"Night Owls" more likely to exhibit psychopathology?

[Bobo08]

I think that the idea that people who need very little sleep is more interesting. Margaret Thatcher, for example, is reported to have only slept 4 hours per night.

I find that interesting as well. I don't know if it was in Women who Love Psychopaths but there was a mention of these pathological types trying to keep their prey up late or keep them from getting enough rest so they could better control them. The pathologicals themselves don't seem to be worried or feel much of an effect from lack of sleep. I had an ex-boyfriend who, when we were first dating, tried to get me to stay out at all hours. Another thing I noticed about these types is that they don't seem to be bothered by working extra long hours or taking on more shifts at work. It's as if there is nothing in their personal lives or physical makeups which would be inconvenienced by working so much.

I do remember reading somewhere that suggests that psychopaths need very little sleep.

From a more esoteric angle, the Cs said that humans need sleep for soul-recharging. Could it be that pathologicals who don't have souls need little of that "recharging"? Not sure if it is too "out there" or not...

 

[adam7117]

I think that the idea that people who need very little sleep is more interesting. Margaret Thatcher, for example, is reported to have only slept 4 hours per night.

I find that interesting as well. I don't know if it was in Women who Love Psychopaths but there was a mention of these pathological types trying to keep their prey up late or keep them from getting enough rest so they could better control them. The pathologicals themselves don't seem to be worried or feel much of an effect from lack of sleep. I had an ex-boyfriend who, when we were first dating, tried to get me to stay out at all hours. Another thing I noticed about these types is that they don't seem to be bothered by working extra long hours or taking on more shifts at work. It's as if there is nothing in their personal lives or physical makeups which would be inconvenienced by working so much.

I do remember reading somewhere that suggests that psychopaths need very little sleep.

From a more esoteric angle, the Cs said that humans need sleep for soul-recharging. Could it be that pathologicals who don't have souls need little of that "recharging"? Not sure if it is too "out there" or not...

Bobo - my thoughts precisely.

 

[knowledge_of_self]

Well, I am and have been a night owl type for most of my life. One of my early memories is me reading a book at night with a flashlight under a cover. For some reason, I couldn't read during the day. In school time it was about doing not school related things that my mother didn't approve. So I'm wondering whether it's genetic or learned tendency... But I used to read at night even before, so I just don't know.

I've also been a night owl most of my life. I also have a bad trait of being really grumpy in the mornings when I wake up. It doesn't matter how much sleep I've gotten either, when I have to get up, I just don't want to! :P

Recently since I started going back to work I've been sleeping normally again which I really like. I have a lot more energy during the day and I like being out in the sun! I always considered my being a night owl a bad habit but never thought deeply about it being something that makes you more pathological. :/

I do know that my father was a night owl as well and always wondered if it was a genetic thing. I do know that a lot of people in Iran are night owls. Reason being simply that it's way too hot during the day (especially in the spring/summer) to go outside, so people sleep in the day and get up very late in the afternoon and stay up until 2-3am. So I wonder if climate has also been taken into consideration.

Uh oh, I just realized it's actually really past my bed time now. There is not enough hours in the day, I tell ya... ;)

 

[Olesya]

I think that the idea that people who need very little sleep is more interesting. Margaret Thatcher, for example, is reported to have only slept 4 hours per night.

I find that interesting as well. I don't know if it was in Women who Love Psychopaths but there was a mention of these pathological types trying to keep their prey up late or keep them from getting enough rest so they could better control them. The pathologicals themselves don't seem to be worried or feel much of an effect from lack of sleep. I had an ex-boyfriend who, when we were first dating, tried to get me to stay out at all hours. Another thing I noticed about these types is that they don't seem to be bothered by working extra long hours or taking on more shifts at work. It's as if there is nothing in their personal lives or physical makeups which would be inconvenienced by working so much.

I do remember reading somewhere that suggests that psychopaths need very little sleep.

From a more esoteric angle, the Cs said that humans need sleep for soul-recharging. Could it be that pathologicals who don't have souls need little of that "recharging"? Not sure if it is too "out there" or not...

Bobo - my thoughts precisely.

I had the same thought as well. Just to add, I remembered reading that Josef Stalin had a habit to conduct his meetings very late at night, keeping all his stuff and members of government awake through the night. They had to be awake waiting for the possible phone call from him. He also slept very little, especially during the Second World War.

From the account of his chief bodyguard here _http://informacia.ru/topsecret/1/994-461.html (quick translation)

He slept very little, and during the way he sometimes didn't go to sleep at all... just napping for an hour or two during the day..

From another Russian source here: _http://www.istpravda.com.ua/digest/2013/03/5/29208/view_print/ (quick translation)

As it's well known, Stalin was working in Kremlin mainly in the evenings up until very late hours of the night.

[...]

For decision making of the current problems, visitors often were invited to his dacha during the day or to dinner after midnight.

 

[Olesya]

Well, I am and have been a night owl type for most of my life. One of my early memories is me reading a book at night with a flashlight under a cover. For some reason, I couldn't read during the day. In school time it was about doing not school related things that my mother didn't approve. So I'm wondering whether it's genetic or learned tendency... But I used to read at night even before, so I just don't know.

I've also been a night owl most of my life. I also have a bad trait of being really grumpy in the mornings when I wake up. It doesn't matter how much sleep I've gotten either, when I have to get up, I just don't want to! :P

I always considered my being a night owl a bad habit but never thought deeply about it being something that makes you more pathological. :/

Same here. "Night owl" since adolescence. For me, is mostly because during the late evenings, night time when everyone is asleep and there are no distractions (it's very hard for me to concentrate where there are noises) I can read, write and do other things more efficiently. I'm not going partying at night. Almost never did when I was young. Just never liked it. In the mornings, I need at least two hours to come into my senses. I require 7-8 hours of uninterrupted sleep at night, and that's depending on the levels of stress during the day. It maybe even more. I don't have insomnia and have very deep sleep. Well, having said that, I'm struggling with changing this habit. Maybe, it's just of question of getting myself more organized during the day? Making lists and so on?

About 10 years ago, I made an experiment and discovered that if I wake up at 4-5 am in the morning. The time period from 4-7 am is as productive as late night hours. But for that I need to go to sleep at 9 pm or even earlier. That's difficult for me to do, but not impossible, osit.

 

[H-KQGE]

I do know that a lot of people in Iran are night owls. Reason being simply that it's way too hot during the day (especially in the spring/summer) to go outside, so people sleep in the day and get up very late in the afternoon and stay up until 2-3am. So I wonder if climate has also been taken into consideration.

What about Spaniards & the whole siesta thing? When it comes to the world's most popular sport football (soccer) they start around 9pm, & eat big meals at that time too. I'm all for resting in the afternoon but that late night stuff went in my teens.

 

[loreta]

So psychopaths are night owls, don't need to sleep normally, they are like night insects. They like the obscurity, they prefer obscurity than the light. But not all night owls are psychopaths.

Vampires also are unable to function well during the day. :)

In Spain people take supper, for example, around 10 o'clock at night. Spaniards don't have a good sleep. What I see is that societies that are well organized, practical and socially better have a regular schedule with a good night of sleep.

 

[neema]

So psychopaths are night owls, don't need to sleep normally, they are like night insects. They like the obscurity, they prefer obscurity than the light. But not all night owls are psychopaths.

Vampires also are unable to function well during the day. :)

In Spain people take supper, for example, around 10 o'clock at night. Spaniards don't have a good sleep. What I see is that societies that are well organized, practical and socially better have a regular schedule with a good night of sleep.

I think like everything else in life there are shades of gray to this phenomenon. Personally my sleeping patterns depend on when I slept last.

But I have to say I’m a morning person. You know the type, annoyingly too happy! ;D

I love mornings. The birds chirping, the sun rising, that fresh smell of life in the morning, etc...

I suppose that it all depends on where you're living, because I wouldn’t want to get up in the morning either if I lived in a filthy megalopolis.

 

[Olesya]

I suppose that it all depends on where you're living, because I wouldn’t want to get up in the morning either if I lived in a filthy megalopolis.

That's an interesting point, neema. I lived in the big cities my whole life, Mexico City and Los Angeles are two of them, and are filthy megalopolises. I just remembered that 2 years ago I went camping for 5 days, and during that time I went to sleep at 9.30 pm and woke up at 6.30 by myself with no problems. When I returned to the city, "my new habit" stayed with me for two weeks approximately and then, it disappeared and everything returned to what it was before. Maybe, if I stayed in the woods longer, it would stick? Apparently a week is not enough for me.

Here is from the article posted on SOTT http://www.sott.net/article/264555-Trouble-waking-up-Camping-could-set-your-clock-straight

If you have trouble going to sleep at night and waking up for work or school in the morning, a week of camping in the great outdoors might be just what you need. That's according to evidence reported on August 1 in Current Biology, a Cell Press publication, showing that humans' internal biological clocks will tightly synchronize to a natural, midsummer light-dark cycle, if only they are given the chance.

A week of exposure to true dawn and dusk with nights lit only by a campfire's glow had the biggest effect on people who might otherwise describe themselves as night owls. Under those conditions, they quickly reverted to a schedule much more like an early bird's.

"By increasing our exposure to sunlight and reducing our exposure to electrical lighting at night, we can turn our internal clock and sleep times back and likely make it easier to awaken and be alert in the morning," says Kenneth Wright of the University of Colorado Boulder.

 

[loreta]

To live near nature it is more easy to follow the hours of nature itself. Living in a metropolis it is against nature. So much electricity that permits you to live night as day. Night Owls are related also to night jobs: in hospitals, precincts, fire stations, vigilance. Very stressful jobs, by the way. That makes you a little crazy, I am sure. Night jobs are terrible, very hard. There is also the ignorance that living night as day is not good for your health. I didn't know myself. I didn't know that electricity was not good for me, during night. It is just when you start to sleep well during night, in a black room, and feel better that you start to see. And I am happy now not to be anymore a night owl.

 

[Possibility of Being]

Well, I am and have been a night owl type for most of my life. One of my early memories is me reading a book at night with a flashlight under a cover. For some reason, I couldn't read during the day. In school time it was about doing not school related things that my mother didn't approve. So I'm wondering whether it's genetic or learned tendency... But I used to read at night even before, so I just don't know.

I've also been a night owl most of my life. I also have a bad trait of being really grumpy in the mornings when I wake up. It doesn't matter how much sleep I've gotten either, when I have to get up, I just don't want to! :P

Recently since I started going back to work I've been sleeping normally again which I really like. I have a lot more energy during the day and I like being out in the sun! I always considered my being a night owl a bad habit but never thought deeply about it being something that makes you more pathological. :/

I do know that my father was a night owl as well and always wondered if it was a genetic thing. I do know that a lot of people in Iran are night owls. Reason being simply that it's way too hot during the day (especially in the spring/summer) to go outside, so people sleep in the day and get up very late in the afternoon and stay up until 2-3am. So I wonder if climate has also been taken into consideration.

Uh oh, I just realized it's actually really past my bed time now. There is not enough hours in the day, I tell ya... ;)

Well, I had six years in my life when I had to be up before 6 a.m. 5 days a week so to get my daughter to school on time. You'd think that should be enough time to change a habit. I'd even keep that cycle on weekends to make things easier and surer. And no, that didn't change a thing. Nothing. Null. One night when I can't go to sleep when I should (for whatever reason, Fool Moon being one) is enough for my internal clock to reset itself and go to the night owl cycle, while any change in the other direction takes 'eternity'. But I do have days when I wake up and get up quite early, and I do like it, I just seem not been able to keep that cycle as 'default' and my internal clock is kind of biased in one direction.

My mother was a morning lark type definitely. My father was neither, he could sleep twelve hours or two hours, but always was up on time and never ever used an alarm clock. It was enough for him to know at what time he would need to wake up and that's it. A night train? No problem. Going to work early morning after a long party to late hours? No problem either. That was a really amazing thing to see. I wish I had that gene from him!

 

[Vulcan59]

My father was neither, he could sleep twelve hours or two hours, but always was up on time and never ever used an alarm clock. It was enough for him to know at what time he would need to wake up and that's it. A night train? No problem. Going to work early morning after a long party to late hours? No problem either. That was a really amazing thing to see. I wish I had that gene from him!

Looks like I have the same genes. :) I do however use an alarm clock but more as a security blanket, so to speak. More often than not, I get up before the alarm goes off!

 

[mkrnhr]

Looks like I have the same genes. :) I do however use an alarm clock but more as a security blanket, so to speak. More often than not, I get up before the alarm goes off!

I don't know what kind of weird genes I have: I wake up a minute before the alarm clock rings, set it off, and fall back asleep for another hour or two :D

 

[doublea1535]

After working graveyard shifts for such a long time, and then working late (starting between 12 and 2am) on a frequent basis I've had a hard time switching to a typical 8-5 routine recently. There is a daily morning meeting I am supposed to attend every morning around 8am and it's brutal for me. It would be like having to attend a meeting at 5am for early risers. Hopefully with the pressure of having to attend this meeting, and a shifting of work schedule I will be able to adjust.

I've noticed that when I go camping my clock starts to reset. Away from all the lights, noise, and RF, it's typically hard to stay up past 10pm unless there is lots of activity going on. Perhaps if I took two weeks off in the outdoors I could reset my clock in a more permanent fashion.

 

[ScioAgapeOmnis]

I notice that I'm often a night owl as well, and thinking about it one reason might be because the hustle and bustle of the day is gone, others are asleep, and I can focus on whatever in a quiet and serene setting with no interruptions, noise, distraction, or responsibilities/errands that exist during the day. Everything just seems quieter and more serene. I think being a night owl or not may also relate to your living situation - if you live alone, it may be easier to create a focused/quiet atmosphere whenever you need it, but if you're living with others, sometimes late evening or night is the only time when you get the privacy and quiet that you need for more focused/prolonged activities like reading.

Also, it's possible that I may find it easier to focus on certain things when in semi-sleepy state, not sure though. Perhaps being tired/sleepy makes it easier to focus for prolonged periods of time without the "ADD" kicking in and my brain going in a million directions at once. It seems I'm less likely to be internally self-distracted when I don't have the energy for it. So night owling may be a way some people force their brains to cooperate (perhaps without consciously realizing why they're doing it), if they don't have enough self-mastery to quiet down the mind and focused for prolonged periods of time when a lot of energy is present. Perhaps it's similar to smoking, people may crave it more for the mental boost they get than pure "addiction" to a substance.

I'm not sure that I would use staying late as a way to manipulate others who may be in a psychologically weakened state as I tend to have almost no interaction with others at that time, which seems to be why I like that time in the first place, osit.