David Bowie Dead at 69

Hi Beherenow,

Apologies, I meant to say that even though he was super famous, he didn't touch all lives. I for one didn't know him or his music. However, I understand he is a famous pioneer as his death has been on the radio waves where they spoke quite a bit about him and his work.
 
Very interesting thread ,, ( thank you all for it ! )
i was a Fan ( i am 61 )
till about 1990 when i went all in for Reggae
and even then only the older material ,,,,,
after 1990 Reggae went very digital ( Dancehall style )
( some of that is economical , , , cheaper with electronics than paying a Band )

tying to understand the Last work of David Bowie
" Blackstar " i just don't get it .. may have to listen to it more ?
 
Hi Beherenow,

Apologies, I meant to say that even though he was super famous, he didn't touch all lives. I for one didn't know him or his music. However, I understand he is a famous pioneer as his death has been on the radio waves where they spoke quite a bit about him and his work.
Click to expand...

No need to apologize Luke, it just made me go :huh:....what you said above clears it up. Thanks.

OK, maybe I'm painting with a wide brush, but my point is just that being a great musician or artist doesn't have much bearing if any on the person's character. They become 'idols' solely based on their talent/popularity, often even in spite of their public actions.
Click to expand...

..Good point, I used to think really talented people always had a properly functioning emotional center, but after meeting and playing with some very technically excellent players I had to scrap that silly idea. Like so many things that can touch you deeply,they can still be produced mechanically, often by someone with very little conscience.
Q: (Galatea) So, if people like anarchy music about hating the government and law, then they're gonna stir up some trouble?

(L) I dunno. Maybe they would track somebody like that and think that they could turn that person to their own uses.

(Perceval) They said there are some types of music that are listened to by certain types of people... Certain types of emo music or whatever that certain types of young people listen to, like outsiders or loners and that kind of thing, and those people could be tracked as candidates for "use"...
Click to expand...

I think the tracking thing is used both ways...not just for "use" but also to know the people of conscience who might stand up against them.

Sorry, I went off topic a bit. Thanks
 
Source: _http://www.nltimes.nl/2016/01/13/video-utrechts-dom-tower-plays-bowies-space-oddity/

Video: Utrecht’s Dom tower plays Bowie’s “Space Oddity”

Posted on Jan 13, 2016 by Janene Pieters

Dom-Tower-of-Utrecht.jpg

Dom Tower of Utrecht / Wikipedia

Utrecht decided to pay tribute to singer David Bowie after his death by having city carillonneur Malgosia Fiebig play hit song Space Oddity on the Dom tower’s bells.

Utrecht resident and Bowie fan Marchal Miller heard the ode and rushed out to record it. He posted the video on Facebook. “Then I heard my phone ping and saw that nine people already shared the video and a heaps of like”, he said to RTV Utrecht. He then decided to make the video public so that everyone can enjoy it.

By 11:15 a.m. on Wednesday the video had 1.2 million views and 30,211 shares.

http://tinyurl.com/z97gxg3
Click to expand...

653801_480.jpg

Tribute to David Bowie by carillonneur Malgosia Fiebig very popular.
Photo: Toerisme Utrecht

She will be playing more Bowie songs on Saturday. (Source)
 
I liked a lot of Bowie's songs (soul Love, Life on Mars, under pressure, five years) but never idolized him. Much of his work is ludicrous pop, and a lot of the rest, if perceptive and truthful, still speaks from a slightly dissociative view (whether positive or negative, I can't tell).

I love the Beatles. I remember feeling sad when George Harrison died, but after rampant exposure to "today's hits," Bowie's death hits me at a deeper level. Likely it's just because I'm older now, and I'm experiencing the "kids these days don't know real music" thing. Just the same, an entire generation already has no idea who Bowie was. At the same time, their own musical tastes are less sophisticated than a man wearing lipstick singing about outer space. And that's some heavy food for thought.

It still alarms me how few of the people that I work with know the words to their "favorite" songs. Hear no evil, I suppose. Our culture is rattling chains big time.
 
I never was a big fan, but appreciated some of David Bowie's older songs, like Space Oddity, Life on Mars and Starman. It was disappointing to read about his sexual crimes, which i wasn't aware until after his death. That G's quote about artists which AI posted is indeed often quite fitting.

I listened and watched the 'Blackstar' few months ago, and my first impression was that the music video was a bit off and strange. Maybe this interview with music video director Johan Rench explains this impression:

[Q] Any specific images come to mind? [interviewer asking about the ideas behind the music video]

[A] What do you mean?

[Q] I’m thinking of [British occult legend] Aleister Crowley who David references in “Quicksand” on Hunky Dory. The pentagram blackstar on the prayer book is Bowie “immersed in Crowley’s uniform of imagery.”

[A] Well, I’m a huge Crowley fan, I’ve always been. I tried to make a movie on his life a few years ago but we didn’t manage to put it together. I love Crowley for being an audacious man at certain point in time. I think he’s greatly misunderstood. He was a good guy, but he was portrayed as an evil man and he wasn’t. He loved the idea of being in an escapist, magical paradigm and tried to evoke that shit. And obviously he didn’t succeed because that shit doesn’t exist, really, other then in here. [Renck points to his head]
Click to expand...
 
solarmind said:
Bowie definitely left legacy and influence on humanity in positive creative way which is bigger than anything that is here in this topic observed, and at the end of the day, what might or might not even be objective fact. His work and his life leaded many of us here, inspired many of us to be free, truth loving, creative, so there must be something good about hm, and doing this black and white kind of search for imperfection in a life of a man who deliberately exposed his imperfection to the humanity, in order to publicly fight with his demons to become a better man, is not productive at all .... we can't really put a sticker on him on a way, let me paraphrase some of the speculation here: "he was famous it must be because he was psychopath" ... hey common ... he was famous because he was able to touch so many various minds and hearts, that we can even think on him as a perfect example of human "machine" who was just experimenting whole his life with all this personalities that where living within him, on his own specific way, through music and visual art ... I think it will be much constructive and useful for the universe, to focus on his work, that was major reason for his life on earth, as from there we can learn a lot about things that were occupying not just him, but also Gurdjieff, Tesla and many other mans that we tend to glorify, but who also had a dark side of their minds ...
Click to expand...
Hi solarmind,

I'm not sure if you were referring to me, but I think you might see some judgments that weren't there in some posts. For instance, that he did a few bad things, that isn't saying that he was a psychopath, but it is merely an observation on its own.

And for my part, to be clear, my opinion has not changed, maybe for years even. He is likable and sort of weird, usually respectable and has some good songs - his lyrics seem a bit random, but also well-written for their universal appeal. Blackstar is strange, I haven't changed on that either, but then it is meant to be, probably because Bowie views "Blackstar" as something strange or something to be in conflict with. I don't think or ever thought he is in league with psychopaths or anything. I also don't assume he knows or thinks the things I do, so I went straight to him, or his wiki page, to try and find out what meaning he might put in his own work.
 
Aragorn said:
To be honest, I've never liked David Bowie's music or saw anything exceptional in him. As I was younger, since everyone was fussing about him, I tried to give his music a chance by listening through a couple of his records. But I never "got it", whatever others thought was so brilliant. His music appeared to me as sophisticated noise, nothing else.
Click to expand...

I have had the same experience, except for really liking his singing voice on the song "Putting out fire" from Cat People. He always came across to me as mainly occupied with the distractions and superficialities of life, but I aknowledge that lots of people I respect have found great beauty in his music.
 
diligence said:
solarmind said:
Bowie definitely left legacy and influence on humanity in positive creative way which is bigger than anything that is here in this topic observed, and at the end of the day, what might or might not even be objective fact. His work and his life leaded many of us here, inspired many of us to be free, truth loving, creative, so there must be something good about hm, and doing this black and white kind of search for imperfection in a life of a man who deliberately exposed his imperfection to the humanity, in order to publicly fight with his demons to become a better man, is not productive at all .... we can't really put a sticker on him on a way, let me paraphrase some of the speculation here: "he was famous it must be because he was psychopath" ... hey common ... he was famous because he was able to touch so many various minds and hearts, that we can even think on him as a perfect example of human "machine" who was just experimenting whole his life with all this personalities that where living within him, on his own specific way, through music and visual art ... I think it will be much constructive and useful for the universe, to focus on his work, that was major reason for his life on earth, as from there we can learn a lot about things that were occupying not just him, but also Gurdjieff, Tesla and many other mans that we tend to glorify, but who also had a dark side of their minds ...
Click to expand...
Hi solarmind,

I'm not sure if you were referring to me, but I think you might see some judgments that weren't there in some posts. For instance, that he did a few bad things, that isn't saying that he was a psychopath, but it is merely an observation on its own.

And for my part, to be clear, my opinion has not changed, maybe for years even. He is likable and sort of weird, usually respectable and has some good songs - his lyrics seem a bit random, but also well-written for their universal appeal. Blackstar is strange, I haven't changed on that either, but then it is meant to be, probably because Bowie views "Blackstar" as something strange or something to be in conflict with. I don't think or ever thought he is in league with psychopaths or anything. I also don't assume he knows or thinks the things I do, so I went straight to him, or his wiki page, to try and find out what meaning he might put in his own work.
Click to expand...

hey, no not particularly to your post, but sort of I got a feeling that discussion went towards trowing stones to a man who was weirdo, but quite interesting, and definitely not a stupid man. More I am thinking about him in this context of knowing things from different perspective, and remembering how C's said that 80s were more into programing people through music etc ... and he and Laure Anderson and Peter Gabriel and all that artists were actually standing on the other side ... or maybe not??? ... I am kind of getting impression of him, and some of his friends artists of that generation, and I get a chance to know some in person, that maybe they can be observed as a kind of a wanderers, a humans who has a strong attachment to outwordly, but have no idea how and for what they got that "talent" ... and through their life and work they are kind of "channeling" a new language that can evoke building of a higher centers in man without direct knowledge of occult of spiritual teachings ... for example I am sure that some how his work did a deep impression on me, and do a significant change in my perception of reality that leaded me here, to a place where I can get answers, while with for example with his art I was just getting some kind of "understanding" that there is something more around life than we can see ...

any way I think he is more interesting to be observed from this point, than through his youngster buzzing through life, where he was just as anyone else experimenting with things offered on the street ...

and if you are still interested to a "Black Star" video symbolism, I found one interesting explanation:

_https://kylebstiff.wordpress.com/myth-myth-myth/david-bowies-blackstar-possible-occult-interpretations/

as one artist by my self, I know that we can get into some states of mind that can lead us to "move the mountains" and produce work that we are amazed with it on a strange level, almost like creating a new separate life of its own that is partly related to us! ... it is strange indeed ... maybe like "channeling" ... so it will be more interesting to see if he was maybe through his life and work "translating of channeling" some new perspectives, some new ways of communicating a big life dramas that we are facing now, and he was singing about them 40 years ago ... and he didn't stop until his last breath
 
I like a few of his songs, like "Absolute Beginners". I was surprised at the amount of various degrees of grief and loss being expressed on his death coming up on my Facebook. The loss and emotional effect many people are feeling is genuine I think. Some people go a bit over the top, suggesting he was actually some kind of "starman" and not merely a regular creative, talented, artistic human being. Another musician once described being famous as something like: a lot of people think they know you, but you don't know them.

I had a look at some of the recent Black Star video. His eyes are bandaged and have little widely-spaced black dots, making him look like a monster. In real life, Bowie's eyes were unusual in appearance. The unusual appearance may have contributed to his being considered as having some kind of "ethereal" or other-worldly quality. A more prosaic explanation is that his left pupil was permanently dilated, due to a fight early in his life when the muscles of the iris were scratched by a fingernail and damaged. This made the muscles unable to retract the iris. I think Bowie came across to many people as a charming and charismatic persona. Maybe an archetypal comparison could be made to the Pied Piper of Hamelin, leading the children away with his flute to some promised land?
 
I'm not invested one way or another on Bowie. But regardless of the truth of the accusations brought against him, there's a bunch of assumptions and projections in your post here, solarmind.

solarmind said:
Bowie definitely left legacy and influence on humanity in positive creative way which is bigger than anything that is here in this topic observed, and at the end of the day, what might or might not even be objective fact. His work and his life leaded many of us here, inspired many of us to be free, truth loving, creative, so there must be something good about hm,
Click to expand...

The conclusion doesn't follow from the premises. A negative influence can have a positive effect depending on the individual. For example, Lobaczewski describes the process of 'critical correction', where pathological material can be interpreted in positive ways that are not present in the original source. A really simple example, someone reads Marx and concludes: sharing is good! I'm not saying this is for sure the case with Bowie, just that it would make more sense to be more open to alternate possibilities, and less rigid in your 'certainties'.

and doing this black and white kind of search for imperfection in a life of a man who deliberately exposed his imperfection to the humanity, in order to publicly fight with his demons to become a better man, is not productive at all ....
Click to expand...

This is an assumption. It's possible he did this to "publicly fight his demons" and become a better man, but we do not know for sure. Some people present their 'negative side' to the world not to become better people, but just because they have no inhibitions. Again, I don't know if this was the case or not with Bowie. Maybe you have some interviews or writings of his that would help support your assessment.

we can't really put a sticker on him on a way, let me paraphrase some of the speculation here: "he was famous it must be because he was psychopath" ...
Click to expand...

No one on this thread called him a psychopath.

hey common ... he was famous because he was able to touch so many various minds and hearts, that we can even think on him as a perfect example of human "machine" who was just experimenting whole his life with all this personalities that where living within him, on his own specific way, through music and visual art ... I think it will be much constructive and useful for the universe, to focus on his work, that was major reason for his life on earth, as from there we can learn a lot about things that were occupying not just him, but also Gurdjieff, Tesla and many other mans that we tend to glorify, but who also had a dark side of their minds ...
Click to expand...

I was never a huge Bowie fan, so I'm only familiar with some of his hits (and I really like his Ziggy Stardust album). Maybe you could provide some examples from his work showing its depth?
 
Attended one of his shows in Montreal in the 1970's. He was not a favorite, yet he put on a good show and had a number of popular hits over the years. In the concert, the first thing remembered was a film that was playing in the background, and on the film were strange scenes (like the video featured previously above) One of the first posts here was when Casper mentions him playing the role of Tesla, and I thought he had done a good representation of what one could imagine Tesla to be like in that film. Some may also remember his role as Lawrence, in the film 'Merry Christmas Mr. Lawrence' (1983).

Here is a short clip.

 
I wonder how much his diet played a part? Maybe it's just me, but the last pictures of him... he didn't look very well. I think he was probably a very private person who didn't want anyone to know he was sick. It was surprising when we heard he died.
 
solarmind said:
and if you are still interested to a "Black Star" video symbolism, I found one interesting explanation:

_https://kylebstiff.wordpress.com/myth-myth-myth/david-bowies-blackstar-possible-occult-interpretations/
Click to expand...
The gnostic interpretation fits the song quite well, and it reminds me of this article on the front page now: http://www.sott.net/article/310215-Kindling-the-divine-spark-within-you

Bowie had made me think his understanding of what religion is went no deeper than Catholicism and surface Buddhism, but the song may be an indication of him having gone a few different directions since. (Those directions could include the likes of Crowley, though.)

It may be best to think of him as another person learning.
 
diligence said:
It may be best to think of him as another person learning.
Click to expand...

yea I think so ...

so to answer also to Approaching Infinity, yes all that can be also negative and manipulative ... I am not up to advocate his positivity, and analyze his work to defend something ... but I am still with the opinion that his work is more interesting than his sexual life, and if there is a broader interest within a group, to go in depth through his art, to see how it fits his personality, and is there something we can learn from, why not? Otherwise I leave it to each who is interested to do his research, and come to their own conclusions, and if want to share with others, I might or might not participate ... but to dig deep into his life and work, is a work for 10 years, and I am not that much trilled by him to give him 10 years of my life ;) ... I think he gave enough food for thoughts and ears that can live happily in the world of unspoken and non analyzed metaphors ... as it is not also good to scrap everything through the writings of our clumsy rational mind ... we can also receive valuable information by means that we cant explain through language and writings ...

any way, interesting is to see how he just rising the heat with his last album, opening up topics , that are for most of the people and his fans still unknown territory ... so if people will start to research more around symbols he used, maybe some can progress in their individual positive growth, what is at the end a good reflection of his legacy ... but sure some can chose opposite ... and it is a nice thing about his work, that he is not imposing anything to anyone, he is just doing his thing .. and using symbols instead of directly formulating a statement, already said that he by himself was open to interpretation, learning, possible personal misunderstanding etc . ... so if his work bring one individual to be aware of choice is a huuuge step forward, comparing to the state of a sleep mood ...

any way I really love this song, and I can't explain why .... so for me it will be more interesting to do my personal reflection, what is here that makes me feel positive, when it is, as explained officially, actually a song about suicide of his step brother ... ?!

 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Trending content

Back
Top Bottom