Show #57: Vladimir Putin: 'Dictatorial Thug' or Anti-Imperialist Stalwart?

Frankly, I don't have time to deal with snarky nitpickers :lkj: nor does Perceval :read: - the world is on fire and this guy has been registered on this forum since 2010 and has made a total of 15 posts, and never an intro.

Sayonara. :violin:

And by the way, that should be "whom" not "which".
 
Thank you, merci, SotT Talk for you're perspectives on the present state of affairs playing out, and the people(s) involved.

A few posts ago, a tiny aggregate of statistics showed peoples knowledge of who Putin was, which is @ 7 of 10, so not bad really, considering that Americas biggest trading partner, who they share a 5,500 + mile boarder with, had knowledge of the prime minister of that country @ 0 (zero) of 10 :shock: Seems there is a wee-bit of a problem with geopolitical knowledge which can point to a type of mental isolationism for such an "exceptional" society. When the press is run by six corporations and the school curriculum is at rock bottom, it makes sense. In this case, lack of knowledge endangers; which is the point for those running the show.

To be fair, the filters on not knowing or understanding are becoming well affixed in most countries now, who have the same version of a compliant press and deteriorating educational curriculum.

Fwiw, Dis, from your opening comment, it showed a lack of considering without initial explanation for the hosts of the show, and the host of the forum; not only that, for the great many people of the forum who are or want to be engaged on the subject. If you don't agree, there are always ways to ask questions appropriatly and elaborate why you feel so. Perhaps just have a look at what you said initially and see if it could not have been different - you did mention you had had wine, which is probably not the best way to engage people on the forum.
 
voyageur said:
A few posts ago, a tiny aggregate of statistics showed peoples knowledge of who Putin was, which is @ 7 of 10, so not bad really, considering that Americas biggest trading partner, who they share a 5,500 + mile boarder with, had knowledge of the prime minister of that country @ 0 (zero) of 10 :shock: Seems there is a wee-bit of a problem with geopolitical knowledge which can point to a type of mental isolationism for such an "exceptional" society. When the press is run by six corporations and the school curriculum is at rock bottom, it makes sense. In this case, lack of knowledge endangers; which is the point for those running the show.

I don't think there is any "mental isolationism" or other such things. I think it is just the amount of exposure. Presidential and gubernatorial campaigns give a lot of exposure and every student is required to know the current president and state governor. Putin has been in the news lately, a lot, and is therefore talked about in private conversations as well. Angela Merkel is a female leader of powerful European country so she gets a lot of exposure as a female role model. In my opinion there are many Americans that aren't really interested in geopolitics, which is ironic when you look at American involvement in world affairs. However, they do seem to like a good story. If you make a geopolitical event exciting they become interested.

ADDED: I thought I might add an amusing exchange I had with a friend. We were casually talking about the Russian/Ukraine situation and he referred to some derogatory comment that a news personality said about Putin. Then he said,"I personally wish it was like the NFL draft and we could trade our president [Obama] with their president [Putin]. I mean the one we got is freakin' embarrassing. This guy [Putin] hunts tigers and rides horses while ours is afraid of guns and rides bicycles with a freakin' helmet. This guy is a martial artist and ours brags about what he can do with his pen and his phone." I don't know. All I could do was laugh.
 
Great show, Joe and Kniall. Lots of insight into Putin.
And James Corbett as well. I am really disappointed that he and Abby Martin have such a limited view of reality. I would expect better from them. I actually took Corbett's report on Putin at face value. I'm probably more disappointed in myself for not being more objective about what I hear from so-called reliable alternative news sources. I guess I just assumed that because Corbett seems to have a high degree of accuracy and objectivity in most of his reports, that that would be the case in all of them.
After all, how hard is it to believe that if Russia had not intervened in Crimea, there would have been a bloodbath similar to the ones in Syria, Iraq and elsewhere. Not to imagine the economic destruction of Crimea and the loss to Russia of it's only naval base with access to the Mediterranean.
Again, great show and keep up the good work.
 
Aye, another great show again Joe & Niall (despite the interference). I was waiting for Joe to say "send your hate mail to Blog Talk Radio" - this always makes me chuckle.

Thank you for sharing some interesting insights of Putin :thup:
 
I agree with the others, it was a very interesting show.
That Russian woman journalist Anna Politkovskaya came to mind who was shot to death in her apartment in 2006. This was also blamed on Putin, if I am not mistaken.
 
Blogtalk cut out for me just as Joe was discussing 'Russia's options' and how certain other alternative commentators, essentially, maintain that Putin should 'do nothing', "roll over".

I hadn't thought of it in that a way, and i think it's an important point that i certainly overlooked (due to relying on the authority of others). Also, it probably hadn't occurred to me because, in some ways, i extrapolate any action - such as a move into Crimea - as effecting Crimea's/Ukraine’s sovereignty and the potential for WW3 when 'all we want is peace' and for countries to be autonomous.

We don't have peace and i don't see any free countries. I don't ;support' either and i think looking at the situation more from a 'gaming' perspective is what is required.

Obviously there are other outcomes which are to be considered, and actually a demonstration of defence may be all that is needed.
Or even that it's about time to get things moving, so if that's where the game goes, so be it.
[infact i understand it has worked and now the EU/US are demanding sanctions?]

(I hope i understood that point correctly)

So i just wanted to say Thank You all involved :)
 
Hi Guys,

After some feedback from You from show with Robert Kirckpatrick "American Heart of Darkness" I realized how I am still prejudiced towards other nations and especially towards Poland's neighbours: Germany and Russia.

When all show really reved up in Ukraine or while I started to really notice it in media (I just listen to Deutschland Funk due to learning German purpose) I realized that it is so predictable for Polish people "to know" whos wrong and who makes mess up there. Of course Russia.

When I was looking on different services providing information I could not find one which would tell what I learned from SOTT distributing also from different sources but anyway.

I just could not believe that media are satisfied with official version of "peacefull revolution" going on on Maidan. And what I could see among my colleagues who was somehow interested in the situation in Ukraine, none was suspecting other parties that could have some business in Ukraine except Russia.

In DLF (Deutschland Funk) there were just small mentions just after escape of Yanukovych that IMF appeared on the scene offering "help" to the new Ukrainian leaders. And I think it was on Thursday morning this week that I heard only once one of the leaders of the left strongly criticizing Merkel for associating with fascists. The rest of the coverage was focusing on the threats from Russia and alleged violations done by Russia.

Great. And it seems that no one is willing to question anything in this version.
This version hits our Polish program: imperialistic Russia always wants to rule the world. I felt it in me and now for some reason I was feeling like going against this mass hypnosis. For the first time I have seen Russian people as being on the right side. I mean for You maybe it sounds strange and nothing exciting but for me it was like treating Russians for the first time like human not like a nation. Not seeing them through historical filters.

I do not know who Putin is and I do not believe that Russia became now something holy and saint but this little revelation that I could have seen beyond "nation" it was ... good. Yeah. And just realized how powerful beliefs are, how silent and unnoticed but how destructive. Why no-one is questioning officially presence of USA in Poland? Because of this threat from Russia Polish defence ministry allowed to install some equipment from USA and some super flying craft to monitor our borders. Why in general we still believe in that myth of USA?

This was good lesson for me. I hope I could live now in Russia too to know people and place more... and to make my devil come to light and never come back.
 
Poles (mostly) didn't fulfill lessons under USSR ocupation and didn't fulfill lessons at all from history. At the political transformation (into "democracy") only master has changed and Poland just passed from red to blue.

After the annexations and occupations of Polish nation like a phoenix from the ashes reborn the governments fascism and nationalism and like a dog that barks the loudest who is strongly subordinate to the other countrie/s (as it is now: western countries), looking for someone else to dominate.

Anti-Russian phobia is a symptom of "treatment" of that national complexes. It seems that Poland also have a knack for being useful idiots in the international games.

Not all Poles are like that, of course, many also think for themselves, but it is hard to come to the fore here. Personally, I feel like stranger in my own country with little chance to positively affect the country.

I suspect that not a single Pole is frustrated and differences between the views and approaches of the average Pole and the government that "represents" them are very significant.
 
Just finished listening to this show. Another great one! You guys did a really good job setting the context all this is happening in. Thanks.
 
Unfortunately, many Poles including most of Polish politicians suffer from wilful blindness. For me, as Pole it’s terrifying to see how again Poland has being used by the USA, actually on its own request.

Lux is right saying that Poland has a knack for being useful idiots in international games. Poland have been fooled so many times by the West and it has not enough…But why? When taking into account the mentality of a common Pole the answer is easy: everything that makes Russia weaker is good. It’s so sad…
 
Mikel said:
After some feedback from You from show with Robert Kirckpatrick "American Heart of Darkness" I realized how I am still prejudiced towards other nations and especially towards Poland's neighbours: Germany and Russia.

Thanks for sharing this lesson, Mikel. It's easy to gloss over why a particular nation or group of people might accept various pathological ideologies without knowing the full context or history of how things have been seen in the past. Even if one does know some of the history, having some personal stories brings things home a bit. That's what's great about the international presence this forum has. People can share the ponerization unique to their nation, and we can all learn about it together.
 
Kasia said:
Unfortunately, many Poles including most of Polish politicians suffer from wilful blindness. For me, as Pole it’s terrifying to see how again Poland has being used by the USA, actually on its own request.

Lux is right saying that Poland has a knack for being useful idiots in international games. Poland have been fooled so many times by the West and it has not enough…But why? When taking into account the mentality of a common Pole the answer is easy: everything that makes Russia weaker is good. It’s so sad…

Hello Kasia. Welcome to the forum.

We ask that new forum members introduce themselves in the Newbies section. Nothing personal, just a little bit about yourself and how you found the forum. If you are unsure of what to write, take a look at how others on the board have done it.

:)
 
Mikel said:
I just could not believe that media are satisfied with official version of "peacefull revolution" going on on Maidan. And what I could see among my colleagues who was somehow interested in the situation in Ukraine, none was suspecting other parties that could have some business in Ukraine except Russia.

Here is part of the picture:

_http://www.kyklosproductions.com/posts/index.php?p=222

Who Benefits from the Ukraine Economic Crisis said:
6. Ukraine Crony Capitalists-USA Capitalists Connections

Little has been written to date about the close connections between the Ukraine’s ‘crony capitalists’ pro-western wing’s connections to western capitalist interests, and USA capitalists in particular.

There are two wings of Ukrainian ‘cronys’—the pro-western and the pro-Russian. Both are composed of opportunist bureaucrats of the Soviet era turned capitalist when the Soviet Union imploded more than 20 years ago. Both wings have been fighting it out openly since the Orange Revolution of 2004, now one in ascendancy, now the other. The pro-western wing is loosely associated with the ‘Fatherland’ Party, once led by Timoshenko and her predecessors; the other by Yanukovich and his predecessors, associated with the ‘Regions’ Party. All the top politicians in both are multi-millionaires and billionaires, having alternating between themselves in raping the Ukraine economically for more than two decades now. The Ukraine in the early 1990s had an economy and standard of living well above the other new ex-Soviet Republics. Today its GDP and average income is less than Belarus and well below Russia’s.

The Yanukovich cronies have been deposed in the recent coup of February 22, or are at least in retreat economically and trying to consolidate their economic forces. Ousted from political control are Yanukovich and ‘Regions’ party billionaire cronies like Rinat Akhmetov, richest man in the Ukraine worth $15 billion, with big holdings in energy and metals; Vadim Novinsky, the third richest; Dymtro Firtash, with billions in chemicals, banking and real estate, who was recently arrested in western Europe; and Sehiy Tihipko, former head of the Ukraine central bank.

The Fatherland party billionaires are now in control, with their very wealthy compatriot, newly minted prime minister, Arseniy Yatsenyuk, running the new government. But behind the scenes lurk the real new crony powerbrokers.

At the top of this list is Victor Pinchuk, the second richest man in the Ukraine with an empire in Media and other business interests. His foundation has been central in funding NGOs (non-government organizations) in the Ukraine, which have been the conduits for western money to help destabilize the Ukraine for years. Pinchuk’s foundation works closely with Yatsenyuk’s foundation. Pinchuk is also close to Wall St. and the Council on Foreign Relations in the USA, the premier foreign policy strategy organization of capitalists in the US. Pinchuk is also on the board of the Petersen Institute in the USA, another key organization influencing US economic and foreign policy. Pinchuk interfaces frequently with the Clinton and Blair Foundations, and is a major participant in the annual gathering of big capitalists at the World Economic Forum in Davos, Switzerland. He is friends with Bill Gates and Warren Buffet.

Below Pinchuk are other key crony-billonaires like Igor Turchynov, interim President and Speaker of the Ukrainian parliament; Stepan Kuban, who heads the new Ukrainian central bank; Sergey Tartuta, billionaire coal and steel boss with extensive holdings in eastern Ukraine, who was just recently appointed the new governor of the Donetsk region in the east after the Yatsenyuk team fired its previous pro-Yanukovich governor. Tartuta has close economic ties with Poland and Hungarian capitalists. Still another is Ihor Kolomysky, similarly appointed in recent weeks as new governor of the Dnepopetrovsk region in the eastern Ukraine.

These billionaires who are either themselves in the Ukrainian parliament, or who were and continue to control blocks of 30-50 votes each, were undoubtedly behind the ‘inside strategy’ of the February 22 Coup. The ‘outside strategy’ was driven by the proto-fascists on the street and in Maidan square. As the latter stepped up the attack outside the Parliament, on the inside the vote to depose Yanukovich took place, as some of his own cronies deserted him to join the ‘Fatherland’ cronies—no doubt convinced in part by threats that arose simultaneously from the west that their assets in Swiss and Luxembourg banks would be frozen. As for the Maidan proto-fascists—the elements of the Svoboda party, the ‘Right Sector’, the UPA, and others—they have been nicely rewarded for their assistance with no fewer than six key positions in the new post-coup government of Yatsenyuk. These include formal positions of police and military power, such as Oleksandr Sych, new vice-premier (second to Yatsenyuk); Andrey Parubiy, National Security Secretary and head of the National Security Council; Dmytro Yarosh, Deputy Secretary for National Security; and Oleh Makhnitsky, Chief Prosecutor; Dimitri Balaatov, Minister of Youth. It is clear the proto-fascists have chosen positions in the government that will allow them to build, arm and organize their street gangs better in the future, now under official government cover.
 
I have been following the line of Putin for some time now. What we see here is a striking similarities between Putin and Julius Caesar; the way he lived in poverty as a child, the way he made his way to get to the top and how he managed to secure his position there in extremely hostile and complicated situation, the way he has been successfully working to rebuilt the country from the ashes, ruled by puppet oligarchs controlled by the ‘West’, in every aspect, political, economical, social, cultural, military, and how much he managed to accomplish in just 10 years time, the way he acts firm, when he feels it is needed and generously, when situation allows. The way he understands people's psychology and his wisdom in dealing with them, not looking for the revenge but for the benefit of the country and its people. The way he cares for people of other countries (like Syria). The way he is popular and supported by common people. The way he conducts himself.

Most importantly, the way he teaches the world the TRUTH about the world we live in through technical devices. Russia seems to be the perfect country, if not the only powerful enough country that can attempt to oppose 'The system'. Putin is doing it and he is doing it right. He seems to be well prepared and secured in every aspect. He once said something like: “We are on the side of the truth, we will win”.

What appears in my mind is that there is a good possibility, that what we witness here is the “Return of Christ”. Perhaps?
 
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