Jordan Peterson: Gender Pronouns and Free Speech War

PhoenixPhilalethes said:
Perhaps some of you have seen this video before, but if not, I think it's worth watching. It's another good example that there are 'trans' people out there who support Jordan Peterson and don't think the SJW left crowd speak for all of them...

I am another trans person that supports Peterson, in the financial sense. I hadn't seen these two videos. I can say that the 1:1 "reward" that is the subject of the 2nd one has moved up to the $200/mo tier. I have not personally found Peterson to be approachable, but he has a lot going on and I don't see a problem with that.

What I find interesting about Peterson is that many things he is saying echo themes that I have been hearing for over 30 years from a variety of sources, and for me they have been a reminder and a wake-up. He draws, of course, on classical sources but there is something special about the way he devotes himself to what he does. I am nowhere near fully aligned with what he is saying, but I am glad to see these messages going out to a large audience, and his work seems to be making an appreciable difference.

I don't know if Peterson has significant support among trans people or not. I would guess not, because much of what I am hearing back from the local community with which I was associated when I was transitioning is of a postmodernist-Marxist character. I think you know where he is with that.
 
Timótheos said:
A new video from the Joe Rogan podcast - featuring an interview with Jordan Peterson and Evergreen State College Professor Bret Weintstein.

While watching this video, Jordan Peterson makes many remarks of "Polarization", while it looks to me as a "Ponerization". Ponerization doesn't have any boundaries of what to use or not.

This makes me wonder whether Jordan Peterson aware of "Political ponerology"?. With all sorts of melting going on all over the place and people becoming tools of PTB agenda very easily. Probably, "Ponerology" may become conspiracy that may become all conspiratorial flat earth style. who knows

It is becoming dizzy with all variations of extremes, once new age, flat earthers, gender equality movements, trump- anti trumpers, liberal-conservative extremes, now enforcing new gender pronouns. It looks there is no limit to these stupidities. May 4D STS is becoming desperate to make every body's head muddy to enforce their control.
 
seek10 said:
...While watching this video, Jordan Peterson makes many remarks of "Polarization", while it looks to me as a "Ponerization". Ponerization doesn't have any boundaries of what to use or not...

Peterson is using "polarization" as a word that is easily recognized and well understood. I don't doubt that he understands where polarization can lead. If you want to understand more clearly what he is saying -- agreeing or disagreeing as you like -- you need to listen to a lot more than this discussion.
 
Jordan Peterson just tweeted out that YouTube has placed the Joe Rogan interview video in "limited state" for having offensive content. Having listened to the whole thing earlier today I think I might be able to guess what he said that triggered it.
 
You might have seen this on social media already :)

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I've been reading The Unquiet Dead: A Psychologist Treats Spirit Possession by Dr. Edith Fiore and it made me wonder how many cases of gender dysphoria could actually be caused by spirit attachments/possession.
 
PhoenixPhilalethes said:
I've been reading The Unquiet Dead: A Psychologist Treats Spirit Possession by Dr. Edith Fiore and it made me wonder how many cases of gender dysphoria could actually be caused by spirit attachments/possession.

I've wondered the same thing.

For instance, in the video of the 8 year old boy who proudly prances around in drag he makes the comment, "I think I've always had a little Lactatia (his drag persona) inside me", and I wondered if maybe Lactatia was a spirit attachment that he'd had his whole life. This statement could have been the result of the child trying to reaffirm his own beliefs and ideas of himself, which he would have gotten from his parents. Who, from what one can gather in the video clip, really did a number on the kid by indoctrinating him with their post-modern, progressive liberalism. But nevertheless the possibility is there, I think.
 
Apparently there's no limit to how nuts the liberal agenda can go: I came across this University of Cambridge essay in their "research" section. The headline says "why be human when you can be otherkin?". Here's parts of the text with my added comments:

As social beings, a sense of identity plays an important role in our relations – and in our own happiness. But identity doesn’t have to be narrowly human. In an essay looking at the groups that exist on the edge of conventional boundaries, and are often subject to prurience and ridicule, Pedro Feijó considers those who feel different, other than human. [...] {same "logic" applied as in gender issue.}

Feijó embarked on an exploration of people who are more, or other, than human – and how such people have been perceived and treated by those around them. “We have witnessed, in the last half a century, an explosion of politics grounded on new identities, and on their overcoming. People have been experimenting with and transgressing the limits of what it means to be a woman, of what it means to have a gender, a sex, or a sexual orientation,” Feijó says. {again, the same logic: because they're a minority group, they are automatically being "oppressed" by majority by not being accepted as normal part of community, and "transgressing the limits" is something desirable in itself.}

“Across the western world, individuals and collectives are defying our identity as organic beings, in contrast with mechanical ones, and exploring cyborgism. {how does one exactly defy being an organic being!?} Social movements of trans and disabled people started questioning what it means exactly to be an able body. The neuro-diverse and BIID (Body Integrity Identity Disorder – people who would prefer to be ‘disabled’) have followed in the same footsteps. I thought it would be worth exploring the worlds of those who clash with one central dichotomy: humanity and non-human animality.” [...]

“During the 18th century, accounts of lycanthropy were left behind as the European Enlightenment movement classified them as irrational and obscure. But people who belong to a kind other than the human seem to have sprung from the blind spots of modernity, and have grown strong and visible for the last four decades.” {even though the author is probably clueless why, this is quite an eerie remark.} [...]

In his essay, Feijó highlights the contrast between communities which embrace the experiences of otherkin and the medical corpus which regards non-human identification and behaviour as a subject of inquiry insofar as it is a problem to be treated. He observes: “Psychiatry sees individual patients, otherkin sees a community and a safe space. Where medicine has seen a syndrome to be explained, otherkin have seen affinities with no need for a unified metaphysical justification.” {this seems typical language, where words like "embrace" and "safe space" are used, in a way implicating that acceptance towards something is always desired, and "diversity" being a goal in itself. And if you don't "tolerate" this, you're a bigot.}

But tolerance of difference is shallow – and acceptance of people who feel different, and visibly don’t conform, is frequently tinged with ridicule
. Their perceived absurdity was capitalized not only for diagnostic purposes, but also for mercantile ones. “Post-1970s medical literature presents lycanthropes as curiosities, as fetishized subjects and ultimately as immaterial commodities. Lycanthrophy is written about not so much for reasons of intellectual inquiry but because it sells. Something analogous happened in the general online community, where otherkin are routinely laughed at,” says Feijó. {gee, i wonder why?}

“The problem is that the ridicule seems to reside elsewhere: modern psychiatry and psychology have not been able to keep up-to-date with new post-human perceptions, which have been unable to admit the problems of distinguishing between a phenomenological symptom and a voluntary behaviour, and furthermore which have chosen to pathologize and ruin the lives of many through the insistence on an obsolete paradigm, while the same people could have found a supporting community off- and online.” {these people feel so progressive and superior yet they're just using the same irrational reasoning no matter how absurd or unacceptable the minority in question.}

Homo sapiens has existed for a mere 200,000 years or so; the earliest land creatures crawled out of around 400 millennia ago. In the tree of life we share our inheritance with creatures as diverse as amoebas, flatworms, insects, fish and birds. {all righty then, i'm a banana.} In 1997 Pat Califia, the well-known queer author of erotic essays, wrote: “I’m never sure if I have gender dysphoria or species dysphoria. I often try to explain that I’m really a starfish trapped in a human body and I’m very new to your planet.{perhaps there's some truth to this in a similar way as there might be with why some people are attracted to flat-earth theory? I.e perhaps they're "young" souls, as Pierre wrote in his article while ago.}
 
MB said:
Jordan Peterson just tweeted out that YouTube has placed the Joe Rogan interview video in "limited state" for having offensive content. Having listened to the whole thing earlier today I think I might be able to guess what he said that triggered it.

What does a "limited state" mean to YT?
 

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