The Mecca Mystery: Probing the Black Hole at the Heart of Muslim History by Peter Townsend

[Nostradamus]

On the origin of this "black stone", I see 2 main options:

- It is a piece of "meteorite" recovered during a cataclysmic event that occurred shortly before the birth of Mohammed (the Sura "The Elephant" seems to keep a record of it)

- It is a piece of meteorite relating to an older event


The 2 hypotheses are not exclusive. We know how old the tradition of venerating meteorites is, especially in this geographical area.

There is an event that intrigues me. The emperor Elagabal, son of Septimius Severus, transported on a chariot "a black stone fallen from the sky" to Rome. This refers us to Syria, which is perhaps a clue. This event is represented on Roman coins made in Antioch. Another coin of Uranius Antoninus shows a temple dedicated to Elagabal, a Syrian "mountain-god": we also see the sacred stone.

Was it this sacred Syrian stone that later moved to Mecca?

But what intrigues me the most is to know why touching a comet is associated with strange powers. We find traces of this tradition also among the Celts, for example among the Irish. I suppose that the electro-magnetic charge of a cometary debris is likely to cause phenomena?

 

[Pierre]

But what intrigues me the most is to know why touching a comet is associated with strange powers. We find traces of this tradition also among the Celts, for example among the Irish. I suppose that the electro-magnetic charge of a cometary debris is likely to cause phenomena?

An example of strange phenomena is atmospheric plasma discharge. Since the dawn of history comets have been associated with atmospheric plasma discharge, plague and diseases. A series of books called the “Mawangdui Silk” was compiled in 300 BC but it list events as far back as 1,500 BC and describes in detail 29 different comet shapes and the kind of disasters, including plagues and other diseases, that they were believed to cause:

© Public Domain
Excerpt from the Mawangdui Silk showing various comet shapes and their meaning​

But there is way more, electromagnetic fields, and their modulation via comets, can and do modify our connection with the information Field and the morphogenic Field. A whole chapter (to be published) is dedicated to this topic in "Mass extinction, evolutionary Leap and Viral Information".

 

[thorbiorn]

On the origin of this "black stone", I see 2 main options:

After having seen the latest pictures, I wonder if one can assume what is left is even a meteorite. It may have been, but now? If the original stone had certain properties, and somebody with power over the area believed it, what might happen if the stone disappeared temporarily and was "returned"? Nothing, as the equivalent of fact-checkers would make sure people understood and believed what they needed to.

The honouring of stones in ancient Rome

There is an event that intrigues me. The emperor Elagabal, son of Septimius Severus, transported on a chariot "a black stone fallen from the sky" to Rome. This refers us to Syria, which is perhaps a clue. This event is represented on Roman coins made in Antioch. Another coin of Uranius Antoninus shows a temple dedicated to Elagabal, a Syrian "mountain-god": we also see the sacred stone.

I suspect you rewrote from the French Wiki. Would this story from the English Wiki about Elagabulus be about the same event?

The cult stone or baetyl was brought to Rome by the Emperor Marcus Aurelius Antoninus Augustus, who, before his accession, was the hereditary high priest at Emesa and was commonly called Elagabalus after the deity.[9] The Syrian deity was assimilated with the Roman sun god known as Sol and later Sol Invictus ("the unconquered Sun").[10]

And further there was:

A temple called the Elagabalium was built on the east face of the Palatine Hill to house the holy stone of the Emesa temple, a black conical meteorite.[11] Herodian writes of that stone:

This stone is worshipped as though it were sent from heaven; on it there are some small projecting pieces and markings that are pointed out, which the people would like to believe are a rough picture of the sun, because this is how they see them.[12]

Looking up baetyl, there was:

Baetylus (also Baetyl, Bethel, or Betyl, from Semitic bet el "house of god") are sacred stones that were supposedly endowed with life, or gave access to a deity. According to ancient sources, at least some of these objects of worship were meteorites, which were dedicated to the gods or revered as symbols of the gods themselves.[1]

Other accounts suggest that contact with them could give access to epiphanic experiences of the deity. The baetyl has been described by Wendy Doniger as "the parent form for altars and iconic statuary".[2] In general the baetyl was believed to have something inherent in its own nature that made it sacred, rather than becoming sacred by human intervention, such as carving it into a cult image. Some baetyls were left in their natural state, but others worked on by sculptors. The exact definition of a baetyl, as opposed to other types of sacred stones, "cult stones" and so on, is rather vague both in ancient and modern sources.[3] In some contexts, especially relating to Nabataean sites like Petra, the term is commonly used for shaped and carved stelae.[4]

They had a role in most regions of the ancient Near East and Greek and Roman religion, as well as other cultures.

In the above excerpt, there was mention of Petra, and that town has been mentioned already:

Townsend's ideas about the historicity of Mecca are in line with Dan Gibson's. I admit that the hypothesis is relevant : moving the Kaaba from Petra to Mecca.

It is as if, we have come a full circle—in the discussing of the topic of the black stone in Mecca.

Merkabah - Kaaba
If I go back to the name above, Baetyl, sacred stones, there was a session where the meaning of Merkabah was discussed:

Session 15 April 2000

April 15, 2000 Ark, Laura, Frank, Terry, Jan, Guest Johann M, Guest Stephanie Q: Hello. A: Hello. Q: And who do we have with us this evening? A: Yojon. Q: And where do you transmit through? A: Cassiopaea. Q: (T) We have guests here tonight... (L) Yes, you guys have anything to...

cassiopaea.org

Q: (L) This is something I have always wanted to get into a session, but I keep forgetting it. So, I wrote it down so I wouldn't forget. What is a "Merkabah?" All these New Age types are talking about it all over the place, and I just want to know if the standard interpretation is anything close to the reality. What is a Merkabah?

A: A creative creation.

Q: (L) Are you saying...

A: As were...

Q: (L) You didn't let me finish my question!

A: We heard it in you.

Q: (L) Well, just to get the question on the record, it was are all these people making all this stuff up about what the Merkabah is?

A: But then again, what is made up and why? It is not so simple!

Q: (L) In ancient literature, something called a Merkabah is talked about, but the definition of this extremely mysterious thing has been lost down through the centuries. There have been many "explanations" from such sources as the Midrash - Jewish commentaries - but there is even argument there. It seems that, even then, nobody knew what it was. But now, we have all these New Age folks coming along who have decided that they know what it is, and it is variously described as rotating double tetrahedrons...

A: If no one knows what it is, that is as good as any other explanation.

Q: (L) I want to know what the ancients who wrote about it meant? What is the definition of the word as the ancient writers used it?

A: The original definition predates this.

Q: (L) What is the original definition that predated the ancient writings that we have access to?

A: What do you think?

Q: (L) What? Well, it's a curious word because it is composed of two words or even three: mer kaba or mer ka ba. If we think of it as three part word, we have the Egyptian Ka, which is like the astral body, and the Ba which is similar to the Ka. I guess you could think of them as the astral body and the genetic body. Then there is the Ab which is the sort of principle element of the life in man - like the part that is of God or the soul. The Ab was represented as a red stone. It was the part of the man that expressed desire, lust, courage, wisdom, feeling, sense and intelligence. So, all of them together sort of expresses an abstract creative principle Kaaba is Arabic for cube, and it is the square stone building in which the Black Stone is housed in Mecca. It was supposed to have been built by Ishmael and Abraham. So with Mer, Ka, Ab, and Ba, we have a cube made up of the principle parts of the etheric self, and housing a stone. Soul stone? Mother stone?

A: By god, she's got it!

Q: (L) Okay, we've got the soul or mother stone. Or the mother of all stones. Now that we have a definition, what was it?

A: The Matriarch Stone.

Q: (L) Is the Matriarch Stone the one in Mecca?

A: Symbolism reigns supreme here.

Q: (T) Is this also the Philosopher's Stone?

A: "Stone" to those you perceive as ancients symbolized communication from "a higher source."

Q: (L) What is it about a stone that made the ancients associate it with communication?

A: Radio waves.

Q: (L) How did radio waves interact with the stone? Were they recorded by the stone; transmitted by the stone?

A: Transmission.

Q: (T) Crystals are stones. Crystals are used for radio transmissions.

A: Yes.

 

[CommieBlockGuru]

Has anyone read Hagarism?

The thesis there is that Islam was created by the Jews to wage war on Rome and Europeans in general.

It seems to line up with the theses' of the authors' mentioned ITT.

 

[happyliza]

What I think we need to keep in mind about books that attempt to explain the "rise of radical Islam" over the last few decades is that the authors' reason for writing them cannot be disconnected from global events of the last 25 or so years. To understand a recently arisen political/religious phenomena, you would think it natural to look at the previous era - in this case, the period from the start of the 20th century to the 1980s - to understand what was happening directly preceding the appearance of the phenomena and perhaps understand the conditions that helped to give rise to it. Yet authors of these books don't do that, instead, they jump back 1,400 years to see what was happening with Muhammad and then 'extrapolate' forward the 1400 years since then. That doesn't seem like a reasonable or objective approach and to me suggests an agenda.

"Radical Islam" today is not fundamentally a religious phenomenon, it is a POLITICAL one. Religion is just the gloss that lends legitimacy an acts as an attractor to suck people in. There is not ONE major event in the 'calendar' of radical Islam over the past 40 years that does not have the fingerprints of "Western values" all over it. Explain radical Islam to me in that context first, strip it away, and then talk about Islam and Muslims today. The problem is you can't do that in any realistic way because many Muslims and their thinking today are a product of that era and you simply can't dissociate the two. But you can do it theoretically, and when you do, you realize that there probably wouldn't be much that is interesting (or certainly inflammatory) to say. And you would be unlikely to sell many books on the topic.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not an apologist for Islam or Muslims, I'm just not inclined to take the bait that is being offered where I should 'pick a side'. I'm all for exposing the truth (or lack of it) as regards major religions, but I draw the line at lending my support (in whatever way) to what looks like a clear 'divide and conquer' agenda. The "problem" in the world today (and perhaps always) is psychopaths in positions of power who instinctively know that setting normal humans at each others' throats is the best way to ensure they do not identify the real source of the problem, and direct their energies towards dealing with it.

Just like they intentionally set the Shia and Sunnis at each other and tried to foment the differences for political purposes?