Humanity Is Deciding If It Will Evolve Or Die

Joe

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the welfare of humanity at large
Between that idea and its opposite, lies the widening gulf that separates many human beings. Desiring the welfare of humanity at large is a core 'new age' idea that has been around for, well, a long time. How many people have and still do engage in all sorts of activities to try and achieve that. None of them seem to recognize just how ridiculous the idea is. One person deciding what the 'welfare' of 8 billion others is can only sound like a good idea if you delude yourself with another core new age belief: 'we are all one'.
 

duyunne

Jedi Master
(What is a "realm border crossing" but a "nexus"?)
"The Nexus was an extra-dimensional realm in which one's thoughts and desires shaped reality. Inside the Nexus, time and space had no meaning, allowing one to visit any time and any place that one could imagine. The doorway to the Nexus was a violent, destructive temporal energy ribbon which crossed through the galaxy every 39.1 years, among others in 2293, 2332, and 2371." - From Memory Alpha Star Trek Wiki

Upon watching generations many years ago now, one of the things I was thinking about the entire time was "this must be like what the wave is!" It's a great on screen visual for the concept but I don't think that we in our current status can accurately portray something so profound on screen without errors.

Our thoughts and desires already shape reality. Part of why things are as chaotic and unreal as they are in the human psychosphere is that the majority of us don't understand or believe this. There's no 'quality' control in the thoughts and desires of the majority of us.

There is a spectrum of thought and feeling within oneself that can be consciously controlled and it is our responsibility to use that to create the scenarios we can experience instead of wishing or hoping they will be created for us. What is worse is that most people without even knowing it use this energy to constantly day dream about self serving ventures or scenarios that ultimately lead to an island of isolation and the entropy that ensues from being severed from their herd.

Many of you mentioned hope in this thread. It's obvious that many of you are too big and bold for hope now. That is awesome! Or at least it feels really awesome in my body/heart to indulge in that concept. Who needs hope when you can actually get sh*t done.

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I see where you're coming from Joe, but I think the very core of 'we are one' concept is nothing more complex than empathy.
 

ScioAgapeOmnis

The Living Force
I see where you're coming from Joe, but I think the very core of 'we are one' concept is nothing more complex than empathy.
Or another meaning, where we are all part of one infinite divine cosmic mind, and ultimately serve the same purpose for the universe. And people misapply this and end up in bed with the enemy while seeing them as a friend. Not everyone deserves empathy, and not everyone is the same - maybe in the ultimate sense, but not in our practical reality on the ground. And empathizing doesn't mean you have to trust or try to befriend - you can empathize and still draw strict boundaries and protect yourself. It just means don't hate or try to harm, but people take it way too far and think "oh ok so best buds then".
 

Joe

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I see where you're coming from Joe, but I think the very core of 'we are one' concept is nothing more complex than empathy.
Interesting, because I think it's the exact opposite: self-centeredness. But that's just me.
 

Joe

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Or another meaning, where we are all part of one infinite divine cosmic mind, and ultimately serve the same purpose for the universe.
Really? Maybe we all ultimately serve A purpose for the universe, but I doubt it's the same.
 

duyunne

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I’m not implying comradery. It’s just easier for me to understand why people do what they do when I put myself in their shoes, or do my diligence in seeing through their lenses. It’s something I kind of had to do to stay sane at a young age. You watch people shift from being genuinely wholesome and loving to ice cold vindication. Eventually you’ll have to confront that if you want to have faith in that person.
 

ScioAgapeOmnis

The Living Force
Interesting, because I think it's the exact opposite: self-centeredness. But that's just me.
Really? Maybe we all ultimately serve A purpose for the universe, but I doubt it's the same.
Thinking about it, that does make sense. Are you thinking in terms of "we are all one" is basically empathizing with others only because they have something in common with YOU, so you're still using yourself as a "bar" for what is acceptable? Which would mean if they were truly different, you'd not be so accepting or empathetic. I suppose it's just an expanded version of "hey we're all Americans at the end of the day", which isn't that different from "Hey we're both made of atoms" or "Hey we are part of the same universe" - anything you use is still somehow trying to tie yourself to someone else as a reason to be cool.

In that case I'm not sure why we need to share something in common, whatever it may be, to try to understand others or care about them. In other words, I don't think that's necessary - I just never thought of it in that way.

As for the purpose - well, again, I was thinking along the lines of experiences in general, we're all atoms, we're all adding to the knowledge of The One so to speak. But it kinda goes back to your other point - even if so, so what? What can we even do with that knowledge, why is that so important to acknowledge in the first place? It's like we always look for some commonality, no matter how vague or fundamental, before "it's cool"... weird!
 

ScioAgapeOmnis

The Living Force
I’m not implying comradery. It’s just easier for me to understand why people do what they do when I put myself in their shoes, or do my diligence in seeing through their lenses. It’s something I kind of had to do to stay sane at a young age. You watch people shift from being genuinely wholesome and loving to ice cold vindication. Eventually you’ll have to confront that if you want to have faith in that person.
What if their experience and feelings were totally foreign to you, like you couldn’t put yourself in their shoes at all because you lack the necessary knowledge? What’s your next step? On the one hand empathy is the ability to put yourself in someone else’s shoes. But what I’m thinking, if I understand Joe’s point correctly, is that even when that isn’t possible, something would still prompt you to try to learn and understand the best you can anyway. In which case, why do we even need “we are all one”, what kind of comfort are we getting from that mantra? Is it really STO?

Even if it is true on some level, why should that even really matter except as a purely intellectual exercise in trying to understand the universe? What kind of emotion or feeling are we tying to this idea, and why?
 

duyunne

Jedi Master
You have no choice but to use your own experience or knowledge as a bar. Nothing wrong with that. Understanding that you are flawed and need work yourself also helps prepare you for disappointment when you sacrifice yourself for others, but it’s something we kind of have to do. I’m doing it right now and it isn’t ‘cool’. This is actually kind of frustrating to be honest! Cest la vie
 

Chu

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Thinking about it, that does make sense. Are you thinking in terms of "we are all one" is basically empathizing with others only because they have something in common with YOU, so you're still using yourself as a "bar" for what is acceptable? Which would mean if they were truly different, you'd not be so accepting or empathetic. I suppose it's just an expanded version of "hey we're all Americans at the end of the day", which isn't that different from "Hey we're both made of atoms" or "Hey we are part of the same universe" - anything you use is still somehow trying to tie yourself to someone else as a reason to be cool.

In that case I'm not sure why we need to share something in common, whatever it may be, to try to understand others or care about them. In other words, I don't think that's necessary - I just never thought of it in that way.

As for the purpose - well, again, I was thinking along the lines of experiences in general, we're all atoms, we're all adding to the knowledge of The One so to speak. But it kinda goes back to your other point - even if so, so what? What can we even do with that knowledge, why is that so important to acknowledge in the first place? It's like we always look for some commonality, no matter how vague or fundamental, before "it's cool"... weird!
Indeed. We also share most of our DNA with practically every creature in the world. That doesn't make us "One" with them in the sense people tend to think about it, and empathy doesn't enter into the equation. We share a space, basic biology... No purpose in common. At least I don't think "we are all One" when I see a mosquito or a tick, and I don't think I could have a lot of "empathy" for them either. ;-)
 

duyunne

Jedi Master
Indeed. We also share most of our DNA with practically every creature in the world. That doesn't make us "One" with them in the sense people tend to think about it, and empathy doesn't enter into the equation. We share a space, basic biology... No purpose in common. At least I don't think "we are all One" when I see a mosquito or a tick, and I don't think I could have a lot of "empathy" for them either. ;-)
To the tick and mosquito we're an entire biosphere to feast on! Kind of humbling and ironic, considering that we're likely pests on earth. More of that 'oneness' coming into play there.

Again, I'm not crying out for unconditional acceptance of all things due to our being one. I'm stating that the concept is important and shouldn't be constantly shewed as new age woo or self bias projection. It can be used as the basis for others to accept or understand empathy as it has been for me. It's part of how I understand that I could be you in another phase of my higher self's incarnation cycle, or that we may be part of the same 'soul group'.

Perhaps that my tolerance and patience for everyone provides the karmic feed back for them to have that same tolerance and patience for others those in need. I see that coming to accept and understand oneness is a direct a result of the Work.
 

Bluegazer

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An old saying: God raises them and they come together. Maybe in English it is said in another way. (I use a translator for some words).

That we are all one, if we consider that we share the blocks and foundations of the creation is technically correct. But as the saying I wrote above says, the core of our inner natures is different. There are those with the STO inclination, and those with the STS inclination. It happens that at the level we are in, everything is quite mixed (one day we look at STO and another day at the STS, and this happens because of what I could understand is our susceptibility to being influenced by influences A and B - excuse redundancy - and that We do not have a unified self, in which case we may confuse empathy with identification.
 

duyunne

Jedi Master
An old saying: God raises them and they come together. Maybe in English it is said in another way. (I use a translator for some words).

That we are all one, if we consider that we share the blocks and foundations of the creation is technically correct. But as the saying I wrote above says, the core of our inner natures is different. There are those with the STO inclination, and those with the STS inclination. It happens that at the level we are in, everything is quite mixed (one day we look at STO and another day at the STS, and this happens because of what I could understand is our susceptibility to being influenced by influences A and B - excuse redundancy - and that We do not have a unified self, in which case we may confuse empathy with identification.
I concur, though I believe we are developing into a unified consciousness. It’s just that in our current state such a concept is ‘too close, too intense for some’ to even want to consider. Especially when we’re constantly opposed or seduced by repulsive STS energies.
 

Joe

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Thinking about it, that does make sense. Are you thinking in terms of "we are all one" is basically empathizing with others only because they have something in common with YOU, so you're still using yourself as a "bar" for what is acceptable?
Sort of, most people do that, they look for "mini mes" to "empathize" with, pretty easy. Or they decide what the other person/group needs (based on their own preferences/world view) and then run with that. Few are really interested in working on their own issues/assumptions, learning as much as they can about human nature, and then, and only then, deeming themselves fit to, perhaps, help someone close to them.

A comment in a session about how to 'do empathy' is instructive (paraphrasing): "when you feel yourself falling into despair, do something for another that will help them from feeling the same way". That's a BIG difference from how most people approach it.

First, when they're feeling hopeless, the LAST thing most people will do is think about stopping someone else feeling the same way, heck, most of them won't even make the effort to stop THEMSELVES from feeling that way, and instead use it to get something from others, eliciting "empathy" from them. It's a lovely little game.

Second, they generally tend to want to "help" others when they get a whiff of something they should deal with in themselves, but rather than do that, they decide to try to make that awareness disappear by focusing on the "problems" of others and attempting to "fix" them. The result is often that they not only do NOT help the other person, they create problems for them, furthering extinguishing the awareness of their own problems.
 
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