Civil War in Ukraine: Western Empire vs Russia

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Немного личных наблюдений, если позволите.
В 2006-2008 годах я много времени провел в Украине по работе. Пришлось побывать почти во всех регионах страны кроме самых западных. Интересно то, что во Львов и Ивано-Франковск я не поехал по совету украинских ребят из Винницы. Мы с ними хорошо общались и когда я сказал, что собираюсь ехать во Львов, они мне сказали: " не надо тебе туда ехать, от греха подальше, давай из наших кто-то съездит." То есть уже в то время в отдельных регионах Украины, в основном на западе, вполне процветали настроения ненависти к "москалям".
В то время власть в Украине была "оранжевая", результат "оранжевой революции" 2004 года. Политику эта власть проводила откровенно русофобскую. Однако при личном общении многие люди говорили: "сейчас мы сбросим "Юща" (так называли президента Ющенко), выберем Януковича и заживем с вами, то есть с Россией, как братья.
Потом произошли события в Южной Осетии. И тут меня поразило качество "промывки мозгов" некоторой части населения. Люди, с кем мне приходилось иметь дела, были далеко не крестьяне необразованные. Бизнесмены из крупных городов: Киев, Харьков, Днепропетровск, Одесса и т.д. В профессиональных и бизнес вопросах абсолютно адекватные, трезво мыслящие, в вопросах политики становились как "зомби", не слышащие, не желающие слышать, не желающие думать, с четкой установкой в мозгах.
Так что то, что произошло в Украине в конце 2013 года готовилось очень давно и очень тщательно.


Translation
Some personal observations, if I may.
In 2006-2008 I spent a lot of time in Ukraine for work. I had to visit almost all regions of the country except the West. Interestingly, Lviv and Ivano-Frankivsk I did not go on the advice of Ukrainian boys from Vinnitsa. We with them communicated well and when I said I was going to go to Lviv, they told me: "you don't have to go there, away from sin, of our let somebody go." That is, while in some regions of Ukraine, mainly in the West, it flourished in the mood of hatred of the "Muscovites".
At that time the power in Ukraine was the "orange" result "orange revolution" in 2004. The policy of this government is conducted openly Russophobic. But in person, many people said, "now we drop the "Yuscha" (the so-called President Yushchenko), will choose Yanukovych and live with you, that is with Russia like brothers.
Then came the events in South Ossetia. And then I was struck by the quality of the "brainwashing" of some part of the population. The people with whom I had to deal, were not uneducated peasants. Businessmen from large cities: Kiev, Kharkov, Dnepropetrovsk, Odessa etc. In professional and business matters absolutely adequate, sober-minded, in matters of policy, as "zombie", not hearing, not wanting to hear, not wishing to think with a clear setting in the brain.
So what happened in Ukraine in late 2013 has been preparing for a long time and very carefully.
 
А вот для разнообразия немножко истерик с "другой стороны". Поражает количество ненависти, так и брызжет. Не уверен, к сожалению, за машинный перевод - способен ли он передать весь накал.

"Запомните эту гниду в лицо — спикер администрации президента по вопросам «АТО»
Публикация волонтера «Правого сектора» Риты Сингер в соцсети буквально взорвала украинский сегмент Facebook, ее перепостили более 1000 человек, среди которых многие известные активисты:
«Просто запомните эту гниду в лицо. Это спикер Администрации Президента по вопросам „АТО” — Александр Мотузяник. У него сегодня ни одного погибшего в зоне боевых действий! У него и у таких же мразей из администрации главной мрази. Знаете, я желаю одного, чтобы арта в**бала по тому самому зданию на Банковой, где у них центральный гадюшник. Твари!»

«Градами по Киеву!»
Сообщение активистки «Лили Совы» также массово репостится в соцсетях:
«Я ору! Ору и матерюсь! От бессилия… Я ненавижу. Я сегодня ненавижу до дрожи в руках, до помутнения в мозгу… У меня вселенская ненависть! Ненавижу рашку, ненавижу сепаров, ненавижу официальный Киев, ненавижу тупое население родной страны! Сколько погибших сегодня на проклятой линии ДАП! Бутовка! Повтор истории с ДАП в январе 15-го года! Расстреливали танки в упор. Накрывали прицельно 120-е минометы.
ПРИЦЕЛЬНО! Вы знаете, как это? Вы знаете, почему? Вот, гребанная власть! Гребанный ГШ! Вы что, не знали, что это будет? Что Бутовка — стратегическая точка? Вам пох! Там не ваши дети! Ненавижу! Градами по Киеву! Детей пид…расов (Нет, не секс-меньшинств!) — на Бутовку, Промку и Зенит!
Предварительно: Бутовка 5–200, 4 -300 тяжёлые (не полные данные) ДУК ПС 4–200, 15–300, 79, Марьинка, 1–200, 8–300, АЙДАР 2–200 7–300 72 5–300, 90 бат-2-300. Погибшие не 128, а рядом стоящий ПС. 4–200 забрали 2–200 под завалами, не могут достать и 7–300. Данные не точные. Еще уточняются».
(Здесь перечисление погибших - код 200 и раненых - код 300 с указанием подразделений: ПС - "правый сектор", 128 бригада ВСУ, 72 бригада ВСУ, 90 бригада ВСУ)

" Лицемеры из ВСУ"
Нардеп Евгений Дейдей написал второе сообщение после того, как увидел, что в пресс-центре «АТО» цинично опровергли его информацию о потерях.
«Как минимум лицемерно рассказывать, сидя в облагороженных кабинетах, что происходит на передовой.
Если сотрудники Министерства обороны не совсем понимают, что же на самом деле происходит на Востоке Украины, я повторюсь специально для них, наверное, в миллионный раз: это ВОЙНА!!! Агрессивная, беспощадная, зверская…
И каждый день она уносит жизни наших ребят. Каждый день тела кого-то из наших бойцов просто пакуют в черные мешки, а кого-то увозят с покалеченными телами и душами…
Вы подбиваете статистику?! Вы говорите, что на Донбассе затишье?! Так, может, сначала выйдете из своих бюрократических укрытий и своими глазами посмотрите, что же все-таки происходит!
Как можно разделять бойцов ВСУ или ребят из «Правого сектора»? Как можно даже думать о том, что кто-то из них не пытается защитить нашу Родину?!
Все ребята, как один, стремятся изгнать врага с Востока Украины. Все они защищают нашу свободу. Кстати сказать, вы все до сих пор наслаждаетесь великим даром жизни именно благодаря им.
Потому, если кто-то пытается скрыть вопиющую правду или ему нужны выборы на Донбассе, не думайте, что никто не распознает ваших истинных намерений.
Я всегда знал, что все, кто находится на передовой, едины в своем желании защитить страну. Я всегда буду поддерживать наших ребят и бороться за правду. Потому я никогда не перестану доносить гражданам Украины сущность агрессивной восточной войны.
Моя страница в Facebook всегда была, есть и будет открытой платформой для этого. Люди должны знать правду. Ведь бороться вслепую — не выход. Мы должны знать, кто и за что воюет в этой стране. Всегда!!!» — пишет Дейдей.


Translation
But for a change a little hysteria with "the other side". Affects the amount of hate, and splatters.
Not sure sorry, for machine translation - whether he is able to convey the intensity.

"Remember this NIT in the face of the President on the issues of "ATO"
Publication volunteers "Right sector" Rita Singer on the social network exploded the Ukrainian segment of Facebook, its genealogy, more than 1,000 people, including many well-known activists:
"Just remember this NIT in the face. Is the speaker of the presidential Administration on issues of "ATO" — Alexander Motuzyanik. He today no one died in the combat zone! He and the same scum from the administration main scum.You know, I wish one artillery hit on the very same building on Bankova street, where they have a Central pit. Creature!" "By GRADs to Kiev!"
The message of the activist "Lily Sova" also massively repost in social networks:
"I'm yelling! Yell and swear! Helplessness... I hate it. Today I hate to shiver in hands, to clouding the brain... I Have a universal hatred! I hate Raschke, hate separatists, hate the official Kiev, I hate stupid people of my native country! How many dead today in a goddamn line of the WCT! Butovka! A repeat of history with the WCT in January 15th of the year! Shot tanks at point blank range. Was covered precisely 120 mortars.
SIGHTING! You know how it is? Do you know why? That's fucking power! Fucking GS! You didn't know, what would it be? Butovka is a strategic point? You POH! There not your kids! Hate! By GRADs to Kiev! Children of pid...racial (not sexual minorities!) — to Butovka, Promka and Zenit!
Previously: Butovka 5-200, 4 -300 heavy (not full data) PS 4-200, 15-300, 79, Marinka, 1-200, 8-300, AYDAR 2-200 7-300 72 5-300, 90 baht-2-300. The dead are not 128, and standing next to the SS. 4-200 2-200 took under the rubble, can't get and 7-300. Data is not accurate. Still to be confirmed".
(Here is a listing of dead - code 200 and wounded - code 300 with specifying the units: PS - "right sektor", 128 brigade AFU, 72 brigade AFU, 90 brigade of the armed forces)

"Hypocrites of the AFU"
The people's Deputy Yevhen Deidei wrote the second message after he saw that in the press center "ATO" cynically denied the information about the losses.
"At least hypocritical to tell, sitting in the sanitized rooms, what happens on the front lines.
If employees of the Ministry of defence do not quite understand what is actually happening in the East of Ukraine, I repeat especially for them, probably for the millionth time: this is WAR!!! Aggressive, ruthless, brutal...
And every day it claims the lives of our children. Every day on one of the bodies of our soldiers just Packed in black bags, and someone being taken away with the crippled bodies and souls...
You're encouraging statistics?! You say that in the Donbass calm?! So maybe the first released from their bureaucratic shelters and your eyes will see what happens!
How can you divide AFU fighters or the guys from "Right sector"? How can you even think that someone is not trying to protect our Homeland?!
All of the guys as one, attempting to expel the enemy from the East of Ukraine. All they are protecting our freedom. By the way, you all still enjoy the great gift of life thanks to them.
Because if someone is trying to hide the blatant truth or he wants elections in the Donbass, do not think that no one will recognize your true intentions.
I always knew that everyone who is at the forefront, are United in their desire to defend the country. I will always support our guys and fight for the truth. Because I will never cease to bring the citizens of Ukraine the essence of the aggressive Eastern war.
My page in Facebook has always been, is and will be an open platform for this. People should know the truth. After all, to fight blindly is not the solution. We need to know who and what is at war in this country. Always!!!" — says Deidei.

http://rusvesna.su/news/1465749870
 
ВСУ вечером обстреляли село Сосновское на юге ДНР и Докучаевск, повреждены 7 домов

16.06.2016 - 1:44
Украинские войска вечером 15 июня обстреляли из орудий калибра 152 мм село Сосновское Новоазовского района на юге ДНР.
«В 20:30 ВСУ открыли огонь из артиллерийских орудий калибра 152 мм по селу Сосновское», — цитирует ДАН слова источника в силовых ведомствах ДНР.
По данным источника, противник вел огонь с позиций в районе оккупированного села Павлополь. Согласно информации собеседника, в ходе обстрела украинские силовики выпустили 12 артиллерийских снарядов.
Также украинскими оккупантами был обстрелян Докучаевск, повреждения получили семь жилых частных домов.


Translation
In the evening AFU shelled the village Sosnovskoye in the South of the DNI and Dokuchaevsk, damaged 7 homes

16.06.2016 - 1:44
Ukrainian troops on the evening of 15 June, fired from guns caliber 152 mm Sosnovskoye village Novoazovskiy district in the South of the DPR.
"At 20:30 AFU opened fire from artillery guns of 152 mm caliber in the village of Sosnovskoye", — quotes the words of the GIVEN source in law enforcement agencies the DPR.
According to the source, the enemy fired from positions near the occupied village of Pavlopol. According to the interlocutor, during the shelling of the Ukrainian security forces fired 12 artillery shells.
Also, the Ukrainian occupiers were fired Dokuchaevsk, damaged seven private dwellings.

http://rusvesna.su/news/1466030665
 
youlik said:
Some personal observations, if I may.
In 2006-2008 I spent a lot of time in Ukraine for work. I had to visit almost all regions of the country except the West. Interestingly, Lviv and Ivano-Frankivsk I did not go on the advice of Ukrainian boys from Vinnitsa. We with them communicated well and when I said I was going to go to Lviv, they told me: "you don't have to go there, away from sin, of our let somebody go." That is, while in some regions of Ukraine, mainly in the West, it flourished in the mood of hatred of the "Muscovites".
At that time the power in Ukraine was the "orange" result "orange revolution" in 2004. The policy of this government is conducted openly Russophobic. But in person, many people said, "now we drop the "Yuscha" (the so-called President Yushchenko), will choose Yanukovych and live with you, that is with Russia like brothers.
Then came the events in South Ossetia. And then I was struck by the quality of the "brainwashing" of some part of the population. The people with whom I had to deal, were not uneducated peasants. Businessmen from large cities: Kiev, Kharkov, Dnepropetrovsk, Odessa etc. In professional and business matters absolutely adequate, sober-minded, in matters of policy, as "zombie", not hearing, not wanting to hear, not wishing to think with a clear setting in the brain.
So what happened in Ukraine in late 2013 has been preparing for a long time and very carefully.

Very true, Youlik, thanks for sharing your personal experience. It's heartbreaking to witness this meaningless aggression and confrontation which is artificially fueled by the Ukrainian authorities and heavily supported by the Western "leaders" who are also puppets in the hands of the global corporate moguls, while ordinary people of Ukraine fall prey of their propaganda and start thinking and acting like zombies indeed. There is so much emotional thinking and pseudo-patriotism in Ukraine now.
 
It's heartbreaking to witness...

Это еще более душераздирюще, когда ты не просто свидетель а почти участник, когда этот кошмар непосредственно касается твоих родных. Дело в том, что бабушка, дядя и сестра моей жены с маленькой дочкой живут в Стаханове. Это городок в Луганской области, ныне Луганская Народная Республика. Сейчас непосредственно у них не стреляют, да и порядок власти навели более-менее, а вот летом в 2014 году там было реально страшно. Прилетали снаряды буквально на соседнюю улицу и бандитизм имел место. Практически все то ужасное время родственники жили у нас. Сейчас вернулись, живут там и это хорошо что было куда вернуться-дом остался цел. Многие ведь остались вообще без крыши над головой. У нас тоже не совсем без потерь-дядька потерял ногу из-за несвоевременно оказанной медпомощи. Так что эта тема во многом личная для меня.

Translate
It is even more heartbreaking when you're not just a witness and almost a party when this nightmare is directly related to your family. The fact that grandmother, uncle and sister of my wife with little daughter live in Stakhanov. Is a town in the Luhansk region, now Luhansk People's Republic. Now there did not shoot, and the order of the authorities brought more or less, but in the summer in 2014, there were really scary. Shells flew literally on the next street and a robbery took place. Almost all that terrible time relatives lived with us. Now back, live there, and it's good that was a lot back-the house remained intact. Because many people remained without a roof over their heads. We also are not entirely without losses-uncle lost a leg due to delays of medical care provided. So this topic is largely personal to me.
 
Militär-Manöver "Anaconda 16" - NATO probt Überfall auf Polen (немецкий язык)
BILD REPORTER

https://youtu.be/Quwfo1MmtTY
How can NATO protect their borders and Poland? This was practiced in the context of a military maneuver - with urban warfare, laser ammunition and real tanks. IMAGE was there - in "Anaconda 16".

EURO 2016: English fans out to settle scores with Russian hooligans English Hooligans in Lille
FRANCE 24 English
_https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OW1aAOc63L0

Petro Poroshenko on Vladimir Putin: 'I don't trust him' (Beyond Lies :phaser:)
Fox News Published on Apr 4, 2016
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=veJgEf-gwb8 Reality
_https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tm1ETKlwkB8


Treating the battlefield wounded on Exercise Anakonda
NATO
Published on Jun 15, 2016

https://youtu.be/vTU8m0THFds
Anakonda MASCAL (mass casualty) is a medical evacuation exercise that took place as part of exercise Anakonda 2016. It involved troops from the Polish Army (2nd Mechanised Infantry Battalion) and US Army (1st Armored Brigade Combat Team and 3rd Infantry Division Raider Brigade). The training took place near Mirosławiec Air Base in Poland. The exercise tested the troops’ ability to follow the correct drills and procedures in a mass casualty situation including evacuating the most severe casualties first. Exercise Anakonda is a Polish-led, multinational training exercise, running from 7 until 17 June, involving approximately 31,000 troops from 24 NATO and partner countries. It aims to test the ability, readiness and interoperability of the Polish Armed Forces with Allies and partners while conducting the joint defensive operation on a large scale.
 
youlik said:
It is even more heartbreaking when you're not just a witness and almost a party when this nightmare is directly related to your family. The fact that grandmother, uncle and sister of my wife with little daughter live in Stakhanov. Is a town in the Luhansk region, now Luhansk People's Republic. Now there did not shoot, and the order of the authorities brought more or less, but in the summer in 2014, there were really scary. Shells flew literally on the next street and a robbery took place. Almost all that terrible time relatives lived with us. Now back, live there, and it's good that was a lot back-the house remained intact. Because many people remained without a roof over their heads. We also are not entirely without losses-uncle lost a leg due to delays of medical care provided. So this topic is largely personal to me.

I understand your feelings, Youlik. My father was also born in Luhansk region. Now I'm often thinking what would his life be, if he didn't leave Ukraine many years ago. By the evil irony, the small town where he was born is named Счастье, which means Happiness in English. I read somewhere that this town got its name from the Russian empress Catherine the Great who was visiting this place in XVIII century and commented about it something like "What a happiness it must be to live here!" Well, unfortunately the happiness ended in 2014: the town was literally caught between two fires as it was located on the conventional border between Ukrainian army and Luhansk People's Republic. Basically they shelled the hell out of it. As far as I know, it's been one of the hottest spots in this war and was effectively ruined.

I don't know what the empress would say about Siberia if she had a chance to visit it nowdays, but to be honest, I sometimes catch myself thinking "What a happiness that I live at the edge of the world and not in this almost-Europe".

And you are right, it's really very scary and depressing to hear all the news coming from Ukraine now. I hope your relatives will be okay, Youlik. Let's keep fingers crossed for them. :hug2:
 
I read somewhere that this town got its name from the Russian empress Catherine the Great who was visiting this place in XVIII century and commented about it something like "What a happiness it must be to live here!" Well, unfortunately the happiness ended in 2014: the town was literally caught between two fires as it was located on the conventional border between Ukrainian army and Luhansk People's Republic. Basically they shelled the hell out of it. As far as I know, it's been one of the hottest spots in this war and was effectively ruined.

Спасибо, Siberia, за "пальцы"! Давайте держать их скрещенными за всех, кто страдает в современных войнах !
Посмотрел я на Счастье, ну и досталось же этому городку! Лупили по нему действительно с обеих сторон.
И по поводу названия Вы совершенно правы. Собственно весь восток Украины стал развиваться благодаря Екатерине Великой.


Translate
Thanks, Siberia, for "fingers"! Let's keep them crossed for everyone who is suffering in modern warfare !
I looked at Счастье, what happened to this town! Thrashed on it really from both sides.
And about the title You're absolutely right. In fact the whole Eastern Ukraine began to develop, thanks to Catherine the Great.

https://www.google.ru/search?q=%D0%B3%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%B4+%D0%A1%D1%87%D0%B0%D1%81%D1%82%D1%8C%D0%B5&newwindow=1&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiovsbIvqzNAhVEhiwKHQzyCz8Q_AUICigD&biw=1600&bih=799#tbm=isch&tbs=rimg%3ACcPAgbkaX-qMIjjH19WO6Sq4FpIhjNKOk7YS236C3CScg0slqJzJsiXciYjHN7aYWtTgER3pKoio_1VJrJ2zCd52sJyoSCcfX1Y7pKrgWEa05lL0w-okIKhIJkiGM0o6TthIR4xFuygHkbokqEgnbfoLcJJyDSxFuGIn3RDNaqCoSCSWonMmyJdyJEcomFEVI-IswKhIJiMc3tpha1OARUUjEtcSBYtcqEgkRHekqiKj9UhHPSurDNYDVZyoSCWsnbMJ3nawnEVYBGBO4D6Jx&q=%D0%B3%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%B4%20%D0%A1%D1%87%D0%B0%D1%81%D1%82%D1%8C%D0%B5&imgrc=_
 
Ukrainian Army Is Running out of Ammunition

http://www.fort-russ.com/2016/06/ukrainian-army-is-running-out-of.html

Translated by Ollie Richardson for Fort Russ
16th June, 2016


http://nr.news-republic.com/Web/ArticleWeb.aspx?regionid=14&articleid=66680509

The Ukrainian army is running out of ammunition. This statement was made by Secretary of the National Security and Defence Council of Ukraine Oleksandr Turchynov. At a meeting on the provision of the army he called for the creation of its own base for the production of ammunition.

At the same time, Turchynov complained that military-technical cooperation with new partners - US, EU, and NATO - is blocked.

At the time, Ukraine got almost all of its arsenal from Warsaw Pact countries. In 2005, the total mass of shells and rockets in the warehouses was estimated to be at 2.5 million tons. Now in Ukraine there is not one ammunition factory, and factories for the manufacture of gunpowder and explosives in Dnipropetrovsk and Pavlograd are in need of costly upgrades, according to RIA Novosti.
 
Siberia said:
youlik said:
It is even more heartbreaking when you're not just a witness and almost a party when this nightmare is directly related to your family. The fact that grandmother, uncle and sister of my wife with little daughter live in Stakhanov. Is a town in the Luhansk region, now Luhansk People's Republic. Now there did not shoot, and the order of the authorities brought more or less, but in the summer in 2014, there were really scary. Shells flew literally on the next street and a robbery took place. Almost all that terrible time relatives lived with us. Now back, live there, and it's good that was a lot back-the house remained intact. Because many people remained without a roof over their heads. We also are not entirely without losses-uncle lost a leg due to delays of medical care provided. So this topic is largely personal to me.

I understand your feelings, Youlik. My father was also born in Luhansk region. Now I'm often thinking what would his life be, if he didn't leave Ukraine many years ago. By the evil irony, the small town where he was born is named Счастье, which means Happiness in English. I read somewhere that this town got its name from the Russian empress Catherine the Great who was visiting this place in XVIII century and commented about it something like "What a happiness it must be to live here!" Well, unfortunately the happiness ended in 2014: the town was literally caught between two fires as it was located on the conventional border between Ukrainian army and Luhansk People's Republic. Basically they shelled the hell out of it. As far as I know, it's been one of the hottest spots in this war and was effectively ruined.

I don't know what the empress would say about Siberia if she had a chance to visit it nowdays, but to be honest, I sometimes catch myself thinking "What a happiness that I live at the edge of the world and not in this almost-Europe".

And you are right, it's really very scary and depressing to hear all the news coming from Ukraine now. I hope your relatives will be okay, Youlik. Let's keep fingers crossed for them. :hug2:

Thank you, Youlik, and I too have my fingers crossed.

Very sorry about the town Счастье, of your fathers birthplace, Siberia. How many towns like this across the globe were/are caught up in the cross-fire, caught up on account of one sides madness for power and control - often initiated as proxy destruction for those who could care less for people anywhere. It's all so heartbreaking.
 
Tass Russian News Agency
Donbass militia source reports Kiev forces shell Donetsk outskirts
June 17, 10:48 UTC+3
http://tass.ru/en/world/882784
MOSCOW, June 17. /TASS/.
Ukrainian forces have fired 28 shells at the outskirts of Donetsk at the evening on Thursday’s evening and in the small hours of Friday, a source in law enforcement agencies of the self-proclaimed Donetsk People’s Republic (DPR) told Donetsk News Agency.

"The Ukrainian side shelled the territory of former Donetsk airport, Volvo Center and Staromikhaylovka from 9:20pm until 11:50pm," the source said adding that "Ukrainian forces fired 28 shells of 82mm caliber in total."

According to the source, Kiev forces opened fire from their positions in settlements of Krasnogorovka, Opytnoye and Peski.

On Thursday Ukrainian forces shelled DPR territory almost 400 times along the contact line.

The participants of the Contact Group on settling the situation in east Ukraine agreed on observing Easter ceasefire starting from April 30. However, the self-proclaimed Donetsk and Lugansk republics (DPR and LPR) and Kiev forces continue accusing each other of violating the ceasefire regime in Donbass.

Tass
Lavrov says United States and European Union tired of Kiev’s whims
http://tass.ru/en/politics/882592
ST. PETERSBURG, June 16 /TASS/.
1137011.jpg


The United States and the European Union are getting tired of Kiev’s whims over the crisis settlement in Donbass, Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov told a session of the Valdai discussion club held as part of SPIEF-2016 on Thursday.
"Ways of settling the Ukraine crisis can be discussed endlessly. There are the Minsk Accords and any attempts to rewrite them are impossible and unacceptable. We hope that our western partners will continue doing pastoral work with Kiev,"
Lavrov said.
"Moreover, the Germans and the French and even the Americans are getting tired of the whims of their fosterlings. They have to implement a document, which they have signed,"
the Russian foreign minister added.

MH-17: ПРАВДА. Новый проект Грэма Филлипса. (Graphic Content) English Sub
Graham Phillips
_https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Exw-E0RkOfo
 
voyageur said:
[...]

Thank you, Youlik, and I too have my fingers crossed.

Very sorry about the town Счастье, of your fathers birthplace, Siberia. How many towns like this across the globe were/are caught up in the cross-fire, caught up on account of one sides madness for power and control - often initiated as proxy destruction for those who could care less for people anywhere. It's all so heartbreaking.

I would also like to say, "Thank-You to Siberia and Youlik" for bringing a personal touch and first hand knowledge to the events transpiring in Ukraine and the surrounding areas. For someone like me, who has never traveled outside of the U.S., I can only study the History and read the Headlines. Your interaction and descriptions of how these events are affecting you personally - brings an added dimension and valuable insight - that rarely comes through in just reading the news! Instead of viewing Ukraine and it's events as being "out there" some where, reading your personal experiences, brings the subject - closer to home.


Kiev Junta Again Stalling On Minsk Agreements, Now Pushing For A Full 3 Month Ceasefire – Lavrov

Kiev Junta Again Stalling On Minsk Agreements, Now Pushing For A Full 3 Month Ceasefire – Lavrov
http://novorossia.today/kiev-junta-stalling-minsk-agreements-now-pushing-full-3-month-ceasefire/

Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said it is unreal to observe the full ceasefire in Donbass during three months. “Our Ukrainian colleagues have again said that the Minsk agreements will start being implemented in full only if there is full and unconditional ceasefire without a single violation for at least three months,” Lavrov said at the Valdai club session of the St. Petersburg International Economic Forum.

“This is just unreal. There will be always someone who opens fire twice and says that the regime has been violated,” he said.

The Ukrainian side earlier said that elections in Donbass must take no earlier than 90 days after the adoption of a special law. During the consultations in the Contact Group on settlement in Donbass region (eastern Ukraine) Kiev insisted that the polls can be held only on the condition of a sustainable ceasefire. Holding elections in Donbass is one of the key points of political settlement in the Donbass region (eastern Ukraine). Under the Minsk deal of February 2015, the polls were due to take place last year along with the constitutional reform in Ukraine aimed at granting certain areas in the Donetsk and Lugansk region a special status on a permanent basis. However, the deadline has been repeatedly postponed due to Kiev’s refusal to comply with its commitments, in particular to grant amnesty to all participants of events in Donbass, to adopt legislation on a special status and to pass a law on elections. Late last year, the leaders of the Normandy Four group (Russia, Germany, France and Ukraine) set a new deadline for elections – the first half of 2016. Kiev still refuses to discuss preparations for elections explaining this by a low level of security in the region.


The elections in the Donetsk and Lugansk People’s Republics are unlikely to be carried out this year, Donetsk republic’s envoy to the Minsk talks on settling the crisis Denis Pushilin said on Thursday.

Elections In Donetsk And Lugansk Republics Are Unlikely To Be Carried Out This Year
http://novorossia.today/126046-2/

Pushilin reminded that another meeting of the Contact Group and four working subgroups was held on Wednesday. “Unfortunately, there is no progress in the work of the political subgroup. There is our position and there is the Ukrainian position – they are completely opposite, no compromise has been reached. That’s why there is no talk about elections this year.”

The DPR and LPR are still ready for elections “at any time,” Pushilin said. The date of holding the polls in Donbass “depends to a large extent on the guarantor countries” and also the United States that can influence Kiev in this issue, he added.

Holding elections in Donbass is one of the key points of political settlement in the Donbass region (eastern Ukraine). Under the Minsk deal of February 2015, the polls were due to take place last year along with the constitutional reform in Ukraine aimed at granting certain areas in the Donetsk and Lugansk region a special status on a permanent basis. However, the deadline has been repeatedly postponed due to Kiev’s refusal to comply with its commitments, in particular to grant amnesty to all participants of events in Donbass, to adopt legislation on a special status and to pass a law on elections. Late last year, the leaders of the Normandy Four group (Russia, Germany, France and Ukraine) set a new deadline for elections – the first half of 2016. Kiev still refuses to discuss preparations for elections explaining this by a low level of security in the region.


Deputies of the Odessa regional council decided not to abandon their intentions to seek a contractual relations with the Central authorities of Ukraine.

Odessa Regional Council Contradicts Poroshenko, Insists On "Special Relationship" With Kiev
http://www.fort-russ.com/2016/06/odessa-regional-council-contradicts.html

On June 17th, during a session, the regional assembly did not support the draft decision to abolish its decision made on 26th May "on the address made by deputies of the Odessa regional council to the President and the Prime Minister of Ukraine regarding the need to conclude agreements on the division of power between the Cabinet of Ministers, the regional state administration, and the regional council".

Only 34 deputies were for the cancellation of the previous decision, including supporter of the address at the meeting Oleg Kutateladze. It was opposed by the first Deputy Chairman of the regional council Oleg Radkovsky, noting that the agreements with Kiev will allow "a more active participation in the formation of the budget and control of planning for administrative-territorial reform".

As a reminder, in Odessa, the initiator of the session questioning contractual relations with the center was precisely Radkovskiy, representing the "Fatherland" faction . Largely thanks to his votes, the draft decision was accepted.

In early June the President of Ukraine Poroshenko said that the desire of the Odessa, Zhitomir, and Kirovograd regional councils to conclude these agreements are contrary to the norms of the Constitution.

"There will not be any contracts between the President and the regional councils," he said.

However, literally after just a few days, despite the visit of the President, Khmelnitsky regional council approved the appeal to the Central authorities on the separation of powers.
 
ВСУ подвергли обстрелу западные пригороды столицы ДНР.
Около 00:10 с направления Красногоровки-Острого был открыт огонь из тяжелой артиллерии с по району Старомихайловки, после чего завязался бой.
Чуть ранее поселок Трудовские подвергается обстрелу из минометов и САУ с направления Марьинки. Отмечены возгорания, в жилом секторе «Куйбышевский слышат глухие звуки», — сообщает дончанин Павел.
«Это Красногоровка лупит по Петровке», — отвечает ему местный житель Дмитрий.
Кроме того, сообщается о перестрелках с использованием крупнокалиберных пулеметов, ЗУ и АГС на блокпосте ВСУ под Мариуполем, а в районе н. п. Лебединского, Широкино и Саханки около 21.00 был отмечен бой с применением тяжелой артиллерии.

Translation
AFU shelled the Western suburbs of the capital of the DNR.
Around 00:10 from the direction of Krasnogorovka-Sharp opened fire with heavy artillery from the area of Staromykhailivka, after which a fight ensued.
Earlier the village Trudovskie come under rocket attack from mortars and self-propelled guns from the direction of Marinka. Marked by fire, in the residential sector "Kuybyshevskiy hear a hollow sound," — said the Donetsk Paul.
"It Krasnogorovka pounding on Petrovka" — he meets a local resident Dmitry.
There are also reports of firefights, using heavy machine guns, AGS and memory at the checkpoint AFU under Mariupol, near the settlement of Lebedinsky, Shirokino and Sahanki around 21.00 was marked by a battle with heavy artillery.

http://rusvesna.su/news/1466204100
 
Добавлю чуть-чуть личного, т.е. не из новостей.
История от той самой сестры моей жены, жительницы Стаханова, о которой я писал выше. Она молодая женщина 25 лет и всю жизнь прожила в этом городке. Естественно знакомых половина города.
Когда началась война многие парни пошли в ополчение. Один "геройский" паренек говорил, что пойдет в ополчение чуть не с первого дня событий. Так он говорил целых полгода и вот наконец то собрался. Его записали в ополчение и приказали сторожить какой-то склад. Когда он попросился с оружием на фронт, типа родной дом защищать, ему было сказано: "воюют военные, а ты делай что приказывают".
Как указывали Кассиопеяне-у каждого свой путь.

Translation
Adds a little personal, i.e. not from the news.
The story from the sister of my wife, a resident of Stakhanov, about which I wrote above. She's a young woman 25 years old and has lived his entire life in this town. Of course the familiar half of the city.
When the war started a lot of guys went to the militia. One "heroic" guy said go to battle almost from the first day of the event. So he said for six months and finally came together. It was recorded in the militia and ordered to guard a warehouse. When he asked arms on the front, the type of home to protect, he was told: "fight in the military, you do what I command".
As was pointed out C's-everyone has their own way.
 
angelburst29 said:
voyageur said:
[...]

Thank you, Youlik, and I too have my fingers crossed.

Very sorry about the town Счастье, of your fathers birthplace, Siberia. How many towns like this across the globe were/are caught up in the cross-fire, caught up on account of one sides madness for power and control - often initiated as proxy destruction for those who could care less for people anywhere. It's all so heartbreaking.

I would also like to say, "Thank-You to Siberia and Youlik" for bringing a personal touch and first hand knowledge to the events transpiring in Ukraine and the surrounding areas. For someone like me, who has never traveled outside of the U.S., I can only study the History and read the Headlines. Your interaction and descriptions of how these events are affecting you personally - brings an added dimension and valuable insight - that rarely comes through in just reading the news! Instead of viewing Ukraine and it's events as being "out there" some where, reading your personal experiences, brings the subject - closer to home.

Thank you for your comments, Youlik, Voyageur and Angelburst. My father actually left Ukraine with his family very long time ago, when he was only four years old. Back then there was no Luhansk region by the way. According to my father's passport, he was born in Voroshilovgradskaya Oblast - that's how this region was called before 1991. It was named after the Marshall of the USSR Kliment Voroshilov who was also born in this region.

My father and mother only visited his birthplace once after that and it was also many years ago. But we do have relatives in Ukraine, both in Luhansk and Kiev regions.

To be honest, at one point I reached the state when I couldn't read the news from Ukraine anymore - it was short after I started the Iodine protocol, about half a year ago. It was so emotionally hurtful that I just stopped reading those news completely. And it is only now that I slowly start reading them again. So you all probably know way more than me about how the situation has been developing there in the recent months.

Today I read one interesting news in Russian, here is a quick machine translation:

The attitude of Russians and Ukrainians to each other improved significantly since last year. This is evidenced by results of a survey conducted by "Levada-center" in the last days of May.

39% of Russians treat Ukraine well, negative attitudes expressed 47% of respondents, while 13% were undecided.

For comparison - in May last year, the number of detractors in Ukraine was 59%.

In turn, 42% of Ukrainians expressed a positive attitude towards Russia. Negative sentiment towards our country express almost as many - 43%. Not able to decide - 15%. In May last year the number of Ukrainians with a strong anti-Russian position was far greater - 57%. That is, the number of "Russophobes" in Ukraine decreased by 14% during the year.

Most experts, including Ukrainian, believe that the reason for such "mutual warming" to the lack of large-scale fighting in the Donbass in the past year, as well as the recent history with the exchange of Savchenko for two Russians.

Ukrainian sociologist Yevhen Kopatko believes that the significant role was played by the human factor. "Ukraine is gradually focusing on solving its internal problems. And against the backdrop of the economic and social reality faced by Ukrainians, it becomes obvious that not everything can be blamed on Russia", - said the sociologist.

"In addition, the Western media are unequivocal signals that Ukraine should not aggravate relations with Russia and even, on the contrary, it is necessary to re-establish economic ties. For the Ukrainian public opinion it was a landmark event", said Kopatko.

Thus, the Kiev government now has two choices: still trying to sculpt the image of Russia as an enemy and aggressor, or "slowing the momentum" to gradually return to a reasonable economic cooperation with our country.

- On the one hand, the Kiev regime is very convenient without end to continue the war in the Donbass - the director of the Center for Political Studies, University of Finance Pavel Salin. - Thus, you can, as before, to write off all the problems in the economy for the "Russian aggression" and "Donbass terrorists." And the Ukrainian society will be cohesive, because it has a common enemy.

On the other hand, just the economy is so bad that even the trench warfare in Ukraine is becoming increasingly heavy burden. Soon, in Kiev simply does not have the means to pay for the so-called "ATO". Earlier Poroshenko in financing the war could count on the unconditional support of the West. But now, in an environment where the Ukrainian army for two years and was not able to destroy the unrecognized republic, the West increasingly loses interest to finance the Kiev regime. Since most of the money goes not to address the country's problems, but is simply stolen.

In addition, Poroshenko understands that active steps against the DPR and LPR may lead to a serious military defeat, the loss of new territories. But a lot of political forces in Ukraine will not forgive this to current president , and in the West too. At a minimum, this defeat greatly complicate the position of the President of Ukraine, as the maximum - will happen next coup.

Therefore, most likely, the choice will be made to ensure that in the information field, as before, to demonize the image of Russia, accusing it of aggression.

But in practice, Ukrainian businessmen and politicians will try to establish favorable economic ties with Russia. Such a policy will lead to the very limited success of propaganda, because people somehow still get the real information about what is happening on the front line in the Donbass. And if this information will be dramatically different from that talk "from the TV box", it will decrease the credibility of the official media.

"SP": - If Ukraine does not have the means to wage war, why the frequent attacks on settlements DPR and LPR?

- First of all, Kiev is simply unable to firmly control the situation on the front line. Nationalist battalions as part of the ATO are trying to aggravate the situation, because they understand that the peace process dramatically weaken their influence in Ukraine. In addition, the parties understand that at any moment can happen final "Frozen conflict" and then, most likely, the area will be divided on the "Yugoslav variant". That is the one area that controls the party to the conflict in fact, legally assigned to it. So now ATO attempts to take a more advantageous position, capturing the so-called "gray zone".

"SP": - Is there a chance that poorly controlled Kiev nationalist and Nazi battalions are disbanded or placed under strict control?

- Probably, such plans are floating in Kiev, but whether they can be realized - the big question. In Ukraine the situation is now very turbulent. And what's going to happen in the end, I cannot predict. A characteristic feature of the situation is that the West can only affect Kiev's politicians. But they in turn are able to influence is not at all the forces and processes within the country.

- According to my observations of the Ukrainian society, it is now roughly divided in half. One half is set against Russia sharply negative - says political scientist, a representative of the DPR in the Rostov region, Eduard Popov. - The other half expresses sympathy, or at least does not feel hostility. Events at the football championship in France showed that the most active part of Ukrainian society, which includes sports fans, are still anti-Russian.

I do not believe that the Kiev authorities, who made so much effort on the creation of the enemy image of Russia, suddenly change their policies and start to convince citizens of the need for economic cooperation with our country.

And Poroshenko recent statement that the Ukrainians should be ready at any time to deploy guerrilla warfare just confirms it.

"SP": - How would you explain the warming of the Ukrainian society with regard to Russia?

- It's life. According to the official (possibly understated) data from Ukrainian sources, 10% of tourists in the Crimea are citizens of Ukraine. These people see that the situation does not deteriorate in the Crimea, but on the contrary - the roads are being repaired, resort infrastructure is improving. Hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians, including from the Western regions come to work in Russia and see that much of what Ukrainian media persuades them in is not true. Against this reality, even Russophobic minded citizens of Ukraine have nothing left to do but to recognize that things in Russia are going not as bad as they would like to see them.

So, perhaps, a little light at the end of the tunnel?
 
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