Is Alan Watt Credible?

[Kieran]

OK. I have had enough of this total nonsense.

It should be obvious to any readers of this thread – who possess two neurones to synapse! – that, between the two of you, you have TOTALLY DIVERTED THE SUBJECT OF WHAT STEVIEX WAS TALKING ABOUT away from the ‘communications signals’ of the ‘illuminati/power elite/etc’ – using numbers like 11, 911, 23, 33, etc – into a ‘flame war’ which will eventually result in someone (guess who?) getting banned!

Is it not important to ‘crack the codes’ of the enemy?

What world do you live in?

WHY ARE THERE 33 SEGMENTS IN THE GRID OVERLAYING THE UN SYMBOL? (THIS WAS CONTRIVED TO GIVE THIS NUMBER BECAUSE YOU WILL NOTICE THAT THE ‘SPOKES’ OF THE GRID STOP SHORT AT THE INNER CIRCLE.)

WHY IS THERE A PYRAMID WITH A – SEPARATED – ALL-SEEING EYE CAPSTONE ON THE DOLLAR BILL?

WHY IS THERE A TINY OWL HIDDEN IN THE DOLLAR BILL?

WHY DOES 9/11/2001 SUM TO 23? THE INVERTED PENTAGRAM.

AND WHY DOES 911 SUM TO 11 =2 = OPPOSITION OF ‘THESIS’/’ANTITHESIS’ = CHAOS. (FREEMASONARY MOTTO: ‘ORDO AB CHAO’ – Order out of Chaos.)

AND WHY DOES THE DATE OF THE OKLAHOMA BOMBING – 04/19/1995 – ALSO SUM TO 11? (4 + 1 + 9 + 1 + 9 + 9 +5 = 38 = 3 + 8 = 11)

My God!

Talk about COINTELPRO!

I repeat:

“ … you have TOTALLY DIVERTEDTHE SUBJECT OF WHAT STEVIEX WAS TALKING ABOUT away from the ‘communications signals’ of the ‘illuminati/power elite/etc’ – using numbers like 11, 911, 23, 33, etc – into a ‘flame war’ …”

I call upon Laura – whose writings I deeply respect and appreciate – to enter this thread and give some input.

Kieran

 

[Laura]

The answer to your questions is that the STS side believes in all that nonsense and they deliberately seek to use numbers to control nature not realizing that it is useless activity.

That is the point Eco was trying to make. The Cs put it slightly differently:

A: Lord of Serpent promises its followers infinite power
which they must seek infinite knowledge to gain, for which
they pledge allegiance infinitely, for which they possess
for all eternity, so long as they find infinite wisdom,
for which they search for all infinity.

Q: (L) Well, that is a round robin... a circle you can't get
out of!

A: And therein you have the deception! Remember, those who
seek to serve self with supreme power, are doomed only to
serve others who seek to serve self, and can only see that
which they want to see.

Q: (L) The thought that occurs to me, as we are talking here,
is that the STS pathway consists of an individual who
wants to serve themselves - they are selfish and
egocentric -they want to impel others to serve them; they
want to enslave others; and they find ways to manipulate
others to serve them. But, they end up being impelled by
some higher being than they are. Because they have been
tricked into believing that by so doing, they are actually
drawing power to themselves through the teachings,
including the popular religions which promote being
"saved" by simply believing and giving up your power.
And, then, you have a whole pyramid of people TAKING by
trickery and deception, from others. The taker gets taken
from in the end. A pyramid where all those on the bottom,
the majority, have no one to take from, so they get
absorbed into the next level higher, until you get to the
apex and everything disappears. In the STO mode, you have
those who only give. And, if they are involved with other
STO persons, everyone has and no one is at the bottom or
at the top, in a void. In the end, it seems like everyone
ends up serving someone else anyway, and the principle is
the INTENT. But in STO, it is more like a circle, a
balance, no one is left without.

A: Balance, yin-yang.

Q: (L) Obviously the 33 represents the Serpent, the Medusa,
and so forth...

A: You mentioned pyramid, interesting... And what is the
geometric one-dimensional figure that corresponds?

Q: (L) Well, the triangle. And, if you have a triangle point
up you have 3, joined to a triangle pointing down, you
have 3, you have a 33. Is that something like what we are
getting at here?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) Is there a connection between the number 33 and the
Great Pyramid in Egypt?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) And what is that connection? Is it that the builders
of the pyramid participated in this secret society
activity? A: Yes. And what symbol did you see in
"Matrix," for Serpents and Grays?

Q: (L) You are talking about the triangle with the Serpent's
head in it?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) Are we talking in terms of this 33 relating to a group
of "aliens," or a group of humans with advanced knowledge
and abilities?

A: Either/or.

Q: (L) Is this what has been referred to in the Bramley book
as the Brotherhood of the Serpent or Snake?

A: Yes. ...

Q: (L) So, we have a bunch of people who are playing with
mathematics, and playing with higher knowledge, basically
as a keep busy activity to distract them at the human
level from the fact that they are being manipulated at a
higher level. Is this what is going on? Or, do they
consciously know what they are doing? Is it a distraction
or a conscious choice?

A: Both.

It is a trap. Those responding to StevieX were trying to warn her of this trap.

Sometimes it is hard to remember that we were all taken in by this stuff during our salad days and to be as patient with others as someone else was patient with us... thankfully!

But please take it in the spirit it was intended: to save someone from a lot of wasted time and possible traps.

Having said that, we all need to remember that we can't save anyone else; we can only share our own experiences as maps.

 

[nf3]

It should be obvious to any readers of this thread – who possess two neurones to synapse!

Kieran's thinking "should be obvious" to others. Interesting.

Is it not important to ‘crack the codes’ of the enemy?

Yes, by striving for an understanding of their psychological makeup and how they think and interact with reality. Not by playing subjective number games and forcing that subjectivity on others.

I call upon Laura – whose writings I deeply respect and appreciate – to enter this thread and give some input.

Did you appreciate The Secret History of the World? If so, I doubt you would be so self-assured on your own interpretation of this particular issue.

 

[Kieran]

Laura,

Thank you.

A wise and gracious reply.

I love the verse in the Gospel of St John that says:

“And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we saw the glory thereof, as the glory of the only begotten son of the Father) full of grace and truth.”

Many have their aggressive truth to tell us these days. But few match it with ‘grace.’ A synonym for spiritual power.

Kieran

 

[anart]

OK. I have had enough of this total nonsense.

It should be obvious to any readers of this thread – who possess two neurones to synapse! – that, between the two of you, you have TOTALLY DIVERTED THE SUBJECT OF WHAT STEVIEX WAS TALKING ABOUT away from the ‘communications signals’ of the ‘illuminati/power elite/etc’ – using numbers like 11, 911, 23, 33, etc – into a ‘flame war’ which will eventually result in someone (guess who?) getting banned!

Keiran, why would you consider this a flame war? Why would you think you were in any danger of being banned? Other than being rude to kenlee, you had not broken any forum rules and it was simply a discussion until you became extremely emotionally reactive about it.

Laura,

Thank you.

A wise and gracious reply.

I love the verse in the Gospel of St John that says:

“And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we saw the glory thereof, as the glory of the only begotten son of the Father) full of grace and truth.”

Many have their aggressive truth to tell us these days. But few match it with ‘grace.’ A synonym for spiritual power.

I'm VERY glad that you were calmed by Laura's explanation. Do you realize that what she said is really no different from what was already said, to which you responded so negatively? That obsessive focus on numerology is a distraction - a very well designed one at that. I never said these things didn't exist - I never said that they weren't used - I was just saying that there is more - and I was saying it in a very open spirit of 'sharing my experience' - not in ever attacking you or anyone else.

 

[Kieran]

Anart

In the words of an old song:

'Tain't what you said, it's the way that you said it.'

That's why I replied that Laura's post was wise AND gracious.

And if you don't understand what I mean by 'gracious' no amount of message writing will get it across to you.

Let's just drop it now.

To continue on with this is silly.

Kieran

 

[anart]

And if you don't understand what I mean by 'gracious' no amount of message writing will get it across to you.

Ohhh, hmmm - nope, I've never heard that word before - thanks so much! I'll add it to my 'word a day' list.

;)

There really is absolutely no reason at all for you to still be so caustic - methinks there is much more behind it - but, it's certainly not up to me to delve into such things when you want to 'drop it now'.

=)

 

[Z...]

whether you like it or not Kieran, Anart has a rare and precious gift of aiming the mirror at the right spot, why not say thanks and deal with the reflection, that would be - not silly ;)

 

[Beau]

Another point is that we are not here to "play nice". If you want to be shocked into seeing your own subjectivity, sometimes graciousness is not the best tact to take. That being said, your interpretation of "the way something was said' could be wrong. Have you considered that? Because I did not note a derogatory or inflammatory tone in any of the replies to you. Maybe you should reflect on why you perceived what was written to you as ungracious, because it certainly was not.

 

[kenlee]

“ … you have TOTALLY DIVERTEDTHE SUBJECT OF WHAT STEVIEX WAS TALKING ABOUT away from the ‘communications signals’ of the ‘illuminati/power elite/etc’ – using numbers like 11, 911, 23, 33, etc – into a ‘flame war’ …”

You see, your understanding of numerology and symbolism, as described above is simplistic and totally erroneous. I would think that “numerical schemes” of any kind would be used to convey "essential information" of some kind. Cointelpro using occultists as useful idiots get people hung up on the numerical scheme itself so they will not learn how it is put to use as a means to convey information. Occultists (by design) get emotionally hung up on the number scheme completely disregarding the essence of the information to be conveyed,

For example, a compact disc has a built in error correction program (a number scheme) to properly track the information on the disc so as to faithfully reproduce the information encoded onto it. Using this analogy, occultists worship the functional “error correcting program” totally overlooking the encoded information put on the disc from lets say, (to continue the analogy) a higher intelligence.

In short, in my opinion, cointelpro operatives bastardize the error correction program and make it look like it has all these great ‘cosmic secrets' so as to convey noise and “signals” of fear and panic. They lead people to study things like the golden mean as if it has some great cosmic significance in and of itself and totally overlook the fact that the golden mean (a numerical scheme) is used in certain ways as a means to ‘read’ encoded information in lets say a work of art. Occultists and so called "numerologists" worship the numerical schemes as if they are significant in and of themselves and don’t see beyond it to it’s application as a means to convey higher truths. It seems to me that people get suckered into wasting their time in studing the basterdized error correction programs as if it actually means something of cosmic significance and they think that's "all there is."

 

[Nienna]

Anart

In the words of an old song:

'Tain't what you said, it's the way that you said it.'

That's why I replied that Laura's post was wise AND gracious.

And if you don't understand what I mean by 'gracious' no amount of message writing will get it across to you.

Let's just drop it now.

To continue on with this is silly.

Kieran

You know, Kieran, you might want to go back and reread the "way that you said" quite a lot of your posts. Well, maybe you won't want to, but you should.

Anart and kenlee were being very polite in what they were saying, while you came off as rude and obnoxious. As is said, a person will project on to others what he, himself is doing.

What is it these last few days with the rude and obnoxious people coming here to flout their sacred cows, or try to push an agenda? I know it is the norm here, but it was kind of quiet for a spell and it was nice. :)

 

[StevieX]

Hello.

Well … I never thought my posts would take a turn like this!

It just goes to show …...

I was only posting my thoughts from my own … oh … fairly long (since I was about 5)… interest in ‘esoteric’ subjects.

But I do not think I have the “truth” on any such subjects. Far from it.

I know how much I don’t know … and then some!

I try my best to understand what I can, and look to what seems reasonable. I know I have much to learn. (And, sadly, suspect that there may not be too much time left to learn in!)

I just got drawn into a conversation. That’s all.

Please forget it.

Kieran …

Thank you for your undoubtedly kind intention in ‘leaping to my defence.’ Tres Galant!

… And I certainly wouldn’t want to get on the rough side of your tongue! Lol!

I was a bit surprised/hurt … I thought it a bit unnecessary to say that someone has no more idea on a subject that they have put some effort into than ‘Fido’ the dog has about calculus … but I get over that sort of thing within about 1 minute.

It is after all; “lessons, just lessons.”

Peace,
Stevie

“The chief means of happiness in this life is the ability to consider outwardly always,
inwardly never.”
_ G I Gurdjieff

 

[Laura]

I thought it a bit unnecessary to say that someone has no more idea on a subject that they have put some effort into than ‘Fido’ the dog has about calculus ...

This is actually a play on some things said by the Cs.

Q: What are consciousness energy directors?

A: Compare yourself to your backyard denizen. How do each of you
view calculus?

Q: Well, I don't know exactly what calculus is, but I know it is
important. I never thought I was able to learn such things, so I
didn't try. But, I think it is important, and someday I will know something
about it. I am sure that the dog would not only think it is not
useful, he would not even be aware of it. How does that relate to
consciousness energy directors?

A: All in nature seeks balance. One day, so to speak, "Percy" will
indeed have an opinion of calculus.

In fact, it could be said that many of the methods that we use in trying to help people to think are taken directly from the Cs "playbook." It can be frustrating, even maddening at times, but it is necessary for those who really wish to learn to use their most valuable possession: their minds.

Q: (L) Okay. Is any process used to affect us at a distance
from fourth density?

A: That question is vague.

Q: (L) Do any of the STS beings have the ability to cause us
physical problems, or mental or emotional problems when
not in direct contact with us?

A: Certainly.

Q: (L) How is this done?

A: A number of different methods used.

Q: (L) Can you describe the most frequently used methods?

A: That's a non-applicable question.

Q: (L) What do you mean?

A: There is no frequency determination by way of mathematical
calculation.

Q: (L) So any and all methods may be used at any given time?

A: That is correct.

Q: (L) Could you give us one or two examples of how this is
done?

A: There are many: sound wave manipulation of the ultra high
frequency range would be one.

Q: (L) What do these sound waves in the ultra high
frequencies do?

A: They can alter chemical balances within the body of the
subject, thereby also the brain, using the physical path
to cause distress by altering these chemical imbalances
into place.

Q: (L) Do these ultra-high frequency sound waves ever carry
messages in terms of pre-coded suggestions that are
triggered by these waves?

A: Messages are not carried in ultra-high frequency sound
waves. Now, you are talking about an entirely different
method.

Q: (L) Could you describe this method to us?

A: This would be very complex and time consuming for you, but
also, there is one more method used than what your mental
capacities are able to perceive.

Q: (L) And what is that?

A: There's no possibility for an adequate response since the
information would not be perceptible for you.

Q: (L) I don't understand. You say there is one more method
that would be beyond our ability to perceive...

A: That's correct. If you cannot perceive it, how can you
expect to understand it?

Q: (L) Well, perhaps if we were helped to understand it we
would learn to perceive it and could thereby negate it.

A: The best analogy would be trying to explain calculus to a
two-year old. Wold this be possible?

Q: (L) To a very clever individual, possibly.

A: And would it be possible for the two-year-old human to
perceive calculus correctly?

Q: (L) If the two-year-old human was extremely bright.

A: Well, now you are adding conditions into a situation which
were not there to begin with.

Q: (L) Well, my question is: why mention something that is
non-perceivable and unexplainable if it cannot be
discussed?

A: It still can be documented, can it not?

Q: (L) Well, how do we document it?

A: Exactly as given.

Q: (L) If we don't know what we are looking for, how can we
document it?

A: Exactly as explained. There is one method which cannot be
perceived by you. Is it not possible to document that as
such?

Q: (L) If documentation is simply writing that there is one
method that we cannot perceive.

A: Precisely.

Q: (L) And then others will come along and ask: "What is it?"
And we will have no answer. Not even a remote estimation
of what it could possibly be. And that is a highly
unsatisfactory condition to be in, to have a hint...

A: It is? What about all the other answers that were once
questions?

Q: (L) Well, they are far more satisfactory since they have
now become knowledge.

A: How did they become knowledge?

Q: (L) By being answered.

A: And how did they exist before they became answers?

Q: (L) As questions.

A: Correct.

Q: (L) And, our question is: What is this other method?

A: It is not perceivable by you.

Q: (L) What are the mechanics of it if it is not perceivable?

A: That's part of what you cannot perceive. Do you not see
that there is a question here for you to begin to study
yourself, and this is the only way that it can be done, by
planting a seed, as it were, for you then to follow until
it eventually leads to the answer. But, in order for you
to receive the answer, you need information in between the
question and the answer which is not yet available to you
because conditions do not exist currently that will allow
for that in between information to be available.

Q: (L) If one crystal is found and the technology is
deciphered, and another is found, does it increase the
power...

A: Let us answer this way: If Neanderthals found a 747 would
they know how to use it?

Q: (Terry A.) Can I utilize this feeling to help those that I come in
contact with, that I really feel the strong inclination, or feel the strong
force, to be able to help them to balance their bodies?

A: Whoa! Wait a minute! Can an infant utilize a "747?"

So, it is useful to remember that we are not in the business of catering to emotional buffers here.

Reminds me of when I was going to give a talk to a group in Orlando one time. My 14 year old daughter was accompanying me and she asked me at one point what I was going to say to these people. I told her that I wasn't sure how advanced they were and how much they could "handle." She then said to me: "Well, I don't think you have time to break it to them gently."

The "mirror method" may, indeed, be "socially unpleasant," but it is valuable beyond measure; assuming that one doesn't want to waste time.

A person who isn't really serious, who just wants to dabble, to play social games, ought to find a place where they can do that.

We just don't have time to "break it to you gently."

 

[kenlee]

…I was a bit surprised/hurt … I thought it a bit unnecessary to say that someone has no more idea on a subject that they have put some effort into than ‘Fido’ the dog has about calculus … but I get over that sort of thing within about 1 minute.

Basically my point was that we (and this includes myself) can very easily get lost in numerology and symbology by studying it from the 'dog' in us. It's our reaction machines or our "passionate self" that is often influenced by numerology and symbolism. The reaction machine when disconnected from the rest of our totality (our critical thinking faculties) produces (in Gurdjieff speak) our Imaginary 'I' or false personality and we fall into delusion.

The false personality legitimizes its reactions and beliefs as 'proper' so as to justify it's own view of the world. When symbology is viewed from this point of view we can never understand it. It may sound cliché to some but it's really all about self knowledge which is NOT an easy thing. It takes constant and sustained efforts to study oneself and how the "inner machine" works. We simply don't stand a chance in whatever is coming in the future if we cannot see ourselves. If we can't see ourselves then how can we ever 'see' numerology and symbology?

The matrix is inside us too and by studying ourselves we study the workings of the matrix also. Perhaps, but I don't know, certain aspects of numerology and symbology will be 'revealed' in this process of becoming more aware of our subconscious but the emphasis must be placed on seeing the internal dynamics of our inner mechanism. Otherwise we will fall into delusion, and lose our compass bearings.

Every day that I leave my apt. to go onto the main road I have to drive thru a very narrow alleyway with tall stone walls on both sides. This reminds me everyday that 'the Way' is very narrow and one cannot travel too far to the left or too far to the right but one must always make their efforts to stay centered. We lose our 'center' when we get distracted by things that emotionally captivate us and we can get lost. I speak with certainty here because I've experienced this truth time and time and time again (ad nauseum). On other things I'm much less certain and they'll be my opinions but there are some things that I do know (even if it's not much.)

 

[StevieX]

Hello Laura and Kenlee,

“So, it is useful to remember that we are not in the business of catering to emotional buffers here.

Reminds me of when I was going to give a talk to a group in Orlando one time. My 14 year old daughter was accompanying me and she asked me at one point what I was going to say to these people. I told her that I wasn't sure how advanced they were and how much they could "handle." She then said to me: "Well, I don't think you have time to break it to them gently."

The "mirror method" may, indeed, be "socially unpleasant," but it is valuable beyond measure; assuming that one doesn't want to waste time.

A person who isn't really serious, who just wants to dabble, to play social games, ought to find a place where they can do that.

We just don't have time to "break it to you gently.””


I understand. And I’m grateful for any ‘shocks’ that contribute to genuine realizations.


Thank you.
StevieX

“No country and no people can remain free and ignorant at the same time.”
- Thomas Jefferson