Organic Portals: Human variation

[consciousnessrep]

I think bi density should go in the middle and psychopaths should go on negative. Regular humans should go right next to bi and 4 density sto should go on positive. And people that think should be like 5 to 6 inches away from sto. Well this is what I think of course to me this would sound pretty accurate.

 

[anart]

I think bi density should go in the middle and psychopaths should go on negative. Regular humans should go right next to bi and 4 density sto should go on positive. And people that think should be like 5 to 6 inches away from sto. Well this is what I think of course to me this would sound pretty accurate.

Hi consciusnessrep, apologies, but this makes very little sense. Are you describing some sort of diagram? What is - in reality - 'bi-density'? Your reference to 5 or 6 inches away is also confusing. Could you please clarify?

 

[wanderer]

My OP-like friend

I have a friend who seemed to be a wise, spiritually oriented person when I first met him many years ago. As our relationship has evolved, I have become increasingly disturbed by what I have experienced. For a long time, I thought that my discomfort was caused by my own emotional reaction to his not fullfilling my needs in a friendship, and that was one my programs that I needed to recognize and overcome. There is surely some truth to that, and this emotional reaction clouds my judgement.

My friend suffered a horrible childhood with an alcoholic, severely disturbed mother and is badly damaged, I think. Has been diagnosed as Adult ADD and is currently medicated for that "condition". He exhibits some of the qualities of a psychopath - facts do not exist for him and any disagreement is perceived as an attack. This makes normal conversation, beyond trivialites, impossible and increasingly disturbing. His personality is good humored, but flat and emotionless. Oddly, I have never seen any sign of sexuality of any sort in all the years I've known him, although he talks about relationships he has had in the past. He exhibits normal empathy, which I think is sincere.

I recently had a conversation with him that has forced me to reconsider our relationship. He suddenly said something completely irrational, and when I asked him to explain, he replied that it was perfectly obvious. I asked again, saying that it wasn't at all obvious to me. In response, all I got was a strange, blank stare. When I looked into his eyes at that moment I was shocked - there was nobody home. The last time I had that experience I was looking into the eyes of someone who had me up against a wall with a large knife at my throat.

Over the next few days, I came to the decision to remove this person from my life. That decision made me feel better, but I haven't actually had the heart to carry through with it.

I understand that it is not my place to decide whether someone is an OP or not, but my relationships with these OP-like beings is my choice. If I identify someone as a psychopath, I have nothing more to do with them, but you can't avoid relationships with OPs, even if you keep them as limited as you can, since they constitute 50% of population. Most of them are quite nice, I find, as long as you don't expect them to be more than what they are. I have noticed that those that have some spiritual leanings are uniformly into a sort of nature worship, I have come to think of that as the OP religion.

This is causing me emotional pain, and I find myself ruminating about it constantly, so I'm reaching out here.

 

[PepperFritz]

Re: My OP-like friend

Hi Wanderer:

I am having difficulty discerning what it is you are "reaching out" for here. Could you perhaps articulate more clearly what kind of information/advice/feedback you are looking for?

:)

 

[wanderer]

Re: My OP-like friend

Hi Wanderer:

I am having difficulty discerning what it is you are "reaching out" for here. Could you perhaps articulate more clearly what kind of information/advice/feedback you are looking for?

:)

I'm looking for input regarding errors in my thinking about (and posting :/) this, hoping that others might share their experience dealing with OPs. It's a conversation that I would normally have with a close friend, but this forum is the the only place where this topic could possibly be discussed, it would make no sense whatsoever to anyone else.

 

[Bo]

Re: My OP-like friend

I'm looking for input regarding errors in my thinking about (and posting :/) this, hoping that others might share their experience dealing with OPs. It's a conversation that I would normally have with a close friend, but this forum is the the only place where this topic could possibly be discussed, it would make no sense whatsoever to anyone else.

How can you possibly identify an OP(there is not enough data available to determine exactly who is an OP and who is not, PERHAPS on some occasions it's possible to do this , but to my current understanding this is a very difficult thing to do)

what if it's just a souled being in struggle?

Most of them are quite nice, I find, as long as you on't expect them to be more than what they are.

How do you know this? what if they are not OP's? what if you are an OP yourself?

Wanderer,

you have to look at every situation objectively, if you feel uncomfortable in your current relationship, if you have tried to talk about it and it did not work, if you have noticed that nothing seems to improve your relationship with this person, then perhaps one needs indeed to move on.

but I haven't actually had the heart to carry through with it.

it appears that you do know that you are emotionally attached to this person, have you ever really put much thought into it why you can't carry through with it? is it because of pity? or something else?

This is causing me emotional pain,

If we are not able to end a relationship, it's because there is still something that we are clinging on too, perhaps you need to find out what it is that keeps you hooked.

It could be false hope, pity?

- Bo

 

[PepperFritz]

Re: My OP-like friend

Over the next few days, I came to the decision to remove this person from my life. That decision made me feel better, but I haven't actually had the heart to carry through with it.

You seem to have come to a realization that the qualities and behaviour of this person make continuing a relationship with him an unwise and unhealthy thing to do. Are you now doubting the validity of what you have observed in him and/or the realization that you came to? Would knowing for certain whether he is an OP or not make any kind of difference in terms of what you have observed and the decision you have made about your relationship with him?

 

[christx11]

Re: My OP-like friend

Hi Wanderer:
I am having difficulty discerning what it is you are "reaching out" for here. Could you perhaps articulate more clearly what kind of information/advice/feedback you are looking for? :)

I'm looking for input regarding errors in my thinking about (and posting :/) this, hoping that others might share their experience dealing with OPs. It's a conversation that I would normally have with a close friend, but this forum is the only place where this topic could possibly be discussed, it would make no sense whatsoever to anyone else.

Well I think your first error is in assuming that you are not an OP yourself. I think you are better off thinking in behavioral and psychological terms and leaving the whole speculation that so and so is an OP and you are not.

What does it matter whether this person in question you are discussing is an OP or not an OP? Or you yourself for that matter? The effect on you is the same regardless.


**

I have a friend who seemed to be a wise, spiritually oriented person when I first met him many years ago.

Often our first impressions of people are highly projective - for instance the above depends entirely on your subjective views of what is spiritual and what is wise and you probably projected and saw those subjective qualities that may or may not have anything that is really wise and or spiritual.

My friend suffered a horrible childhood with an alcoholic, severely disturbed mother and is badly damaged.

A great majority of the population suffered childhood trauma and abuse in one way or another.

He exhibits some of the qualities of a psychopath - facts do not exist for him and any disagreement is perceived as an attack.

This could be the signs of many psychological pathologies and causes could be genetic, environment brought up in, food, primary physical brain damage, many things.

Oddly, I have never seen any sign of sexuality of any sort in all the years I've known him, although he talks about relationships he has had in the past. He exhibits normal empathy, which I think is sincere.

Lacking more data, this may or may not be odd at all. Sexuality is one of the most messed up things a person has to deal with in an insane world.

What it comes down to I think is whether the relationship is detrimental to your growth, especially if there are signs of harm surfacing directed toward you. Each person has their own path and must form their own kernel within. There is not a lot of in depth data about this person to make any kind of determination as to their condition, but it sounds as if there are some major issues that you cannot help him with.

I do get a sense from your post though that you are mired in the belief that you know what an OP is and you have excluded the possibility that you yourself are one. Big mistake. I also get the sense that you are kind of on a psychopath identification program. I think reading a lot more of the psychological materials to get a better understanding of the psychological spectrum would be of great benefit - narcissism, schizoidal dysfunctions, etc.

Recommended reading is here: Recommended Reading

This link recommends an order to read the psychological material - Link

And don't forget 'Political Ponerology', along with being invaluable in understanding our psychological environment also it has great information in showing us the spectrum of disorder that is out there and in here (inside us also).

 

[wanderer]

Re: My OP-like friend

Thank you all for your detailed responses.

You seem to have come to a realization that the qualities and behaviour of this person make continuing a relationship with him an unwise and unhealthy thing to do. Are you now doubting the validity of what you have observed in him and/or the realization that you came to? Would knowing for certain whether he is an OP or not make any kind of difference in terms of what you have observed and the decision you have made about your relationship with him?

Since I do not have the level of understanding to determine if he is OP (or if I am) or if it would make a difference, I see now that this is irrelevant.

If we are not able to end a relationship, it's because there is still something that we are clinging on too, perhaps you need to find out what it is that keeps you hooked.

It could be false hope, pity?

No, I think it's this:

what if it's just a souled being in struggle?

But..

What it comes down to I think is whether the relationship is detrimental to your growth, especially if there are signs of harm surfacing directed toward you. Each person has their own path and must form their own kernel within. There is not a lot of in depth data about this person to make any kind of determination as to their condition, but it sounds as if there are some major issues that you cannot help him with.

I cannot help him in any direct way, since discussion is impossible. Since this disturbed me enough to compel me to post about it here, there must be lesson I need to learn from this situation.

 

[Psalehesost]

Re: My OP-like friend

If we are not able to end a relationship, it's because there is still something that we are clinging on too, perhaps you need to find out what it is that keeps you hooked.

It could be false hope, pity?

No, I think it's this:

what if it's just a souled being in struggle?

But..

What it comes down to I think is whether the relationship is detrimental to your growth, especially if there are signs of harm surfacing directed toward you. Each person has their own path and must form their own kernel within. There is not a lot of in depth data about this person to make any kind of determination as to their condition, but it sounds as if there are some major issues that you cannot help him with.

I cannot help him in any direct way, since discussion is impossible. Since this disturbed me enough to compel me to post about it here, there must be lesson I need to learn from this situation.

And unless in some way he truly asks, you'd help him not as an act of giving, but in order to change him to your idea of how he should be - which is not "help" and would only serve to further entropy.

And "souled", if so, does not mean "good"; it simply means "potential to evolve in either direction" according to basic inclination and choices on a level deeper than the present life.

OSIT.

As for parting ways and not "having the heart" to do this even though the situation is destructive, it could be well to remember the advice of the C's, that such is not "acting against" the person, but acting for your destiny. Could this perhaps be related to the lesson to be learned?

 

[wanderer]

Re: My OP-like friend

As for parting ways and not "having the heart" to do this even though the situation is destructive, it could be well to remember the advice of the C's, that such is not "acting against" the person, but acting for your destiny. Could this perhaps be related to the lesson to be learned?

Yes, I think so. That and being able to see the situation objectively, without the distortion of emotional and intellectual programs.

 

[Bo]

Re: My OP-like friend

As for parting ways and not "having the heart" to do this even though the situation is destructive, it could be well to remember the advice of the C's, that such is not "acting against" the person, but acting for your destiny. Could this perhaps be related to the lesson to be learned?

I could not have said it better.


Wanderer,

It appears that you are trying to determine the needs of another, and that is not helping, if he does not ask for any help it is not up to you to decide what's best for him considering your situation at this moment.

Q: How does it come that you are taking energy from someone by
giving them love when not asked?
A: Because an STS vehicle does not learn to be an STO candidate
by determining the needs of another.
Q: I don't understand how that means you are taking energy?
A: Because the act is then one of self-gratification. If one "gives"

where there is no request, therefore no need, this is a free will
violation! And besides, what other motivation could there possibly be
in such a scenario?!? Think carefully and objectively about this.
Q: My thought would be that, in such a scenario, that if one gives
love to someone who has not asked or requested that it seems to be
a desire to change the other, i.e. a desire to control.
A: You got it!!

 

[ELTE2307]

About OP's

Hi,

I still don't get pictures with OP's.
Can somenone give me a hint about it ?
Is it true that half of the population on earth is made of OP's ?

Your comments are greatly welcomed

Thank's in advance

ELTE

 

[Meg]

Re: About OP's

Hi Elte2307,

Is it true that half of the population on earth is made of OP's ?

From what the C's say, it is probable.

Have you read the thread on Organic Portals? http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=457.0

Organic portals are discussed in many other threads on the forum, so doing a search and reading through the results might help your understanding. Happy Reading! :)

 

[vinny]

Re: About OP's

It is necessary to read The Wave and in addition the works of Gurdjieff ('In Search of the Miraculous' is a good place to start) to get the full context, and also to search other discussions on the forum, such as Megapode mentioned. You may also wish to read Mouravieff's interpretation of Gurdjieff, where he refers to OPs/non-OPs as Adamic Man and Pre-Adamic man.

but in summary:

Gurdjieff's teachings suggest that man is made up of 'lower' centers, and 'higher' centers. The lower centers are the 'moving', 'emotional' and 'intellectual' (the body, the heart and the brains... kinda) with which he is connected, and which he uses to live and to operate. Due to the malformed operation of these lower centers, man is wholly disconnected from the higher centers, which he has only 'in potential'. For this potential to be realised, the Work must be carried out in order to re-adjust the operation of the lower centers, and to have a chance to connect to the higher centers, via the correct operation of the lower emotional center which then resonates with the higher emotional center.

It is postulated that OPs do not have the higher centers 'in potential', so although they are functionally identical to 'non-OP' man in his current state (both would be Gurdjieff's 'three brained beings'), they do not currently possess the potential to evolve and reconnect to their higher centers. If my understanding is correct, OPs are seen as an evolutionary link between 2nd density and 3rd density levels of existence. (They are then 'used' by 4th density, along with all 3rd density life - 'food for the moon' as Gurdjieff puts it - due to their ease of manipulation). I hope I did not oversimplify this, but it is discussed in more depth elsewhere.