Role of Crypto/Cybercurrencies in the PTB's loss of control?

And Bitcoin is finite. Historically, the PTB like creating money out of thin air. Are they really going to be happy with a very finite supply of Bitcoin?

Practically, it's not very feasible given human nature, the nature of the PTB, and human history in general.

This is the key. But it is nothing new. Money with an expiration date.

There is a very old story behind the idea, and it will reveal what problems cryptocurrencies have.

"Adored by Keynes".

The fashionable economist who invented the money that expires

Although he has been forgotten for decades, Silvio Gesell predicted a theory that could be used today to face future crises.

He was a curious mixture, half Argentinean and German. Jean Silvio Gesell was born in Belgium (although it was then part of Germany) in 1862 and was the seventh of nine children in a family that was not characterized by its economic ease. His lack of resources prevented him from attending university, so he ended up working as an apprentice in commerce with his brother in Berlin, although he also went to Malaga or Argentina, fleeing from poverty.

Seen in this light, it is natural to think that he was not a great admirer of money. He witnessed a massive financial collapse in 1890 that convinced him that behind the mighty gentleman that is money there was also a darker side: poverty, inequality, unemployment or stagnation. The problem - he concluded - was that money fulfilled two conflicting functions: one is the way people store wealth and the other is what they need to do business.

An ephemeral money

In 1889, as a result of this crisis coinciding with the government of Juárez Celman in Argentina, he began to analyze the monetary system to find a solution to the crisis, and these observations would come to fruition in 1931, when he wrote his first theoretical treatise on finance: 'Die Reformation des Münzwesens als Brücke zum sozialen Staat' or, in other words, 'The reform of the monetary system as a bridge to a welfare state'. Gesell's aim was to create a new type of money so that people could not hoard it in times of crisis, out of fear, and thus paralyze business.

It would have to be a money that would rot, rust, that would not be eternal, so that people would use it as an instrument of exchange and nothing more: sealed money, a cash that had to be sealed every certain time in a public office because it would have an expiration date, in other words, it would have to be paid for so that it would not expire, so it would be sufficiently dissuasive to avoid accumulation. Keynes said in 'General Theory of Employment, Interest and Money' that in the future Gesell would be studied more than Marx and he was not wrong: after years of silence it is heard again in speeches of leaders in the Federal Reserve of the United States, research documents of the International Monetary Fund and the pages of the 'Financial Times', as explained by 'National Public Radio'.

Money that had to be paid for in order to continue to be used sounds like a radical measure, to be sure, but he was convinced of his idea. So much so that in 1899 he began to travel around Europe and Argentina spreading his gospel, in which he also advocated the end of monogamous relationships and the importance of free love. He was a bohemian and hippie utopian before these existed, who lived in a vegetarian commune near Berlin and criticized big business and finance and fascism*. However, for a long time sealed money was only a theory, and Gesell did not get to see the culmination of his work, which would come during the Great Depression, as he died of pneumonia in 1930.

*(sounds familiar right?)

In 1932, the city of Wörgl in Austria began issuing stamped money as a way to combat unemployment and business closures. The system struggled to lift people out of poverty and was widely praised by the press at the time, which called it "The Wörgl Miracle." The experiment inspired other places in California, Iowa or Anaheim. However, with the end of World War II and industrialization, Gesell began to fall into oblivion.

So far. The world's central banks are looking at how to keep the money moving. When the economy goes into recession they usually cut interest rates to encourage spending, but interest rates are already close to zero, which could be a big problem in another recession. For a long time, economists believed that rates could not be negative for a simple reason: if saving in places like banks costs money, they will just hoard cash, which won't cost them. Cash becomes an obstacle to economic stimulus. One way around this is higher inflation, which devalues or "taxes" money in real terms, but central banks have shown that they have much less power to increase inflation than previously thought.

A solution? It is hard to say, but Europe and Japan are experimenting with very small negative interest rates as a way to stimulate the economy, the problem is the same as always: people will start hoarding cash. That is why, for the first time after so many years, Gesell is again considered relevant. The best thing is that with modern changes there would no longer be a need for a sealed money, but other ideas such as the electronic cash system or the complete elimination of paper and currency have been talked about. Not bad for a person who, fleeing from poverty, began to understand the functioning of a money he had always lacked, was branded as an anarchist, a free spirit or a crank, and of whom only Keynes had some kind words: "A strange prophet". He certainly was.
 
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With China's crackdown, I was wondering whether it was just a matter of time when on one fine morning you read in the news that that the U.S. Treasury states "Bitcoin is NOT U.S. legal tender.''

But then I was reminded of this. There is news about bills in some states in the US to propose digital asset banks. So I guess that won't be happening. Crypto is coming to mainstream.


Perhaps the PTB have big plans with crypto after all. Not sure what to think about it.
 
China says the crypto market is too volatile. It certainly is volatile. But most of the time the market has collapsed was thanks to China and its negative messaging and draconian approach to this market. Without China, bitcoin was probably already at 300,000. Now it has collapsed to 30.000. Shame.

Huobi Scales Back Due to China Crackdown; Market Falls With Ether Dropping Below $2K


 
Since it isn't mentioned in the above Yahoo article about China and it's 'crackdown' on cryptos, Reuters published an article just a few days ago, and, although i don't know anything about cryptos, China's statement apparently released back in 2019 for why they've banned them makes sense; cryptos are based on nothing of real value and they're easily manipulated.

It seems to me that the ban will protect China from at least one avenue of attack from more nefarious actors. Whether it confers other benefits to them as well, because they're launching their own digital currency (which i'm pretty sure is different), i can't say, i would imagine so.

The article does highlight that it's financial institutions that are banned, whilst private individuals can still legally hold cryptos. The concern over speculation by financial institutions reminds me of that which contributed to the crash of 2007/8:


China bans financial institutions from cryptocurrency, highlights risks of manipulation


Reuters
Wed, 19 May 2021 11:42 UTC



China has banned financial institutions and payment companies from providing services related to cryptocurrency transactions, and warned investors against speculative crypto trading.

It was China's latest attempt to clamp down on what was a burgeoning digital trading market. Under the ban, such institutions, including banks and online payments channels, must not offer clients any service involving cryptocurrency, such as registration, trading, clearing and settlement, three industry bodies said in a joint statement on Tuesday.

"Recently, crypto currency prices have skyrocketed and plummeted, and speculative trading of cryptocurrency has rebounded, seriously infringing on the safety of people's property and disrupting the normal economic and financial order," they said in the statement.

China has banned crypto exchanges and initial coin offerings but has not barred individuals from holding cryptocurrencies.

The institutions must not provide saving, trust or pledging services of cryptocurrency, nor issue financial product related to cryptocurrency, the statement also said.

The moves were not Beijing's first moves against digital currency. In 2017, China shut down its local cryptocurrency exchanges, smothering a speculative market that had accounted for 90% of global bitcoin trading.

In June 2019, the People's Bank of China issued a statement saying it would block access to all domestic and foreign cryptocurrency exchanges and Initial Coin Offering websites, aiming to clamp down on all cryptocurrency trading with a ban on foreign exchanges.

The statement also highlighted the risks of cryptocurrency trading, saying virtual currencies "are not supported by real value", their prices are easily manipulated, and trading contracts are not protected by Chinese law.

The three industry bodies are: the National Internet Finance Association of China, the China Banking Association and the Payment and Clearing Association of China.

In January 2021 apparently India was also thinking about banning cryptos, however the article refers more to 'payment for illegitimate activities', which also seems to be a fairly valid reason, but whether they finally did or not, i haven't checked:
 
cryptos are based on nothing of real value and they're easily manipulated.

As long as people have money to spend in addition to the practical things they need in life, anything can be of value. As long as they are willing to put money into it. I think China acts as an over-controlling parent. In the long run, bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies have proven to be very safe investments. Simply because it keeps rising anyway. All that is required is patience. Gambling and stocks are riskier. OSIT.

Whether it confers other benefits to them as well, because they're launching their own digital currency (which i'm pretty sure is different), i can't say, i would imagine so.

It's linked to a central bank so it will be more stable.

The article does highlight that it's financial institutions that are banned, whilst private individuals can still legally hold cryptos.

China banned crypto in 2013, in 2017, and now yet again. You see, they don't really ban it. Just make it harder for their citizens to acquire it. Next year they will probably ban it again. I think the Chinese Govt isn't sure what to make of crypto just yet. So they keep the door slightly open. In case they decide at some point to allow it.

In January 2021 apparently India was also thinking about banning cryptos, however the article refers more to 'payment for illegitimate activities', which also seems to be a fairly valid reason, but whether they finally did or not, i haven't checked:

They decided against it. That doesn't say that at some point they will.
 
Here’s the latest “news”...


All pretty predictable. I’m not making a prediction by any means. But the pattern certainly has been that TPTB do not enjoy competition. We see what they do to ensure value of a petrodollar, yes?
 
All pretty predictable. I’m not making a prediction by any means. But the pattern certainly has been that TPTB do not enjoy competition. We see what they do to ensure value of a petrodollar, yes?
It takes a while but eventually the patterns emerge. From the Nazi Scientists to the space race to digital currencies - "Ooh We CAN'T let the bad guys win! We need to push ahead with this agenda! Everybody get on board - it's good for you - really...we're not just doing this to get you to give us what we want, honest..."

As for the Petro - sure - it is still of use for now - let's blow up the middle east to keep up the value of what will be a dead horse in a year. It's worth the cost of a few Palestinians...ugh.

... the article is a set up for regulation. Once you regulate, the big boys can safely move in.
 
The concern over speculation by financial institutions reminds me of that which contributed to the crash of 2007/8:

Crypto isn't big enough. Yet...


Banks are interested in Bitcoin, this is because their wealthy clients are interested in Bitcoin, and Banks will profit from this interest.

The billionaire and millionaire class are getting into the game. This is a good and bad thing. Good thing is that bitcoin may reach 1 million one day. Bad thing is that Wall Street Wolves will pump and dump together. Meaning they will pump it to new heights and dump it all at once to take profit. This will create fear in which many will panic sell. Losing 50% or more of their savings.

That said, it's just a possible prediction of mine.
 
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Wall Street Wolves will pump and dump together. Meaning they will pump it to new heights and dump it all at once to take profit. This will create fear in which many will panic sell. Losing 50% or more of their savings.

That said, it's just a possible prediction of mine.
Prediction? It's already happening - in fact it happened over the past week. The money lost in cryptos did not go to money heaven; it changed hands.
 
I’m speaking of the states here.

Another good reason to make crypto an asset: assets are taxable as capital gains. So if anyone maybe put their savings into something that had a chance at holding value, and that thing actually became extremely pricey lately, they are high income now and get taxed on the value of the asset without making a sale.
Without such a classification, it’d be hard to wring the life out of folks who have been working out of the control system.
 
Bad thing is that Wall Street Wolves will pump and dump together. Meaning they will pump it to new heights and dump it all at once to take profit. This will create fear in which many will panic sell. Losing 50% or more of their savings.

That said, it's just a possible prediction of mine.
Bjorn, I am basically agreeing with what you say, but I am adding that it is already happening. What you describe above is exactly what just happened. A pump and dump by the wolves. A mainstream narrative where bitcoin is the best thing since canned beer and it's going to the moon - then whammy - it drops like a rock. The whales and the shills talk the price up and ride the price up and convince the retail traders to buy due to fomo. "bitcoin to $100,000 before you know it". They suck everybody in as much as they can (62,000 ish) and then the whales are selling and the retail little guys are buying - that money changed hands! There are 2 sides to every trade. The big whale hands sold to the little retail hands. Furthermore, bitcoin is traded on futures exchanges AND on margin. So that exacerbates the whole process. Liquidate the leveraged longs. You are saying it is a prediction. I am saying things are happening so fast, that your prediction is already true. As for the bounce - of course - the whales bought all their shares back because they are going to do it all over again! It is an old game. I wish I figured it out sooner.
Oh, did the economy crashed?
Nowhere did you or I say anything about the economy crashing. Not sure where that is coming from. But, really, economic activity is down to an extent so great that IT COULD be said it has crashed I suppose. But it will get worse. Crashes don't just "happen" - there are always reasons and manipulation is a big one.
 
I wish I figured it out sooner.

Now you know.

Although I think that the explosive spike that happened over the past few months was mostly organic and the crash that happened only natural.

Most people now are newcomers in crypto and don’t understand or play the long game. They are going to panic sell at the slightest of a bad rumor, even at a loss. The veterans will hold and buy more during the dips.

Not even the billionaire predator whale group(s) can fully control this game. If they are not careful themselves they might get on the wrong side of the fence.

The crash was bound to happen. Musk his tweet just set in motion. And China has a pattern of banning crypto (again) when the market is at its peak and most unstable. When Bitcoin reached 100.000. They will ban crypto again and the newcomers will fall for it and panic sell. The Chinese Govt crashes the market on purpose in order to discourage their own citizen to try to buy it. Very lame for the rest of us.

Nowhere did you or I say anything about the economy crashing. Not sure where that is coming from.

Because I responded to another post that referenced the 2008 crash. To which you responded that this has already happened. Doesn't matter. It's a miscommunication.

Crashes don't just "happen" - there are always reasons and manipulation is a big one.

Yes, but sometimes a crash happens because the market is simply too unstable. Not even the big shots can control it fully. OSIT.
 
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