FORGIVENESS TO ONESELF

In order to forgive himself, one needs to remember all the time his/her state before the work and from the moment of intent to gain real knowledge.

It is essential to take into consideration that things couldn't be done differently before a conscious decision to remind itself of the default state of each individual in 3D is the STS predator's mind

And just reading the other threads this morning, I think here is a nice explanation by Laura of the only path one can take to be humble and fulfilled with forgiving itself - Session 26 February 2022
 
I am realising today that any work on oneself needs to start with an understanding that one's need to forgive oneself first. All is just lessons.
Holding memory and regrets of things we could have done differently, even better can only stop you from growing and learning...
If only I could hold on to this truth, I made mine, and get strength in my everyday life!
Looking at the sky, watching the dogs play, listening to people around having fun, even digging my hands in the earth and grow a garden are actions so calming to me and help me ground myself when the feeling of loosing the inside battle get too strong.

Thank You for initiating this thread and for sharing! 🙏🤗

What you so aptly expressed, somehow got me to associate to something the Universe has spoken to me on several occasions over the years, words I would like to share: - "Don't be so hard on yourself...!" (Those exact words, in English)

Every time these words appeared in my mind, they were felt in my heart, and made me stop and reflect on the situation I found myself in, and made me look at how the situation at hand was related to the meaning of "don't be so hard on yourself".

I know well why I got these words whispered to my heart. They mean I must not punish myself eternally for my sins (from this life and past lives), to put it in plain wording. The school of Life is where we are studying, and the lessons given offer reconciliation, and opportunities to rectify imbalances we have caused others, and ourselves.

The more conscious one becomes, the more one may realise the graveness of past sins. This realisation can indeed be causing great inner anguish, sadness, mourning - well, all sorts of emotions really. Whatever emotions arise when we have put ourselves in the light of Truth, it is important not to shun these feelings, but to study them. To understand what they may be reflecting, their true context. But not to get stuck in them. And not to be repeating and returning to them like dogs returning to their vomit, just for the sake ot if.

We have all, at some point, caused other souls great trauma. By inflicting harm to others, we inflicted trauma also to ourselves. All because we are One!

Your pain is my pain. If I cause you pain, your pain is also given to me, as a result.

We share the pain we have caused each other. If I cause others pain, but use free will to refuse to share the burden, it causes imbalance and further trauma.

We should nourish others just like we nourish ourselves.

The more we trigger soul memories of the imbalances we have been the cause of in other lives, these memories may indeed be painful to relive. It is, however, an opportunity we get to understand how we have expanded our consciousness - it becomes an educational frame of reference! - by being given this memory, or set of memories. In that there is in this an offer to explore what we have learnt. It is a chance to debrief from soul traumatic circumstances.

We are here to learn, learning is fun! And everything is lessons! And for every little lesson, or set of lessons, that we have truly absorbed and learnt, we adventurously move on from there. We do not keep on inflicting self-harm. This is only resulting in unnecessary self-restraint.

We are forgiven. Who is it that forgives us?

For the Universe/The Cosmic Mind/our higher self, it's sufficient enough of us to become aware of our past (or present) mistakes, why they happened, to shed light on the hidden context (that's why we are doing the Work!), to understand how to put our insights in relation to the higher spiritual order. The self-punitive behaviour may in some instances be a necessary reminder, a lesson in itself. But most often to punish ourselves, although we already well understand our failings, is an action all coloured with Service To Self, and could actually also be enhanced by contributing STS forces, who most often take the pleasure of indulging in misery. And if we get stuck in this punitive mindset about ourselves, it hampers growth. In doing so, we keep, or are being kept, wandering in circles. Sometimes in life after life, until something must occur which breaks the spell of this vicious circle.

To quote The Cassiopaeans:

"Love is Light is Knowledge. Love makes no sense when common definitions are used as they are in your environment. To love you must know. And to know is to have light. And to have light is to love. And to have knowledge is to love."

The Cosmic Mind loves all, because it knows all. We are its constituents. We are here because of karma. When we cause imbalance, we must put things right, because we are this integral part of the universe. The universe is at all times striving at balancing all of its parts. Above all - the soul consciousnesses that we are! - we aspire to understand why and how this imbalance could happen, in order not to repeat it, or not to fall into the same traps again.

It is my experience of life, that even if we do not remember why we incarnated, we will meet our shortcomings in the lessons we are being served with from life. No need to worry about past lives, if you cannot recall any, or if you do not have a clue what you did in past (or future) lives. You will encounter the gist of the imbalance you caused by being confronted with people and situations while walking along this life path.

The process is reciprocative, because you fulfill the same function of reminding others about their lessons, on their paths, whenever paths cross.

When we have learnt, we have gained knowledge, by knowledge we expand our common light and love.

When we have found knowledge, i e love, we are forgiven, and do not feel inclined towards causing self-harm. If we have knowledge, that is we understand the context of our predicaments, but still want to cause self-harm - which self-punishment like feeling unable to forgive oneself is! - means we still have something unresolved to be looking closer at.

The self-harm because of feeling shame about what we have done, may linger as a phantom reflex in our behaviour, or mind, even after we have forgiven and reconciliated with ourselves. And then the reason must be adressed why this behaviour, or remnants of it, is still active, in spite of the fact that the cause is healed. Are we under some unknown influence, which must be brought to light, or something else? When we are fully healed, all tendencies towards inflicting harm on ourselves comes to rest.

I have seen these self-punitive tendencies in many fellow incarnated souls.

Some people were born with heavy karma to resolve, but they proceed many years in life without understanding where this vague sense of having done something bad, this unexplicable feeling of shame, pain etc., from where it springs, not knowing that it is soul memories, that these emotions are in fact reminders to ourselves not to forget why we are here. We are here to resolve, whatever it is we were set to come here to resolve.

There comes a moment where one comes to term with having done atrocities, in this life or other lives. But even so, one should not punish oneself for every little wrongdoing. After all we live in an environment where we are constantly encouraged to do wrong. Here we are fallible in the extreme! And if we fail at times, we must forgive ourselves. And if we fail again, acknowledge that we may now have become aware of this failure, this "flaw", to be a repeating pattern. This invites us to explore the bigger picture why this wrongdoing of ours at all happened so many times, thus rectifying the imbalance, gaining knowledge into its psychology.

But then, to go on from having understood, having processed, having integrated into knowledge, into light and love, and still feeling bad, or punishing ourselves for at all having done something wrong, is simply contraproductive, from the perspective of our higher frequency.

One must reconcile, make peace, and allow for the internal changes that this transformative process offers. But not only forgive ourselves and our own mistakes, but above all forgive others for theirs! One cannot punish others forever, not even for many incarnations! 😜 Just like we cannot go on punishing ourselves for too many incarnations.

When we have learnt our lesson, we have learnt it!

Because, if in the end we still find it hard to forgive ourselves, or others, it proves we did not fully follow through in our learning. It may imply that our learning was (in part) superficial, and that we shunned the root cause. The root cause is always the most interesting part! And perhaps the most difficult part of the lesson to ascertain.

There has to be a chosen, conscious moment in time where one makes peace with one's darkness. This moment must rest on full intent and awareness in the full and unfaltering light of truth.

And then, if one goes on from there, only to make new, or other grave mistakes, is another story (or some hidden, unresolved part of the same story? It's for you to find out!). But still, what is required is self observation to understand the underlying motives of our actions, whether these actions be within ourselves or outside of ourselves (or both).

And to become aware of other contributing factors, like hidden influences, which enhances that which lies unresolved within us, and of which we are not entirely aware. Our blind spots. And once we have found them out, not to create new ones, but to invite change and transformation, expansion of being, in take their place!

Forgiveness is the great redeemer. To many the notion of "forgiveness" in practice becomes an "abstract" concept, a social construct, perhaps even something mechanical, an empty word, with no further implications.

Thus, to forgive, is a healthy lesson for all of us. 😍
 
Self-Remembering or focusing on who you truly are in meditation and then being present in the body in the here and now helps a lot too. I realize more and more that it is really the core of the Work, so to speak.

It is not any destination in the outside world that ultimately matters, but building that inner connection and living from that place of 'being truly me'. Making the choice that Self-Remembering or Self-Presence is more important than anything else I do. Intending it no matter what.
Remembering ........to self remember .......and then to have self observation. Bringing Attention to the physical/the body is all that we have to begin. The way of the sly man.....
 
We are here as a "correction" and maybe we arrived with little to fix in comparison to our general environment, so in turn we have had to 'break' many things; relationships, trust, love, etc in order so that we may eventually once again 'correct' ourselves at a deeper level.

Yesterday I came across this quote on bjorn's profile and it comes close to what I'm thinking: The first to apologize is the bravest. The first to forgive is the strongest. The first to forget is the happiest.

The first to apologize is the bravest:
Sometimes because of ego one feels that he deserves an apology, sometimes because it is the healthy and rational option to establish a successful communication. Recognize what was done, there are people who cannot, they do not know how to apologize and their way of doing it is to appear and act as if nothing has happened, the problem of doing it, is to show vulnerability. How to forgive when you feel that thorn that if the other person does not recognize his faults? he/she will fall into the same for more good intentions want to heal the relationship (at whatever level).

The first to forgive is the strongest: sometimes, if the circumstances were not so drastic, by very annoying they were, one could forgive quickly, after assessing the situation in a way cold without the intervention of emotions, but when the objective evidence about the other person and that somehow one had helped to magnify, because one must know the percentage in which helped to make things worse and this is where always is present the regret, "I should not have said this or done that, it was because of ego and emotion of the moment "it's like recognizing the lack of one and the other person and then, "OK, there is room to forgive."

The first to forget is the happiest: I think it's the hardest part when the evidence proves otherwise and there isn't a conversation with all the cards on the table.

I can give several opportunities and always leave the doors open, but if the other person has problems in terms of social skills and thus not recognize their part, what do you do? would you adapt to this lack of social ability of the person to submit yourself to another test to see if what he cannot say with words is present in actions? from that point, I see not only myself, but also the other person's burden and the clumsy attempt to fix something.

Would they give themselves the opportunity to do so even when the evidence tells them they should have their alarms on?

i can't go back, and sometimes because of the knowledge I have now, the person I am now, I wouldn't want to go back to change things."
Yes, indeed. I understand that feeling. And there's no remorse because you're really facing the lie in you and being true to you objectively. You really know that and that's when I remember what Cass referred to "there is no regret in the death of an illusion" and surely that is something you should celebrate as it has already "died" and learned from it. It is the point of no return in which some suffer more for the image they have left to their peers, the "past that haunts" and for which you must know how to forgive yourself, no one else will understand it but yourself, you can not go back to being the zombie that everyone accepted, among other things for which it is recognized that they were part of the "you" of that moment and necessary to move forward in something "new".
 
"The first to apologize is the bravest. The first to forgive is the strongest. The first to forget is the happiest" @Alma.Innovadora
I understand the explanation... but it seems that all the reflexions are directed towards the other person, to the antagonist, to outside of oneself, as if to apologize, forgive and forget, all those involve the other's input.

" How to forgive when you feel that thorn that if the other person does not recognize his faults? he/she will fall into the same for more good intentions want to heal the relationship (at whatever level)".
IMO forgive has nothing to do with the other person (their feeling, their understanding of the situation), it comes from you and the decision is your own.

"I should not have said this or done that, it was because of ego and emotion of the moment "it's like recognizing the lack of one and the other person and then, "OK, there is room to forgive."
I agree when it comes to questioning oneself.

"I can give several opportunities and always leave the doors open, but if the other person has problems in terms of social skills and thus not recognize their part, what do you do? would you adapt to this lack of social ability of the person to submit yourself to another test to see if what he cannot say with words is present in actions?"
IMO once again too much energy is allocated to the other person (maturity ...ect) and one forgets about oneself.
 
The other Serenity Prayer

God, grant me the serenity
to stop beating myself up
for not doing things perfectly,
the courage to forgive myself,
because I'm working on doing things better,
and the wisdom to know that You already love me,
just the way i am.

Eleanor Brownn
 
For the Universe/The Cosmic Mind/our higher self, it's sufficient enough of us to become aware of our past (or present) mistakes, why they happened, to shed light on the hidden context (that's why we are doing the Work!), to understand how to put our insights in relation to the higher spiritual order. The self-punitive behaviour may in some instances be a necessary reminder, a lesson in itself. But most often to punish ourselves, although we already well understand our failings, is an action all coloured with Service To Self, and could actually also be enhanced by contributing STS forces, who most often take the pleasure of indulging in misery. And if we get stuck in this punitive mindset about ourselves, it hampers growth. In doing so, we keep, or are being kept, wandering in circles. Sometimes in life after life, until something must occur which breaks the spell of this vicious circle.

Thank you for bringing this material, it was what was missing.

IMO once again too much energy is allocated to the other person (maturity ...ect) and one forgets about oneself.

Thank you very much! I'm getting a little closer now.

You will encounter the gist of the imbalance you caused by being confronted with people and situations while walking along this life path. The process is reciprocative, because you fulfill the same function of reminding others about their lessons, on their paths, whenever paths cross.

The self-harm because of feeling shame about what we have done, may linger as a phantom reflex in our behaviour, or mind, even after we have forgiven and reconciliated with ourselves. And then the reason must be adressed why this behaviour, or remnants of it, is still active, in spite of the fact that the cause is healed. Are we under some unknown influence, which must be brought to light, or something else?

Here is my confusion and the easy trap of falling into the vicious cycle. In the process that I am believing that I am trying to be reciprocal, I am focusing distortedly on the other person so that I can then allow myself what to do or what not to do. I am surrendering my freedom of choice too... Interesting. That feeling of responsibility for something I didn't have has just dissipated, thank you very much.
 
Forgiving yourself is how you will be better able to help others, how can you help others if you cant even help/forgive yourself? Everyone makes mistakes but thinking about your past mistakes and genuinely feeling bad and forgiving yourself and the person you wronged is a good start. Some people will do wrong onto others and not feel bad at all because they think that others deserve it, this is how some people fall into a cycle of hate and sorrow. The ego is a big obstacle and wants to steer you onto the path that is easy, because that path that is right requires more effort. Forgiving yourself also recognizes your shadow self thus making it easier to make amends to yourself and others.
 
Today, my elder daughter taught me how to deal with obnoxious people and why 'giving the other cheek' in fact, is a weapon against negative energy build-up. She said that one can expect that people can be real jerks, but what you give in exchange with them, is for the entire Universe.
Forgiveness to yourself requires a lot of work and reparation in terms of giving more work and energy to the Universe.
 
"The first to apologize is the bravest. The first to forgive is the strongest. The first to forget is the happiest" @Alma.Innovadora
I understand the explanation... but it seems that all the reflexions are directed towards the other person, to the antagonist, to outside of oneself, as if to apologize, forgive and forget, all those involve the other's input.

" How to forgive when you feel that thorn that if the other person does not recognize his faults? he/she will fall into the same for more good intentions want to heal the relationship (at whatever level)".
IMO forgive has nothing to do with the other person (their feeling, their understanding of the situation), it comes from you and the decision is your own.

"I should not have said this or done that, it was because of ego and emotion of the moment "it's like recognizing the lack of one and the other person and then, "OK, there is room to forgive."
I agree when it comes to questioning oneself.

"I can give several opportunities and always leave the doors open, but if the other person has problems in terms of social skills and thus not recognize their part, what do you do? would you adapt to this lack of social ability of the person to submit yourself to another test to see if what he cannot say with words is present in actions?"
IMO once again too much energy is allocated to the other person (maturity ...ect) and one forgets about oneself.
... and the Universe.
 
Regret can be a two edged sword. If we didn’t regret things, we wouldn’t change our behaviour and we’d be no different from psychopaths.

But it can get out of hand and become pathological. If we are plagued by memories of things we did wrong in the past, and we use them to beat ourselves up, that falls more into the category of what Elan Golomb calls the ‘Negative Introject’ in her book, Trapped in the Mirror.

It’s a form of narcissism (self-focus) that comes from viewing ourselves through the eyes of a judgemental parent figure. We can find ourselves habitually triggering guilt inside ourselves because guilt was part of a cyclical dance we acted out with our parents where they castigated us for doing wrong, and the negative emotions that came when we ‘looked at ourselves’ then triggered a pattern of behaviour and a demeanour from us (repentant, sorrowful, lowly, apologetic, begging, making ourselves invisible, making amends, beating ourselves up, etc. etc.,) which regained the parent’s love and acceptance, training us to switch into those states for rewards.

So when we feel bad about something we did in the past, we should openly ask ourselves why. Are we genuinely remorseful, or are just using the memory as a tool to make ourselves feel bad on purpose, using the memory as the ‘music’ for that old dance of emotional toxicity that we learned as a child.
 
Its necessary to understand the past if its not understood the negative emotion attached to it will remain or the mistake will be repeated. New information might be needed to understand it. Maybe life will provide unpleasant but necessary updates to the world view that makes it possible to view the past in a way that while painful provides insight into the human condition and therefore releases the pain from the experience resulting in hard earned wisdom.
 
"To forgive is NOT to forget!"
(did I just write that? Hey it's a wonderful day get out there and do something that others won't forget)
Once we have forgiven what we feel the universe has dealt us unfairly, we begin to "build back better" - sorry I'm in a cheery mood.
- "C'est la crise, vive la crise!
The crisis has come, thank G.d for the crisis....
 
Je pense qu'il est plus facile de pardonner aux autres qu'à soi même...
J'ai écouté ce matin :
Je dirai ce que j'en ai retenu plus tard mais ce qu'il me reste de pus important c'est qu'il faut se pardonner et se souvenir de notre divinité...

Je pense qu'il est plus facile de pardonner aux autres qu'à soi-même...
J'ai écouté ce matin :
Je dirai ce dont je me suis souvenu plus tard mais la chose la plus importante dont je me souviens est que nous devons nous pardonner et nous souvenir de notre divinité...
 
Self-Remembering or focusing on who you truly are in meditation and then being present in the body in the here and now helps a lot too. I realize more and more that it is really the core of the Work, so to speak.

It is not any destination in the outside world that ultimately matters, but building that inner connection and living from that place of 'being truly me'. Making the choice that Self-Remembering or Self-Presence is more important than anything else I do. Intending it no matter what.
In these lines we find the core of our Work: to ascertain whether we are in reality, in practice living only to fulfill a wish to be a "me", and according to the wish and ulterior motives of whom? Are we a designed "me"? Or are we living with the intent of becoming true and see ourselves for who we truly are?

Are we an illusion? Or are we real? Which constituents of us are illusory? Who are we without the cosmetics of illusion? When we are real, how do we know how to tell this state from illusion? What is it to be real? What does this in fact imply? How do we know? What does "to know" imply"?

We seem already to have an innate frame of reference within us to ascertain the answers to the above queries. But this frame of reference have gotten obscured to us.

In all of our incarnations we are so many different aspects of consciousness, each time trying out different "templates", learning from this what is balance, what is love and true light, and what is the absence of these.

We may in this process ask ourselves how we even got into this adventure in the first place!? An excerpt as a reminder from The Cassiopaeans in this session of 28 August 1999:

Q: Well, this is one of the problems I am dealing with in trying to write this history of mankind. As I understand it, or as I am trying to figure it out from the literature, prior to the 'Fall in Eden,' mankind lived in a 4th density state. Is that correct?

A: Semi/sort of.

Q: Please be more specific.

A: 4th density in another realm, such as time/space continuum, etc.

Q: Okay, so this realm changed, as a part of the cycle; various choices were made: the human race went through the door after the 'gold,' so to speak, and became aligned with the Lizzies after the 'female energy' consorted with the wrong side, so to speak. This is what you have said. This resulted in a number of effects: the breaking up of the DNA, the burning off of the first ten factors of DNA, the separation of the hemispheres of the brain...

A: Only reason for this: you play in the dirt, you're gonna get dirty.

Q: What was the motivating factor for playing in the dirt? What essential thing occurred? You said once that it was 'desire based imbalance.' What was it a desire for?

A: Increased physicality.

Q: What was the objective sought for in this desire for increased physicality?

A: Sensate.

Q: How was sensate experienced so that these beings had an idea that they could get more if they increased their physicality?

A: Not experienced, demonstrated.

Q: Demonstrated how, by who?

A: Do you not know?

Q: It was demonstrated by the Lizzies?

A: Basically.

Q: Demonstrated in what way? Did they say: 'here, try this!' Or did they demonstrate by showing or doing?

A: Closer to the latter.

Q: They were doing, experimenting, playing, and saying: 'look, we are doing this, it's so great, come here and try it?'

A: Not really. More like: "you could have this."

Q: What seemed to be so desirable about this increased physicality when they said 'you can have this?'

A: Use your imagination!

Q: Was there any understanding, or realization of any kind, that increased physicality could be like Osiris lured into his own coffin by Set? That they would then slam the lid shut and nail him in?

A: Obviously, such understanding was lacking.

Q: Sounds like a pretty naive bunch! Does the lack of this understanding reflect a lack of knowledge?

A: Of course. But more, it is desire getting in the way of...

Q: Okay. The 'Fall' occurred. It seems like, and some of the archaeological studies indicate, that for many thousands of years, there was a peaceful existence and a nice agrarian society where the goddess or female creative forces were worshipped. At least, this is what a lot of present-day books are proposing...

A: No. These events took place 309000 years ago, as you measure it. This is when the first prototype of what you call "modern man" was created. The controllers had the bodies ready, they just needed the right soul matrix to agree to "jump in."

Q: So, prior to this time, this prior Edenic state...

A: Was more like 4th density.

Q: But that implies that there was some level of physicality. Was there physicality in the sense of bodies that look like present-day humans?

A: Not quite.

Q: What did these pre-fall...

A: Cannot answer because it is too complex for you to understand.

Q: Does this mean that the are experienced... that the bodies we possibly would move into as 4th density beings, assuming that one does, would also be too complex for us to understand? You are saying that this 'sort of 4th density' pre-Fall state, in terms of the physical bodies, is too complex to understand. If going back to 4th density is anything like coming from 4th density, does that mean that what we would go back to is something that is too complex to understand? This variability of physicality that you have described?

A: Yes.

Q: So, was there any kind of worship of God, or religious activity in this pre-Fall state; this Edenic, 4th density state?

A: No need when one has a clue.

Q: What I am trying to get at here, what I am trying to understand, is the transition from the goddess worship to the god worship; the change from the understanding of cyclical time as expressed in the feminine cycles, and expressed as the goddess; to the concept of linear time, expressed as the masculine principle. It seems to me that these were stages of inversion of concepts which gradually led to the ideas that the Lizzies are imposing on us, and seem to have been working in this direction for millennia - the dominator experience which expresses as: believe in something outside yourself that will save you, otherwise you are damned because the world is gonna end, and you are going to get judged. This is the concept I am trying to deal with here. I am trying to understand what was worshipped. Okay, we had these guys; they fell from Eden, but they were still fairly close to the original concepts, in some terms. Once they jumped into the physical bodies, as you put it, what was their level of conceptualization regarding the universe? Did they still retain some understanding at that point?

A: Kind of like the understanding one has after severe head trauma, vis a vis your normal understanding in your current state.

Q: So, they were traumatized; they may have had bits and pieces of ideas and memories, but they may also have lost a great deal altogether. There may have even been a sort of "coma" state of mankind for many millennia. But, after they woke up, with the bits and pieces floating around in their heads, they may have begun to attempt to piece it all together. So, they started putting it all back together. What was the first thing they put together regarding the cosmos around them?

A: Sex.

Q: What did they decide about sex? I mean, sex was there. They were having sex. Is that it? Or, did they understand the cosmos as sex?

A: More like the former. After all, that is what got you guys in this mess in the first place! Just imagine the sales job if you can: "Look how much fun this is! Want to try it?!? Oops, sorry, we forgot to tell you, you cannot go back!"

Q: I really fail to understand - and I know it is a big issue that has been hinted at and alluded to, and outright claims have been made regarding sex in all religions and mythologies - but I fail to understand the mechanics of how this can be the engineering of a 'fall.' What, precisely, are the mechanics of it? What energy is generated? How is it generated? What is the conceptualization of the misuse of this energy, or the use of the energy?

A: It is simply the introduction of the concept of self-gratification of a physical sort.

Q: On many occasions you have said that the ideal thing is to have perfect balance of physicality and ethereality. This has been said on a number of occasions. Now, I don't understand how it can be that gratification of a physical body can be the mechanics by which one is entrapped? Is it not gratifying to look at something beautiful? Is it wrong, sinful, or a form of a fall, to look at beauty, to hear something beautiful such as music, or to touch something that is sensually delightful such as a piece of silk or the skin of a loved one? These various things that the human being derives pleasure from very often elevate them to a spiritual state.

A: Possession is the key.

Q: What do you mean?

A: In STS, you possess.

Q: That's what I am saying here...

A: If you move through the beautiful flowers, the silk, the skin of another, but do not seek to possess...

Q: It seems to me that it is possible to experience all of these things, including sex, without the need or desire to possess; only to give. In which case, I still don't understand how it can be a mechanism for a 'fall.'

A: If it is desired, then the mechanism is not to give. Do you eat a piece of chocolate cake because it is good to give to the stomach?

Q: Well, you could!

A: No, in STS, which is your realm do not forget, one gives because of the pleasant sensation which results.

Q: Could it not be said that, if everything that exists is part of God, including the flesh, that if one gives to the flesh, without being attached to the giving, that it could be considered a giving to the 'All?'

A: Explain the process.

Q: For example: there are some people who like to suffer, because they believe that the flesh is sinful. That is a big thing that the Lizzies have instituted. For centuries they have wanted people to suffer, and they have made this big deal about sex and anything that might be considered pleasant or desirable should be denied, and that a person should suffer, and revel in their suffering. And, actually, making a person...

A: If one seeks to suffer, they do so in expectation of future reward. They desire to possess something in the end.

Q: What I am saying is: if a person can simply BE, in the doing and being of who and what they are, in simplicity; to become involved in doing everything as a meditation, or as a consecration, whether they are walking down the street and being at one with the air, the sunshine, the birds and trees and other people; in this state of oneness, doesn't that constitute a giving to the universe as giving oneself up as a channel for the universe to experience all these things?

A: Not if one is "feeling this oneness."

Q: We are what we are. Nature is nature. Progression is progression. And if people would just relax and be who and what they are in honesty, and do what is according to their nature without violating the Free Will of others, that this is a more pure form of being than doing things out of any feeling of expectation, or desire; to just BE, not want... just BE?

A: Yes, but STS does not do that.

Q: (A) From which I draw conclusions: if there STS around us, we cannot just...

A: You are all STS. If you were not, you would not be where you are.

Q: (A) There are those who are happy in the STS mode; and there are those who are trying to get out of the STS mode...

A: STO candidate.

Q: (A) These STO candidates cannot just simply BE, even theoretically, because then, STS would eat them.

A: No.

Q: Why not?

A: STS does not eat according to protocol.

Q: What does that mean?

A: What do you suppose?

Q: I have no idea!

A: STS "eats" whatever it wants to, if it is able.

Q: That's what we said. If you are STO in an STS world, you are basically defenseless and they eat you.

A: No.

Q: Why? What makes STO unavailable or 'inedible?'

A: Frequency resonance not in sync.

Q: (A) But then, that would mean that all these people who are saying that we need just to love everything and everybody, are right. They just be, and love, don't do anything, just give everything to the Lizzies... they are right!

A: No, because motivation is STS.

Q: How is the motivation to love everything and everybody, and to just give, STS?

A: Feels good.

Q: So, they want to do it because it feels good?

A: Want is an STS concept.

Q: So, you seem to be suggesting that the real trick is to just become non-attached to anything and anybody, do nothing, and just dissolve into nothing? No thought, no want, no do, no be, no anything!

A: If you are STS, that does not fit, but, if you did exactly that, you would reincarnate in an STO realm, where such energy does fit.

Q: But, if you have become nothing, how do you reincarnate? And, when you say 'reincarnate,' that implies being in a body!

A: You do not become nothingness.

Q: But, being incarnated means being in a body?

A: No.

Q: You mean moving into a realm that does not necessarily mean being in a body?

A: Close. But 4th density is partially physical. Does not consume nor possess.

Q: (A) This is contradictory to what we are doing. (L) Why write a book or do anything? There is no point. We should just sit around, do nothing but contemplate our navels and do nothing. (F) Why do you say that? (L) Because doing anything at all constitutes wanting, needing, possessing, having, and so on. (F) Of course, because this is an STS realm. (L) So, therefore, we should do nothing. We should contemplate our navels and try to get out of it and to heck with everybody else! (F) I disagree. (L) Otherwise, it is contradictory. If you try to help anyone else, or do for anyone else, you are desiring to help them. Therefore, you are desiring to change something... (F) Well, sure, but this is an STS realm. (L) Anyway, I would like to know who and what this Marcia Schafer is channelling. She seems to be channelling several sources, or claims to be. Could you tell me who and what?

A: Not yet, because this issue is not yet resolved. You are confused because you seem to think you must be STO to be an STO candidate. You are STS, and you simply cannot be otherwise, until you either reincarnate or transform at realm border crossing.

We have to forgive ourselves for having ended up in this situation. Above all we have to understand the Why.

In this context a reminder from 11 August 1996 about intent and anticipation:

Q: Well, this is one of the problems I am dealing with in trying to write this history of mankind. As I understand it, or as I am trying to figure it out from the literature, prior to the 'Fall in Eden,' mankind lived in a 4th density state. Is that correct?

A: Semi/sort of.

Q: Please be more specific.

A: 4th density in another realm, such as time/space continuum, etc.

Q: Okay, so this realm changed, as a part of the cycle; various choices were made: the human race went through the door after the 'gold,' so to speak, and became aligned with the Lizzies after the 'female energy' consorted with the wrong side, so to speak. This is what you have said. This resulted in a number of effects: the breaking up of the DNA, the burning off of the first ten factors of DNA, the separation of the hemispheres of the brain...

A: Only reason for this: you play in the dirt, you're gonna get dirty.

Q: What was the motivating factor for playing in the dirt? What essential thing occurred? You said once that it was 'desire based imbalance.' What was it a desire for?

A: Increased physicality.

Q: What was the objective sought for in this desire for increased physicality?

A: Sensate.

Q: How was sensate experienced so that these beings had an idea that they could get more if they increased their physicality?

A: Not experienced, demonstrated.

Q: Demonstrated how, by who?

A: Do you not know?

Q: It was demonstrated by the Lizzies?

A: Basically.

Q: Demonstrated in what way? Did they say: 'here, try this!' Or did they demonstrate by showing or doing?

A: Closer to the latter.

Q: They were doing, experimenting, playing, and saying: 'look, we are doing this, it's so great, come here and try it?'

A: Not really. More like: "you could have this."

Q: What seemed to be so desirable about this increased physicality when they said 'you can have this?'

A: Use your imagination!

Q: Was there any understanding, or realization of any kind, that increased physicality could be like Osiris lured into his own coffin by Set? That they would then slam the lid shut and nail him in?

A: Obviously, such understanding was lacking.

Q: Sounds like a pretty naive bunch! Does the lack of this understanding reflect a lack of knowledge?

A: Of course. But more, it is desire getting in the way of...

Q: Okay. The 'Fall' occurred. It seems like, and some of the archaeological studies indicate, that for many thousands of years, there was a peaceful existence and a nice agrarian society where the goddess or female creative forces were worshipped. At least, this is what a lot of present-day books are proposing...

A: No. These events took place 309000 years ago, as you measure it. This is when the first prototype of what you call "modern man" was created. The controllers had the bodies ready, they just needed the right soul matrix to agree to "jump in."

Q: So, prior to this time, this prior Edenic state...

A: Was more like 4th density.

Q: But that implies that there was some level of physicality. Was there physicality in the sense of bodies that look like present-day humans?

A: Not quite.

Q: What did these pre-fall...

A: Cannot answer because it is too complex for you to understand.

Q: Does this mean that the are experienced... that the bodies we possibly would move into as 4th density beings, assuming that one does, would also be too complex for us to understand? You are saying that this 'sort of 4th density' pre-Fall state, in terms of the physical bodies, is too complex to understand. If going back to 4th density is anything like coming from 4th density, does that mean that what we would go back to is something that is too complex to understand? This variability of physicality that you have described?

A: Yes.

Q: So, was there any kind of worship of God, or religious activity in this pre-Fall state; this Edenic, 4th density state?

A: No need when one has a clue.

Q: What I am trying to get at here, what I am trying to understand, is the transition from the goddess worship to the god worship; the change from the understanding of cyclical time as expressed in the feminine cycles, and expressed as the goddess; to the concept of linear time, expressed as the masculine principle. It seems to me that these were stages of inversion of concepts which gradually led to the ideas that the Lizzies are imposing on us, and seem to have been working in this direction for millennia - the dominator experience which expresses as: believe in something outside yourself that will save you, otherwise you are damned because the world is gonna end, and you are going to get judged. This is the concept I am trying to deal with here. I am trying to understand what was worshipped. Okay, we had these guys; they fell from Eden, but they were still fairly close to the original concepts, in some terms. Once they jumped into the physical bodies, as you put it, what was their level of conceptualization regarding the universe? Did they still retain some understanding at that point?

A: Kind of like the understanding one has after severe head trauma, vis a vis your normal understanding in your current state.

Q: So, they were traumatized; they may have had bits and pieces of ideas and memories, but they may also have lost a great deal altogether. There may have even been a sort of "coma" state of mankind for many millennia. But, after they woke up, with the bits and pieces floating around in their heads, they may have begun to attempt to piece it all together. So, they started putting it all back together. What was the first thing they put together regarding the cosmos around them?

A: Sex.

Q: What did they decide about sex? I mean, sex was there. They were having sex. Is that it? Or, did they understand the cosmos as sex?

A: More like the former. After all, that is what got you guys in this mess in the first place! Just imagine the sales job if you can: "Look how much fun this is! Want to try it?!? Oops, sorry, we forgot to tell you, you cannot go back!"

Q: I really fail to understand - and I know it is a big issue that has been hinted at and alluded to, and outright claims have been made regarding sex in all religions and mythologies - but I fail to understand the mechanics of how this can be the engineering of a 'fall.' What, precisely, are the mechanics of it? What energy is generated? How is it generated? What is the conceptualization of the misuse of this energy, or the use of the energy?

A: It is simply the introduction of the concept of self-gratification of a physical sort.

Q: On many occasions you have said that the ideal thing is to have perfect balance of physicality and ethereality. This has been said on a number of occasions. Now, I don't understand how it can be that gratification of a physical body can be the mechanics by which one is entrapped? Is it not gratifying to look at something beautiful? Is it wrong, sinful, or a form of a fall, to look at beauty, to hear something beautiful such as music, or to touch something that is sensually delightful such as a piece of silk or the skin of a loved one? These various things that the human being derives pleasure from very often elevate them to a spiritual state.

A: Possession is the key.

Q: What do you mean?

A: In STS, you possess.

Q: That's what I am saying here...

A: If you move through the beautiful flowers, the silk, the skin of another, but do not seek to possess...

Q: It seems to me that it is possible to experience all of these things, including sex, without the need or desire to possess; only to give. In which case, I still don't understand how it can be a mechanism for a 'fall.'

A: If it is desired, then the mechanism is not to give. Do you eat a piece of chocolate cake because it is good to give to the stomach?

Q: Well, you could!

A: No, in STS, which is your realm do not forget, one gives because of the pleasant sensation which results.

Q: Could it not be said that, if everything that exists is part of God, including the flesh, that if one gives to the flesh, without being attached to the giving, that it could be considered a giving to the 'All?'

A: Explain the process.

Q: For example: there are some people who like to suffer, because they believe that the flesh is sinful. That is a big thing that the Lizzies have instituted. For centuries they have wanted people to suffer, and they have made this big deal about sex and anything that might be considered pleasant or desirable should be denied, and that a person should suffer, and revel in their suffering. And, actually, making a person...

A: If one seeks to suffer, they do so in expectation of future reward. They desire to possess something in the end.

Q: What I am saying is: if a person can simply BE, in the doing and being of who and what they are, in simplicity; to become involved in doing everything as a meditation, or as a consecration, whether they are walking down the street and being at one with the air, the sunshine, the birds and trees and other people; in this state of oneness, doesn't that constitute a giving to the universe as giving oneself up as a channel for the universe to experience all these things?

A: Not if one is "feeling this oneness."

Q: We are what we are. Nature is nature. Progression is progression. And if people would just relax and be who and what they are in honesty, and do what is according to their nature without violating the Free Will of others, that this is a more pure form of being than doing things out of any feeling of expectation, or desire; to just BE, not want... just BE?

A: Yes, but STS does not do that.

Q: (A) From which I draw conclusions: if there STS around us, we cannot just...

A: You are all STS. If you were not, you would not be where you are.

Q: (A) There are those who are happy in the STS mode; and there are those who are trying to get out of the STS mode...

A: STO candidate.

Q: (A) These STO candidates cannot just simply BE, even theoretically, because then, STS would eat them.

A: No.

Q: Why not?

A: STS does not eat according to protocol.

Q: What does that mean?

A: What do you suppose?

Q: I have no idea!

A: STS "eats" whatever it wants to, if it is able.

Q: That's what we said. If you are STO in an STS world, you are basically defenseless and they eat you.

A: No.

Q: Why? What makes STO unavailable or 'inedible?'

A: Frequency resonance not in sync.

Q: (A) But then, that would mean that all these people who are saying that we need just to love everything and everybody, are right. They just be, and love, don't do anything, just give everything to the Lizzies... they are right!

A: No, because motivation is STS.

Q: How is the motivation to love everything and everybody, and to just give, STS?

A: Feels good.

Q: So, they want to do it because it feels good?

A: Want is an STS concept.

Q: So, you seem to be suggesting that the real trick is to just become non-attached to anything and anybody, do nothing, and just dissolve into nothing? No thought, no want, no do, no be, no anything!

A: If you are STS, that does not fit, but, if you did exactly that, you would reincarnate in an STO realm, where such energy does fit.

Q: But, if you have become nothing, how do you reincarnate? And, when you say 'reincarnate,' that implies being in a body!

A: You do not become nothingness.

Q: But, being incarnated means being in a body?

A: No.

Q: You mean moving into a realm that does not necessarily mean being in a body?

A: Close. But 4th density is partially physical. Does not consume nor possess.

Q: (A) This is contradictory to what we are doing. (L) Why write a book or do anything? There is no point. We should just sit around, do nothing but contemplate our navels and do nothing. (F) Why do you say that? (L) Because doing anything at all constitutes wanting, needing, possessing, having, and so on. (F) Of course, because this is an STS realm. (L) So, therefore, we should do nothing. We should contemplate our navels and try to get out of it and to heck with everybody else! (F) I disagree. (L) Otherwise, it is contradictory. If you try to help anyone else, or do for anyone else, you are desiring to help them. Therefore, you are desiring to change something... (F) Well, sure, but this is an STS realm. (L) Anyway, I would like to know who and what this Marcia Schafer is channelling. She seems to be channelling several sources, or claims to be. Could you tell me who and what?

A: Not yet, because this issue is not yet resolved. You are confused because you seem to think you must be STO to be an STO candidate. You are STS, and you simply cannot be otherwise, until you either reincarnate or transform at realm border crossing.

There are many reasons to forgive, as long as we have knowledge, i e understand our Why we should. 😍

We may help and support each other's memory. And we are. Constantly. Not only in this Forum, even if here the sole intent is put on doing this. As individual consciousnesses we are always invited to use our free will to allow ourselves to remember our Why. Nobody else can do this for us. It is our individual lesson. But for every one who remembers, where knowledge is brought into the light of truth, love and light is added to our common consciousness. When this common consciousness is thus strengthened, this strengthened information field helps and supports others to also remember.

Now, we'd better read that part about "intent and anticipation" again... 🤓

This really is the tricky part! 😜
 
Back
Top Bottom