well include disassociation as a response for childhood and adolescence trauma. I noticed that the most common of this mechanisms are things like "being kind to everyone", "satisfying everyones needs", "not being able to put out the limits", "avoid confrontation", but, at the same time I have this other behavior which is 'agressive' and spits out everything at once. It is like playing "hide now and spit later" by saying "everything is OK" and then throwing some poisonous comments or things like that. I have to say that this is not happening as much as it did before, because it has been a while since I observed it and managed to control it in some way, yet, it is just now that I fully (maybe not) understand how all this has been generated inside myself, which gives tools to 'cleanse' all this patterns of behavior instead of just suppressing them.

I realized during that therapy that I mentioned that all this converges in one point that is my lack of self confidence which makes me live in a constant state of fear and insecurity towards my self and the others. This also makes recognition something that stresses me a lot as I am constantly hoping to be recognized and I must admit that I still feel kind of 'down' when I'm not. I tend to suppress the feeling because I see it as 'childish'... basically, I noticed that I tend to suppress every emotion as a lot of you have mentioned here, every time with the excuse that 'it is ridiculous', 'I can't let this affect me', 'I'm strong', etc...

In fact, this is why I never participated to much in the forum... I am always scared of saying something wrong, stupid, ridiculous, completely out of place, etc. So, I'm making the effort of stepping out that fear and share more with you. And this new 'ability' comes because, after observing myself and understanding all this, I realized that I am just what I am and I have to accept who I am and that I am valuable for that, just for being who I am. I feel as if I finally recognized myself just as I am, and I can always heal what still has to be healed, learn and transform myself. (Yet I still have doubts about posting right now as an example... )

Now, I would like to comment about some of the physical sensations I have, relating to what some of you where discussing long ago. Belibaste did, indeed, a great job in putting things in a very clear way. But I have to say that all of you who contributed to this topic have really helped me and certainly others too. :)

I realized that when I am in a situation that presses some of the 'weak points' in myself I can feel the emotion in the heart area or in the stomach, I still didn't recognize which are the ones that are felt in the stomach and which are the ones that are felt in the chest area.

Just today, I had a discussion with a friend that is really close to me. He was really angry for some reason I still don't understand. Now, generally, whenever someone I appreciate a lot got angry with me I would feel desperate, very scared, and that would always mean a long dispute in which I tried to please the other person so he/ she would not be angry (This was very energy-sucking so I guess I was the perfect food for vampire-like relationships). It has been a while since I don't get involved in this kind of issues anymore, but today it just appeared as if to prove if I could really handle it. So I felt the emotion right in my chest and shoulders, very clearly, quite strong. My heartbeat was quicker as well. I concentrated in the feeling and I noticed some fuzziness in the head to which I gave a deep breath and the feeling went down again. At this moment I felt the urge of smoking, so I realized I tend to smoke in this moments in order to release stress and also 'forget' all this feelings. I didn't smoke and continued to observe myself. I noticed that I was in the pattern of wanting to change the other and not externally considering the situation so I said a big STOP in my head and managed to let go of the emotional attachment to this friend so I could see him, myself, and the whole situation more clearly. After some quiet moment of just concentrating in what I felt, trying to stop the inner talk, I recognized that I felt sad. And I realized that it was because 'he didn't understand me even though I was trying my best to explain things rationally.'... I concentrated a bit more and I got to the point where it all converges, which is the feeling of not being recognized and accepted. At this point the physical sensation was different, still in the chest area but instead of being one of blockage it was one of relief, similar to the one I feel often while doing EE. I stayed like this for a little more, concentrating on my breathing so the head wouldn't start to talk again, and when I felt I was in a normal, relaxed state again, I continued with 'normal life' lol. I guess it is needless ti say that I felt quite 'lighter' in weight.

I also observed that each time I feel more aware of myself in each specific situation. I'm glad for that, even though there's still much to go in the path of self-knowledge and control. I reckon that 'learning is fun'. :)

I just wanted to share this with you and, once again... Thanks a lot for this and all the other threads and topics. This one has been particularly insightful and useful for me.

Best regards!