Qualities of essence

For what seems to be the bulk of my contemplations, I've found that getting stuck in my head trying to figure out why I did what I did is not nearly as productive as admitting 1) that my territoriality instinct was triggered, 2) that I reacted in accordance with it and 3) my intellect simply rationalized it after-the-fact since it wasn't in charge at that time anyway. From that position, the "territory" can be more easily spotted in some contexts... as a sacred cow, for instance.

There's a clarity of understanding that seems to come from that simple acceptance. And it lets me know how deeply the "rewiring" needs to reach, as well.

So, I think you are sensing how deep the roots can go and if this is the case, I agree with you.

Just reading this quote through once and applying the 1, 2 and 3 I can feel how that can help one get over past the hinderance of hurting others. I believe that I think about the situation in my mind and go over it again and again because I don't wan't to make the same mistake again in the future and I wouldn't be doing my fellow man/woman or myself any justice if I just made mistakes and continued on buffering them away saying "o its ok" when it really isnt. One of the reasons why I don't like this existance is that it seems that mistake making is inevitable that when one makes a mistake and then has the being to analyze it search for truth that then leads to growth of being of some kind and it almost seems that mistakes and then the correct type of contemplation then leads to a growth of being. But then what about the other that was hurt? Its very STS to be in a world where people are suppose to grow and in doing so you sometimes step on the heart of another to climb up the ladder. Most of the mistakes are made IMO because we are born into narcassitic family structures and other institutions and we are told things that are just not objectivly true that leads to secred cows and wishful thinking and even if one is doing the work on their journy mistakes are inevitable and others have to pay the price for their growth and I think this is bullshit.

Back to what you said about me making an analogy and using depth with hurting others. I use this analogy because I can't describe the feeling in words and I am not as well verse in science as you are but what I feel is something deep in my solar plex right above my naval and its a clenching/hurting (again words can't really discribe it) feeling that makes me tear its is almost too much for me at the times when it happens but it is a que that I need to reavaluate my actions that have caused this feeling deep in me that I have done something wrong to another something of substance not just cutting someone in line or saying something mean but something wrong through actions that hurt another on a deep emotional level.
 
I think it is valuable to discuss and learn about essence. Gaining an idea of its characteristics may help us to know what to look for in ourselves.

Gurdjieff said:
Essence is purely emotional. It consists of what is received from heredity before the formation of personality, and later, only those sensations and feelings among which a man lives.

The center of gravity of the body, its soul, is the moving center. The center of gravity of the essence is the emotional center, and the center of gravity of the personality is the thinking center.

Gurdjieff's words quoted above contain profound indications of possibilities and directions of enquiry.

Thinking about essence and personality, some questions arise in my mind that may be fruitful to ponder.

Do I know my own essence?

If I realise that I do not know my own essence, is it my aim to know it?

Is there something in me that could be - or is - my essence? Can that 'something' be known?

If it is my aim to know my essence, how will I achieve my goal?
 
Menna said:
For what seems to be the bulk of my contemplations, I've found that getting stuck in my head trying to figure out why I did what I did is not nearly as productive as admitting 1) that my territoriality instinct was triggered, 2) that I reacted in accordance with it and 3) my intellect simply rationalized it after-the-fact since it wasn't in charge at that time anyway. From that position, the "territory" can be more easily spotted in some contexts... as a sacred cow, for instance.

There's a clarity of understanding that seems to come from that simple acceptance. And it lets me know how deeply the "rewiring" needs to reach, as well.

So, I think you are sensing how deep the roots can go and if this is the case, I agree with you.

Just reading this quote through once and applying the 1, 2 and 3 I can feel how that can help one get over past the hinderance of hurting others.

I meant 'productive' in terms of getting past some buffers of narratization but you're right in that it's one 'way' to get further along in dealing with hurting others.

Menna said:
I believe that I think about the situation in my mind and go over it again and again because I don't wan't to make the same mistake again in the future and I wouldn't be doing my fellow man/woman or myself any justice if I just made mistakes and continued on buffering them away saying "o its ok" when it really isnt.

Right, and sometimes a kind of 'thinking about the situation' can go round and round without leading to a useful answer and that can, itself, be a form of buffering regardless of the content of the thinking. If it's a reflex act, sometimes the 'thinking about the situation' actually keeps us from feeling the full brunt of emotions because without an internal dialog with the power to assign and mis-assign meaning to just about anything so that we can keep our worldview relatively consistent and stable, the whole world can feel like a painful and very flicked up place.

Menna said:
One of the reasons why I don't like this existance is that it seems that mistake making is inevitable that when one makes a mistake and then has the being to analyze it search for truth that then leads to growth of being of some kind and it almost seems that mistakes and then the correct type of contemplation then leads to a growth of being. But then what about the other that was hurt?

We can't control everything and, at this point, someone might inject something about how the very fact that we are in a relationship with someone we hurt may indicate that they have a similar lesson profile. What I prefer to think is that a better pattern to express is to live our life recapping on the fly, extracting all the value we can from our previous experiences. If we are doing this and being conscientious while facing the music when we do make mistakes, shouldn't any harm we accidentally do to others be relatively mild? Or at least not irreversible to some extent? I'm not sure of the best way to put that question, but do you see what I mean?


Menna said:
Its very STS to be in a world where people are suppose to grow and in doing so you sometimes step on the heart of another to climb up the ladder. Most of the mistakes are made IMO because we are born into narcassitic family structures and other institutions and we are told things that are just not objectivly true that leads to secred cows and wishful thinking and even if one is doing the work on their journy mistakes are inevitable and others have to pay the price for their growth and I think this is bullshit.

Maybe we could keep holding onto the idea of creating a new world where there is less of that bull product to step in.

Menna said:
Back to what you said about me making an analogy and using depth with hurting others. I use this analogy because I can't describe the feeling in words and I am not as well verse in science as you are but what I feel is something deep in my solar plex right above my naval and its a clenching/hurting (again words can't really discribe it) feeling that makes me tear its is almost too much for me at the times when it happens but it is a que that I need to reavaluate my actions that have caused this feeling deep in me that I have done something wrong to another something of substance not just cutting someone in line or saying something mean but something wrong through actions that hurt another on a deep emotional level.

That's the location where I feel too. I notice that just hearing two people in a mild emotional conflict starts a spasming reaction in my lower abdomen and my mood can deteriorate pretty fast, depending on what I'm hearing.

I agree that this gut brain behavior can be a cue for reevaluating our actions. Some controlled breathing and deliberate relaxation of your body during these times might help to restore some lucidity with which to do this reevaluating.
 
Endymion said:
Thinking about essence and personality, some questions arise in my mind that may be fruitful to ponder.

Do I know my own essence?

If I realise that I do not know my own essence, is it my aim to know it?

Is there something in me that could be - or is - my essence? Can that 'something' be known?

If it is my aim to know my essence, how will I achieve my goal?

The essence that a person is born with often consists of some simple likes and dislikes. What is described as "instinctive substratum" by Lobaczewski in Political Ponerology (see Laura's post here for a summary) possibly forms a significant part of the essence. There could be certain potentials that can be actualized given suitable life conditions and/or the strength of the original endowment. Some examples could be what Dabrowski describes as higher level dynamisms (determinants of behavior) like the "developmental instinct", "creative instinct" and the "self-perfection instinct" which can usually be discerned only after certain developmental stages are crossed.

Gurdjieff said
[quote author=ISOTM]
As a rule a man's essence is either primitive, savage, and childish, or else simply stupid. The development of essence depends on work on oneself.
[/quote]

So it is development of essence that is important. In this regard, "personality" or what is not one's own plays an important role.

[quote author=ISOTM]
"As has been said earlier, in the case of less cultured people essence is often more highly developed than it is in cultured man. It would seem that they ought to be nearer the possibility of growth, but in reality it is not so because their personality proves to be insufficiently developed. For inner growth, for work on oneself, a certain development of personality as well as a certain strength of essence are necessary. Personality consists of 'rolls,' and of 'buffers' resulting from a certain work of the centers. An insufficiently developed personality means a lack of 'rolls,' that is, a lack of knowledge, a lack of information, a lack of the material upon which work on oneself must be based. Without some store of knowledge, without a certain amount of material 'not his own,' a man cannot begin to work on himself, he cannot begin to study himself, he cannot begin to struggle with his mechanical habits, simply because there will be no reason or motive for undertaking such work.

"It does not mean that all the ways are closed to him. The way of the fakir and the way of the monk, which do not require any intellectual development, remain open to him. But the methods and the means which are possible for a man of a developed intellect are impossible for him. Thus evolution is equally difficult for a cultured or an uncultured man. A cultured man lives far from nature, far from natural conditions of existence, in artificial conditions of life, developing his personality at the expense of his essence. A less cultured man, living in more normal and more natural conditions, develops his essence at the expense of his personality. A successful beginning of work on oneself requires the happy occurrence of an equal development of personality and essence. Such an occurrence will give the greatest assurance of success.
[/quote]

Learning through reading and discussions, following a "do good - be good" or "fake it till you make it" approach involve the personality in the beginning but eventually, if efforts and conditions are right, they pass on to the essence and becomes one's own. So perhaps it can be said, that with right work, essence expresses itself more and more.
 
What I am very much interested in at this point is of a practical nature. Is it at all possible to say anything about essence in terms of characteristics it might have and characteristics it absolutely will not have?

For instance i know that things like vanity or greed can only be qualities of personality, not of essence.

Can anything more be said about that? If I am looking for essence, what should i be looking for? Is it possible that aim is in any way connected with essence?
 
Endymion said:
...
Thinking about essence and personality, some questions arise in my mind that may be fruitful to ponder.

Do I know my own essence?

If I realise that I do not know my own essence, is it my aim to know it?

Is there something in me that could be - or is - my essence? Can that 'something' be known?

If it is my aim to know my essence, how will I achieve my goal?
Yes, it may indeed be fruitful to ponder. :)

You may like to begin the process of coming to know yourself - to know yourself as a whole - your innateness, your fundamental character, your inner drive, the real you - essence. You may like to allow your essence to become active in your life.

You may like to set aside a period each day to contemplate, or to contact essence (through concentrated attention), with the question: 'I wish to know myself as a whole'.

Or, just keeping the question alive: 'May I be a little more aware of who I am now - wherever I am, however I am - who am I?'

And take whatever comes up, be it words, visions, feelings or movements, and then constatate on that.

Have fun in the process. :)

This may help, or not. :)

celestialvisionz said:
Maybe Essence is the Truth that is within the individual
There is a source (cannot find it just now) that suggests that this is true, it is your true self and possibly the source of Real 'I'.
 
I meant 'productive' in terms of getting past some buffers of narratization but you're right in that it's one 'way' to get further along in dealing with hurting others.

And by using 1..2..3...To "get over" past hurt the "getting over" includes getting past buffers (for me) in order to see the truth so in my response I meant that the 1...2...3 system you talked about will help me see the truth by eliminating buffers and in seeing the truth I can then go on my way I am no longer stuck because I wont make that same mistake. But then that bring me to my next point.

We can't control everything and, at this point, someone might inject something about how the very fact that we are in a relationship with someone we hurt may indicate that they have a similar lesson profile. What I prefer to think is that a better pattern to express is to live our life recapping on the fly, extracting all the value we can from our previous experiences. If we are doing this and being conscientious while facing the music when we do make mistakes, shouldn't any harm we accidentally do to others be relatively mild? Or at least not irreversible to some extent? I'm not sure of the best way to put that question, but do you see what I mean?

Yes I see what you mean but I disagree just because you enter into a relationship with someone doesn't mean that they have a similar lesson profile and even if they do in my experiences 9 out of 10 people buffer their actions and emotions also how about organic portals? Just because someone is an organic portal and don't have soul potential doesn't mean they don't feel negative emotions. Even if the non organic portals are on a similar lesson profile the majority of the time they won't even get a peak at the lesson because it is easier to go back to the lies what they have done their whole life. Why change now? So my point is yes after tasting what is spicy you then know what mild taste like and can then live your life in the mild zone but what about that taste or tastes of spicy that you had in order to know what mild is. This is my point I feel like in life to realize what doesn't cause damage you have to cause some damage. This then gives you contrast and leads to the realization of how you want to live your life and treat people but its still not right that you found your way by bouncing off of others. The same moment when I analyze my life and look at the sky and I am greatfull and start to tear that same feeling happens if I am sitting on the couch and contemplate my actions with people I have wronged and I get the same feeling in the same part of my body. Same feeling produced by two different types of contemplation. One is where I have come from and how much I have progressed/gratitude and the others is the emotion hurt I have caused to others realizing that at the end of the day even if I have progressed or I can live a better life now it wasn't right will never be right.

Maybe we could keep holding onto the idea of creating a new world where there is less of that bull product to step in.

Yes! This is where I believe the saying "life is religion" comes into play. This is the idea but to get to the new world you want to create you have to experience and have your part in the old and my part in the old I am carrying around and even if I can get to a point where I can let it go it that still doesn't changed the fact that I was the catalyst for sorrow/emotional pain.

In saying all this I am not walking around depressed or constantly beating myself down i am generally a happy person I just feel that the feeling that one gets in their solar plex through the emotional center that causes tingling and tearing in the body is a very important part of someone life and organic portals are not capable of this IMO. It is also interesting to me that not only love, gratitude and fortune can cause this feeling but also the realization of sorrow, misfortune and pain. I am talking about this in the essence thread because I believe that this sensation I have talked about has something to do with essence or something else esoteric and I know that it has NOTHING to do with personality.
 
sarek said:
What I am very much interested in at this point is of a practical nature. Is it at all possible to say anything about essence in terms of characteristics it might have and characteristics it absolutely will not have?

For instance i know that things like vanity or greed can only be qualities of personality, not of essence.

Can anything more be said about that? If I am looking for essence, what should i be looking for? Is it possible that aim is in any way connected with essence?

Are you familiar with our Glossary?

Glossary on Essense said:
In common usage, the essence of something is its inherent quality or central, defining feature.

In 4th Way discourse, a man's essence is the totality of the qualities or propensities he is born with. As opposed to this, personality is the totality of the acquired or learned patterns of thought and emotion.

Essence is not directly observable since all interaction with people normally passes through the filter of personality.

Modern psychology attributes about 80 percent of observable characteristics of human psyche to factors of nature and only 20 percent to factors acquired from environment. Physical or psychological reflections of the 4th Way idea of essence would include things like features of the endocrine system having to do with stress and flight/fight responses or inherent abilities such as memory or IQ or predispositions such as verbal vs. visual thinking or left vs. right brain dominance.

There is however more to the concept of essence than this. Essence includes the concept of fundamental character, as in whether one's center of gravity is in the moving, feeling or thinking center. Even further, essence would include an idea of invariable moral character, i.e. tending towards truth or lies or service to self or service to others. There is some evidence that these features are genetically based and also reflected in observable brain functioning. For example, psychopaths, which would represent a serious flaw of essence, have distinctive brain electric patterns.

We could say that essence is what is left when the conditioning of culture and the multiple faces and acquired roles of little I's are stripped away. The Work may in principle bring essence and personality closer to each other. Gurdjieff comments that the education system of his time, and the modern one with all the more reason, favor personality at the cost of essence development by from the get go teaching hypocrisy and by teaching children to distrust their own senses. Personality is the only part that can thrive in a context of culturally conditioned lies and arbitrary value judgements.

Primitive societies are more favorable for essence development and make individuals that are less contradictory and maybe healthier in essence terms. However, they are no better for esoteric development because their cognitive or 'personality' side is under-trained.

Any work on essence needs to proceed through personality, since personality is the one part of man's inner life that can be reached. Disciplines of personality, such as self-remembering may in time benefit essence, although the 4th Way teaching is generally vague about any work on essence. Gurdjieff says that most often the growth of essence stops around the age of seven and man's essence is usually left in a state of stupidity or weakness.

There exists a set of psychophysiological features of man which are life-long or very slowly changing and which correspond to Gurdjieff's description of essence. The 4th Way and psychology seem to have reached compatible conclusions in this area.

I think it's very, very tricky. When we think about our most pure emotions, thoughts, traits, whatever, it's not only that they've got distorted in the course of our life, so what was pure back in the past is mostly dormant now and overshadowed by, or wrapped in, new constructs like a cast; but to make things worse, our observation capability - self-insight - or our observatory instrument, is strongly influenced by our personality. It tends to see what it wants to see, what fits in its self-image, what does not pose a real or imaginary threat to it - and the truth usually does.

Take your likes and dislikes and think what their origins are. Culture, upbringing, buffers, false personality... How to find the real ones in the jungle of falsity?

Say, you feel a 'spark' inside, you are curious, you want to grow up, to peel the onion till you get to the very core. You feel you want to connect with other human beings and with whatever is higher than us. You may wish to become a conduit, to serve. It can be a sincere desire (aim), but it can be superficial, out of a need to feel special, spiritual, or because it seems more colorful than any ordinary/ mundane life. Or perhaps you carry inside a hope for 'salvation'. It can be mix of both, which I think prevails, especially at early stages of the path. But as they say, the proof is in the pudding. What is superficial likes to take an easy road and withdraws when things become difficult. The only way to know is to try. The only way to get there, as close as possible, is to persist. Or so I think...
 
sarek said:
What I am very much interested in at this point is of a practical nature. Is it at all possible to say anything about essence in terms of characteristics it might have and characteristics it absolutely will not have?

Assuming a certain familiarity with Gurdjieff's teachings and how it is the intellect that does categorical thinking and makes comparisons, that could be a difficult question to answer. Having said that though, what if I said "why not"? Just look for or intuit the meaning underlying the talk about essence in the Gurdjieff and glossary quotes. And if an answer of sorts comes to you that you didn't have before, please consider sharing your observation with us.

sarek said:
For instance i know that things like vanity or greed can only be qualities of personality, not of essence.

Great! What, of that knowledge, is your own? Asking the question another way, if there is anything about this knowledge that can be lost, altered or taken away from you by artificial means (ISOTM), then what would be left?

sarek said:
If I am looking for essence, what should i be looking for?

Are the quotes and the glossary reference sufficient?

sarek said:
Is it possible that aim is in any way connected with essence?

Well, assuming your aim is something like "self-mastery" and self-mastery entails essence and personality growing together in parallel, then I'd answer 'yes'!
 
Prodigal Son said:
celestialvisionz said:
Maybe Essence is the Truth that is within the individual
There is a source (cannot find it just now) that suggests that this is true, it is your true self and possibly the source of Real 'I'.

There is this:

[quote author=ISOTM]
"Essence is the truth in man; personality is the false. But in proportion as personality grows, essence manifests

itself more and more rarely and more and more feebly and it very often happens that essence stops in its growth at a very early age and grows nofurther.[/quote]
 
Menna said:
This is my point I feel like in life to realize what doesn't cause damage you have to cause some damage. This then gives you contrast and leads to the realization of how you want to live your life and treat people but its still not right that you found your way by bouncing off of others. The same moment when I analyze my life and look at the sky and I am greatfull and start to tear that same feeling happens if I am sitting on the couch and contemplate my actions with people I have wronged and I get the same feeling in the same part of my body. Same feeling produced by two different types of contemplation. One is where I have come from and how much I have progressed/gratitude and the others is the emotion hurt I have caused to others realizing that at the end of the day even if I have progressed or I can live a better life now it wasn't right will never be right.

Until we have will enough to change this, we are yet fully plugged in to a massive, interlocked system where everything is engaged in a process of seeking balance (homeostasis) and we are pulled along with everything else. In one sense, I agree with you when you say "it's not right." In another sense it appears that, in most cases, such value judgments are applied in retrospect only; meaning, at the time the hurt happens, it couldn't have been any other way for mechanical man. Everything happens (Gurdjieff).

This is not intended as a statement about personal responsibility so much as to point to the value of an awakening conscience hand-in-hand with the emotional center to whatever extent. It seems important to emphasize that we learn self-knowledge by allowing ourselves to emotionally experience aspects of our behavior without self-condemnation in order to acquire the kind of knowledge the thinking center can't acquire on it's own since it doesn't make the same kinds and types of distinctions the emotional center is capable of.

We can allow ourselves to feel the full experience of everything that is there; we can sit with it for as long as necessary until whatever we can learn from our experience has been learned. During the time we are sitting with it, we can intellectually describe whatever details and facts exist of the experience as long as we avoid weaving these separate elements of the emotional experience into a story or some narrative that only the intellect can conceive and use for its own purposes.

Menna said:
This is the idea but to get to the new world you want to create you have to experience and have your part in the old and my part in the old I am carrying around and even if I can get to a point where I can let it go it that still doesn't changed the fact that I was the catalyst for sorrow/emotional pain.

In saying all this I am not walking around depressed or constantly beating myself down i am generally a happy person I just feel that the feeling that one gets in their solar plex through the emotional center that causes tingling and tearing in the body is a very important part of someone life...

And I agree. There is knowledge in the pain, the tingling, the tearing. It's a different kind of knowledge consistent with being a different quality of impression. Maybe all we need do is stand fast with a quiet mind until the worst is over and the available in-sight is able to reflect in conscious awareness.


Menna said:
It is also interesting to me that not only love, gratitude and fortune can cause this feeling but also the realization of sorrow, misfortune and pain. I am talking about this in the essence thread because I believe that this sensation I have talked about has something to do with essence or something else esoteric and I know that it has NOTHING to do with personality.

I'm with you on this. And overall, I'm moved by your postings - especially the part quoted above as, even though I'm judging by the written words, it strikes me as coming from someone who is alive with that essence like what we're talking about. I appreciate what you've shared here as well as what everyone has added.
 
Anthony said:
To complicate things even more, G. said that behind personality lies essence, behind essence lies real I, behind real I lies God.

Would you cite a source for this quote please??

Thanks

Kris
 
Yes. Maurice Nicoll Psychological Commentaries on the Teaching of Gurdjieff and Ouspensky Volume 4.
Also here in more detail: http://gurdjieffbooks.wordpress.com/2008/03/31/56/
 
dugdeep said:
I had an experience last night that I think relates to the subject of this thread (at least, I think it does).

I went to see a movie by myself, as I often do (called The Grandmaster, incidentally; really good if you like the idea of martial arts and historical high drama set in 1930s China). The theatre wasn't very full so I had a row to myself. About 5 minutes after the movie had already started, a couple of guys came in and sat in the same row as me, only a couple of seats away.

It didn't take long before I got a whiff of one of the guy's cologne. Hard not to - he was wearing enough of it to drown a rat! Immediately I was annoyed at this and thought about how I was being poisoned by this horrible noxious gas. I'd taken a class called "Nutrition in the Environment" in order to graduate from nutrition school, and in it we'd studied all sorts of household and environmental toxins and how horrible they are for the body. We'd spent some time looking into all the chemicals that are in the average perfume or cologne, and it's not a pretty picture. So naturally (or not so naturally, as it turned out) I was disgusted by the smell.

Shortly after, my mind drifted back to the movie and my dissociation tuned out my immediate environment. But in the back of my mind, just outside of my conscious awareness I was aware of some sort of pleasant sensation. As I started to become more aware of it, I realized I was actually enjoying the smell. And why not? It was sweet and flowery, and kind of nice, if not a little strong.

I realized then and there that my initial reaction of disgust was a learned reaction. It belonged totally to personality; the image I have of myself as a nutritionist and what I'm supposed to approve of and disapprove of. I even remember times in the past going on at length about how much I hate cologne and how I can't understand how anyone could like this horrible stuff. And I've actually gone to great lengths to avoid people wearing it.

Yet here I am, struck by the realization that I was actually enjoying the smell. Strip off the learned opinion that the personality has acquired and my essence was simply enjoying a pleasant smell. It didn't change the fact that I know it's toxic and that it's not a good idea to expose yourself to it much (although I think that with all of the other crap in our environment, this is probably one of the least of our worries), but none the less, I thought it smelled nice. I had the vague idea that it reminded me of something pleasant.

This started me thinking about how many false opinions, assurances and learned behaviours I have wrapped up in this personality. How much of "me" is actually not mine at all, but the product of my "education". And that started me on a bit of an exercise, trying one by one to remove all the things I have an opinion on, likes and dislikes, that were preoccupying me at that moment. I kept at it until I got to something that felt real.

I only engaged in it for a minute or so before my attention was, once again, wrapped up in the film. But I speculate that, if we're sincere enough and can put effort into seeing the falsity of everything that makes up "me", we can catch a glimpse of essence; or at least get closer to it. Easier said than done, of course.

OSIT.

Excellent story Dug and a very interesting observation, and very true I think. It reminds me of Gurdjieff's experiment with the "raspberry jam man"

Here it is for those who haven't read it before. It's from "In Search of the Miraculous"

Conversations in groups continued as usual. Once G. said that he wanted to carry out an experiment on the separation of personality from essence. We were all very interested because he had promised "experiments" for a long time but till then we had seen nothing. I will not describe his methods, I will merely describe the people whom he chose that first evening for the experiment.

One was no longer young and was a man who occupied a fairly prominent position in society. At our meetings he spoke much and often about himself, his family, about Christianity, and about the events of the moment connected with the war and with all possible kinds of "scandal" that had very much disgusted him.

The other was younger. Many of us did not consider him to be a serious person. Very often he played what is called the fool; or, on the other hand, entered into endless formal arguments about some or other details of the system without any relation whatever to the whole. It was very difficult to understand him. He spoke in a confused and intricate manner even of the most simple things, mixing up in a most impossible way different points of view and words belonging to different categories and levels.

I pass over the beginning of the experiment.

We were sitting in the big drawing room.

The conversation went on as usual.

"Now observe," G. whispered to us.

The older of the two who was speaking heatedly about something suddenly became silent in the middle of a sentence and seemed to sink into his chair looking straight in front of him.

At a sign from G. we continued to talk without looking at him.

The younger one began to listen to the talk and then spoke himself.

All of us looked at one another.

His voice had become different. He told us some observations about himself in a clear, simple, and intelligible manner without superfluous words, without extravagances, and without buffoonery. Then he became silent; he smoked a cigarette and was obviously thinking of something. The first one sat still without moving, as though shrunken into a ball.

"Ask him what he is thinking about," said G. quietly.

"I?" He lifted his head as though waking up when he was questioned. "About nothing." He smiled weakly as though apologizing or as though he were surprised at anyone asking him what he was thinking about.

"Well, you were talking about the war just now," said one of us, "about what would happen if we made peace with the Germans; do you still think as you did then?"

"I don't know really," he said in an uncertain voice. "Did I say that?"

"Yes, certainly, you just said that everyone was obliged to think about it, that no one had the right not to think about it, and that no one had the right to forget the war; everyone ought to have a definite opinion; yes or no-for or against the war."

He listened as though he did not grasp what the questioner was saying.

"Yes?" he said. "How odd. I do not remember anything about it."

"But aren't you interested in it?"

"No, it does not interest me at all."

"Are you not thinking of the consequences of all that is now taking place, of the results for Russia, for the whole of civilization?"

He shook his head as though with regret.

"I do not understand what you are talking about," he said, "it does not interest me at all and I know nothing about it."

"Well then, you spoke before of your family. Would it not be very much easier for you if they became interested in our ideas and joined the work?"

"Yes, perhaps," again in an uncertain voice. "But why should I think about it?"

"Well, you said you were afraid of the gulf, as you expressed it, which was growing between you and them."

No reply.

"But what do you think about it now?"

"I am not thinking about it at all."

"If you were asked what you would like, what would you say?"

Again a wondering glance-"I do not want anything."

"But think, what would you like?"

On the small table beside him there stood an unfinished glass of tea. He gazed at it for a long time as though considering something. He glanced around him twice, then again looked at the glass, and said in such a serious voice and with such serious intonations that we all looked at one another:

"I think I should like some raspberry jam."

"Why are you questioning him?" said a voice from the corner which we hardly recognized.

This was the second "experiment."

"Can you not see that he is asleep?"

"And you yourself?" asked one of us.

"I, on the contrary, have woken up."

"Why has he gone to sleep while you have woken up?"

"I do not know."

With this the experiment ended.

Neither of them remembered anything the next day.

G. explained to us that with the first man everything that constituted the subject of his ordinary conversation, of his alarms and agitation, was in personality. And when his personality was asleep practically nothing remained.

In the personality of the other there was also a great deal of undue talkativeness but behind the personality there was an essence which knew as much as the personality and knew it better, and when personality went to sleep essence took its place to which it had a much greater right.

"Note that contrary to his custom he spoke very little," said G. "But he was observing all of you and everything that was taking place, and nothing escaped him."

"But of what use is it to him if he also does not remember?" said one of us.

"Essence remembers," said G., "personality has forgotten. And this was necessary because otherwise personality would have perverted everything and would have ascribed all this to itself."

"But this is a kind of black magic," said one of us.

"Worse," said G. "Wait and you will see worse than that"
 
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