Session 30 January 2010

[Nienna]

Wow, a man made quake? How diabolical! But then, when I was listening to alternative radio, I learned of President Wilson sending troops into Haiti and dominating the island from 1915 to 1934 ( http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ho/time/wwi/88275.htm ). It was all done in "good intentions"... or so they say, just like Clinton and Bush say now!

Oh, yes. It's always done for the "good of the people". What they aren't saying is just which people it is good for. WE KNOW that it is the psychopaths who will profit from whatever they can get there such as money, power, military bases, etc.

Nothing the US does is for the good of anybody but the psychopaths that are running the US.

My 2 cents.

 

[WIN 52]

Yes, the psychopathic behaviour in the US is at such a high percentage that this behaviour is being seen as normal. Experts are in denial, probably because they exhibit this behaviour themselves. I am talking about road rage, bullying tactics and other moments when a person seems to be "out of their mind". They are trying to sweep this behaviour into one pile of people who are not psychos.

The big problem is this behaviour is so prominent, that it is seen as not being psychopathic in nature. How frightening is that position? Yet, that is where most North Americans find themselves. They lash out at fellow countrymen for the simplest things, and turn around in the next breath calling Iraqis psychos while considering them selves to be normal.

 

[tracer]

I don't think i was putting words in your mouth. In fact I did not know how Hitler was determined in the discussion. Did you notice the question mark at the end of my sentence?
Putting words in someones mouth is manipulation.

Let's be clear: Manipulation is intentional, misunderstanding is not intentional. All I see in the above exchange is misunderstanding because of lack of clarity... on both sides.

Thanks for offering that Laura!
I agree, nobody is trying to manipulate anyone.
I remain guilty of writing unclearly though (I do that a lot!) - and I am sorry for that!

In order to avoid any confusion I should have asked how Laura and the group defines the psychopath. And I am sorry for that too.
Keep strong and healthy Breton.

 

[Breton]

I don't think i was putting words in your mouth. In fact I did not know how Hitler was determined in the discussion. Did you notice the question mark at the end of my sentence?
Putting words in someones mouth is manipulation.

Let's be clear: Manipulation is intentional, misunderstanding is not intentional. All I see in the above exchange is misunderstanding because of lack of clarity... on both sides.

Thanks for offering that Laura!
I agree, nobody is trying to manipulate anyone.
I remain guilty of writing unclearly though (I do that a lot!) - and I am sorry for that!

In order to avoid any confusion I should have asked how Laura and the group defines the psychopath. And I am sorry for that too.
Keep strong and healthy Breton.

Thanks Tracer, and good health to you too!

 

[Nienna]

I don't think i was putting words in your mouth. In fact I did not know how Hitler was determined in the discussion. Did you notice the question mark at the end of my sentence?
Putting words in someones mouth is manipulation.

Let's be clear: Manipulation is intentional, misunderstanding is not intentional. All I see in the above exchange is misunderstanding because of lack of clarity... on both sides.

Thanks for offering that Laura!
I agree, nobody is trying to manipulate anyone.
I remain guilty of writing unclearly though (I do that a lot!) - and I am sorry for that!

In order to avoid any confusion I should have asked how Laura and the group defines the psychopath. And I am sorry for that too.
Keep strong and healthy Breton.

If you are looking for the definition of psychopathy, there is a good description in the Cassiopedia here.

Then, you can read up on psychopathy from the list on Psychopathy books in the recommended books from QFS.

It is probably a good idea to read them as listed unless you cannot get certain ones in time to read them that way. Then just read them as you can get them.

Enjoy! Learning is fun!!!

 

[tracer]

I don't think i was putting words in your mouth. In fact I did not know how Hitler was determined in the discussion. Did you notice the question mark at the end of my sentence?
Putting words in someones mouth is manipulation.

Let's be clear: Manipulation is intentional, misunderstanding is not intentional. All I see in the above exchange is misunderstanding because of lack of clarity... on both sides.

Thanks for offering that Laura!
I agree, nobody is trying to manipulate anyone.
I remain guilty of writing unclearly though (I do that a lot!) - and I am sorry for that!

In order to avoid any confusion I should have asked how Laura and the group defines the psychopath. And I am sorry for that too.
Keep strong and healthy Breton.

If you are looking for the definition of psychopathy, there is a good description in the Cassiopedia here.

Then, you can read up on psychopathy from the list on Psychopathy books in the recommended books from QFS.

It is probably a good idea to read them as listed unless you cannot get certain ones in time to read them that way. Then just read them as you can get them.

Enjoy! Learning is fun!!!

I was referring to the whole sticky situation. I have had a mess in my head on the psychopathy from an esoteric point of view.
With my lame English reading all these books will take me forever.

 

[tracer]

Q: (Ark) Then I had to put another number which was not told to us. I was asking about the mass of this companion star, and I was told that it was "much less than the sun". So, in my calculations, I put half a percent of the mass of the sun. Is it approximately true?

A: 3.4, closer

I do not know whether it was already discussed somewhere but I am wandering if this body is bigger than Jupiter? And and what is it density?

 

[ScioAgapeOmnis]

I found the masses of the planets here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attributes_of_the_largest_solar_system_bodies

Let me summarize, here are the masses of all the planets relative to the mass of Earth:

Sun - 332,946
Mercury - 0.055
Venus - 0.815
Earth - 1
Jupiter - 318
Saturn - 95
Uranus - 14
Neptune - 17

Jupiter is 318 times more massive than the earth. C's said our brown dwarf is 3.4% the mass of the sun, which would make it 11,320 times more massive than the earth, which is about 35 times more massive than Jupiter. Although that doesn't mean it is 11,320 times bigger than the earth because I believe that would depend on how dense it is. My guess is it is probably closer to the Sun and Jupiter in density than to the Earth, so that would probably make it about 35 times bigger than Jupiter, ish. (Edit: that guess appears to be wrong, see below)

See here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brown_dwarf

Here's another thing talking about brown dwarf density
_http://www.daviddarling.info/encyclopedia/B/browndwarf.html

One way to distinguish low-mass brown dwarfs from gas giant planets is by their density, which is higher. Remarkably, all brown dwarfs, whatever their mass, are about the same size – just a little larger than Jupiter. But because they are much more massive than Jupiter, their densities are considerably greater. Some brown dwarfs also differ from planets in that they emit X-rays. The more massive a brown dwarf, the higher its surface temperature, though a typical value is about 1000K.

Another source:
_http://home.att.net/~numericana/answer/stars.htm

A typical brown dwarf is always roughly the same size as Jupiter, although it can be 15 to 80 times more massive. That's because the density of such a brown dwarf increases in direct proportion to its mass. That density is typically 70 g/cc, which is about 13 times the average density of the Earth (5.515 g/cc) or 50 times the average density of Jupiter itself (namely, 1.33 g/cc).

 

[Juba]

Q: (Ark) Then I had to put another number which was not told to us. I was asking about the mass of this companion star, and I was told that it was "much less than the sun". So, in my calculations, I put half a percent of the mass of the sun. Is it approximately true?

A: 3.4, closer

I do not know whether it was already discussed somewhere but I am wandering if this body is bigger than Jupiter? And and what is it density?

Hello tracer,

As per wiki and other encyclopedias mass of the sun would be between 98% to 99% of entire mass of the solar system. Related to the mass relation of the sun and Jupiter, perhaps will be the best to explain it on this way: If we calculate mass of the sun as 99% of the mass of the entire Solar System than calculation is following:

The mass of the Sun is 1.9891 x1030 kg. I'm sure you find that a hard number to wrap your mind around, so in comparison, that's 333,000 times the mass of the Earth. And while the Earth is made up of rock, the Sun is almost entirely hydrogen and helium; the two lightest elements in the Universe.

Compared to the Sun, Jupiter is about 0.001 its mass, and is about 1/50 its diameter.

Here are some tabs from: http://www.vendian.org/envelope/dir1/earth_jupiter_sun.html

with Earth - Sun - Jupiter relations in mass, diameter, volume....,...

Clarifying size, and practice with spheres...

diameter vs Earth
Earth 107 × 1.27 m 1 x
Jupiter 108 × 1.43 m 10 x (closer to 11)
Sun 109 × 1.39 m 100 x (closer to 110)

length, area, volume
m1 m2 m3
If length (m) goes 1 : 101 : 102 (ie 1 : 10 : 100)
then area (m2) goes 1 : 102 : 104 (12 : 102 : 1002)
and volume (m3) goes 1 : 103 : 106 (13 : 103 : 1003).

diameter vs Earth
Earth 107 × 1.27 m 1 x 100
Jupiter 108 × 1.43 m 10 x 101 (closer to 11)
Sun 109 × 1.39 m 100 x 102 (closer to 110)

surface area vs Earth
Earth 1015 × 0.510 m2 1 x 100
Jupiter 1017 × 0.641 m2 100 x 102 (closer to 130)
Sun 1019 × 0.609 m2 10,000 x 104 (closer to 12,000)

volume vs Earth
Earth 1021 × 1.1 m3 1 x 100
Jupiter 1025 × 1.52 m3 1,000 x 103 (closer to 1,400)
Sun 1027 × 1.41 m3 1,000,000 x 106 (closer to 1,300,000)

diameter area volume
Earth 107 × 1.27 m 1015 × 0.510 m2 1021 × 1.1 m3
Jupiter 108 × 1.43 m 1017 × 0.641 m2 1024 × 1.52 m3
Sun 109 × 1.39 m 1019 × 0.609 m2 1027 × 1.41 m3


mass
The densities (kg/m3) are somewhat similar, so mass follows volume.

density volume mass
Earth 103 × 5.5 kg/m3 (5.5 g/cm3) 1021 × 1.1 m3 1025 × 0.60 kg x100
Jupiter 103 × 1.3 kg/m3 (1.3 g/cm3) 1024 × 1.52 m3 1027 × 1.9 kg x103
Sun 103 × 1.4 kg/m3 (1.4 g/cm3) 1027 × 1.41 m3 1030 × 2.0 kg x106

As Sao allready wrote brown dwarf could have different mass per volume than giant gas planets or stars because of different fusion fuel (Methane (older brown dwarfs), Lithium if high mass brown dwarf (this is according to our calculation small possibility) or deuterium fusion if low mass brown dwarf) and/or limited fusion processes on it's crust side except in it's core.

Attached picture from: http://www.daviddarling.info/encyclopedia/B/browndwarf.html to visualise low mass brown dwarf and Jupiter - Sun volume.

 

[tracer]

Here are some tabs from: http://www.vendian.org/envelope/dir1/earth_jupiter_sun.html

with Earth - Sun - Jupiter relations in mass, diameter, volume....,...

Clarifying size, and practice with spheres...

diameter vs Earth
Earth 107 × 1.27 m 1 x
Jupiter 108 × 1.43 m 10 x (closer to 11)
Sun 109 × 1.39 m 100 x (closer to 110)

length, area, volume
m1 m2 m3
If length (m) goes 1 : 101 : 102 (ie 1 : 10 : 100)
then area (m2) goes 1 : 102 : 104 (12 : 102 : 1002)
and volume (m3) goes 1 : 103 : 106 (13 : 103 : 1003).

diameter vs Earth
Earth 107 × 1.27 m 1 x 100
Jupiter 108 × 1.43 m 10 x 101 (closer to 11)
Sun 109 × 1.39 m 100 x 102 (closer to 110)

surface area vs Earth
Earth 1015 × 0.510 m2 1 x 100
Jupiter 1017 × 0.641 m2 100 x 102 (closer to 130)
Sun 1019 × 0.609 m2 10,000 x 104 (closer to 12,000)

volume vs Earth
Earth 1021 × 1.1 m3 1 x 100
Jupiter 1025 × 1.52 m3 1,000 x 103 (closer to 1,400)
Sun 1027 × 1.41 m3 1,000,000 x 106 (closer to 1,300,000)

diameter area volume
Earth 107 × 1.27 m 1015 × 0.510 m2 1021 × 1.1 m3
Jupiter 108 × 1.43 m 1017 × 0.641 m2 1024 × 1.52 m3
Sun 109 × 1.39 m 1019 × 0.609 m2 1027 × 1.41 m3


mass
The densities (kg/m3) are somewhat similar, so mass follows volume.

density volume mass
Earth 103 × 5.5 kg/m3 (5.5 g/cm3) 1021 × 1.1 m3 1025 × 0.60 kg x100
Jupiter 103 × 1.3 kg/m3 (1.3 g/cm3) 1024 × 1.52 m3 1027 × 1.9 kg x103
Sun 103 × 1.4 kg/m3 (1.4 g/cm3) 1027 × 1.41 m3 1030 × 2.0 kg x106

Does somebody know if there is any way to lossless paste the contents of the table into this forum?
I am asking because these tabs contain errors which have arisen during the process of pasting. Errors of the "power" type. For instance, in the first tab Earth diameter is "107 × 1.27 m" and should be "107 x 1.27 m" and so on.
Perhaps they need to be corrected.

Thank you for your response SAO and jubazo.

 

[ScioAgapeOmnis]

You can go to source code of the page and get the html source of the table (easy way is to select the table and right click in Firefox and go to selection source, so you only get the source code for the part you selected and nothing else, just make sure you select enough to include the < table > tag), then paste it into this converter here:

http://www.seabreezecomputers.com/html2bbcode/ (SMF Code option seems best suited)

This converts html into a code this forum understands which essentially replaces the < > characters with [ ]. There are a few anomalies here and there that you would need to manually correct like removing defined font sizes that this forum doesn't recognize. A bit of work but still faster than manually typing in all the table code. You could also avoid the mess entirely and just post a link to where the table is and leave it as that :)

 

[Harold]

From Obyvatel: Reply #396 on: February 24, 2010, 12:20:18 AM

from: Harold on February 23, 2010, 10:37:17 PM


I get a sick feeling when I realize the enormity of the evil apparatus. But to me in some way, I like to think I see them in their proper light, which is the PTB remind me of those two cartoon characters.... one is the evil mouse and his dumb assistant, and every night after the real scientists leave, they take over the lab, the dumb assistant asks the evil mouse scientist at the beginning of every episode " so what are we gonna do tonight?", the evil mouse impersonating a scientist says "the same thing we do every night so and so...... try to TAKE OVER THE WORLD!!!! moo ha ha ha!!", they never do..... its very funny.

From Obyvatel: So you felt sick at the enormity of the evil apparatus but moved on to trivialize that feeling through comparison with some cartoon characters. This could be an example of self calming . Something for you to consider

Thank-you Obyvatel for the observation, I read the article. So to quote "promotes the further factionalization of little I's." This I would imagine and hope is your observation that you are pointing out? Very interesting.... I am going to keep this in mind. It was a while ago that I made that remark, I 'thought' at the time I was using the cartoon characters to illustrate, on yes, a very simple and comic level. My attempt to apply a light hearted take on the situation..... in this context is innapropriate? Something for me to think about...thanx.

From Obyvatel: Reply #396 on: February 24, 2010, 12:20:18 AM

from: Harold on February 23, 2010, 10:37:17 PM
My only worry in this game is that we are playing with some poor sports, who think nothing of kicking over the game table.

From Obyvatel: This is not a game for 3D residents which is what we all are at this stage. Treating this as a game may not be conducive towards "waking up" to reality - osit.

What would you suggest as how to treat this 3d, if not as a game, as yes, I see a game like situation here in 3d. Something I will definetly consider, thanx. I think it is good to understand the rules of life... yes?...no?

From Patience:Reply #397 on: February 24, 2010, 04:15:56 AM

from: Harold on February 23, 2010, 10:37:17 PM
the evil mouse impersonating a scientist says "the same thing we do every night so and so...... try to TAKE OVER THE WORLD!!!! moo ha ha ha!!", they never do..... its very funny.
My only worry in this game is that we are playing with some poor sports, who think nothing of kicking over the game table

From Patience: Reply #397 on: February 24, 2010, 04:15:56 AM
Laughing at these machinations is probably a defense mechanism against the terror of the situation, and it is an understandable one. I find that my sense of humor itself has been co-opted to make the intolerable acceptable. A laugh break is needed to break the tension from time to time, but I hope that our efforts here will give us the situations in which we can laugh in joy in the fellowship of other humans seeking a way to realise love and service.

Looking at my comment, I apologise for the front line humor, maybe I've been out here too long. I long for the moments, as you say

From Patience:Reply #397 on: February 24, 2010, 04:15:56 AM in which we can laugh in joy in the fellowship of other humans seeking a way to realise love and service

From Laura: Reply #399 on: February 28, 2010, 12:59:20 PM
Quote from: JEEP on February 24, 2010, 05:15:54 PM
Good points, Patience! But, I'd like to readdress what Laura said in her reply:

from: Laura

from: JEEP
In other words, the further one progresses, the more challenging and difficult the progression becomes? In light of these thoughts, my original premise really seems much too mundane. It would seem then, in order to progress, we must move on from what may have been a comfortable point on the cycle (a possible STO physical existence?) to a more uncomfortable, but challenging area of experience in order to continue an upward flow, osit.

I must say, the first premise was a lot easier to wrap my head around, but it probably was too simplistic and our path has probably had a lot more complexity than my limiting thought had allowed.

Actually, I think that when a person reaches a certain progression, they realize with a serious thump to the head that they are here on this planet because that is where they fit and they really need to learn the lessons of this reality before trying to figure out what is going on at higher levels. Understanding what is there at the expense of managing your life here isn't going to help you advance. You have to accumulate energy at this level to advance to the next level and that can only be done by learning the lessons of this level.


I totally agree, if I'm understanding correctly what Laura is saying, that one shouldn't be spending any energy on speculating what is going on at higher levels (4D and the transition to it?), which I didn't think I was doing. I was attempting to formulate an idea as to the progression that led to the "fall" - where we had been rather than to where we are going. And I can see from the rereading of the Cs session from 22 July 2000 (being discussed in this thread), that it's probably impossible to arrive at any kind of accurate line of progression, mostly because lines don't exist and limits don't exist. From the session:

A: How do you perceive the reincarnation process to be?
Q: (LC) I perceive it as you come back with people you choose to come back with, and that you choose people that you are karmically connected to. (I) I see it a little bit differently than that...
A: Aha! We have a variance!
Q: (I) I think that when we die and go to 5th density, that we make pacts with people in each incarnation, so when you come back, it is coming back to fulfill that pact. (LC) Yes, that is the way my line of thinking is going. But, when they asked that question, I was thinking that you have people you come back with because of closeness. Somebody may be your mother in one life, and there is a love bond, and then there are other people that you come back with because you have to resolve something to let go of that person rather than to get closer.
A: This is partially correct. But, there is more to it than this. For example, one can incarnate on various planes of existence, not just the one you perceive currently. And, one may actually reincarnate on more than one plane concurrently, if one is advanced enough to do this.
Q: (I) You know, a psychic told me that I had two lives going on at once... (L) Are you suggesting that ...
A: Yes, we are!
Q: (L) I was thinking it, but they didn't let me finish. For the record, I was thinking that we are all part of the same soul unit here.
A: To an extent, but you may not yet understand what exactly a "soul unit" is in that sense. And of course, there is more than one sense for this as well. The "trick" that 3rd density STS life forms will learn, either prior to transition to 4th density, or at the exact juncture, is to think in absolutely limitless terms. The first and most solid step in this process is to not anticipate at all. This is most difficult for you. We understand this, but this as also why we keep reiterating this point. For example, imagine if one of your past lives is also a future life?
Q: (I) There we have quantum tunnelling!
A: Yes.
Q: (I) This has to do with past lives and future lives.
A: Yes.

So maybe Laura is saying that thinking about what is going on at higher levels is a waste of energy regardless of the orientation of your thinking, be it towards the past or the future? I'll repeat that I believe Ra stated that 3D is not for understanding or rather, don't waste energy on things that are beyond comprehension at this point on our cycle. Instead, concentrate on the lessons to be learned in the absolute present - with no anticipation!

Learning ancient history and speculating about it is THE most worthy pastime, IMO. But you can do that systematically, and have discussions based on at least SOME starting facts. It CAN lead to insights; just as often, it can be just entertainment. My point was that we don't want to get our knickers in a bunch about things we can't grasp yet while there are issues around us that need solutions.

Nice , great input
cheers Harold

edit: moderator cleaned up quotes for clarity

 

[tracer]

You can go to source code of the page and get the html source of the table (easy way is to select the table and right click in Firefox and go to selection source, so you only get the source code for the part you selected and nothing else, just make sure you select enough to include the < table > tag), then paste it into this converter here:

http://www.seabreezecomputers.com/html2bbcode/ (SMF Code option seems best suited)

This converts html into a code this forum understands which essentially replaces the < > characters with [ ]. There are a few anomalies here and there that you would need to manually correct like removing defined font sizes that this forum doesn't recognize. A bit of work but still faster than manually typing in all the table code. You could also avoid the mess entirely and just post a link to where the table is and leave it as that :)

I took the first table from the source given by jubazo and here is the result of the steps you suggested:

	diameter	vs Earth
Earth	107 × 1.27 m	1 x
Jupiter	108 × 1.43 m	10 x	(closer to 11)
Sun	109 × 1.39 m	100 x	(closer to 110)

I'm not delighted with this result and it seems that this forum in this version? does not recognize numeric character references (&#215;).
Any further advices?

Now I think that because of the time it will be necessary to comply with your closing advice in the issue of the tables :)

 

[ScioAgapeOmnis]

No ideas at the moment but this sounds like it should be a separate thread, as it's essentially a technical question about whether there is a clean way to bring html tables into the forum. If you could create the new thread and paste our conversation about this into it, perhaps the mods can delete the posts from this thread, and maybe some forum admins may have some input on the subject. Thanks :)

 

[eschaton]

Q: (L) Why are there different races?
A: Many reasons. Experimental creations. Partly.
Q: (L) Where did the Orientals come from?
A: Same as all others. Result of experimentation.
Q: (L) Did they originate on this planet? Are they native to this planet?
A: Both. Orientals reserved for souls most advanced; Aryans most aggressive;
Negroes most naturally attuned to earth vibrational frequency. So are "native Americans".

Does anyone know what the Cs meant by "Orientals reserved for souls most advanced"?
What does "advanced" mean?
If - for example - a person who incarnated as an Aryan in a particular lifetime reaches certain levels of advancement (whether intellectual, spiritual, or whatever) during that incarnation, does that individual then come back as an "Oriental"?
Anyone have any thoughts on this?

Thanks