Jordan Peterson: Gender Pronouns and Free Speech War
- Thread starter Laura
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Have you actually listened to anything JBP was saying after he took the vaccine? Sounds like you didn't.
There are a few factors here which are probably being taken largely for granted. One is that JP has already (and continues to) publicly take on some gigantic societal and political issues in a Major way; requiring an incredible amount of time, research, high levels of energy, will, discipline and rigor that is to be greatly respected, acknowledged and admired. The guy is simply tireless and relentless in sharing knowledge and which is evidenced by his prolific output. So most of his focus has obviously been on CRT, left wing authoritarianism, character growth, etc. And all of that while being attacked by much of the mainstream media.
Another dimension to this is that Peterson, himself, is on his own 'soul's journey', if you will. Which means that while he may have areas of awareness that may be "weak" (at least relative to what we know on a given subject) - he is forging his own personal path that is inherently "imperfect" or lopsided - just like anyone else. We, all of us, have blind spots, weaknesses, challenges etc. - that are specific to us as individuals. So while it may be a frustrating, from "someone in the know" to see just how he gets it wrong on occasion (especially because we like him, want him to know this or that important something, and because of his great reach and influence) it would be a mistake, I think, to leave so much out about Peterson "a soul in progress," in your reasoning.
Lastly, taking on such a view as you have seems quite limiting to me. Individuals, and life itself, are far more complex and varied than what you are suggesting here with your statements. Becoming more aware of how this is true - especially within one's own thinking and one's own self - is a nearly never-ending process. So to apply such black and white thinking to Jordan Peterson, I think, is to also be applying such limited thinking, to some great extent, to your own growth.
One interesting intersection I found between Ellen/Elliot Page and Kanye West (the conversation starts in this thread here) was having the "A-list Celebrity Personal Trainer" Harley Pasternak, who also did a 2 year stint as a scientist at Defense and Research Development Canada
. The same person who threatened to institutionalize Kanye and deprive him of his kids for supporting Trump. So there is definitely a handler in the picture vis-a-vis Page. Other clients include Lady Gaga, Gwyneth Paltrow, and Bono to name a couple lunatics.
Aside from a handful of tweets talking about the vaccine supply in Canada in the months prior to this, this video is the first time I could find Peterson openly talking about the vaccine and the COVID situation in general. Notice that the seeds for what he would later come out and say in November 2021 in his "stupid me" confession regarding mandates, vaccines, and lockdowns were already present in his thinking in June 2021.
So, in a sense, he never really backtracked because he was never fully "on program". He just wasn't fully against the program from the start. Which is understandable, I think, considering his health and family issues at the time as well as his background in academia and trust in the medical profession.
Complexity, based on the past few posts about your relationship with Corbyn and Peterson I think you put people on a pedistal, and when they became misaligned with your view how they “ought” to behave you pour a lot of emotionally charged derision on them (the higher the pedistal, the farther the fall). This tells me that your admiration of them is also based on a similarly distorted perception. Whether you idolize or anathematize someone (as all-good or all-bad) you are not quite seeing them in their full humanity, with their own shadows and own weakness.
To me that is the attitude of someone who feels like a victim, looks for a saviour, and villainizes people who stop fulfilling that role for you.
To me that is the attitude of someone who feels like a victim, looks for a saviour, and villainizes people who stop fulfilling that role for you.
I get kind of a Monday Morning Quarterback, vibe from your posts. It is easy from your armchair to critique those that are actually playing the game. Peterson is actually out there playing the game, in a most hostile environment, doing the best with whatever information and knowledge he has at the moment. Not easy to do. Like most humans, he has made some mistakes. But I get the feeling that his heart is in the right place, and that is what is important to me.
truepositive
Jedi
I had some shrooms and too many beers at the same time, then identified as my bedroom desk. An interesting experience for sure, but not one recommended for permanence.
By January, just two months later, JP had started to figure things out, and wrote in the Nation Post of these matters:
Jordan Peterson: Open the damn country back up, before Canadians wreck something we can’t fix
The country is growing more authoritarian in response to fear
And he says much more, and since then, even more.
These things take time, however when one has had enough of all the building destructive nonsense, things will be said, and he has said them. And good for him.
For what it's worth I agree with Whitecoast. I remember seeing large swaths of both Peterson's 'fans' and those that hate him jump on him for the Benzo situation.
Some of the 'arguments' boiled down to things like "why should I stop smoking pot, when he's a drug addict". Or "why should I take responsibility for my life, when his is falling apart". Obviously they where not that succinct, but that's how I read them.
Forums, twitter, youtube comments.
Given Peterson has taken on somewhat of a father figure archetype for so many, you may (if you choose to) want to stop and consider:
1) What you feel about Peterson - bitterness? anger? distrust? etc
2) What you feel/think about your own father (or male role models growing up) - "he can do no wrong" - hero worship, "he is always wrong" - bitters/anger/resentment/rebellion, "I will never be like him, he was a monster", "I will be like him, he was perfect" etc
3) Does some part of you feel 'glee' or 'relief' at dismissing Peterson without question? Does some part of you feel 'betrayed' or 'abandoned'? If so, how's Personal Responsibility for your life going? Do you expect it to be 'perfect'? Always 'failing'?
Hi_Henry
The Living Force
But lets not forget who saved his a$$ when his drugged state was getting out of control, with no help in sight in the West.
Russia !!!
So when he starts to hint or say anything against them, I have a huge issue with him. In those situations I just wish the guy was smart enough to just shut up.
Hi_Henry
The Living Force
Yepp, this situation is very interesting. I recall when he went ballistic on stage, but did not follow the situation as this neighborhood does not interest me.One interesting intersection I found between Ellen/Elliot Page and Kanye West (the conversation starts in this thread here) was having the "A-list Celebrity Personal Trainer" Harley Pasternak, who also did a 2 year stint as a scientist at Defense and Research Development Canada
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But having seen an interview of Pasternak where he talks about "experimenting" with drugs that can be done by someone in the military but not in the civilian practice, pushed my warning button on this character. I saw some of the vids where he talks about how bad sugar is for you and how to lose weight. For me this is all BS and old News. What I suspect is happening is that this BS is being used as his camouflage for playing the role of "Health Expert". His true task being something else. Why such a person would be needed for the artists I have no idea, though control to make sure they stay on script of the accepted narrative does make sense. The worst examples of being ON script for me are DeNiro and Shawn Penn, scum bags.
I don't know how this all works but I find it hard to believe that the actors who are listed above all maintain contact with him to make sure their health is in top shape.
@Complexity Perhaps a more productive way of looking at it, instead of judging someone like JP for mistakes in his judgement, would be to perceive the matrix that is all around us and which manipulates our thinking. We sometimes forget that JP and many other public figures still live much more in the Mainstream Bubble than it sometimes seems. In that sense it's interesting to witness the effects this has (I can certainly relate), how they deal with it in their own ways, where they break out, and when this surrounding spell (and this is what it is: a spell) is still too strong.
If we manage to put ourselves in their shoes, and experience the flavor of that spell too, we can also learn something about ourselves. Because we, too, are still subject to this spell in many ways. (Don't forget that this spell isn't just the latest lie peddled on the news, but has been created for centuries and longer). Still way to go! I shudder to think what I will think in 5 years from now about some of my current takes on things.
If we manage to put ourselves in their shoes, and experience the flavor of that spell too, we can also learn something about ourselves. Because we, too, are still subject to this spell in many ways. (Don't forget that this spell isn't just the latest lie peddled on the news, but has been created for centuries and longer). Still way to go! I shudder to think what I will think in 5 years from now about some of my current takes on things.
He IS backtracking, that's pretty much what I said. However, vast swathes of the media in general are definitely NOT backtracking, at least , not that I've seen.
I'm pretty sure no one is wanting it "both ways". In fact, we were pretty clear that we view it as him having made a mistake and recognizing it. That's the point. Clearly Peterson was not intelligent enough to "spot the greatest con in modern history" (as you put it), but that doesn't mean he isn't intelligent, he clearly is.
Not sure what your point is here other than ragging on someone for making a mistake and then correcting it. Like I said, your response is a common one from a person who over-idealized someone and then watched them "fall" from that lofty position. The solution, in such a case, is not to "throw the person out of your heart", but consider that you likely (in fact, most assuredly) expected far too much from that person. The mistake, in the end, was yours, not Peterson's.
My counter-argument was to point out that you were at fault, not defend Peterson.
Benjamin
The Living Force
Are you familiar with the Girl Guides or Girl Scouts? It's a world wide organization like Boy Scouts. Well, it's divided according to age:
Sparks- 5 & 6
Brownies- 7 & 8
Guides- 9-11
Pathfinders- 12-16
Rangers- 15-17
From the wiki as to where the name 'Brownies' came from:
Now, in Canada, 'Brownies' is getting a name change because the original Scottish folklore association has no meaning anymore.
Sparks- 5 & 6
Brownies- 7 & 8
Guides- 9-11
Pathfinders- 12-16
Rangers- 15-17
From the wiki as to where the name 'Brownies' came from:
Now, in Canada, 'Brownies' is getting a name change because the original Scottish folklore association has no meaning anymore.
