Ketoadaptation - Consensus

[Marcus-Aurelius]

This is a very great idea! If I remember how I struggled and I'm still struggling with diet! Available infos are just overwhelming and making a book condensing same is just wonderful! Thanks for thinking about this, Gaby!

 

[l apprenti de forgeron]

Thank you very much Gaby! It's a great and wonderful idea.
I'm obviously trying to systematically read the important threads about the diet, but the amount of data is quite overwhelming. And, for example, I have just recently increased my fat intake (before that I think it was 50% fat and 50% protein, or even more proteins, which made me lose much weight). I still have doubts (many), so this idea is a great service to many people who may benefit from this information. Thank you again.

 

[paralleloscope]

Good idea indeed, and yes the viral crunch seems to be near, so a distilled easy to use guide will be very helpful.

Personally I haven't had any real problems with keto transition. I've always regarded myself as someone with very resistant genes, apart from some incidents of strong reaction to alcohol, milk and tomatoes in my teens, which after short removals I'd return to consuming for 20 years, without noticeable reaction. Keyword here being: noticeable. 5 years ago I found myself weakened from a 1½ year venture as a vegetarian. The weakness was noticed in the physical, and in retrospect mentally/ emotionally unstable, having become increasingly sensitive to noise and Wi-fi/ EMF fields. This got better after starting a supplemented paleo period, cutting out alcohol, dairy and gluten, leading to a much more stable psyche and body, also being able to live in an noisy and electric urban area again.

Now after 2 -3 years on a ketogenic diet, I'm much better off in every area, in fact I haven't been ill for 3 years. Of course other factors than diet have played in to my much improved life, such as learning how to breathe and getting in touch with my body and feelings. Learning about oneself definitely also plays in, to extend ones attention and reasoning in times of subliminal carb temptations. And as hinted above; taking notice of my what my body was telling me has come as a late lesson in life, which when looking back has a lot to do with diet. Even though I may have had a tendency to suppress feelings and emotions from childhood, this act has been reinforced by bad diet and its many off-the-radar ways of soothing emotional bumps with chemical highs.

Even though my diet now is circa 95 % fat and meat, my favorite treat while having been keto active has been dried dates, and it took me a while to figure out that I just shouldn't eat them, as they gave me irritated bowels and negative emotions every time. I was for a long time aware that my colon would react, and I accepted the trade-off but first when I was shown repeatedly that it would produce hours worth of being dominated by negative emotions did I stop.

After having healed in many ways with the diet, as well as going from hyper sensitive to what I think is just normally sensitive towards EMF, I joined a support group for EHS (Electro Hyper Sensitive) people, to tell my healing story and findings of diet as well as posting links to supplements. The group was young and there still wasn't any simple guide around about keto, so my attempts to link diet and electro sensitivity failed. (I still haven't found proper evidence, though I'm sure there's a link with mitigating EHS with a less stress inducing diet, keto-adaption and/ or vagus stimulation.) These were mainly normal people just awakening to the fact that science must be bit skewed since their doctors and health ministry regarded their symptoms as figments of imagination, so arguing the many points about modern diet, as well as articles at the time still were very technical, didn't go over too well. But there was also the phantom of vegetarianism, popular in groups just starting to form an alternative worldview. Despite vegetarianism and Raw food movements seem to have grown in popularity, so has an overall general awareness into food and health topics in groups that are open to a necessary new paradigm, so I think a simplified keto guide will be a timely thing.

I love how sated fat makes me feel, as well as the fact that I don't have to spend much time in the kitchen, (literally under 10 minutes a day) and I'm fully sated with two meals a day. Ok, maybe I'll throw in some cracklings in the middle of the day.

Don't know how ideological you want it to go, but maybe part of a chapter could highlight animal welfare (grass-fed and cared for animals) as well as the vegetarian meme? Points that I've needed to remind myself of often enough: How every being that lives has to let the life of another being go. How there is a natural order of food chains, which provide sufficient nutritional information for the more developed group of beings above it. Just because a plant doesn't have a face doesn't mean it doesn't have feelings.

 

[Arwenn]

Great idea Gaby, as we were discussing in the Jeff Volek thread. Is there any way that we can help? Were you wanting feedback for a certain aspect of the keto experience? How were you thinking of organizing the document? I ask because forum members might be better able to chime in with their experiences etc. specific to a particular aspect of the whole keto experience. I compiled a short list below of the health advice in general that I've come across on the forum (in no particular order):

Why go keto - the science behind it
Recipes
Supplements (initial, and ongoing)
Detoxing
Healing the gut, candida
Initial side effects, transitioning
Monitoring -calculators and ketone meters, keto sticks
Managing Weight loss and weight gain
Exercise- resistance training with weights
Intermittent fasting
Regulating sleep
Cold baths
Far infrared saunas

In my case I really have had to focus on healing my gut, and keeping the fat up. I need to find a nicer coconut milk than what I've been experimenting with as well as taking digestive enzymes. Ultimately, I need to get myself a ketone meter to really know where it's at and to chart my progress.

Once again a sincere thank you for undertaking this project!

 

[Gaby]

Great idea Gaby, as we were discussing in the Jeff Volek thread. Is there any way that we can help? Were you wanting feedback for a certain aspect of the keto experience? How were you thinking of organizing the document? I ask because forum members might be better able to chime in with their experiences etc. specific to a particular aspect of the whole keto experience. I compiled a short list below of the health advice in general that I've come across on the forum (in no particular order):

The most useful thing is for people to continue to report their experiences in the various threads, problems they are having and how they are solving them. Testimonials are great too. Those who are very silent and don't post a lot, but have done the diet, it will be nice to hear about them too.

I'm revising and updating a document I did nearly 2 years ago, and I'm realizing it has already covered what people are putting in their wish lists The ketogenic article was extracted from there. I deleted so much stuff from the original (including FIR sauna and cold adaptation), but I'll add it back because people want to know the basic "how to" and it is one of those things that might help people to transition faster.

It is the practical "how to" of the diet that needs more updating according to people's experiences and troubleshooting. The more problems they report, the more we can make sure they are addressed in the documents. If there are no problems, good :)

For instance, problems with the Fat Bomb so it can be explained how it is best to approach it by eating throughout the day and with HCl instead of having it in one gulp. Will that solve the problem? Are people getting constipated with it?

The usual practical problems and their solutions are currently covered, but it will be nice to hear more experiences to see how things are evolving.

Also, the recipes are looking good, but if some of you have special ways of preparing fatty meats (i.e. in the oven), that would be nice to have. More numbers for recipes that are lacking it to make sure how much protein, fat and carbs they have (i.e. the liver paté).

In my case I really have had to focus on healing my gut, and keeping the fat up. I need to find a nicer coconut milk than what I've been experimenting with as well as taking digestive enzymes.

Yeah, it can be hard to tolerate big amounts of fat in the beginning. Taking care of your liver would also help: other than digestive enzymes, there is HCl, oxbile, milk thistle and alpha lipoic acid which helps with sluggish liver issues. Let us know how it goes ;)

 

[Altair]

Thanks a lot, Gaby. Such a book would be of great help for us :)

 

[ashu]

The most useful thing is for people to continue to report their experiences in the various threads, problems they are having and how they are solving them. Testimonials are great too. Those who are very silent and don't post a lot, but have done the diet, it will be nice to hear about them too.

This is a great idea, thank you for starting this thread Gaby . I have been struggling with eating more fat compared to protein. When Laura posted up the recipe for the fat bomb - that was like a god send. I find that I can eat a lot of fat this way and not feel hungry whatsoever. Its now been 13 days whereby I have been having a fat bomb every day. Some days (particularly this week) I have felt a wee bit nauseous, but the milk thistle has helped.

It is the practical "how to" of the diet that needs more updating according to people's experiences and troubleshooting. The more problems they report, the more we can make sure they are addressed in the documents. If there are no problems, good :)

I still need to buy the supplements as recommended by Maria Emmerich in Keto Adapted as I think that this will help with the adjustments to the diet.

For instance, problems with the Fat Bomb so it can be explained how it is best to approach it by eating throughout the day and with HCl instead of having it in one gulp. Will that solve the problem? Are people getting constipated with it?

I am getting constipated however, is this normal?

 

[Gaby]

I am getting constipated however, is this normal?

Constipation is common in ketoadaptation. I'm keeping an eye on this because some have reported it. I think the fat bomb should help though, let's see how it goes. Some magnesium or salted water will help.

Thank you for sharing! It seems that yeah, some do need help with the fat bomb, but that overall, it is a god send :)

Taking care of sluggish liver problems and helping digestion is very important for keto-adaptation. I hope you resolve your issues.

Let us know how it goes. :)

 

[Nancy2feathers]

Great idea Gaby, as we were discussing in the Jeff Volek thread. Is there any way that we can help? Were you wanting feedback for a certain aspect of the keto experience? How were you thinking of organizing the document? I ask because forum members might be better able to chime in with their experiences etc. specific to a particular aspect of the whole keto experience. I compiled a short list below of the health advice in general that I've come across on the forum (in no particular order):

Why go keto - the science behind it
Recipes
Supplements (initial, and ongoing)
Detoxing
Healing the gut, candida
Initial side effects, transitioning
Monitoring -calculators and ketone meters, keto sticks
Managing Weight loss and weight gain
Exercise- resistance training with weights
Intermittent fasting
Regulating sleep
Cold baths
Far infrared saunas

In my case I really have had to focus on healing my gut, and keeping the fat up. I need to find a nicer coconut milk than what I've been experimenting with as well as taking digestive enzymes. Ultimately, I need to get myself a ketone meter to really know where it's at and to chart my progress.

Once again a sincere thank you for undertaking this project!

Along with exercise, I would like to add Pilates. It`s a great way to get a workout, feel the burn, but a little gentler on the bod at my age! :D

 

[happyliza]

Great Idea Gaby and the video 'How to' as well.

My suggestions (second attempt as lost the last one) are:

Recipes to be for two people max so people like me who botch things up don't waste precious ingredients and money. Plus we can just multiply the ingredients to make more once we have got the hang of it.

Can we know which recipes we can freeze for larger batches?.

Not everyone can get all the ingredients. I cannot get coconut cream, milk (too many additives and E numbers here and only 55% milk), plain gelatin, Xylitol and liquid stevia are a few. Sad as I think I would enjoy the coconut custard.

How to weigh and measure. I have no idea how to work out how much I taking or weighing cooked weight or raw weight and how you work out the fat ratios on daily meals or recipes. I don't understand the calculator either. So I know I am doing things wrong from the off. I never did any diet where you measure stuff. Like fat in pork belly how would I calculate that? Raw or cooked.

Snacks too - no easy ham or pork chorizos or salamis here and I find all my fats melt so whenever I take them with me in an emergency no matter what container or jar I put them in they leak all over the place in these temperatures.

I still haven't got past the sugar cravings yet - well chocolate in my case as I don't usually take sugar in anything.

Supplements. For instance essential ones, others that should also be taken if possible, and those that 'would be nice' if you could afford it.

Just my thoughts for now FWIW thanks.

That is all I can think of for now - thanks.

 

[Oxajil]

Not everyone can get all the ingredients. I cannot get coconut cream, milk (too many additives and E numbers here and only 55% milk), plain gelatin, Xylitol and liquid stevia are a few. Sad as I think I would enjoy the coconut custard.

Have you tried ordering online? Like iherb.com?

Snacks too - no easy ham or pork chorizos or salamis here and I find all my fats melt so whenever I take them with me in an emergency no matter what container or jar I put them in they leak all over the place in these temperatures.

In my case, chorizos and salamis cause a reaction, and mostly a headache, it's probably due to the spices and high protein. Perhaps if you can get the ingredients and get to make the fat bomb, you could have that as a snack? Or homemade fatty chocolate? Maybe bits of bacon with butter?

With regard to the jar, you might want to think about buying leak-proof thermo-jars, that will keep things from leaking and will also keep your food many hours cold or warm. Here's an example: _http://www.amazon.com/Thermos-Stainless-King-16-Ounce-Midnight/dp/B0017IFSIS/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1398533947&sr=8-1&keywords=thermos+king+jar

I still haven't got past the sugar cravings yet - well chocolate in my case as I don't usually take sugar in anything.

I think of all the cravings I've had, eating store bought chocolate, even the high% cacao ones (organic/non-organic), are the worst on my system. It causes: disorientation, nauseousnous, lack of concentration, lack of strength, geez, a whole list! It took me some time to get over it, and now I'm avoiding it like the plague! :P Maybe it helps if you write down what you experience, and see whether the cons are worth it, and see if that helps with kicking the habit? Replacing it with homemade chocolate could help too! Also, taking magnesium could be a great help.

Hope this helps.

 

[daddycat]

It is a pleasant surprise to learn that a person can go directly to ketoadaption, without other steps in between. I do have a lot of reading to do in the health threads, so I am ignorant about which supplements are necessary for ketoadaption.

 

[LQB]

Also, the recipes are looking good, but if some of you have special ways of preparing fatty meats (i.e. in the oven), that would be nice to have. More numbers for recipes that are lacking it to make sure how much protein, fat and carbs they have (i.e. the liver paté).

Here is a combo recipe for a beef liver pate and a slow-cooked beef dish. I like to combine a dollop of each in a bowl and warm it up to produce a very tasty thick stew that has very high fat content. When you stir it up a bit, the fat mixes well so its not like you are slurping up pure fat. The fat/protein/carb content will depend on what you actually use, but even with the onion added, the per serving carb content will be very low.

Beef Liver Pate

1-1 ½ lbs beef liver
1lb beef heart (Head Cheese from US Wellness) or other organs
1lb liverwurst or braunswieger or other organs
1 ½ - 2lbs ground beef
1 package bacon
4 cups lard or bacon fat (rendered)
1 med onion
2 TBL dried garlic granules
2 TBL salt
Ground nutmeg to taste
2 Tsp dried thyme
½ Tsp dried Dill
1 Tsp dried Sage
2 Tsp ground pepper


• Grind the bacon in a processor to a paste (wash the processor before use below)
• Begin cooking the bacon in the fat/lard in a large pot
• Cut the liver/organ meats into ¼ to ½ inch pieces and add to pot
• Add all other meat to the pot
• Cook on Med-Low slowly for about 1 to 1 ½ hr
• Remove from heat and let the pot cool to warm
• Put cut up onion (or onion powder) and spices in clean food processor and grind to a paste
• Add meat/fat mixture from pot and grind until smooth
• Transfer ground mixture to a large bowl
• Grind all the meat fat and transfer to the bowl
• Mix the bowl well and transfer to the fridge
• Done – this will keep in the fridge for many weeks

Beef Roast – Slow Cooked

5 Packages beef short ribs OR 3-4 lb chuck roast
1 Qt Bone broth (including fat)
1 ½ TBL low-sugar berry preserves
2 TBL apple cider vinegar
2 TBL Nama Shoyu soy sauce (organic, unpasteurized, fermented) – OR – add salt
2 Med onions (optional)
Dried garlic granules
Extra beef tallow 1 ½ cups (optional)


• Sprinkle the meat with garlic granules
• In the slow cooker pot, mix broth, vinegar, soy sauce, preserves
• Arrange meat in pot so that it is covered in the broth
• Add extra tallow and quartered onions on top
• Cook on LOW overnight
• Allow to cool
• Remove meat from bones/grizzle, return to pot, mix, and put pot (covered) in fridge
• Should stay good in the fridge for 2 weeks or freeze excess for later

I sent this combo recipe to WAPF's Sally Fallon for a new cookbook she is working on.

 

[Psalehesost]

It is a pleasant surprise to learn that a person can go directly to ketoadaption, without other steps in between. I do have a lot of reading to do in the health threads, so I am ignorant about which supplements are necessary for ketoadaption.

It's largely a matter of individual needs. People can run into a variety of problems after a lifetime on a "standard" diet (or even years on our old paleo diet), and for each of these there are some solutions. Until you run into problems, it's hard to say what exactly you will end up needing, though some digestive aid (e.g. Betaine HCl, oxbile, ...) are among the most common.

Until Gaby's documents are ready, Emmerich's book Keto-Adapted seems to be the best source addressing the problems people commonly run into as they adopt the ketogenic diet. So you can pretty much look up whatever issues you run into and find e.g. some dietary adjustment or some supplement that can resolve the issue during the transition - or in some cases, it's a matter of correcting some bad habit (often something that many think is "good for us"). Eventually, when the body has fully adapted, additional supplements are no longer necessary. (Though HCl and a few other things can still be good to have on hand at times.)

You can also search the forum when you experience some specific issue - it may have been discussed. Beforehand, though, there's no telling what you'll end up needing, if anything.

 

[Minas Tirith]

I am getting constipated however, is this normal?

I am on Day 8 and I had to double my Magnesium intake. The dosis I am taking now would have sent me to the bathroom immediately two weeks ago, but now it keeps me regular. Maria Emmrich recommends using Magnesium and I guess one just needs more in the transition phase. So if you are taking Magnesium and it stopped working for you, it might be time to amp up the intake (cautiously).

M.T.