SOTTREADER

The Living Force
Talking about this "confidence" in vaccines Days ago saw this video of a severe reaction and, within minutes there were many posts from IMSS of different States (Instituto Mexicano del Seguro Social - Mexican Institute of Social Security) like the one after.

They are eliminating loose ends to strengthen trust and confidence. Even though, there might not be a video or testimonies, people talks.

Had not been able to find more info about the video. A guy asks the nurse when (the patient) got the shot, she answers back that it was the day before at evening. At the end, same guy (I asume is a Doctor) mentions: adverse response to Covid... (not understood a word here )... to the vaccine.

Mexico Hospital: reaction AFTER the "covid" vaccine. #IDon'tVaccinateMyself


(IMSS Oaxaca) Calls on people not to fall into misinformation, as there is no evidence to show that the vaccine alone can have negative effects on people.

The first part is about a new hospital, the second part mentions: In the face of unfounded speculation about the effects of the Covid-19 vaccination, the Mexican Institute of Social Security calls on people not to fall into misinformation as there is no evidence to show that the vaccine alone can have a negative effect on people.

Eduardo González Guerra, head of the Division of Epidemiological Surveillance of Non-Communicable Diseases of the Social Security Institute, mentions: To investigate the impact of Covid vaccines on people, the international community, through the World Health Organisation, has developed methodologies to carry out an exhaustive investigation to determine the causes of adverse events.
It should be noted that any reaction to the vaccine is studied by a specialised sectoral group, which evaluates and follows up on these cases.
The events supposedly attributable to the vaccine are rare and the symptomatology is similar to that of other vaccines.
And this is why I think some governments from developing countries are not understanding the existential risk they are facing.

If only a few people will get this type of reaction, then they are fine. If a lot I think the potential for violent protests arise which could lead to revolution. The same techniques used to lull western citizens into complacency won't work in developing countries.

So they are playing with fire in my opinion.

I note India is now taking a hard stance on some vaccines ...

The Pakistani health minister came out and told the citizens to take the vaccines at their own risk. [Link provided by the UK column]


South Africa has rejected the Oxford vaccine.

Iran has rejected all the new Western covid vaccines.

Tanzania has rejected them too.

The countries around the peripherals are wisely waking up.

I'm also convinced that the slow rollout by some European countries is a tactical ploy. That is, they are moving slowly deliberately to buy enough time to see what happens to British, Canadian and American citizens who are the defacto guinea pigs. Also they may be moving slowly to watch and see how the variants evolve.
 

mabar

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
And this is why I think some governments from developing countries are not understanding the existential risk they are facing
I think they do understand the implications, if common people had done their research, governments can and do more because, I assume, they do not have the censor dificulties.

Here, the president Andrés Manuel López Obrador, can and had said that Covid-19 is not big deal but, governments of their own party and from opposition, had been applying measures accordingly the narrative. Less authoritarian, less mandatory perhaps. I guess, Western nations do and are doing the draconian measures as their force, security structure, are allowed.

Mexican president had Covid and, after 2 weeks he recover... Media and opposition (that had been pushing, demanding more draconian measures) are indígnated because recently, he said that he won't use the mask. He may not, but citizens cannot go to buy groceries without a mask pretty much in the whole country.

He had said that vaccine is optional, but his government is the one calling to their citizens to make the appointments in order to get the vaccine.

Is common to find this messages from the media. 🙄
Marinating people to make them believe that the President is a danger to the nation. Similar to Trump.

Wearing face masks remains an act of civil resistance.


When this never ending story would end? Some day.
 

Laurs

Jedi Council Member
FOTCM Member
My heart goes out to all of you in the UK, my daughters are there in their uni cities and they are hanging in bravely but find it very hard at times, the social aspect is dreary but the level of course content and quality of their respective courses has dramatically been reduced, but i guess that was to be expected and is in line with decades of dumbing down, still.... Amazingly, one of them told me that the Isle of Man is completely up and running!
it's days like today when people will be hugging their friends and family, drinking down the pub with their work mates and visiting their elderly relatives in a care home, where everyone here will feel especially lucky to be on this side of the water.

On another topic, also amazingly, i saw on Telegram (World Doctors Alliance Chat) that the study Completion Date for the Pfizer/BioNTech "vaccine" is January 31st 2023:


Actual Study Start Date :April 29, 2020
Estimated Primary Completion Date :August 3, 2021
Estimated Study Completion Date :January 31, 2023


while Moderna's "vaccine" study is set to be finished on 27th October 2022:

Actual Study Start Date :July 27, 2020
Estimated Primary Completion Date :October 27, 2022
Estimated Study Completion Date :October 27, 2022

Scientists, doctors etc must have noticed this i would think, but by now presumably have been fully immersed in The Lie and can't really be bothered to think about things anymore.

In the meantime, it seems people drop like flies after vaccination and the UK Medical Freedom Alliance sent an Open Letter to the UK government to:
call for an immediate and urgent audit of deaths that have occurred since the beginning of the Covid-19 vaccine rollout, to ascertain if Covid-19 vaccines (in general or any one brand in particular) are leading to an increased number of deaths (Covid-19 and non-Covid-19 related), Covid- 19 cases or increased risk of death in certain age groups or cohorts.

They give a good breakdown of what is happening in various countries that did have a strong roll out versus two countries (Jordan and Sweden) that didn't, and of course in Jordan and Sweden there are no such spikes in death.

Several countries have recorded a rise in deaths since they began their Covid-19 vaccine rollout. A comparison between those countries that have started vaccination programmes and those that have not, is striking. Below we present graphs of data from the UK, Ireland, Sweden, Israel, UAE, Bahrain, and Jordan. The graphs of Covid-19 mortality rates in different countries and Covid-19 vaccination rates show marked rising deaths rates commencing around the time the rollouts began which correlate with rate and number of vaccinations administered.

Regarding the situation in Israel, Gilad Atzmon wrote an interesting article covering this:

The country voluntarily decided to mass vaccinate itself. Israel is clearly winning in the vaccination contest, yet the numbers of COVID-19 cases and deaths aren’t encouraging to say the least. As for this morning, Israel’s R number is back at 1. The Times of Israel produced a grim audit yesterday; despite Israel vaccinating almost a third of its population “Israel has been reporting some 7,000 new infections a day, one of the highest rates in the developed world. Nearly 5,000 people have died, more than a quarter of them in January alone.

In its desperate attempt to vaccinate the entire population, health services are offering vaccination to anyone aged 16 and above. But the Israelis are reluctant. According to Israeli reports the vaccination centers are empty. The more pressure mounted by the government (including threats to future employment and personal freedom), the more suspicious Israelis become. They can see that the COVID situation in Israeli-Arab communities is improving despite their defiance of the Pfizer/Israeli experiment, while some almost entirely vaccinated Jewish cities struggle with a relatively high number of cases. A brief examination of the Israeli COVID situation reveals that the number of cases and deaths grew exponentially since the beginning of mass vaccination and the third lockdown.
Perhaps the situation in Israel is indicative of how things in other countries might develop, as long as vaccination is not mandatory.

But then there is the karmic aspect for the western countries and that could be something that must be lived through, osit. The people become more gullible by the day it seems, not good for chances of a revolt any time soon. On her daily 10K walk yesterday my mother (in the Netherlands) encountered a young female walker with mask, it was -10C and 8 am, who she knew, and this girl is a home care worker. My mother asked her why she would wear the mask outside and in these cold circumstances with no one about for miles. She said they were told by their home care institution that all care workers needed to carry with them 24/7 a small monitoring device that can "check" if they stick to the rule of masking up for 3 hours consecutively, then 2 hours without etc. twice a day i think. And so this young lady did. My Goodness....
 

N1mTzo

Jedi
Good news from Russia:

The first Russian region announced the abolition of the mandatory wearing of masks

In Udmurtia, mandatory wearing of masks will be canceled from February 12. At the same time, the authorities asked those who have not had a coronavirus or have recently been vaccinated to beware and still use protective equipment.

Obligatory wearing of protective masks will be canceled in Udmurtia this week, said the head of the region, Alexander Brechalov, during a live broadcast, during which he answered questions from residents. The broadcast was conducted on his page in the social network "VKontakte".

“Starting Friday, February 12, the mask regime [in the republic] will be advisory in nature,” Brechalov announced. He explained the cancellation of the mandatory wearing of masks by the fact that many residents have already had coronavirus.

At the same time, Brechalov asked those who did not get the coronavirus, and those who received the first or second component of the vaccine, "take care" and still wear a mask in public places, including in transport, shops and theaters.

According to the head of the republic, canceling the demand, he hopes "for an element of a social contract." “We naturally meet entrepreneurs halfway. But at the same time [the sellers] behind the store counter must be wearing masks, "Brechalov added.

In connection with the improvement in the situation with the spread of coronavirus in Udmurtia, from February 10, restrictions on the operation of catering establishments, cinemas and theaters will also be lifted. All residents will be allowed to attend sports events, except for persons over 65 years old, while the halls must be no more than half full.

Since the end of January, the daily increase in people infected with coronavirus in Udmurtia has begun to decline sharply. If on January 21, 190 new cases were registered in the republic, then by February 2, the figure dropped to 90 people. In total, since the beginning of the pandemic in Udmurtia, 26.4 thousand people have been infected with coronavirus, it follows from the data of the operational headquarters. 541 people died of the disease.


PS I think in the coming days the stupid mask regime will be canceled in all other regions of Russia, including Moscow and St. Petersburg.
 

XPan

Jedi Council Member
And this is why I think some governments from developing countries are not understanding the existential risk they are facing.

If only a few people will get this type of reaction, then they are fine. If a lot I think the potential for violent protests arise which could lead to revolution. The same techniques used to lull western citizens into complacency won't work in developing countries.

So they are playing with fire in my opinion.

I note India is now taking a hard stance on some vaccines ...

The Pakistani health minister came out and told the citizens to take the vaccines at their own risk. [Link provided by the UK column]


South Africa has rejected the Oxford vaccine.

Iran has rejected all the new Western covid vaccines.

Tanzania has rejected them too.

The countries around the peripherals are wisely waking up.

I'm also convinced that the slow rollout by some European countries is a tactical ploy. That is, they are moving slowly deliberately to buy enough time to see what happens to British, Canadian and American citizens who are the defacto guinea pigs. Also they may be moving slowly to watch and see how the variants evolve.

Possible other strings attached ?

I agree with what you wrote @SOTTREADER that some countries are rejecting vaccines due to the awareness of side effects.

May I additionally suggest, that other motives might or could be a play, too. Like strategical economical chess games behind the rejection of vaccines in some countries. You know like a bargain chip.

Then there is the possibility of induced delays in order to favor a countries own vaccine development (many countries are working on covid “vaccines”)

So, as of now we do not know if or how wisdom/awakening or economic strategies are at play responsible for the rejection of certain “vaccines” in some countries


Future development

interesting will be, to see - how or if they change their minds further down the road. I
 

Debra

Jedi Council Member
SARS-CoV-2 is a fact, and viruses do exist.
Man, when ever I hear or read a discussion, and someone makes the statement "I know for a FACT..." the table pounding generally tends to come next....and the discussion is over....

Lots of things "exist, that are named differently, by others looking at the "thing" differently.

View attachment 42601
As an example, not a very clever one, but here goes:

What if I believed a theory, that is considered a FACT by some, that All Dogs are dangerous, but some ARE much more Dangerous.
A certain breed of Dog, a Pitbull, is the most dangerous, and all Pitbulls must be eradicated.
The Pitbull is a Terrier, so eventually, all Terrier types should be eradicated, due to them being dangerous.

Now, if you know anything about dogs, and if you have read any of Pavlov's experiments, you will have an idea that it isn't the bred, but how these dogs are conditioned emotionally, and the temperaments of dogs is formed by interactions from birth.
Additionally, different breds of dogs do seem to have different levels of intelligence.
Historically, there are different JOBS that different dog types were ORIGINALLY genetically created/modified/bred to do: rat killers, sheep herders, trackers etc.

A well read and informed individual, such as yourself, would probably ague that this dangerous dog issue, stated as a FACT is actually a flawed and opinionated THEORY.
There is a province in Canada, Ontario, that HAS outlawed Pitbulls:

"Since 2005, it's been against the law to be the guardian of a pit bull in Ontario. The rationale for this breed ban is to improve public safety by outlawing a type of dog deemed dangerous. ..."

In this picture below, the EVIL inactive virus is pictured beside an inactive exosome and an inactive extra cellular vesicle:
View attachment 42600
Of course, a picture can't tell us what is inside of each of these identical looking things.
They would have to dock, connect with a port in a cell, and download the information, mRNA, into a cell first.

Then, we could scoop up that living, working cell, take it away from its body, and kill it.
We would do an extraction, which means mash it up.
This is to isolate the genetic material, then we would use "special chemicals" spin it around in a thermal cycler, at least 40 times,:whistle: cause a reaction,(with more "special" chemicals) and make millions of copies of a small portion of the SARS-CoV-2 virus’s genetic material.

One of the "special"chemicals produces a fluorescent light if SARS-CoV-2 is present.
This fluorescent light is a “signal” that is detected by the PCR machine and "special" software is used to interpret the signal as a positive test result.

According to the Germ Theory, the NAME is what matters, and it is now named SARS-COV-2 Virus, and it is Dangerous!!



Check out this picture, of "inactive" Flash drives:
View attachment 42604
One cannot tell what they contain, just by looking at them.
They all look similar, yet...
:scared:

I wish to know more about the truth, in terms of closing in on it - and therefore I do not consider that the final answer is given as you said @Niall , that the existence of SARs-CoV-2 virus is a "fact" (in the way it is claimed to exist)

In my mind personally, I keep both options open (yes it exists. No it does not exist)
Your question reminds me of : "Which came first, the Chicken or the egg?"

From what I ascertain, the Virus Theory came first, waaaay before exosomes, or any type of smaller than bacteria particle was even identified.
There was a Tobacco plant mutation that happened, back in the mid 1800's and early 1900's.

A dutch microbiologist, Martinus Willem Beijerinck is credited with the discovery, and he called it "contagium vivum fluidum"(contagious living fluid).
The term " Virus" is an the English word, created in America, in the early days of the Rockefeller Establishment, probably by good ol' boy, and Rockefeller buddy Wendell Meredith Stanley.

It is a very interesting and exciting history, and if you have the time, following the trail is an adventure.

There seems to be some group in Germany that is pushing this No Virus Theory, and Engelbrecht is at the heart of it. He is NOT a scientist; he is an (ex) MSM journalist who has made a name for himself as an 'alt.media investigative journalist' since he co-authored Virus Mania in the mid-2000s.
I agree, it seems to always comes down to finding the right "Alex Jones" type to drag the "red Herring" around and through everyone off the true scent, doesn't it?
Then when the Big Lie can knock him down, along with EVERYTHING he has said, then, the Liers can carry on with the original Big lie, and we all can go back to sleep.
Anyone claiming or suggesting otherwise is leading people into a dead-end, a position that is readily falsifiable (not unlike 'Covid-19 only occurs where 5G has been installed'.)
Lumping the truth, or should I say, viable possible probabilities, along with hearsay, imagined fears, lack of knowledge, and a few opinions based on subconscious bias, points to the Big Lie and the Manipulators at the core, seeding the lies to cover up the harm that is being done.

When you mentioned the 5G issue being connected to the conspiracy of Covid-19,reminded me that I have had a few ponders on that, as well.

I have thought long and hard regarding the electric, microwave, and environmental sensitivities that are reported.
ARE these real or just made up issues? If people are faking, is it for attention, fame, or something else?
In some cases the correlation to exposure of and the onset of physical and or mental breakdown appears to be VERY detrimental, and pretty hard to fake.
The devastation to Human and animal lives and health has been documented, so probably not fake.

Could it be, that the Frequency Resonant Vibration(FRV) of SOME living organisms, not ALL, but some, are perhaps MORE sensitive, and respond negatively, developing dire mental and physical manifestations to different waves and frequencies?

If so, then"Why?"

Why do only SOME people and animals Frequency Resonant Vibration exhibit these vulnerabilities,these rips and tears, or openings that allow these "waves" in?
Why are some people becoming damaged, developing tumors, rashes and organ failures( eg: Heart Attacks) or becoming mentally unstable, hearing voices, seeing things, becoming violent, but not ALL people, all of the time?

Why did some of the Elephants in that herd in Botswana drop dead, BUT NOT ALL?
Perhaps the vulnerabilities share a similarity that hasn't been looked at from the right angle, at least, by the Darwinian Medical association?
What causes the vulnerability?
Might it be a shared/similar traumatic unhealed incident?
The 'elephant in the room' that officialdom is 'hiding' is that this virus was the product of 'gain-of function' research, i.e. it was man-made.
This Lab Experiment of "gain of function" didn't start with Sars-Cov-2, based on what I have been researching, IMO.

Tampering and messing with our DNA, RNA, information packets, virii, viruses,or exomes,( a rose by any other NAME[...]) is a total backasswards approach, and has been going on for a very long time.

Every "immunization" every dose of antibiotics, every medical intervention with DRUGS, has the potential to change the cellular DNA, of EVERY being.

These "gain of function" experiments have in turn tampered and changed how each and every human beings FRV interacts with Nature/ Divine Cosmic Mind.
This also includes a whole host of "energy" experiments the Nazis perfected during the original experiments during WWII.
The guys that were "Paperclipped" to North America after WWII.

Yet, we survive.
Every single time, after each jab, pill or potion, inside our innate cellular intelligence, deep inside our DNA in all our cells, cells that were INTELLIGENTLY DESIGNED to adapt and SURVIVE, an attempt to overcome and utilize the information delivered by the drugs and injections is made.

Survival is always attempted, but in a lot of cases, there are too many "spanners in the gears" already, chemicals and blocks in all the different cells and organs, deposited by previous injections and drugs, toxins from food and water.

It becomes Biologically impossible for some to overcome the onset of the triggered healing crisis that is prematurely or falsely initiated by the interference of the chemicals and foreign materials, as well as the Fear Trauma.

So, when you hear about a "variant", what if that is a "Kite" of sorts.

Cellularly created anda released by a SURVIVOR.
A rearrangement of a different set of instructions, nestled into a little nano exosome, er, virus, sorry.
Perhaps, containing a set of instructions for a positive horizontal "evolution", maybe even the map on how to overcome some future weirdness?

I'd like to recommend an interesting book.
"Dissolving Illusions" by Suzanne Humphries, MD and Roman Bystrianyk
Here's is a link to their info:

I'm pretty sure that there was another European scientist who wouldn't go as far as saying that it was man made, but did comment that those sorts of changes in viruses have never been observed in nature.
The info in the quote below was posted about 500 or so pages back, in April 2020.
LOTS of information was posted at the beginning of this scamdemic, and due to all the excitement and awe, and the speed at which things were happening, the discussions moved very quickly.
This massive thread holds a lot of data that, perhaps once understood and combined, could add a few more pieces to the puzzle:
Luc Montagnier and a mathematician friend analyzed the genome and concluded that the genome of this new coronavirus had sequences from another virus, oh surprise, from the HIV virus.
(but they were not the first to see this, he cites a group of Indian researchers who came to the same conclusion but were forced to retract their study)
He says this cannot be a natural mutation caused by hiv patients affected by CV19, as such a mutation requires molecular tools, i.e. it is an alteration made in the laboratory.

The reporter then asks whether this was done intentionally to create a biological weapon or is the consequence of a problem that arose in the attempt to create an HIV vaccine.

Luc M. wants to believe that it is rather the second hypothesis. Humans like to play sorcerer's apprentice but nature doesn't like these disharmonizations and tries to eliminate "foreign bodies" from the coronavirus genome through a very rapid mutation as the virus passes from one person to another. It has been found that the virus of the last infected people, such as the west coast of the US for example, contains much less of these intrusive sequences.

All this will resolve itself naturally, but to avoid further deaths, patients could be treated with waves interfering with the waves behind these RNA sequences, he suggests.

You're not in danger of being called a conspirator? Asks the reporter.

No, the conspirators are on the other side, the ones who's hiding the truth from you, he answers.
 

Niall

Administrator
Administrator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
I would like see clear evidence of the existence of a SARS-CoV-2 entity - more than just through PCR sequencing tests. The studies which claim to have “purified/isolated” it - but when you go in depth (description of how they did it) - you then discover how contaminated the material has been with other material. Well that ain’t isolation/purification !

In that light, I feel I need to be critical. That the SARS virus is portrayed and put in connection in ways that do not make fully sense to me.

Since Dr Köhnlein was part of both the book Virus Mania, as well part of the article that called the existence of SARS-CoV-2 in question.... but are you aware @Niall that Köhnlein is not denying viruses ? (Which makes it an odd couple to write the book like that together)

Nor is Dr Wolfgang Wodarg or Dr Andrew Kaufmann by the way - just to add another teo (neither are connected to the book nor the article by the way)
Good, I'm reassured then that you're thinking this through.

The specific claim being made (by rather a lot of people out there) is what you wrote above about the 'fact' that SARS-CoV-2 has not been 'purified/isolated'.

This is not true.

Here are two articles about this on Sott. In the second one, the author - a virologist - explains that science and technology have long since moved on from Koch's Postulates. Nowadays, they can take 'photographs' of viruses up close - as has been done for SARS-CoV-2:



The thing I can't understand is where people got this 'idée fixe' from? When it comes to SARS-CoV-2, they will settle for nothing less than 'definitive proof' that it exists (whatever they think they mean by 'definitive proof'). If I were to guess, I suspect it has something to do with the fact that they are already predisposed to being skeptical about 'the Covid pandemic' because of administrative misuse of PCR testing, Big Pharma rushing vaccines to market, and of course governments' absurd and cruel lockdowns.

All of that is reasonable, so, as they see it, it's just one small step from there to doubting the existence of a virus at the heart of the global farce.
 

Ageeva

Jedi
One of the biggest news stories this week in lockdown Ireland was the 'Jerusalema' Dance Challenge performed by members of the Gardai (Irish Police Force). As Dave Cullen pointed out recently in a 'Computing Forever' video, they were performing at places where the imprisoned population are forbidden to travel to. It was such a big 'hit' that the biggest TV chat show featured them performing again. And the prisoners clapped and felt nicely assured by the performance of their prison guards. It was supposed to 'boost the spirits of the community they serve'. While they were dancing, police checkpoints are all over the place making sure only those permitted to travel beyond the 5km limit do so. Anyone caught gets a big fine. They're at the airports too checking for anyone wanting to escape this dystopian nightmare, 500 euro fine if you do. Hotels are been prepared to quarantine anyone breaking the rules, complete with security, as our vice prime minister, Leo Varadkar reassured everyone. And he also said foreign summer holidays and next Christmas celebrations are in doubt.
One of the places I work at, an 800-year-old castle, was closed in mid-January. Across the road from the castle was a small shop run by a friendly middle-aged man and his daughter. The shop sold gifts and souvenirs to visitors to the town and castle. He also did a very good trade in selling ice cream cones, coffee and newspapers to customers of all ages. His name was Vinnie and he was very well known to us at the castle and almost everyone in the town. Always very helpful, Vinnie would give us a cup of hot water if the lock on the main gate was frozen during the winter. The lockdowns destroyed his business. No more tourists, no more schoolkids. No summer business to look forward to.
Vinnie decided he'd had enough yesterday. He hanged himself.
We can't go to the funeral because no more than ten people are permitted. Any funerals with a bigger attendance are been investigated by the happy dancers:
 

XPan

Jedi Council Member
So confusing, so wonderful

I did not understand everything (yet), (nor did i see any pictures by the way) but i loved the input @Debra - the input through several angles, stimulating (me) to go deeper in the area.

More books on order !! :wow:

Just one two hours ago I was pondering “Ralf, you may have to go back to the beginning of this thread and read it ALL!” Well my ego puppy replied “Seriously ?!?! That’s 1099 pages duuude !!”


500 Pages ago

Now you mention that there is indeed a lot of noteworthy information embedded from members of the forum in the beginning of this threat (500 pages ago) - before events heated and acellerated anew, changing focus.

That tells me, I have to read the thread from the beginning - Not just because you suggested it, but also because it crossed my mind in serious manner before you wrote.


Out of its surrounding

Taking cells and other elements out of context, out of the body, out of their natual habitat, then adding chemicals... in order to study... (nothing wrong with that, but...)

I have often thought about the - very important aspect - what consequences it might have ? Removing something away from its natural function and surrounding - how alters that observations, results and conclusions ?


Raymond Rife

Then that reminds me of Rife’s unique observations he made with his special UV microscope of living pre-cell entities in the 20s/30s in their natural, living habitat - and LIVE while changing (the electron microscopes always kill (freeze) every sample you wish to study in detail)

So these pre-cell entities had a cyclical development; into virus, then into bacteria, then into fungus and finally disintegrating back to the small pre-cell entities after 14-16 cycles.

That must mean something to the whole !!
 

Lucius Lu

The Force is Strong With This One
Yes, I've seen that article. It's crazy. The author claims that what is seen in those electron microscopic images of SARS-Cov-2 must be 'exosomes' because he doesn't 'believe' in the existence of viruses.

There seems to be some group in Germany that is pushing this No Virus Theory, and Engelbrecht is at the heart of it. He is NOT a scientist; he is an (ex) MSM journalist who has made a name for himself as an 'alt.media investigative journalist' since he co-authored Virus Mania in the mid-2000s.

OffGuardian has fallen for this in a big way. The first critical reader comment under that article says:



To which an OffGuardian moderator responds by saying:‌



:umm:

I'm reminded of how the No Plane Theory split the 9/11 Truth Movement in the early 2000s.
How to make a fraud credible? How can you make people believe something that doesn't exist? Create a legend. Legend that the virus escaped from the military lab.
 

Gaby

SuperModerator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
The thing I can't understand is where people got this 'idée fixe' from? When it comes to SARS-CoV-2, they will settle for nothing less than 'definitive proof' that it exists (whatever they think they mean by 'definitive proof'). If I were to guess, I suspect it has something to do with the fact that they are already predisposed to being skeptical about 'the Covid pandemic' because of administrative misuse of PCR testing, Big Pharma rushing vaccines to market, and of course governments' absurd and cruel lockdowns.

All of that is reasonable, so, as they see it, it's just one small step from there to doubting the existence of a virus at the heart of the global farce.
Researchers who de-emphasize the germ theory bring a lot of good points and food for thought, but when they go to the point of nitpicking SARS-CoV2 to the extent that they come across as if they're denying the very existence of the virus, they discredit their own research. Shooting oneself in the foot through what looks like 101 cosmic cointelpro that works through unconscious agents will only give ammunition to those defending the exclusivity of the germ theory. People will not stand a chance at discerning the truth if they don't put their sacred cows out to pasture. That goes both ways, those who defend terrain theories and those who defend germ theories, and to each one their due. Perhaps it will help to have the question in mind - am I defending this global farce, even indirectly, by holding on to this view?

Makes me really value and appreciate those who work toward self-knowledge, for a true becoming.
 

mabar

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Now that the almighty WHO concluded that the virus is of animal origin, we will see this more often, I wouldn't be surprised if they bring out a chupacabra one next.:lol2:

NEW BUG New coronavirus closely linked to Sars-Cov-2 discovered in bats in Thailand, experts say

A NEW coronavirus closely linked to Sars-Cov-2 has been discovered in bats living in Thailand, a study has revealed.

The virus is not thought to be able to infect humans, as it is unable to bind to cells in the body, which is how Sars-Cov-2 infects people.Published in the Nature Communications journal, the experts have warned “cross-border surveillance is urgently needed” in order to find where the virus originated from.

Sars-Cov-2 shares 91.5 per cent of its genetic code with the virus discovered in the bats in Thailand.

The virus is called RacCS203 and antibodies present in the blood of both infected bats and pangolins were found to be effective at neutralising the infection.


Researchers from Chulalongkorn University in Bangkok said that bat-based coronaviruses cannot infect humans - but said that humans could be infected by the virus if a bat first passed it to an intermediate host - such as a pangolin.

The authors theorised that the virus changes shape when it inhibits the pangolin as it is able to create a binding which can then attach to a human host.

In order to garner samples of the virus, the researchers analysed bats in a wildlife sanctuary in Eastern Thailand.
 

XPan

Jedi Council Member
Good, I'm reassured then that you're thinking this through.

The specific claim being made (by rather a lot of people out there) is what you wrote above about the 'fact' that SARS-CoV-2 has not been 'purified/isolated'.

This is not true.

Here are two articles about this on Sott. In the second one, the author - a virologist - explains that science and technology have long since moved on from Koch's Postulates. Nowadays, they can take 'photographs' of viruses up close - as has been done for SARS-CoV-2:



The thing I can't understand is where people got this 'idée fixe' from? When it comes to SARS-CoV-2, they will settle for nothing less than 'definitive proof' that it exists (whatever they think they mean by 'definitive proof'). If I were to guess, I suspect it has something to do with the fact that they are already predisposed to being skeptical about 'the Covid pandemic' because of administrative misuse of PCR testing, Big Pharma rushing vaccines to market, and of course governments' absurd and cruel lockdowns.

All of that is reasonable, so, as they see it, it's just one small step from there to doubting the existence of a virus at the heart of the global farce.

I do not believe "it is a fix idea"

I consider BOTH sides to have valid arguments
(which also includes that there are faults at both sides, open questions, misunderstandings, potential miss-interpretations and so on) - but at the same time I acknowledge as well - the vast complexity that surrounds the SARS-CoV-2 virus subject; the origin, function, existence, consequences, and all that has been attached and attributed to the virus itself. Both right arguments as well wrong ones (since so many who benefit from it to push the SARS-CoV-2 virus agenda, being more than it is).

On top it pulls in the Germ vs Terrain theory, which I consider to be so major and complex - that - let's face it - it feels more like David and Goliath are battling, other days dancing tango (or something like that). A conflict never deeply addressed, and therefore has lot of gunpowder dwelling. You know, since the medical establishment has set the agenda that Germ Theory rules - and that's it. 130 years of unsolved conflicts bobs around in the mist on the bottom. Now it starts to emerge, coming a little into light, because of SARS-CoV-2 being or not being.

Great.

And what is wrong with proof ? And what is wrong with being critical towards what is represented as "being the proof"? Jeremy R. Hammond from the Article @Niall referred to - is pissed and writes that it takes up too much of his precious time, which he considers not to have. He uses tools in his speech in the latter part of his article, reminding me of mainstream and cancel culture using words looking down on a bunch of lunatics, or Conspiracy Theorists Nerds.

Is that really necessary ? Are we just a bunch of followers who just follow anything the alt-media shoots into the sky ? Is it that simple ? Do you always go the straight way in everything you do, knowing that you do it all right ?


Researchers who de-emphasize the germ theory bring a lot of good points and food for thought, but when they go to the point of nitpicking SARS-CoV2 to the extent that they come across as if they're denying the very existence of the virus, they discredit their own research. Shooting oneself in the foot through what looks like 101 cosmic cointelpro that works through unconscious agents will only give ammunition to those defending the exclusivity of the germ theory. People will not stand a chance at discerning the truth if they don't put their sacred cows out to pasture. That goes both ways, those who defend terrain theories and those who defend germ theories, and to each one their due. Perhaps it will help to have the question in mind - am I defending this global farce, even indirectly, by holding on to this view?

Makes me really value and appreciate those who work toward self-knowledge, for a true becoming.

Beautiful written, in which you @Gaby say "Researchers who de-emphasize the germ theory bring a lot of good points and food for thought...) Then of course there is a but.

I believe 'nitpicking' on the SARS-CoV-2 virus is vital (I think of scrutinizing more, than "nitpicking", to be honest) Is that wrong ? Who is setting the answers to be final ? Where is the convincing status coming from ?

This Subject does of course - I may add - a latent danger of becoming a sort of "love-bite" or "obsession"; a dark hole which swallows people's energy, in order to take away the focus from what happens in the dark. From an energetic point of view. Going all the way to deny SARs-CoV-2's existence... is a bit too much - because we may not even be ready for what that really means, or looks like. (You can still have a virus - but is it all what they say it is ? Why ? Because people get ill ? I don't think it is that straight-lined simple.


Each extreme "consensus" - can make a ship potentially sink.

We may not yet be ready, to dig into the consequence of exploring deeply into the Germ vs Terrain Theory territory (due to the massive domination of Germ Theory in the vast medical establishment for over 130+ years. Vs. the young awakening senses of Terrain Theory. Pretty fundamental stuff after all. And no answers are in truth that final or "already set in stone". In each Theory - virus, exosomes, extracellular vesicles - different significance has been attached to ! That does mean something - the question is - what does it mean ? You will get different results on each side.


Who goes wrong(ish) ?

That should not be equalized to when you @Gaby say, "people will not stand a chance to discern". But that can happen on both sides of the coin, no ?

Do you @Niall, discern ? Do you @Gabi, discern ?

Do I ? Does any us in truth - in this matter - really fully, and always discern ? To understand and fully access the total complexity involved in the whole virus & SARS-Cov-2 to be able to determine the existence of a virus. Have we already figured the facts out, then? And now it is suggested by a terminology who goes towards appreciated self-knowledge, and who goes into the blind ?

There isn't much leeway, is there ? Why is that ?

It is good to point out the danger of deception - absolutely ! But it does not automatically define who goes 'hoops' slipping down the drain, and who does not.


We all can have the potential of sliding at times.

Like I said before - I keep the doors open to BOTH SIDES in the matter of a SARS-CoV-2 existence. I personally have to. As well the need to be critical - because at this stage, I consider that there are vital reasons for it - and those are not just taken out of the blue, or just based on some garbage in, garbage out material.

I also need to feel humbleness in the process - which reminds me, aligning towards the center, between the opposites - and I love doing my best in that regard. It is something I call into my life, at least every day, like a person who does meditation. It does not automatically confine me into the category or immediate danger of "not being able to discern".

I am aware of cosmic forces play a roll - which love to take the opportunity to enhance (=dumb down) if one is or get caught in a mind-trap. So the process goes though oneself, so to speak. But isn't that also one of the major reasons why people have found their way to the Cassiopaean Family (forum) - in order to learn to snap out of it, to discern - and that process is usually is done though lessons.


Is that process of learning a straight line ? Of course not !


For most people who are into learning the deeper aspects of life, love, universe and spirit, insight and knowledge - that is one hell of a complex process. But we know this. I read what forum members write here, their path though life, which I am humbly allowed to follow in empathy, reading what they wrote... Do we consider ourselves be on the potentially wrong path, because of the "swaying" along the road ?! I don't see it that way.

I ain't loosing hope, determination or joy in the exploration of the SARS-CoV-2 and Corona subject. I secretly also love the criticism @Niall and @Gaby put out so determined - it is stimulating, at time annoying, as it is interesting. As I also feel a bit of fear / tremble a bit; because I feel partially uncomfortable to criticize, because I do not wish my criticism to come out the wrong way.

Ultimately, I feel it is wise to listen to all arguments - and not dismiss them (as I ponder a lot of what everyone writes to the subject of SARS-CoV-2 including here at the Cassiopaean Forum). It does not help with an article (below) bitching towards the end. I wonder if it is wise doing so, in an article - which at the same time claims wanting to set the records straight, why the CDC's document likely has been misinterpret.


He DID made good points more in the beginning of his article - I do realize that it actually might have been how the CDC really reasoned. But then the text goes into bitching against everyone who just couldn't agree with the narrative of that the SARS-CoV-2 doesn't exist - including those who where critical about the test procedures of so called "isolation" and "purification". He used argumentations which reminded me strongly to how mainstream media speaks down about alternative media and people who are aligned with them Like if most people where a bunch of idiots just follow another duck.

But that isn't helping !

I also did read the CDC paper(s) about claimed isolation, both new ones, as well re-reading. Sorry to say, the procedure of how they "isolated" the virus, left a lot to be desired.

A better tone was the article of Ian M Mackay, PhD - at least he made his points, and I respect him for that, even if there are too, some areas of criticism from my side. He makes however valid points from his perspective, and does so with good manners. And for that I respect him.



Koch's Postulates - oh, you mean the Old Dinosaur ?

In the past 24 hours, I have gone even deeper - on both sides of the arguments - and to be really honest; both sides do have a lot of valid points regarding SARS-CoV-2.

But also errors.

What I do not understand from you @Niall, is that you dismiss Koch's postulates like that is some old dinosaur stuff. Yes, science has gone wayyyy beyond that - everyone knows that ! Koch's postulates may be old - but they are brilliant guidelines, which also includes moral and discipline over the job ! Something today's mainstream science don't care much about, only shining light on the goodies side. Especially the CDC with their history is, mildly spoken, somewhat a dualistic entity. I do care about, to view, to listen, to scrutinize, to ask questions, to criticize ! For good reasons - we need more of that in today's science, with the accelerating corruption that has become evident.

Why do I have to remind you of the importance ?

Science has found a super darling called PCR, which is an excellent tool for DNA, but very poor for RNA - due to the many traps that come with PCR technology by design. (The inventor Kary Mullis was very explicit about those many issues !) Not to mention how easy it is to tinker with PCR at many levels.

One single molecule that does not belong in the desired purified sample - and your PCR test results is.... useless.

PCR technology has not only opened the door for fantastic forensic, an investigative tool for tiny genetic fragments, but also opened the door for Pandoras Box, by declaring it the "New Golden Standard". Claiming to find whole virus entities with it (which it can't) - brings problems in the analysis and validation of results. It is a "standard" which isn't much of a standard if you consider, that none truly exists for PCR !

Shall we call it a "very, very flexible tool" perhaps ?

How does that fit into the SARS-CoV-2 virus theme and statements of facts ?
 

XPan

Jedi Council Member
Sars-Cov-2 shares 91.5 per cent of its genetic code with the virus discovered in the bats in Thailand.

I often wondered about such genetic comparisons :wow:

When something is let's say 82% or 91.5% close to another genome. What does that even mean exactly ?
Well, Chimps genetic code is 96% that of the human genetic code.

That doesn't make us chimps, or does it ?
 
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