Smoking is... good?

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Re: FSC Fire-Safe Cigarettes

Gimpy said:
This paper contains only natural flax fiber, calcium carbonate,
citric acid, diammonium phosphate (a naturally occurring material),
guar gum, water, and the natural starch used to form the speed
bumps.

Uranium is a naturally occurring material too, but I don't want to smoke it! :wow: :umm: :headbash:

ROFL You are MUCH more PC than I .....I read that and immediately thought "What comes out the rear end of my dog is all natural too, but I wouldn't want to smoke it"

I called the Mohawk Trading Associates (Native and Seneca cigs) yesterday 'cause I felt like I should at least warn them some people might be allergic. The lady was real nice and said someone would call me back, but no has as of yet. They might think I intend to sue them...which I don't.

I still have two nasty soars on my lips, and my voice isn't right yet. A friend brought me a honey like concoction last night, and it is helping A LOT. I still sound like Marge Simpson's sisters, but it doesn't hurt anymore. :)
 
Re: FSC Fire-Safe Cigarettes

Guardian said:
ROFL You are MUCH more PC than I .....I read that and immediately thought "What comes out the rear end of my dog is all natural too, but I wouldn't want to smoke it"

I called the Mohawk Trading Associates (Native and Seneca cigs) yesterday 'cause I felt like I should at least warn them some people might be allergic. The lady was real nice and said someone would call me back, but no has as of yet. They might think I intend to sue them...which I don't.

I still have two nasty soars on my lips, and my voice isn't right yet. A friend brought me a honey like concoction last night, and it is helping A LOT. I still sound like Marge Simpson's sisters, but it doesn't hurt anymore. :)

Guardian do you smoke American Spirits from the pack or are they roll-your-own? As far as I can tell the roll-your-own papers are still made from 100% flax, no "speed bumps" or carpet glue...
 
Re: FSC Fire-Safe Cigarettes

Guardian said:
Puck said:
Hey Guardian, I just had another thought. Lately, it seems there's been a lot of bad juju in the air. I've been trying to take extra precautions, watching my energy level, staying away from unnecessary risks, paying extra close attention to my diet and school/work life. That said, please consider all the tragedy and drama we've see forumites having to deal with. This could be a trap, one you may regret falling into if it turns out badly.


I hear you Puck, and I have a LOT to think about today. There is certainly a whole lot of high weirdness going on. A cigarette almost killed me last night, and I am not exaggerating. If I had been alone, I might not be sitting here right now. I was on-line putting links up and my lips and throat started to burn and swell. It got so bad I could hardly breath. Couldn't yell, talk...nothing. Fortunately the ambulance guys recognized what was happening and stuck me with something that started to open my airway up almost immediately. The medic said I was their third "victim" of FSC" cigarettes. They told me one lady is still in the hospital with possible brain damage from lack of air.

Unbeknownst to me cigarette manufactures have added an ingredient to ALL cigarettes (even my no additives Native brand ) that I and some other people are deathly allergic to. They are called "Fire Safe Cigarettes" and have a chemical in them to stop them from burning if left in an ashtray. They showed me the letters "FSC" printed above the bar code on the pack I had just opened.

I am just starting to look into FSC cigarettes (the drugs they gave me made me sleep 12 freakin hours) but it looks like I will be rolling my own from now on. I do not tolerate ANY chemicals or drugs well, and there is a new law that requires these chemicals in ALL cigarettes...even Native and American Spirit brands.

I still have some nasty burns on my lips and my throat feels like I drank drano. I guess the majority of people can tolerate these new chemicals...but I can't. I suppose it could have been a coincidence that I was working on the Kituwah issue ...except I really don't believe in coincidences.

Holy crap Guardian that's awful! I just realized this is what you were referring to when you said you wished you had read this thread a couple days ago. Hope you don't mind me quoting your post from another thread here so people can see what they're up against and hopefully be forewarned.

I hope everything clears up for you soon. :cool2: <- (hand rolled)
 
Re: FSC Fire-Safe Cigarettes

Thanks for the info! Things are going crazier by the day... I'd vote for a poster: "Natural Tobacco is Naturally Fire-Safe: Mother Earth Approved."
 
Re: FSC Fire-Safe Cigarettes

Thanks for bringing this subject up!

For the last 2 - 3 months I have noticed the feeling of needing to clear my throat a lot. It feels like phlegm or a constriction in my throat. Also have been coughing more. It is very annoying and I was wondering what was going on. :huh: I have been smoking American Spirits.

Dang, another thing to be angry about! :mad:

Gonna role my own. :cool2:
 
Re: FSC Fire-Safe Cigarettes

Star asks FDA permission to sell reduced risk product
Feb 23, 2010—Star Scientific, Inc. has filed an application with the Food & Drug Administration for approval to market its Ariva-BDL brand as a "modified risk" tobacco product under the Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act of 2009. According to the company, this submission is the first such application to be filed with the Tobacco Products Center of the FDA, which has been established to oversee all aspects of tobacco regulation outlined in the 2009 Act.

Ariva-BDL, a dissolvable tobacco lozenge with wintergreen flavoring, is made with flue-cured tobacco that contains levels of tobacco-specific nitrosamines (TSNAs) that are below detectable limits ("BDL") by most current standards of measure. TSNAs have been identified in scientific literature since the early 1950s as one of the most deadly and abundant groups of carcinogens in tobacco and its smoke.

Star says that TSNA levels in Ariva-BDL are significantly lower than those measured in currently marketed popular moist snuff and "pouch" tobacco products.

The company believes that Ariva-BDL, if approved, will be attractive to other companies. For this reason, Star has committed to exploring opportunities for sub-licensing agreements with both domestic and international entities
 
Re: FSC Fire-Safe Cigarettes

Fwiw, the best rolling papers I've ever used are the American Spirit papers. They're 100% flax, chlorine free and use natural gum. You can order them by the pack but they're cheaper with the four-pack: https://www.rollingpapers.com/cgi/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=4574

Or here on ebay someone is selling 12 packs for $10 US. That's .83 cents per pack which is almost half the price of what they normally cost - http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=360154071520&rvr_id=&crlp=1_263602_263622&UA=M*S%3F&GUID=dbd8a5251260a02653465e56ffa01d89&itemid=360154071520&ff4=263602_263622

Or if all else fails just search google for "American Spirit Flax Rolling Papers"

Down with filters! Down with tubes! :P
 
Re: FSC Fire-Safe Cigarettes

I've been thinking about trying cigarettes. I signed up for the American Spirit website and they're sending me some coupons. But after reading this I'm not sure if I want to with those fire safe chemicals. I think I might get a RYO device and just dump the tobacco out of the cigs if I get them.

JonnyRadar said:
Down with filters! Down with tubes! :P

Aren't the tubes and tube machines a lot easier and faster to make cigarettes with?
 
Re: FSC Fire-Safe Cigarettes

3D Student said:
Aren't the tubes and tube machines a lot easier and faster to make cigarettes with?

Easier and faster, maybe, depending on how fast you can handroll. Personally I prefer not having to mess with the extra equipment, and taking the time to roll a cig makes it a more pensive experience for me.

Also, lots of the tubes have tar lines in the papers so they'll burn better, not to mention the paper being thicker, which means you get more paper smoke in the paper/tobacco smoke ratio. I also don't feel too comfortable taking in the smoke when it's run through the foam filters, but that's just me and I don't have any evidence to back up whether or not it's harmful to smoke through the filters.

3D Student said:
But after reading this I'm not sure if I want to with those fire safe chemicals.

The other benefit to using rolling papers is that they don't have the FSC in them, depending on which type you get. American Spirit papers like the ones I linked to above are made of flax with no additives. Lots of cigarette papers, especially the tubes, contain chlorine as a bonding agent.
 
Re: FSC Fire-Safe Cigarettes

3D Student said:
Aren't the tubes and tube machines a lot easier and faster to make cigarettes with?

Not necessarily. My machine has a serious jamming problem so it fills about halfway and I have to do a lot of manual packing to make it tight. I've never been able to get a well-packed ciggie with just one push on the machine. Could just be my device though. I wouldn't consider it a major inconvenience. Just messy.

I think once my tubes run out I'll get some natural rolling papers.
 
Re: FSC Fire-Safe Cigarettes

Thanks for the info JonnyRadar and Odyssey, I'll take it into consideration if I decide to try RYO.
 
Re: FSC Fire-Safe Cigarettes

I've asked a couple of natural tobacco producers whether they use fire-safe papers. I am waiting until March 1st to hear back from Manitou, a German tobacco company. I've also gotten in touch with Nat Sherman about their Natural range. Their website shows a diagram of their cigarettes, which includes their use of 100% flax paper. I also realised that all of their cigarettes are claimed to be 100% additive-free natural tobacco, not just their Natural range. However, I've read in many places that Nat Sherman have gone completely FSC now, which means their 100% flax paper diagram (see link below) is a load of crap. So it will be interesting to hear back from the two.

_http://natsherman.com/since1930/ns_cigarette_anatomy.cfm?CFID=131135&CFTOKEN=ab02d79503a576d-07FA8670-19B9-F18B-22B0FC752C48741B&jsessionid=5c304d1d72d5a965dac0194e3a194a731a3c

Has anyone ascertained what brands are still producing non-FSC cigarettes or tobacco?

American Spirits aren't sold in Australia any more, so I don't know what to buy. :/

EDIT: Manitou offer loose tobacco in Australia, so I've just answered my own question. It's just a matter of finding non-FSC papers :)
 
Re: FSC Fire-Safe Cigarettes

Nathan said:
I've asked a couple of natural tobacco producers whether they use fire-safe papers. I am waiting until March 1st to hear back from Manitou, a German tobacco company. I've also gotten in touch with Nat Sherman about their Natural range. Their website shows a diagram of their cigarettes, which includes their use of 100% flax paper. I also realised that all of their cigarettes are claimed to be 100% additive-free natural tobacco, not just their Natural range. However, I've read in many places that Nat Sherman have gone completely FSC now, which means their 100% flax paper diagram (see link below) is a load of crap. So it will be interesting to hear back from the two.

_http://natsherman.com/since1930/ns_cigarette_anatomy.cfm?CFID=131135&CFTOKEN=ab02d79503a576d-07FA8670-19B9-F18B-22B0FC752C48741B&jsessionid=5c304d1d72d5a965dac0194e3a194a731a3c

Has anyone ascertained what brands are still producing non-FSC cigarettes or tobacco?

American Spirits aren't sold in Australia any more, so I don't know what to buy. :/

EDIT: Manitou offer loose tobacco in Australia, so I've just answered my own question. It's just a matter of finding non-FSC papers :)


Is there a reason you can't smoke with a pipe? Its another solution. :)
 
Re: FSC Fire-Safe Cigarettes

Hey guys, I emailed American Spirit to find out if they were adding chemicals to the paper and here's the email and reply. I highlighted the interesting bits.

me said:
Hi,

Recently I've been directed to information that demonstrated a new chemical additive being put in most all cigarettes. It's called FSC or some such, designed to prevent the cigarette from burning continuously. I was hoping that American Spirit Organic and Additive free cigarettes would remain just that, additive free and organic - however fellow smokers have indicated that even you guys are putting this new chemical into cigarettes. I was hoping you could clear up my confusion, because I have a friend who had a severe allergic reaction to it, and I REALLY do not like any sort of chemical additive in my smokes.

Is there a difference between the boxed cigarettes and the rolled tobacco?

Thanks
Brent K

And the reply:

Dear Brent,

Thank you for expressing your concerns about our Natural American Spirit Fire Standards Compliant (FSC) cigarettes. Please find information on our methods of creating these cigarettes listed below. If you would like to discuss your concerns further, please feel free to call us at 1-800-332-5595 and any of our Customer Care specialists will be happy to assist you personally.

"Fire Standards Compliant," (FSC) is a phrase Santa Fe Natural Tobacco Company uses to describe the Natural American Spirit cigarettes that have been tested and have satisfied the requirements of many states across the country (further information about which states are involved is listed below). These tests, according to state authorities, measure the tendency of a cigarette to self-extinguish if left unattended. All tobacco companies are required to abide by this law. Please note: while our FSC cigarettes are more likely to go out when left to smolder than our regular cigarettes, this does not mean that they are "fire-safe" or any more "fire-safe" than regular Natural American Spirit cigarettes. Therefore, we stress that no cigarette can be considered to be "fire-safe."

Santa Fe Natural Tobacco Company does not add any chemicals to our tobacco to comply with State fire safety laws. We simply use a new type of flax-based cigarette paper which has built-in "speed bumps." Two speed bumps are placed in horizontal bands along the length of the cigarette. The burn retardant bands are virtually non-porous. As a result, not enough oxygen can diffuse through the bands to the burning tobacco in order to support the smoldering process. As the lit end burns across these bands, the supply of oxygen is restricted and the cigarette is more likely to self-extinguish.

The material used to create the speed bumps is a natural starch, made from a water based alginate that is an extract of seaweed. This alginate is food use approved, biodegradable and applied to the paper in a water solution.
Our FSC cigarettes contain the same amount of tobacco that Natural American Spirit cigarettes always have, and we use only the same premium quality 100% additive-free natural tobacco our customers have come to know and expect.

We have been recommending to our customers that they try our roll your own tobacco as an alternative to the FSC cigarettes, as the papers supplied with loose tobacco do not currently need to meet state laws for FSC standards. We also recommend using Premier brand filter tubes to create a filtered cigarette. Premier products use the same ingredients that we do in our own cigarettes, but are not required to include the FSC bands.

Due to national legislative trends, we are producing all of our cigarettes as Fire Standards Compliant (FSC) as of September 28, 2009. Most states and Washington D.C. have already passed FSC legislation. The remaining few states have filed or introduced FSC legislation, and we anticipate that these introduced bills will pass in the state legislatures.

Please remember that there is NO safe cigarette. FSC cigarettes need the same careful attention and handling as any other cigarette. Any burning cigarette can ignite materials if handled carelessly. If you are concerned about the health risks of smoking, the best advice is to quit smoking.

Thanks again for taking the time to contact us, Brent. We hope this information has been helpful. We appreciate your interest in our Natural American Spirit tobacco products!

Best regards,

The People of Santa Fe Natural Tobacco Company

:cool2: :cool2: :cool2:
 
Re: FSC Fire-Safe Cigarettes

I also received a reply from Manitou, in Germany.

According to a certain law we have to use fire-safe paper.

I asked if chemicals are added to the paper to achieve this or if speed bumps are used.

We do not use "speed bumps" at all to be consistent with our philosophy of
"producing without additives".

I think this person misunderstood what I meant by speed bumps, or that speed bumps can be used in flax paper (as Puck quoted above) without the addition of detrimental chemicals.

On the brighter side, Manitou also sell loose additive-free tobacco. And Nat Sherman sell additive-free cigar tobacco. :)

EDIT: I meant to say pipe tobacco, not cigar tobacco :P
 

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