Session 14 October 2017

SeekinTruth

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Thanks for another great session, and getting it up so quickly again.

The craziness in our world just gets more and more intense, I have to agree.
 

Fluffy

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Excellent, lots of things cleared up for me.

A few months ago I joined a Gurdjeiff group in Canberra and at my first visit got this pang that I was in the wrong place. I literally just had to talk about what I noticed about my right hand and after asking a few questions it became clear that there was no benefit for me or anyone else by doing these noticing movements or dancing, or attending the group at all. I don't need a group to teach me to sit up straight. They also had no concept of diet and health, fed people cakes and biscuits, didn't have any outside scope on anything else at all and treated Gurdjeiff's words as gospel, as if it was a sin to question or seek further...it was very weird to me. And I was one of 2 in 'beginner' group- not much of a following, barren indeed, on many levels.

Vegas, pretty much what I guessed, mind controlled patsy that didn't even touch a gun that night. Poor bloke!

Thank you for the session. Although I'm very quiet on the forum and don't participate in anything I'm still very very grateful for all of your support in learning and growing.
 

Laura

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whitecoast said:
That was quite a packed and informative session. Kudos to you all for keeping the channel so clear and quality. :)

I thought I'd bring up a quote of the session on 21 June 2014:

(Aiming) Okay, we wondered what's up with Gurdjieff's soul?

(L) What?

(Aiming) We were wondering what he is doing right now? Where he is, or...?

A: He was attentive to earth issues for quite some time, but now has gone to full contemplation preparatory to rebirth in 4D.

Q: (L) So, you're saying that people get born in 4D?

A: Yes. When did we say otherwise?

Q: (L) Well, you didn't. I was just not sure.

(Chu) Well, with changes in physicality, you'd think people could avoid the normal human birth, with the pain...

A: It's just a bit more intense in some ways.

Q: (Data) Was Gurdjieff a "man" in the fullest sense of the word as he described it himself?

A: Close. Gurdjieff's greatest problem was that there was no one to place on the step behind him at the time, and he slipped a bit.
If the above is true, in spite of his misgivings he still managed to complete the lessons of 3D. However, the recent information the last bolded section may change if it was asked again of the C's, given the different position in terms of knowledge and awareness of the chateau crew. I wonder if that also means the first bolded section would also change (no mention of "suprise" for example)? They don't mention whether G graduated to 4D STS or 4D STO.
I don't see any contradiction at all; it meshes together, expanding the view. Keep in mind that answers from Cs are most often specific to the question.
 

Gaby

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Thank you for the session and discussions! Collingwood's work has been fascinating.

The chaos all around the world is overwhelming and beyond insane asylum. Turbulence ahead, so let's stay aware!
 

Phill4

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Bluelamp said:
Felipe4 said:
Laura said:
Q: (L) So that helps you to really understand mechanical programs. It IS very useful for that. And what about his tables of hydrogens?

A: He was onto something though again it was materialized. But you might have more success interpreting the "foods" as stimuli to the nervous system and its consequent release of neurochemicals and hormones. It was actually a quite clever description of same!
Bingo! I knew I jumped into neurology for a reason. this is what I was thinking, the table did not reach the mind, and in and of itself does not offer examples of the inreactive nature or relationships of these foods/stimuli with one another. how one hidrogen "fits" within another. H12 into H92 etc. or higher influences can actually pass through this world. from higher densities to lower densities...
The more generic "shock" idea might fit with lots of things that aren't restricted to materialism.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_Way_enneagram

At point 3, Mi-Fa, occurs a "shock". Air can provide this shock because it also is of density 192, and furthermore this air enters as a new Do... Point 6 being where "impressions", regarded as a type of food, are said to enter the body. "Impressions" are said to also have a "density" of 48, and can serve as a shock if they are intensified by some such means as the exercise of "self-remembering" taught by Gurdjieff, thus allowing the air and impressions octaves to proceed... A further conscious shock, requiring "a special type of control over the emotions" at point 9 would enable a new "higher" or spiritual body to begin to grow, this is represented by Gurdjieff as the aim of his and other esoteric traditions...
The six in Enneagram personality models can be counterphobic which is a looking back at a shock/fear of sorts. The self-remembering part is probably quite important for being able to take advantage of shocks to the nervous system. Finding Laura's work was quite shocking. It's either run away as fast as you can or do the counterphobic thing and look back at the shock. Gurdjieff seems to have looked back but couldn't quite see around the 4th density STS materialistic roadblocks; not that we can overly blame him, things look rather bleak out there without hints to help level the playing field.
This is part of my theory or how I have been correlating things, the enegram refers to biorhythms and the transmutation process to all processes

If you think of Air as H192 entering the system and encountering a Hydrogen already present in the body, I can only think on the chemical reaction of O2 entering and encountering glucose, Hydrogen that is as "dense" as air according to the table.
but if you think about it it is a more complex molecule than air, the citrate acid cycle and whatnot,, which is already formed in the body via another process of food.
It is that chemical reaction in the metabolic process what would equate on the table as (MI H192) and Air as (DO 192) the transformation results H96. While the food in digestion continues the process of transmutation of food through digestion and the enzymes involved, already present in the body , to become finer and finer.
But Air also has mechanical properties such as the stimulation of certain muscles, which activate or stimulate other muscles , tissue, or systems, the stimulation of the vagus nerve etc. and then that goes into activating different areas, emotions, memories, etc, which by themselves have a whole different relationship to the rest of the organism. Meaning that previous perceptions contain assumptions that relative to the personality affect emotions in a different way and thereby other higher processes in the body.

If you work your way up, you get to the hormones, enzymes, co-enzymes, proteins, etc. all of which function through electricity. The brain synapses, and the nervous system. The brain uses lots of the ATP result of the critrate acid cycle to polarize and depolarize the nerves and neurons. If i remember correctly.

Those are the finer Hydrogens. DO48 is said to be the impressions, I imagine what we perceive through our senses, the information or external vibrations from the world, light , sound, sensations, taste, electromagnetism, etc, our senses translating information through the perception mechanism, is the DO48 hydrogen. Those would be the electric impulses. the reconfiguration and filtering/assignment process that takes place when we process any event through the pre-stablished view of our already formed personality.

We are configured to perceive things one way or another, and can work to configure ourselves to increase the receivership capacity or to be able to be tuned enough to receive , process and interpret higher information. FA24 in air octave -SOL12 in the body - LA6 in the impressions.

What it all tells me is that MI12-SOL12-LA12 in the body refers to a heightened state of physical self awareness that allows the mind a sort of direct access to the physical body and the emotional body.

Those would be the higher hydrogens that (to me) would correspond to addition of the shock of H48 in the table of impressions.

But there are more electric impulses taking place that we are not aware of, such as the involuntary muscles , the heart, the intestines, or the neuronal impulses that we are not acutely aware of such as the activation of certain organs, certain glands, etc.

We react in fear, happiness , stress, relaxation about something because we inherently have these functions and through experiences we create a dictionary to attribute this reactions, and one person can be afraid of spider while another afraid while another develop the same reaction to clowns, but whatever the object, the dictionary is accessible to our minds and so we have access to our emotions which have access to other systems.

This dictionary is a function of the brain and memory, the idea of having self-awareness, that we are not reacting linearly, is yet another function that is higher, so I think that it does make sense that becoming aware of the potential access that we have to reach different systems through our minds, and knowing how to differentiate the soup of impressions coming from inside and outside ourselves, is the creation of these channels .
More clearly , if a person that has never heard any of this in their lives is going by his day, the point of reference is the personality and many times this is programing, this is a configuration of the psyche and mind and body and selfawareness to certain rules, the mind and brain configure ourselves to adapt to those conditions, but if there is self awareness, we notice the distinction, between an emotion supported by reality such as a snake, and an emotion to something illusory such as a self inflicting looping thought of self-defeat.
we start configuring the mind to separate the weed from the shaft so to say, and to put things in place, and thus, we can access different parts by different means.

We can't make out heart go faster or slower the same as other muscular tissue, this is an involuntary system, but we still could have access to this system in indirect ways, stimulation of the vagus nerve, breathing and that type of training.

That self awareness and reconfiguration of the psyche, that type of work, the right type of knowledge, and the right "increase of frequency" enhances perception, that (this is only my opinion) could be the same as providing the map to the access of higher centers, or bodies, or the so called Hydrogens.


The difference between the "notes/tones" asigned to each hidrogen are the relative stage of the process, so if (as I am theorizing it) [MI(H192)glucose] and [SOL(H48)ATP] I am not sure what is FA96, he is indicating a definite biorhythm in all of this that I don't have the formal knowledge to compare or analyze properly.
let alone [LA24in the air octave] and [SI12in the body octave] here it goes down in the diagram , as substances that reach the physical body may be the physical impulses, which move faster than other centers, we have immediate access to our muscles at will.

Equally there are no indications of the remains of the reaction which closes the cycle, I mean, CO2 or urine etc, which is a substance that contains the accumulated mass that was unused, much has a higher density or contain all the corresponding remains. Those numbers don't just go away, they go somewhere. Some to the toilet, some in the atmosphere, some as sweat, but some may be stored in the body.
And this is something that I found important, the higher notes also have a byproduct that has no use to the succession, H48=>H24, what happens to the other H24 that remains?
I only thought that , what remains translates at that level in the food diagram as something that stores in the body and either has no use, or has a definite use in the machine at least in potential. An emotion or accumulated muscle tension, or trauma, or any number of things.

Alot of what happens in the body are cycles of molecules that, through certain processes become one thing and then going back to what they where.

Activation of genes would probably stand at the top of the table of hydrogens.
 

whitecoast

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I don't see any contradiction at all; it meshes together, expanding the view. Keep in mind that answers from Cs are most often specific to the question.
Yeah - sorry, I didn't mean to imply it was contradictory.

Edit: fixed quote.
 

goyacobol

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FOTCM Member
Thank you to everyone in the session for the thoughtful questions.

The one question and answer about Gurdjieff that made a lot of sense to me was:

(Mikey) Which parts of Gurdjieff's teachings are still most useful to read?

A: Psychology, up to a point.
I have often found myself saying to myself "Gurdjieff was right" when it comes to observing the mechanical programming in humans.

I still think he was a psychologist at heart in many ways. As far as the "science" I think he was more limited maybe.

As for the hydrogens:

Q: (L) So that helps you to really understand mechanical programs. It IS very useful for that. And what about his tables of hydrogens?

A: He was onto something though again it was materialized. But you might have more success interpreting the "foods" as stimuli to the nervous system and its consequent release of neurochemicals and hormones. It was actually a quite clever description of same!
What if the "foods" would have been seen in a more spiritual sense such as "food" for the soul instead of "food for the moon"? Ever notice how your body responds to positive thoughts?

The question of how many "shooters" and the answer of 3 with one on the ground kind of rules out the speculation of the abandoned ferris wheel towers I think.

Thanks again for all the "food" for thought. :)
 

Gary

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Thank you so much for another fascinating and informative session! :flowers:

The chaos all around the world is overwhelming and beyond insane asylum. Turbulence ahead, so let's stay aware!
Yes indeed. Stay vigilant everybody!
 

loreta

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FOTCM Member
Thank you for the session!
Me too I don't understand the LV shooting. What can be the real reason?
 

shijing

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FOTCM Member
Thanks for the session, everyone. For the past few weeks, one of my cats has been more anxious and whiney than usual, for no apparent reason, so I found the first part about the effect of chaotic energies on animals interesting -- it may or may not be connected, but it's a data point.

Also very interesting info about the situation in Las Vegas -- I was also surprised when I read the distance given for the 3rd shooter.

The questions about Gurdjieff are very enlightening -- I think it's really helping to gain a more well-rounded perspective of him, which can only be beneficial IMO. One thing I've always been bothered by was his apparent willingness to use and/or manipulate people, as long as it was justified by furthering his Aim, so I'm glad there was some discussion about that. And 83% of his material coming from mediums :umm:

A couple of years ago, I tried to put his table of hydrogens and cosmoses into an easier visual format -- once I'd done so, I had to move on to other things and never really had a chance to follow up on it. Since the Cs seemed to think that it wasn't totally useless, I'm attaching the spreadsheet I created in case anyone wants to play with it.
 

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Oxajil

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Many thanks for the new session! Chaos is definitely what comes to mind when I read the news, and go through my Twitter feed. Stay safe everyone :flowers:
 

IronFloyd

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FOTCM Member
Thank you so much Laura and the whole team for this another great session. According to what C's said about Gurdjieff, and remembering the previous session where the C's mention Castaneda and don Juan, I wonder if it will not be a subtle indication to get involved more to the teachings of the latter as a more "powerful" way of knowledge compared to Gurdjieff... thanks so much again! :flowers:
 

Laura

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Shijing said:
A couple of years ago, I tried to put his table of hydrogens and cosmoses into an easier visual format -- once I'd done so, I had to move on to other things and never really had a chance to follow up on it. Since the Cs seemed to think that it wasn't totally useless, I'm attaching the spreadsheet I created in case anyone wants to play with it.
Actually, I don't think they intended to say that the TABLE of hydrogens was useful, but rather the IDEA of the hydrogens/foods for different purposes. That is to say, that there is food that we eat that induces growth and changes in the body, and there are other kinds of foods that can induce changes, but that the way these changes transpire is via neurochemicals and hormones, etc. Impressions and thoughts can be "food" in that way. But, I guess we'll have to ask a follow-up question or two to be sure.
 
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