Smoking is... good?

[Oxajil]

One thing I can't really get over is the throat and lung irritation I've felt. I know it was non-organic that I tried, but I still think that inhaling heated smoke does result in some lung damage; no matter what substances you're delivering to your bloodstream. That's why I just have been sticking with nicotine patches.

But now you're basing your decision on belief, unless you have data that backs that up? In my case, inhaling the smoke through my mouth was too harsh on me, it made me cough, so now when I have the smoke in my mouth, I get it in my lungs by inhaling through my nose, and then exhale through my mouth. That's much more pleasant for me. But I personally don't think "heated smoke" is harmful, if you keep the smoke a bit longer in the mouth before you inhale it, it cools down. Not to mention the air from outside that goes with it once you inhale, which cools it down too.

 

[whitecoast]

One thing I can't really get over is the throat and lung irritation I've felt. I know it was non-organic that I tried, but I still think that inhaling heated smoke does result in some lung damage; no matter what substances you're delivering to your bloodstream. That's why I just have been sticking with nicotine patches.

But now you're basing your decision on belief, unless you have data that backs that up? In my case, inhaling the smoke through my mouth was too harsh on me, it made me cough, so now when I have the smoke in my mouth, I get it in my lungs by inhaling through my nose, and then exhale through my mouth. That's much more pleasant for me. But I personally don't think "heated smoke" is harmful, if you keep the smoke a bit longer in the mouth before you inhale it, it cools down. Not to mention the air from outside that goes with it once you inhale, which cools it down too.

Yeah I don't deny that is probably something I'm taking for granted without investigating properly. The dreaded "truthiness" blindspot. I haven't considered experimenting with different inhalation techniques before, but that and organic tobacco are two things I should be looking into more seriously. Thanks for the input. :)

 

[SeekinTruth]

You get used to smoking after a little while. I've been smoking since I was around 13, although I didn't start smoking regularly everyday until in my early 20's -- I used to be a casual smoker, like 4 or 5 a day and sometimes not smoke for up to a couple of weeks when I ran out -- until I became a regular smoker and began smoking everyday. That was over 20 years ago. So I don't have any issues, but it does depend on the quality of the tobacco and also how dry it is when it comes to irritating the throat, etc. and even whether the taste is pleasant or not.

But first, smoking is not for everyone. That said, if you do try it and find that it IS for you and you enjoy it, you'll get used to it pretty fast. Some people don't have any issues right off the bat, others will need a little while to get used to it. I still don't smoke that much: about 8 to 10 regular cigarettes plus 1 to 2 bowls of pipe with pipe tobacco (probably another 3 to 8 cigarettes worth of tobacco -- depending on how much I pack in), and the occasional cigarello and roll-your-own.

The nicotine patch is a far from ideal delivery system and who knows what other unwanted chemicals are being absorbed besides nicotine into the skin. Also there's quite a bit of information about the vaporizers/"e-cigs" here and on SOTT (mostly in reader's comments) if you do a search. Vaporizers are generally not recommended either. If you decided you benefit from nicotine, your best bet is to smoke quality pure (ideally organic) tobacco.

 

[SeekinTruth]

One more thing that's been on my mind the last year or more, ever since the "Fire Safe Cigarette" laws were passed. Where did THIS issue come from? It seems to me to have come out of the blue. Fire from cigarettes weren't a problem ALL that time and then suddenly there was such a serious problem that legislation was enacted to make the FSC cigarettes mandatory?

Did anyone notice increased reports of people burning down their house connected to smoking cigarettes for the few years before these laws came out? I didn't. Very suspicious. I get the feeling it was one more new way to poison the population, particularly the "first hand" smokers. Maybe the PTB weren't satisfied with the myriad other ways they poison the population and want to accelerate and escalate it?

I know that a lot of the imported cigarettes here in Armenia are also FSC. I've never smoked an FSC cigarette, but from what I've heard from other forum members, they're REALLY nasty! Same from a couple of people who switched to local brands in the last year or so. A lot of people smoke imports for some reason, besides most being toxic crap that shouldn't be called tobacco, they cost from 2 to 4 times or more of the price of local cigarettes. One guy who switched to local, told my brother if you put the FSC cigarette in hot water (he said tea) there's a cellophane kind of thing that comes out and floats in it.

 

[Mr. Premise]

You know, I was interested in trying tobacco, but all the stores I went to only carried generic agrochemical-infused cigarettes. I actually ended up settling with using nicotine patches for my day-to-day dosage

A subjective part of me, of course, does not want to have to be seen smoking by my relatives. British Columbia is one of the most vehemently anti-smoking regions in the world, from what I've heard. My mother used to smoke often when I was a child, and I did end up getting terribly sick due to problems in the indoor "air quality," as a medical specialist told us. And almost every single adult relative I've had while growing up did memorize these little pet anti-smoking lectures, saying what we'd be forced to do if we were ever "caught" smoking (because it is obviously a cloak-and-dagger operation we're talking about here). This stains my memory of tobacco somewhat, but I have tried a non-organic cigarillo before and ended up liking it.

One thing I can't really get over is the throat and lung irritation I've felt. I know it was non-organic that I tried, but I still think that inhaling heated smoke does result in some lung damage; no matter what substances you're delivering to your bloodstream. That's why I just have been sticking with nicotine patches. Even if the delivery method is slower, I like just having to put it on in the morning and not worry about it for the rest of the day. Plus I don't need to go outside for a smoke during work breaks and I can just read a book or something. ;)

That being said, have any of you considered using a vaporizer on tobacco, to make the nicotine optimally healthy or pure for inhalation? That's one thing I would consider using, but I couldn't justify spending upwards of 150$ on something just for myself like that. And I can't carry it around in my pocket either, of course.

Well the newer e-cigarettes can be carried easily in your pocket. It's just a mini vaporizer. People who have gone from cigarettes to e-cigarettes say it's easier on your lungs. I bought one (No. 7 brand) that looks like a pen for use on long plane flights. I was introduced to them when for work I was at a client site right after I started smoking and this young guy had one, which he would "smoke" right in the conference room with everyone. Since the boiling point of nicotine is pretty high, it doesn't really get vaporized, but the nicotine is suspended in vegetable glycol which gets vaporized. Apparently it's the same stuff they use for medical inhalers. They really work, but since the nicotine is not actually vaporized, it doesn't hit your brain quite as fast as smoking, so I still only use the e-cigarette when I can't smoke. But if my lungs start to feel bad I might.

Whitecoast, how did you find the patch? I was curious about those, too. My wife's an ex smoker who wasn't happy when I started (but respects free will and only gives me a hard time about it when I give her a hard time about wheat and dairy! Fair's fair), and when I extolled the virtues of nicotine, she suggested a patch.

 

[Don Genaro]

Did anyone notice increased reports of people burning down their house connected to smoking cigarettes for the few years before these laws came out? I didn't. Very suspicious.

Ha ha, yes! I read the article by Joe Jackson last night and I heard an ad on the radio this morning about the risks of burning down the house because you "had to have that last smoke at night and didn't put it out properly". You know the sad thing is you could point out to someone that if a fire burns down because of cigarette smoke, maybe they should look for a needle or a bottle to explain how the smoker "forgot to put out the cigarette" but the anti smoking activist is still going to reply "it doesn't matter- if they hadn't been smoking..."

 

[EGVG]

Did anyone notice increased reports of people burning down their house connected to smoking cigarettes for the few years before these laws came out? I didn't. Very suspicious.

Ha ha, yes! I read the article by Joe Jackson last night and I heard an ad on the radio this morning about the risks of burning down the house because you "had to have that last smoke at night and didn't put it out properly". You know the sad thing is you could point out to someone that if a fire burns down because of cigarette smoke, maybe they should look for a needle or a bottle to explain how the smoker "forgot to put out the cigarette" but the anti smoking activist is still going to reply "it doesn't matter- if they hadn't been smoking..."

When dealing with anti smoking activists you just have to go "talk to the hand".

 

[Alana]

A subjective part of me, of course, does not want to have to be seen smoking by my relatives. British Columbia is one of the most vehemently anti-smoking regions in the world, from what I've heard.

You can say that again! I was shocked, during a short visit there. The smoking laws are draconian throughout the city, indoors and outdoors, with no one allowed to smoke in the parks or beaches. I have seen (and smelled) however, more people smoking marijuana in the parks and the streets in Vancouver than I've seen anywhere else. We also drove through the "bad hoods" of the city, and there were people shooting heroin on their arms in the middle of the day, in the middle of the pavement! I haven't seen such scenes even in New York. But god forbid, thou shalt not smoke tobacco! Go figure...

In regards to your family, it might be best to keep it a secret from them that you smoke, given their attitude towards the subject. It's externally considerate too. You can smoke a few cigarettes here and there when you can, and it should be enough. Try to look out for a brand of cigarettes named Yuma. They are organic tobacco, and I was able to find them in at least two cigarette stores in Edmonton. I am sure if you look around, you might find them in Vancouver too. Good luck

 

[whitecoast]

Well the newer e-cigarettes can be carried easily in your pocket. It's just a mini vaporizer. People who have gone from cigarettes to e-cigarettes say it's easier on your lungs. I bought one (No. 7 brand) that looks like a pen for use on long plane flights. I was introduced to them when for work I was at a client site right after I started smoking and this young guy had one, which he would "smoke" right in the conference room with everyone. Since the boiling point of nicotine is pretty high, it doesn't really get vaporized, but the nicotine is suspended in vegetable glycol which gets vaporized. Apparently it's the same stuff they use for medical inhalers. They really work, but since the nicotine is not actually vaporized, it doesn't hit your brain quite as fast as smoking, so I still only use the e-cigarette when I can't smoke. But if my lungs start to feel bad I might.

Whitecoast, how did you find the patch? I was curious about those, too. My wife's an ex smoker who wasn't happy when I started (but respects free will and only gives me a hard time about it when I give her a hard time about wheat and dairy! Fair's fair), and when I extolled the virtues of nicotine, she suggested a patch.

Sounds like e-cigs are another thing I should try out too! Thanks Mr.Premise and SeekinTruth.

I found the patch works well for me. I started with the "stage 3" patches (5mg over 24h) and worked my way up to the patches designed for heavier smokers. Since you already smoke you may want to try the 10 or 20mg right off the bat. Since patches cost the same no matter the dose you're getting, I found it frugal to just buy the 20mg patches and cut them down to a size/dose you find suitable, and store the unused parts in an air-tight plastic bag to prevent diffusion of the nicotine. They are more expensive then standard commercial cigarettes, so there's that to consider too.

The nicotine patch is a far from ideal delivery system and who knows what other unwanted chemicals are being absorbed besides nicotine into the skin. Also there's quite a bit of information about the vaporizers/"e-cigs" here and on SOTT (mostly in reader's comments) if you do a search. Vaporizers are generally not recommended either. If you decided you benefit from nicotine, your best bet is to smoke quality pure (ideally organic) tobacco.

"Ideal" depends on what your priorities are. It is slower than inhalation, but like I said I like the fact that intrudes into my free time less, and produces a steady dosage throughout the day-- I can slap it on in the morning and forget about it. As for how healthy transdermal patches are, according to pharmainfo.net most transdermal drug delivery systems utilize a natural or synthetic polymer or elastomer as the drug reservoir. Nothing listed on the website seems overtly hazardous. The worst that could probably happen is someone comes down with an allergic reaction to some of the compounds used in the matrix, which is easy to catch and correct. As for the hazy possibility that something may be being absorbed and causing bodily harm over time, all I can say is that they've been commercially available in the US since 1980, and to my knowledge no studies have shown detrimental effects yet. Obviously that doesn't guarantee they're 100% safe, but we're starting to try and prove negatives here.

There's a wealth of information here if you're interested: _http://www.pharmainfo.net/reviews/development-fabrication-and-evaluation-transdermal-drug-delivery-system-review

You can say that again! I was shocked, during a short visit there. The smoking laws are draconian throughout the city, indoors and outdoors, with no one allowed to smoke in the parks or beaches. I have seen (and smelled) however, more people smoking marijuana in the parks and the streets in Vancouver than I've seen anywhere else. We also drove through the "bad hoods" of the city, and there were people shooting heroin on their arms in the middle of the day, in the middle of the pavement! I haven't seen such scenes even in New York. But god forbid, thou shalt not smoke tobacco! Go figure...

In regards to your family, it might be best to keep it a secret from them that you smoke, given their attitude towards the subject. It's externally considerate too. You can smoke a few cigarettes here and there when you can, and it should be enough. Try to look out for a brand of cigarettes named Yuma. They are organic tobacco, and I was able to find them in at least two cigarette stores in Edmonton. I am sure if you look around, you might find them in Vancouver too. Good luck

To be perfectly fair smoking marijuana and shooting heroin are probably illegal in the parks and streets as well, but they just don't put signs up for those ;) I think the cigarette smokers are similarly rebellious, but they're innocuous enough for me to not pay attention to so I can't really say.

Thanks for your brand suggestion! It's really hard to window shop for cigarettes in BC, since places that sell cigarettes aren't allowed to publicly display their tobacco products. Tobacconist specialty stores are exempt though, so I should drop by and see what some of them have.

Thanks again all.

Last question: are organic cigarettes more benign for your breath as well? For those of you who have non-smoking significant others, how do they find it?

 

[neema]

Well I get my cigarettes (American spirits) from Washington, as the border store is very close. With the duty in, it is the same price as a Yuma bought in a store in Vancouver. Plus it doesn’t have those horrible pictures on the box, (yet).

Just the note about BC being very anti-smoking, well to be technical it is only the major cities, especially Vancouver. I’ve been living in Chilliwack for a while now, (an hour away from Vancouver) and there is many smokers here. I guess that’s do to a lot of old timers.

But I have to admit, as right now I’m traveling Europe, it has been heaven being able to smoke in most places. Especially in Italy and Spain. I have seen all sorts of smokers of all ages. It is very refreshing when seeing a grandma of 80 that lights up.

What is odd about Vancouver is the fact that I personally know more than one parent that tells their kid “hey don’t you ever smoke, but if you have to, smoke marijuana. It’s better!!”

Bizarro world indeed.

 

[Mr. Premise]

Unfortunately organic tobacco will also give you tobacco breath. Mrs. Premise let's me know that in a good natured way so for her and for my job I keep a supply of xylitol gum around.

 

[meta-agnostic]

I've recently tried transparent rolling paper - it's made from cellulose as all rolling papers are, just the process is a bit different. I only used a couple of sheets; the smoke was actually pretty good because there were no conflicting tastes, but I got a bit creeped out in feeling like I was smoking plastic. The danger I found is when cellulose reaches extreme temperatures it releases some toxic gas, I don't recall what though.

I just tried one of these transparent cellulose rolling papers this morning and I was impressed. It certainly didn't seem more irritating and I'll probably be able to tell if it's less irritating after switching back and forth a few times. Anyone else have any experience with them? Could there be any real drawback? They look a little weird, but I assume people looking at you weird will either figure it out or assume it is some kind of mini-cigar (or they can just mind their own business). Since cellulose is a main ingredient in paper anyway, I doubt there would be any extra danger from it unless it was altered in some way (i.e. cellulose acetate).

This is the brand I found:

http://www.burnpaper.com/

 

[SeekinTruth]

I've recently tried transparent rolling paper - it's made from cellulose as all rolling papers are, just the process is a bit different. I only used a couple of sheets; the smoke was actually pretty good because there were no conflicting tastes, but I got a bit creeped out in feeling like I was smoking plastic. The danger I found is when cellulose reaches extreme temperatures it releases some toxic gas, I don't recall what though.

I just tried one of these transparent cellulose rolling papers this morning and I was impressed. It certainly didn't seem more irritating and I'll probably be able to tell if it's less irritating after switching back and forth a few times. Anyone else have any experience with them? Could there be any real drawback? They look a little weird, but I assume people looking at you weird will either figure it out or assume it is some kind of mini-cigar (or they can just mind their own business). Since cellulose is a main ingredient in paper anyway, I doubt there would be any extra danger from it unless it was altered in some way (i.e. cellulose acetate).

This is the brand I found:

http://www.burnpaper.com/

I smoked a couple of roll-your-own cigs with those transparent cellulose papers in France last year. Burma Jones was using them and offered for me to try it when I asked about it (I think I saw a couple of other people using them as well). I didn't notice anything "off" about them. It felt a bit weird to roll it in what seemed like cellophane, but other than that it had no smell or taste that I could discern.

As far as I understood, much of the opaque fibers are removed leaving just the transparent cellulose, so it's supposed to have less stuff burning. The process it goes through to remove the fibers, I don't know if it leaves any chemical residue or anything like that.

 

[lennybruce]

Something amazing happened quite recently. There was a thread posted on Facebook by B.G. discussing the causes of harmful effects of smoking. It was generally agreed that the chemical additives that kept your cigarette burning smoothly, or alternatively caused the cigarette to smoke itself, were possibly more dangerous than the tobacco itself. Astonishingly, very soon after that thread posted my Silk Cut started to go out if I did not pull on it. Is this the influence of B.G. and SOTT or just coincidence I wonder? Either way notice has been taken by the manufacturers which cannot be a bad thing. Well done! :D

 

[pete02]

Something amazing happened quite recently. There was a thread posted on Facebook by B.G. discussing the causes of harmful effects of smoking. It was generally agreed that the chemical additives that kept your cigarette burning smoothly, or alternatively caused the cigarette to smoke itself, were possibly more dangerous than the tobacco itself. Astonishingly, very soon after that thread posted my Silk Cut started to go out if I did not pull on it. Is this the influence of B.G. and SOTT or just coincidence I wonder? Either way notice has been taken by the manufacturers which cannot be a bad thing. Well done! :D

Most likely that was the effects of the FSC (fire safe chemical) that they have added to all brands within the US and some other countries. If you check the barcode on your box you might notice it. It doesn't make your cigarette safer, on the contrary it makes it more dangerous to smoke. It would probably be in your best interest to read this entire thread lennybruce as it refers mostly to natural organic tobacco and not the commercialized brands. Very few commercialized brands are decent to smoke but most are just plain evil.