venusian said:
NormaRegula said:
Mrs. Tigersoap said:
...how can these really disturbed characters (and sometimes full-on psychos) as those of the LC or in the Punk movement write such beautiful songs? For example, 'Just a Perfect Day' by Lou Reed is a gorgeous song (and God knows Lou Reed is some shady character), and there are many wonderful songs in the LC movement as well.
I've had that same question, too, after my perceptions regarding rock n roll (and the entire entertainment industry cause they are somewhat related) got a shaking from this series.
Perhaps one of their possible multiple personalities wrote the lyrics/music. Or perhaps they didn't write the songs at all - they were written by very clever individuals who knew just what an audience wanted to hear - truth, with a few lies thrown in for confusion/programming purposes. The music could have been composed in the same manner - with an added twist in that it affected listeners into emotional states ripe for further programming.
I've known many songwriters who wrote beautiful songs and were pretty screwed up as people. Some people just seem to have the knack for putting it together in a way that communicates feelings. Many times they don't even have to work at it very hard- it just rolls out. Those that aren't able to go deeper and grow as people end up doing more variations of their best songs over and over. At least that has been my observation.
Another factor to consider is that at the level where artists are putting out and selling records, there is usually quite a bit of feedback and input from others to help shape the eventual result into something that will reach people and sell records.
I've had these same thoughts since this series started, as well, NormaRegula, Mrs. T, and venusian. And I've also been meaning to post about them for a long time. It's definitely been interesting. Some more thoughts to add to the mix. I think Dave's succeeded in raising many questions and REALLY creepy and weird connections in a very entertaining and amusing way (especially for such dark subjects). I got the impression that he took on a really big project and is feeling his way through how to complete it. While I generally agree with some of the criticism raised, I think in the LC series he's not insisting on particular answers, but on the questions, weirdness, coincidences, and the whole milieu, etc. I was thinking of reading his moon landing series too, and never got around to it, so I can't comment. I've also planned to look closer into that issue (faked landings, etc.) for many years and never got around to it, so I don't know, I've just run into bits and pieces of info that raised the issue.
I was also a big fan of the Doors and Led Zeppelin from an early age (around 10 or 11 on). The factors to consider about the whole industry -- and it is an industry -- are important. It's kind of like an assembly line approach in the entire entertainment industry. "Talent" is manufactured and packaged. So it's hard to say just how talented someone is inherently from just a cursory look. I think Dave HAS stirred a lot of sacred cows with the LC series. I'm just trying to add some more perspective. Some of what he says is just opinion, and some hard to verify, although he did mention at some point that he will make this into a book -- he's using the old serial publishing technique revived by Dickens with such wild success (as has Laura with Wave, Adventures, etc.). So he may eventually have more sources cited, bibliography, footnotes etc. But I think it's a valuable work, anyway.
Some of what he wrote was corrected by others, and he made corrections saying that he found it easier to do this project this way online and have readers give feedback, fact check, etc. Some of what people have objected to (including readers writing to him) IS just sacred cows and opinions, etc. What he's saying in a lot of places is not that the studio album is crap, but that the band was crappy live. Besides, the Monkeys, I think there WERE a lot of other "bands/musicians" that were not really musicians. I had heard before this series that certain bands, when they got together (or a certain lineup of a band), some of the band members did not really know how to play their instruments, etc.
In any case, I think quite a bit of what Dave has written is good food for thought and much of it resonates with me in a general way about the entire entertainment industry and pop culture. These not only manufacture "talent characters" they also destroy real talent regularly and always have. Anyone who is truly talented and creative will not last in this industry without strategically making it to a point to have enough independence and free space. But the distribution channels and media promotion are totally controlled. So you're always in a pickle if you want to create in these media.
It has close parallels to Laura and her work. She is the real deal, hasn't been co-opted or controlled or destroyed so she and her work are REALLY dangerous and have enormous potential for having a sea change in the control system. But all this makes it near impossible to get as wide an audience as those who are not the real deal, HAVE been co-opted/corrupted, sold out, etc. It is "their" game. If you play for the big audiences (in whatever niche) in the even larger information / communication field you WILL be controlled. I'm pretty sure there's very little way around it.
As far as writing beautiful songs, etc. I think everything mentioned in the above quote is at least a partial explanation, probably a combination of all of these things. Dave does say as much for certain examples: either writing or even playing the instruments on the studio recordings, e.g. "The Recking Crew" etc. These issues have become even worse over the years, and more obvious, AND exposed (Milly Vanilli, Ashley Simpson on Saturday Night Live, etc.). I mean lip syncing, as well as, people who sound great in the studio but terrible live, etc. has been around for a long time. And these days with the technology advances, you can make anybody sound great in a digital studio and seem to posses perfect musicianship. Also this reminds me of what Laura wrote about in The Wave about people who have a very pronounced gift for unconventional healing etc. but are alcoholics or just messed up in many ways. Some people are just like antennas and pick up and transmit certain things. I have some of this quality in several ways myself. To say a song is beautiful is subjective to a certain extent no matter what, I think. More than say if someone is a good musician or plays a particular instrument well or not. Some people will really like a song or (think it's beautiful), others won't. But there is some more objective criteria when it comes to whether someone plays an instrument well or not. Also these issues have been around and known for ever. Not only studio session musicians being hired, with or without credit, songs being written by others than those who perform them, again with or without credit, etc. I've dabbled in music and film, so these issues are certainly not unknown (and that's how I also know a bit the controlling, pathological, oppressive, suffocating, repulsive atmosphere first hand). Also, a distinction should be made between those who are always terrible live, and those who are, if not terrible, not as good as expected sometimes. Jimmy Page is known for this, depending on how intoxicated he is on stage (or if it's a "good trip or a bad one" I guess).
I think Inside the LC HAS been valuable to spot programs, reactions, sacred cows, etc. as well. I knew, for instance, about Jimmy Page's fascination or obsession with Crowely, but not about some of Jim Morrison's eyebrow raising connections and background covered by Dave (although I'd read a biography back then). I've joked to my brother that I'm bracing myself because so far other favorite bands such as Pink Floyd, Deep Purple, Black Sabbath have not been implicated. Though Black Sabbath
was in a very roundabout way with their manager whose daughter, Sharon, ended up marrying Ozzy Osborne after he left the band for a Solo career. (Heck even John Lennon showed up with Ravi Shankar at one of the get-togethers at the LC, so more evidence that you just can't be working in the industry and NOT come into contact with, and to some degree even be influenced by, the gang at the center of LC and the puppet masters behind the scenes.) But it HAS been in jest because I've put out any of
these types of sacred cows over a couple of decades. I would NOT be surprised if any of them WERE implicated in creepy connections.
By the way, another thing I've been meaning to look into or ask for a while: does anyone know if Ravi Ravi Shankar of Art of Living is the same Ravi Shankar? That could be another one of those connections.
