Jordan Peterson: Gender Pronouns and Free Speech War

[Voyageur]

Here is an excellent New Years article by Jordan Peterson:

http://jordanbpeterson.com/2016/12/new-years-letter/

He just released a video on youtube where he reads this letter out loud to the audience. He admits to being sick recently and becomes visibly emotional a few times during the recording. It seems like the stress of the situation may be having a negative affect on his health. He is so passionate about his subject and feels so strongly about the disastrous direction society is heading, combined with his history with depression, I really feel for the guy.

I doubt whether entering into a debate with an atheist like Sam Harris is worthwhile or productive strategy for him at this time.

http://<iframe width="560" height="...0o" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Listened to Peterson's New Years address from within this SoTT article . So indeed, felt for the guy, too, as he has been through a grueling year. May his year ahead offer some respite and kindness.

 

[Timótheos]

I doubt whether entering into a debate with an atheist like Sam Harris is worthwhile or productive strategy for him at this time.

I think that gathering as many allies as possible, and of various colors, is not a bad strategy. Sam Harris happened to make a few talks on that subject. In one, where he presents, and comments on (in a supportive way), parts of Jonathan Haidt's talk on social justice, he makes a reference to the other case in BC, Canada, and also to Peterson's battle (starting around 7:00, but you won't waste you time watching all 12 mins).

http://<iframe width="560" height="...5E" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Thanks for posting the video PoB, it was interesting. Just a note though, the narrator's voice that is heard over the video is not that of Sam Harris, but the video's creator, someone named Independent Man. Sam Harris, along with Christopher Hitchens and Richard Dawkins are popular hard core atheists. Being that J. Peterson describes himself as a deeply religious person, even if it's in the archetypal and not orthodox sense of the word, it seems like entering into a debate on spirituality with an atheist like Harris is an exercise in futility. Given that Peterson appears to be under a lot of stress at the moment, I just thought it might benefit him to take some time to focus on his physical health and well-being.

Here's an article Harris wrote for the Huffington Post in 2005 defending the use of torture...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/sam-harris/in-defense-of-torture_b_8993.html

And one of many videos on Youtube critical of his overall views...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5LNRX9BfDM

 

[Possibility of Being]

Thanks for posting the video PoB, it was interesting. Just a note though, the narrator's voice that is heard over the video is not that of Sam Harris, but the video's creator, someone named Independent Man. Sam Harris, along with Christopher Hitchens and Richard Dawkins are popular hard core atheists. Being that J. Peterson describes himself as a deeply religious person, even if it's in the archetypal and not orthodox sense of the word, it seems like entering into a debate on spirituality with an atheist like Harris is an exercise in futility. Given that Peterson appears to be under a lot of stress at the moment, I just thought it might benefit him to take some time to focus on his physical health and well-being.

Well, I more or less know what kind of an animal Sam Harris is. But for some reason I originally misunderstood the video description and didn't give it a second thought, sorry!

Anyway, found this:
_https://www.samharris.org/forum/viewthread/68984/

Member(22 Nov): I’m posting this because there is a UoT Psychology Professor named Jordan Peterson who is engaged in a battle at the moment and I think more people should be aware of him and what’s going on. The battle in question is around legislation known as Bill C16 which is ostensibly to do with trans-rights and preferred pronouns but has wide-ranging connotations regarding free speech.

He was recently involved in a debate with some other “academics” and I’ll post the link below, any Canadians on here would do well to listen to what he has to say.

I think Dr Peterson is a brilliant man and I’m firmly in his corner on this, and believe he deserves as much support and public exposure as possible as he may well lose his job and career. ...

Another Member: I’d love to hear a conversation between Jordan Peterson and Sam Harris. Consciousness, atheism, the culture of censorship… Also, I think this conversation would have the power to change listeners’ opinions on the importance of religion, or at least expose them to a different and powerful perspective.

A few posts further someone posted this (26 Dec):

 

[bjorb]

This interview showcases Miley Cyrus one of the strongest advocates for 'gender theory' Her inner landscape is quite disturbing, Or so I think.

In an interview with TIME, Cyrus talks about her past relationships, Instagram insecurities and her new role as an advocate for people across the gender spectrum
http://time.com/3918308/miley-cyrus-transgender-rights-instapride/

It doesn’t take much to summon a whirlwind of words from Miley Cyrus, who answers every question with a torrent. She darts from memories of football games in Nashville to pop star etiquette to how America is obsessed with sex—all so quickly that some words are hard to distinguish. (Except the profanity, which she uses at roughly the same rate teens use emoji.) Occasionally she slows, camping up her light Nashville drawl to mock the conservative politicians who are at odds with her new social-justice mission: teaching America that there’s more to gender than deciding someone is a girl or boy in the delivery room—and supporting people across the gender spectrum.

Cyrus counts herself among the people who don’t feel they fit in the traditional boxes, saying she doesn’t like the labels boy or girl or even gender fluid, though she’s settled on the latter for now. “I’m just equal. I’m just even. It has nothing to do with any parts of me or how I dress or how I look. It’s literally just how I feel,” Cyrus says during a break from taking pictures for Happy Hippie Presents #InstaPride in Los Angeles last month. The campaign is a collaboration between Happy Hippie—her non-profit dedicated to helping homeless and LGBT youth—and Instagram, aimed at spreading positive images of gender-nonconforming people and the families who love them.

''I’m just equal. I’m just even'' - Or in other words. Defining yourself as your correct gender makes you unequal

Cyrus, wearing a yellow jumpsuit that hugs no curves and shows little skin, is talking about how she’s been sexually open for years and felt androgynous long before she heard the phrase gender fluid. She says she was the person other sexually curious teenage girls came to in Nashville: “They all wanted to experiment. I was always the one.” Now, when she does arrive somewhere wearing little but pasties and butterfly wings, she knows there will be critics who shame her for having her “tits out,” as she puts it. But she says she keeps doing it to challenge people: “I’m using it as a power stance,” she says. “It’s funny to see people try to look me in the eye.”

Just shows that her behavior is tide to an agenda

Like a college student exploring gender and sexuality in a very public seminar, Cyrus is combing back over the experiences of her youth in search of new kinds of understanding. Many of the people she’s photographing at the #InstaPride shoot have been on long journeys to find themselves, too. Greta Martela came out as a transgender woman late in life while living as a 44-year-old single dad. Tyler Ford, a close friend of Ariana Grande who grew up with the star in Boca Raton, came out as a transgender man before they (Ford’s preferred pronoun) stopped taking testosterone and started identifying as agender—meaning they feel they have no gender at all.“People try to make everyone something,” Cyrus says. “You can just be whatever you want to be.”

She’s familiar with the feeling of people trying to make her something she’s not. Before she was smoking weed, dropping F-bombs and decorating her private parts with paint and ribbons for Paper magazine, she became famous as a child star on the Disney Channel series Hannah Montana. Back then, her fans were scandalized when Annie Leibovitz took a picture of her with her back exposed; Cyrus, then 15, said she was “embarrassed” by the picture and apologized. She was a young girl reporting to a bunch of old men in suits who told her how a budding pop star needed to look and act. Cyrus recalls coming back from one Hannah Montana summer hiatus with braces on. “I had to take them off immediately because of the way I looked,” she says. “If I was me now, I would have been like, ‘F— you. Normal 14-year-olds have braces. I’m going to have braces on the show, so kids who have braces in real life know that’s okay.’ But I didn’t have that in my mind then. I was coming from Nashville. My grandma’s a beauty queen. I didn’t know.”

Now 22, Cyrus isn’t worried about offending anyone. “Someone said the other day to me, ‘Should you ask your advisor?’” she says. “I’m like, ‘If I have an advisor, they should have been fired two years ago.’” And when Cyrus does offend someone, she doesn’t jump to apologize. Bristol Palin, daughter of former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin and onetime Dancing With the Stars contestant, lashed out at Cyrus on her blog in a post titled, “Miley Cyrus Claims She’s ‘Least Judgmental Person Ever,’ Calls Christians ‘Insane Motherf—ers.'” Palin took issue with comments included in the Paper magazine interview, accusing Cyrus of being open-minded only toward people who think like her. But Cyrus says that isn’t true.

“Happy Hippie and what I’m about is all about acceptance. That isn’t what I meant at all,” she says. “You say what you say, and I meant it, but it wasn’t necessarily my full thought.” She says there will always be critics, giving the example of Caitlyn Jenner coming out as transgender. Though it was widely praised, a smaller contingency criticized how the Vanity Fair cover shoot perpetuated cisgender standards of beauty. “You can’t make every single person agree with what you say,” Cyrus says. “You got to just say your truth.”

That’s what Cyrus is doing now, in opening up about how she’s had past relationships with both men and women—and about having a future that could involve a husband or wife or perhaps being a single mom by choice. She’s also reflecting on how dissatisfied she felt in past romances, especially with the expectations for how men and women are supposed to act.

With guys, Cyrus says, there was an “overly macho energy” that she didn’t like. “That made me feel like I had to be a femme-bot, which I’m not. And then when I was with a girl, I felt like, ‘Oh s—, she’s going to need someone to protect her, so I’m going to need to have this macho energy.’ And that didn’t feel right either.” Cyrus says she sat in a restaurant with her male date last Valentine’s Day and started crying, looking at the older heterosexual couples around her. “All the women in the restaurant were with these older, fat men that had just let themselves go. They were just being drunk bastards. And then the women were sitting there, trying so hard just to look good. And they’re ignoring them the whole time. And I thought, ‘I’m not living like this,’” she says. “If I end up in a straight relationship, that’s fine—but I’m not going to be with f—ing slob guys who are watching porn, making all their girls feel ugly.”

I think she is making stuff up or exaggerating just to send out the message that tradional relationships enslaves us all. So we should all embrace 'gender theory' and find our true selves.

She traces her fluid feelings about relationships and gender back to her own parents, country singer Billy Ray Cyrus and producer Tish Cyrus. “I don’t associate men and protection necessarily,” Cyrus says. “I think that’s what’s given me the openness of sexuality. Not that my dad wasn’t an awesome protector, but I trust my mom to save me. She’s the prince. I never had that fairy tale.” She recalls crying before dates as a teenager, stressed about people noticing flaws like a pimple. Now she says she’s much less concerned with the superficial stuff. “F—ing is easy. You can find someone to f— in five seconds,” she says. “We want to find someone we can talk to. And be ourselves with. That’s fairly slim pickings.”

Social media can still make her cringe and doubt herself, a feeling with which most young women will likely identify. “Every time you post a new photo, you might get 3,000 amazing things and then you get one s—-y one and it damages you,” she says. “I’ll do the same thing. I’ll post my art and everyone can say it’s great. And then some motherf—er says one thing and you’re like, ‘Well, maybe I am s—-y.’ It sticks in your head.” Cyrus sees girls making duck-faces to get likes on social media and wants to put other examples out there, for an audience that includes her younger teenage sister. “It’s so bad. You look at Instagram and you think, ‘Oh, I don’t look that way.’ And it makes you feel like s—. You start scrolling and you see all these people you’ll never be like and they have so many followers and so many friends,” she says. Hence the #InstaPride campaign: “That’s why we want to do it through Instagram—enough of these pictures. Let’s get some likes on some real pictures.”

Cyrus is bent on helping other people be confident in themselves, sometimes reaching out to individual fans through Twitter. One girl who took a cue from Cyrus was reprimanded for wearing a “Legalize Gay” shirt to school, so Cyrus contacted the school and sent the girl that T-shirt in every available color. Still, she says she feels some uncertainty for telling young people to be themselves, because she knows it’s not as easy for everyone as it is for her now—that a transgender kid who comes out to their parents may well end up on the street. “I hope more kids don’t do what I did and sit in their room and cry, thinking ‘I just don’t know what I’m supposed to be,’” she says. “But when I tell kids sometimes, ‘Just be yourself,’ I feel like, ‘I hope you can do that. Can you really do that?’”

It's not about liberation!! All she does is encouraging mental illness.

Cyrus seems drawn to the LGBT community in part of the solidarity that’s abundant there. She recently went to the finals of RuPaul’s Drag Race, but says she’s not particularly interested in attending award shows—even if they’re a good opportunity to send a once-homeless youth on stage to give A-listers a homily. She responds better to the unbridled, flamboyant support that RuPaul’s contestants gave one another as they performed. “Beyonce would never be down in the front row cheering on Katy Perry,” she says. Perhaps because unlike people who are in the throes of coming out, pop stars often have to pretend to be something they’re not. That’s not something Cyrus is willing to do anymore—even if she’s still figuring out who she is.

I wonder what she will turn into, much be some 'gender' we haven't seen before.

“Maybe if you’re finally getting to be yourself, it’s more of a celebration,” she says, surrounded by new gender-nonconforming friends at the shoot in Hollywood. “Like, you are living your f—ing life.”

 

[Timótheos]

Found this on Facebook today. It seems there is a trend emerging in North America where some women are choosing to "marry themselves" in a special personal or public ceremony, often accompanied with a bouquet, wedding dress, cake and invitations. A little off topic but interesting none the less...

http://www.goodhousekeeping.com/life/relationships/a42034/marrying-yourself-wedding-trend/

Self-marriage is a small but growing movement, with consultants and self-wedding planners popping up across the world. In Canada, a service called Marry Yourself Vancouver launched this past summer, offering consulting services and wedding photography. In Japan, a travel agency called Cerca Travel offers a two-day self-wedding package in Kyoto: You can choose a wedding gown, bouquet, and hairstyle, and pose for formal wedding portraits. On the website I Married Me, you can buy a DIY marriage kit: For $50, you get a sterling silver ring, ceremony instructions, vows, and 24 "affirmation cards" to remind you of your vows over time. For $230, you can get the kit with a 14-karat gold ring.

 

[Voyageur]

Found this on Facebook today. It seems there is a trend emerging in North America where some women are choosing to "marry themselves" in a special personal or public ceremony, often accompanied with a bouquet, wedding dress, cake and invitations. A little off topic but interesting none the less...

http://www.goodhousekeeping.com/life/relationships/a42034/marrying-yourself-wedding-trend/

Self-marriage is a small but growing movement, with consultants and self-wedding planners popping up across the world. In Canada, a service called Marry Yourself Vancouver launched this past summer, offering consulting services and wedding photography. In Japan, a travel agency called Cerca Travel offers a two-day self-wedding package in Kyoto: You can choose a wedding gown, bouquet, and hairstyle, and pose for formal wedding portraits. On the website I Married Me, you can buy a DIY marriage kit: For $50, you get a sterling silver ring, ceremony instructions, vows, and 24 "affirmation cards" to remind you of your vows over time. For $230, you can get the kit with a 14-karat gold ring.

Goodness me. Perhaps once they get tired of themselves or see themselves for who they are, there will be a surge in self-divorce.

 

[Cosmos]

Stumbled upon an interesting passage from Ouspensky, in the book "In Search Of the Miraculous", about lefty people (or more exactly; politicians) in russia during world war one:

BY THIS time, that is, by November, 1916, the position of affairs in Russia had begun to assume a very gloomy aspect. Up to this time we, at any rate most of us, had by some miracle kept clear of "events." Now "events" were drawing nearer to us, that is to say, they were drawing nearer to each one of us personally, and we could no longer fail to notice them.

It in no way enters into my task either to describe or to analyze what was taking place. At the same time it was such an exceptional period that I cannot altogether avoid all mention of what was going on around us, otherwise I should have to admit that I had been both blind and deaf. Besides, nothing could have given such material for the study of the "mechanicalness" of events, that is, of the entire and complete absence of any element of will, as the observation of events at this period. Some things appeared or might have appeared to be dependent on somebody's will, but even this was illusion and in reality it had never been so clear that everything happens, that no one does anything.

In the first place it was clear to everyone who was able and who wanted to see it that the war was coming to an end and that it was coming to an end by itself through some deep inner weariness and from the realization, though dull and obscure yet firmly rooted, of the senselessness of all this horror. No one believed now in words of any kind. No attempts of any kind to galvanize the war were able to lead to anything.

At the same time it was impossible to stop anything and all talk about the necessity of continuing the war or of the necessity of stopping the war merely showed the helplessness of the human mind which was even incapable of realizing its own helplessness. In the second place it was clear that the crash was approaching. And it was clear that nobody could stop anything nor could they avert events or direct them into some safe channel. Everything was going in the only way it could go and it could go in no other way. I was particularly struck at this time by the position of professional politicians of the left who, up to this time, had played a passive role but were now preparing to pass into an active one. To be precise they showed themselves to be the blindest, the most unprepared, and the most incapable of understanding what they were really doing, where they were going to, what they were preparing, even for themselves.

I remember Petersburg so well during the last winter of its life. Who could have known then, even assuming the very worst, that this was its last winter? But too many people hated this city and too many feared it and its last days were numbered.

PS: The paralles are striking, or so it seems. First the "right wingers" brought us into endless war since 9/11, then "the leftys" played the role of the good guy, and during "the end" of the war, "the leftys" took over, came out of the woodwork, and made things much more gloomy, just before the crash (which still has to come).

 

[Alana]

Found this on Facebook today. It seems there is a trend emerging in North America where some women are choosing to "marry themselves" in a special personal or public ceremony, often accompanied with a bouquet, wedding dress, cake and invitations. A little off topic but interesting none the less...

http://www.goodhousekeeping.com/life/relationships/a42034/marrying-yourself-wedding-trend/

Self-marriage is a small but growing movement, with consultants and self-wedding planners popping up across the world. In Canada, a service called Marry Yourself Vancouver launched this past summer, offering consulting services and wedding photography. In Japan, a travel agency called Cerca Travel offers a two-day self-wedding package in Kyoto: You can choose a wedding gown, bouquet, and hairstyle, and pose for formal wedding portraits. On the website I Married Me, you can buy a DIY marriage kit: For $50, you get a sterling silver ring, ceremony instructions, vows, and 24 "affirmation cards" to remind you of your vows over time. For $230, you can get the kit with a 14-karat gold ring.

Goodness me. Perhaps once they get tired of themselves or see themselves for who they are, there will be a surge in self-divorce.

Yes, that article was hilariously insane, i.e. the woman whose vow to herself reads: "I will never leave you". She needed a wedding ceremony and a vow for that... ooookay...

Another quote from article:

It's not a legal process — you won't get any tax breaks for marrying yourself. It's more a "rebuke" of tradition, says Rebecca Traister, author of All the Single Ladies: Unmarried Women and the Rise of an Independent Nation. "For generations, if women wanted to have economic stability and a socially sanctioned sex life or children, there was enormous social and economic pressure to do that within marriage," she says. "Personally, as someone who lived for many years single and then did get married, I know that the kind of affirmation I got for getting married was unlike anything I'd ever had in any other part of my life." That, she adds, is "incredibly unjust."

So she married herself to find "justice" from a society that gives affirmations only when one is married? Where's the revolution in that?

Here's a couple more quotes for your daily cognitive dissonance (reds for a sanity respite):

Nonetheless, the stigma for single women remains. "It's left over from centuries of one kind of marriage pattern and one path for women," Traister says. She recalls reading books as a girl in which the story always ended when the heroine got married, as if that were the ultimate goal. "We're set up as a culture to treat marriage as the most exciting thing you'll ever do in your life," she says. "But if you marry yourself, you can say: My life is just as meaningful as the life of the person who happens to be getting married."

Not everyone understood. Her dad back home in the Midwest asked, "Is this for real?" A guy she knew said it sounded narcissistic and pointless. But Erika says loving yourself, and being yourself, is a good thing. "I think freedom should mean freedom to choose our own path," she says. "And marrying yourself isn't surrendering to the wedding-industrial complex. It's saying yes to something new."

 

[theos]

Not everyone understood. Her dad back home in the Midwest asked, "Is this for real?" A guy she knew said it sounded narcissistic and pointless.

Narcissistic, pointless and a precious snowflakey bastardization of marriage. I wonder why the article failed to mention the honeymoon?

 

[DianaRose]

This interview showcases Miley Cyrus one of the strongest advocates for 'gender theory' Her inner landscape is quite disturbing, Or so I think.

In an interview with TIME, Cyrus talks about her past relationships, Instagram insecurities and her new role as an advocate for people across the gender spectrum
http://time.com/3918308/miley-cyrus-transgender-rights-instapride/

It doesn’t take much to summon a whirlwind of words from Miley Cyrus, who answers every question with a torrent. She darts from memories of football games in Nashville to pop star etiquette to how America is obsessed with sex—all so quickly that some words are hard to distinguish. (Except the profanity, which she uses at roughly the same rate teens use emoji.) Occasionally she slows, camping up her light Nashville drawl to mock the conservative politicians who are at odds with her new social-justice mission: teaching America that there’s more to gender than deciding someone is a girl or boy in the delivery room—and supporting people across the gender spectrum.

Cyrus counts herself among the people who don’t feel they fit in the traditional boxes, saying she doesn’t like the labels boy or girl or even gender fluid, though she’s settled on the latter for now. “I’m just equal. I’m just even. It has nothing to do with any parts of me or how I dress or how I look. It’s literally just how I feel,” Cyrus says during a break from taking pictures for Happy Hippie Presents #InstaPride in Los Angeles last month. The campaign is a collaboration between Happy Hippie—her non-profit dedicated to helping homeless and LGBT youth—and Instagram, aimed at spreading positive images of gender-nonconforming people and the families who love them.

''I’m just equal. I’m just even'' - Or in other words. Defining yourself as your correct gender makes you unequal

Cyrus, wearing a yellow jumpsuit that hugs no curves and shows little skin, is talking about how she’s been sexually open for years and felt androgynous long before she heard the phrase gender fluid. She says she was the person other sexually curious teenage girls came to in Nashville: “They all wanted to experiment. I was always the one.” Now, when she does arrive somewhere wearing little but pasties and butterfly wings, she knows there will be critics who shame her for having her “tits out,” as she puts it. But she says she keeps doing it to challenge people: “I’m using it as a power stance,” she says. “It’s funny to see people try to look me in the eye.”

Just shows that her behavior is tide to an agenda

Like a college student exploring gender and sexuality in a very public seminar, Cyrus is combing back over the experiences of her youth in search of new kinds of understanding. Many of the people she’s photographing at the #InstaPride shoot have been on long journeys to find themselves, too. Greta Martela came out as a transgender woman late in life while living as a 44-year-old single dad. Tyler Ford, a close friend of Ariana Grande who grew up with the star in Boca Raton, came out as a transgender man before they (Ford’s preferred pronoun) stopped taking testosterone and started identifying as agender—meaning they feel they have no gender at all.“People try to make everyone something,” Cyrus says. “You can just be whatever you want to be.”

She’s familiar with the feeling of people trying to make her something she’s not. Before she was smoking weed, dropping F-bombs and decorating her private parts with paint and ribbons for Paper magazine, she became famous as a child star on the Disney Channel series Hannah Montana. Back then, her fans were scandalized when Annie Leibovitz took a picture of her with her back exposed; Cyrus, then 15, said she was “embarrassed” by the picture and apologized. She was a young girl reporting to a bunch of old men in suits who told her how a budding pop star needed to look and act. Cyrus recalls coming back from one Hannah Montana summer hiatus with braces on. “I had to take them off immediately because of the way I looked,” she says. “If I was me now, I would have been like, ‘F— you. Normal 14-year-olds have braces. I’m going to have braces on the show, so kids who have braces in real life know that’s okay.’ But I didn’t have that in my mind then. I was coming from Nashville. My grandma’s a beauty queen. I didn’t know.”

Now 22, Cyrus isn’t worried about offending anyone. “Someone said the other day to me, ‘Should you ask your advisor?’” she says. “I’m like, ‘If I have an advisor, they should have been fired two years ago.’” And when Cyrus does offend someone, she doesn’t jump to apologize. Bristol Palin, daughter of former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin and onetime Dancing With the Stars contestant, lashed out at Cyrus on her blog in a post titled, “Miley Cyrus Claims She’s ‘Least Judgmental Person Ever,’ Calls Christians ‘Insane Motherf—ers.'” Palin took issue with comments included in the Paper magazine interview, accusing Cyrus of being open-minded only toward people who think like her. But Cyrus says that isn’t true.

“Happy Hippie and what I’m about is all about acceptance. That isn’t what I meant at all,” she says. “You say what you say, and I meant it, but it wasn’t necessarily my full thought.” She says there will always be critics, giving the example of Caitlyn Jenner coming out as transgender. Though it was widely praised, a smaller contingency criticized how the Vanity Fair cover shoot perpetuated cisgender standards of beauty. “You can’t make every single person agree with what you say,” Cyrus says. “You got to just say your truth.”

That’s what Cyrus is doing now, in opening up about how she’s had past relationships with both men and women—and about having a future that could involve a husband or wife or perhaps being a single mom by choice. She’s also reflecting on how dissatisfied she felt in past romances, especially with the expectations for how men and women are supposed to act.

With guys, Cyrus says, there was an “overly macho energy” that she didn’t like. “That made me feel like I had to be a femme-bot, which I’m not. And then when I was with a girl, I felt like, ‘Oh s—, she’s going to need someone to protect her, so I’m going to need to have this macho energy.’ And that didn’t feel right either.” Cyrus says she sat in a restaurant with her male date last Valentine’s Day and started crying, looking at the older heterosexual couples around her. “All the women in the restaurant were with these older, fat men that had just let themselves go. They were just being drunk bastards. And then the women were sitting there, trying so hard just to look good. And they’re ignoring them the whole time. And I thought, ‘I’m not living like this,’” she says. “If I end up in a straight relationship, that’s fine—but I’m not going to be with f—ing slob guys who are watching porn, making all their girls feel ugly.”

I think she is making stuff up or exaggerating just to send out the message that tradional relationships enslaves us all. So we should all embrace 'gender theory' and find our true selves.

She traces her fluid feelings about relationships and gender back to her own parents, country singer Billy Ray Cyrus and producer Tish Cyrus. “I don’t associate men and protection necessarily,” Cyrus says. “I think that’s what’s given me the openness of sexuality. Not that my dad wasn’t an awesome protector, but I trust my mom to save me. She’s the prince. I never had that fairy tale.” She recalls crying before dates as a teenager, stressed about people noticing flaws like a pimple. Now she says she’s much less concerned with the superficial stuff. “F—ing is easy. You can find someone to f— in five seconds,” she says. “We want to find someone we can talk to. And be ourselves with. That’s fairly slim pickings.”

Social media can still make her cringe and doubt herself, a feeling with which most young women will likely identify. “Every time you post a new photo, you might get 3,000 amazing things and then you get one s—-y one and it damages you,” she says. “I’ll do the same thing. I’ll post my art and everyone can say it’s great. And then some motherf—er says one thing and you’re like, ‘Well, maybe I am s—-y.’ It sticks in your head.” Cyrus sees girls making duck-faces to get likes on social media and wants to put other examples out there, for an audience that includes her younger teenage sister. “It’s so bad. You look at Instagram and you think, ‘Oh, I don’t look that way.’ And it makes you feel like s—. You start scrolling and you see all these people you’ll never be like and they have so many followers and so many friends,” she says. Hence the #InstaPride campaign: “That’s why we want to do it through Instagram—enough of these pictures. Let’s get some likes on some real pictures.”

Cyrus is bent on helping other people be confident in themselves, sometimes reaching out to individual fans through Twitter. One girl who took a cue from Cyrus was reprimanded for wearing a “Legalize Gay” shirt to school, so Cyrus contacted the school and sent the girl that T-shirt in every available color. Still, she says she feels some uncertainty for telling young people to be themselves, because she knows it’s not as easy for everyone as it is for her now—that a transgender kid who comes out to their parents may well end up on the street. “I hope more kids don’t do what I did and sit in their room and cry, thinking ‘I just don’t know what I’m supposed to be,’” she says. “But when I tell kids sometimes, ‘Just be yourself,’ I feel like, ‘I hope you can do that. Can you really do that?’”

It's not about liberation!! All she does is encouraging mental illness.

Cyrus seems drawn to the LGBT community in part of the solidarity that’s abundant there. She recently went to the finals of RuPaul’s Drag Race, but says she’s not particularly interested in attending award shows—even if they’re a good opportunity to send a once-homeless youth on stage to give A-listers a homily. She responds better to the unbridled, flamboyant support that RuPaul’s contestants gave one another as they performed. “Beyonce would never be down in the front row cheering on Katy Perry,” she says. Perhaps because unlike people who are in the throes of coming out, pop stars often have to pretend to be something they’re not. That’s not something Cyrus is willing to do anymore—even if she’s still figuring out who she is.

I wonder what she will turn into, much be some 'gender' we haven't seen before.

“Maybe if you’re finally getting to be yourself, it’s more of a celebration,” she says, surrounded by new gender-nonconforming friends at the shoot in Hollywood. “Like, you are living your f—ing life.”

To be fair I'm not sure Cyrus is the healthiest of person mentally speaking. I know someone who got to know her when she was still a Disney kid. According to this person, Cyrus went through a lot of horrible things. I think that's why she's at the same time extremely narcissistic and yet truly seems to want to do good. In any case, she's a very good puppet.

 

[Renaissance]

This interview showcases Miley Cyrus one of the strongest advocates for 'gender theory' Her inner landscape is quite disturbing, Or so I think.

Sounds like Cyrus was severely damaged as a child star and now is passing that damage onto other youth with her fame.

 

[obyvatel]

"And marrying yourself isn't surrendering to the wedding-industrial complex. It's saying yes to something new."

Yeah right.

Self-marriage is a small but growing movement, with consultants and self-wedding planners popping up across the world. In Canada, a service called Marry Yourself Vancouver launched this past summer, offering consulting services and wedding photography. In Japan, a travel agency called Cerca Travel offers a two-day self-wedding package in Kyoto: You can choose a wedding gown, bouquet, and hairstyle, and pose for formal wedding portraits. On the website I Married Me, you can buy a DIY marriage kit: For $50, you get a sterling silver ring, ceremony instructions, vows, and 24 "affirmation cards" to remind you of your vows over time. For $230, you can get the kit with a 14-karat gold ring.

 

[Windmill knight]

This thing about marrying yourself is up there with Flat Earth theory. Perhaps it's another sign of the disintegration of personalities. I really hope it is just one or two people who do that. Otherwise, what hope for humanity?

 

[Possibility of Being]

This thing about marrying yourself is up there with Flat Earth theory. Perhaps it's another sign of the disintegration of personalities. I really hope it is just one or two people who do that. Otherwise, what hope for humanity?

Yeah, logic is not their cup of tea. Just think. Now she is married. All right. So when she gets into a romantic situation with someone, she is unfaithful, right? And if she happens to fall in love with someone and wants to get married, she has to divorce from herself first, right? Good luck with that!

The world is upside down. More and more (if that's possible) with each coming day.

 

[bjorb]

[quote author= DianaRose94]To be fair I'm not sure Cyrus is the healthiest of person mentally speaking. I know someone who got to know her when she was still a Disney kid. According to this person, Cyrus went through a lot of horrible things. I think that's why she's at the same time extremely narcissistic and yet truly seems to want to do good. In any case, she's a very good puppet.[/quote]

Correct me if I am wrong, but it's my impression that many of those Disney kids end up mentally screwed. Just what is happening over there?



-----------------------------------

Selling the idea that sexuality is just a construct of mere subjectivity, gay porn is liberating straight men... :

1 in 5 straight men watch gay porn, according to researchers
https://www.indy100.com/article/sexuality-porn-gay-straight-homosexual-heterosexual-viewing-data-statistics-survey-7510826

A new study has tracked the porn-viewing habits of 821 gay, straight, and bisexual men.

The study, published in Archives of Sexual Behaviour, found that 55 per cent of men identifying as 'gay' watched 'straight' porn, while 21 per cent of men identifying as 'straight' watched 'gay' porn.

It prompted researchers to ask the question:

Are these men really identifying themselves as what they are?

Dr Martin J Downing, the study's lead researcher, said the study confirmed the men identifying as 'straight' didn't have sex with men, while the men who identified as 'gay' didn't report having sex with women.

Their behaviour and identity appeared to align, so Downing saw the viewing habits as “some level of evidence” of sexual attraction being a spectrum across sexes, at least in terms of the pornography people viewed.

Downing said the viewing habits of men identifying as 'bisexual' were quite different from men identifying as 'gay' or 'straight'. They reported watching a significant amount of 'straight' porn, 'gay' porn, and 'bisexual' porn.

[Bisexual men] are more like heterosexual men in some things, and more like gay men in other things, but that’s a reflection of their own unique attractions. They’re not identical to either group in terms of their porn viewing, which I think is really interesting for understanding bisexuality.

The study adds weight to arguments that male porn consumption is more varied than common preconceptions and that male sexuality is a broader and distinct spectrum than we previously thought.