the path of recovery

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Phoenixxx

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Hi,

I'm new to the forum although I've been lurking and reading for a number of weeks now.

I've heard plenty of statements made over the last few years that the emotional victims of narcissists and psychopaths will be forever changed. And that recovery is incredibly difficult, slow and frought with plenty of potholes.

Of the people here, I wonder if those of you who have recovery under your belt, might help make a laundry list of things that helped, and things that were necessary for that recovery to take place.

thanks
 
Welcome Phoenixxx,

You can post an introduction to the Newbie Forum here and share your interest in narcissism and psychopathy. You can utilize the Search function since the subject is rather vast and much has already been discussed here.

As well, if you haven't read the Forum guidelines you can see them here.
 
Hello Phoenixx, welcome to the forum.

As suggested, perhaps you could write a brief introduction about yourself in the Newbies section, letting us know what brought you to this forum, whether you've read any of Laura's books yet, etc.

Phoenixxx said:
I wonder if those of you who have recovery under your belt, might help make a laundry list of things that helped, and things that were necessary for that recovery to take place.
Click to expand...

I'm assuming from your post that you yourself are a victim of narcissists and/or psychopaths.... Maybe you could get the discussion ball rolling by listing a few of the things that have helped your own recovery process?

:)
 
Well, of the many things I've employed in the last few years I found for me at least, EMDR therapy was the most helpful. I came to it late,however, because I hadn't realized I had acquired PTSD from the years long bracing myself against "the next" trauma/crisis/injury. Once I had come to realize that, the work in EMDR was far from easy, but it was impactful and liberating. I feel now all the emotions I have regarding my experiences are more appropriate in their intensity than they had been before.

I feel as though I've tried just about everything I can think of, or read of. But I know I'm not where I wish to be either, and theres still room for forward movement. So I'm trying to listen to the wisdom of people who have been there, done battle with that and won.
 
Also, I've used the "search" option and come up with only a handful of suggested threads but none of them spoke about methods or experiences found beneficial for recovery. I've started going through the thread titles in the archives in reverse chronological order, for about 8 pages, picking odd threads whose titles seem they might fit the theme but I havent found what I'm looking for yet (but will continue looking tomorrow evening perhaps).

thanks for the suggestion
 
Hello Phoenixxx,

Welcome to the forum. All of the sites available to you here are filled with tons of information and the possibility of gaining real knowledge for ones true self.

It seems that you may be seeking a 'how to list' when it comes to dealing with narcissists and psychopaths. I don't think such a list or text exists. There is a vast amount of information relating to this subject on the site, but without any details, it is impossible to offer any input or assistance to you.

Your posts to date, just don't provide enough information for anyone to answer your potential questions. It would really help if you would post a intro message, as suggested, for those of us involved with this forum.

What do you mean by 'EMDR therapy'?

Hope this helps,

gwb
 
At this point I don't want to know how to deal with narcissists. I think because so much of my focus has been on them over the last 8 years I'd prefer at this point to focus on myself, how I found myself here, how I can find my way back to feeling other than so negatively affected.

Right now I'm just looking for good ideas from survivors of N abuse, on how they further their recovery (from the confusion, the injury, the anger, the grief). Its true N/S's have incredible impact on their targets. Its time consuming and hard work shedding those negative effects, at least I'm finding thats true for me. I just figure those who have had success with that may have suggestions for me and others who are still in the process of working that recovery.

Thanks, I did post an introduction on the Newbie page right after it was suggested.

EMDR is Eye Movement Desensitization Reprocessing
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eye_Movement_Desensitization_and_Reprocessing
My particular therapist is well regarded in my area for helping rape victims, Rwandan refugees and abuse survivors with EMDR.
It was very effective in relieving the post traumatic stress disorder. My goal now, after having taken care of the immense grief and anger is to hopefully clear away more of the confusion, improve my memory and concentration, recapture my exhuberance for life, and who knows, perhaps even clear away my aversion to intimacy and vulnerability within a relationship again. (I hope thats enough information that other forum members might be willing to share what worked for them.)

Here's to a sunny Monday.
 
I think there are a couple of important components to rehabilitation, recovering from the effects of narcissism:

1. understanding what happened, and why - making it easier to come to terms with the fact that it did happen. (like getting 'closure'). So that would involve an understanding of why narcissistic behaviour happens (including one's own behaviour) in the first place - both through psychopathy, and also from general pathalogical behaviour from 'damaged' individuals who have their narcissim imprinted through various circumstances including childhood experience and current social environment 'Political Ponerology', goes into much detail about how that can happen in a societal setting, as pathology spreads through society like a contagien. 'Trapped in the Mirror', 'The Narcissistic Family', 'The Myth of Sanity' and others describe what part childhood experiences have to play in creating narcissistc behaviour.

2. focussing 'forward' on the positive aspect of ones life/aspirations. It is said that you can't simply break a habit in isolation, what you can do is create a new one to replace it. I think the same applies to repeating thought and emotional patterns that can be the result of trauma/damage from narcissistic situations.

So, I would think that for someone who has got through the first stage, the next thing to do is to focus 'outwards', and think "what can I do? What creative endeavour can I put my energies into?". Well, ideally this would be something that is not concerned with oneself, but is concentrated towards doing something for someone else, applying oneself to fulfilling some external need. If one can tap back into one's creative, positive drive and channel it into something appropriate with a 'can do' attitude, this can go a long way to helping the healing process for past events, because it will give real meaning to one's life, and move the focus away from 'victim mentality'.

I know that's all rather general, but that's my take, for what it's worth.

There is also Cognitive Behavioural Therapy (which is sometimes offered along with EMDR as an alternative treatment), which can be very successful at rehabilitating one's damaged thought/emotional processes - loosening one up enough to actually start with the pro-active rebuilding of one's life without being continually undermined by self-defeating thought/emotion patterns.

If studying the Gurdjieff material (this admittedly won't be a general solution for everyone, but is a major part of the approach here), involving self-observation, knowledge of the workings of the human system in terms of centers, energies, little i's etc, this knowledge can also be very useful, and validates with much of the modern psychology material.
 
Thanks Nomad.

The creativity part of the process was a Godsend for me over the last 3 years. I'm an artist, and a photographer in my career. I was much of the time, noticing and documenting the beauty, strength, resilience, and the humanity of the at-risk teens and the dedicated people who work with them (everyday heroes if you will). That did exactly what you described, turned my focus and energy on others, helped me take the focus off my own suffering, re-grounded me in the practical earthly world in which I live and engaged me with those who were experiencing hard times too.

That has settled into my everyday work life. In fact, of the 20 years I've been in this career, its easy for me to say I'm more impactful, more efficient, more creative and supportive of others creativity, and being in the moment, and "present" in my job right now than I ever have been before.

What I've noticed though is the pleasure, goodness, enthusiasm, the exhuberance (I keep coming back to that word) I used to feel just in the last 2 years has faded dramatically.

How do I put this --- I find it much much easier now to be in the rhythm of life and do everything I SHOULD be doing. So the effects of narcissistic abuse no longer grip me in that regard. I seem to be "on top of my game" more than before. But the spark, light, fire of life seems to be gone. Does that make sense?

Its not depression, or grief, or even a lack of forgiveness. Its not a lack of therapy, or reading and research and knowledge about what makes N/S's tick. Its not even much of a lack about what makes ME tick. Its the absence of.....light.

grr, I feel like I'm speaking poetry, words are failing me right now.

Maybe this is the last stop on the recovery journey, the last scar to heal, I'm not sure. I just know life is more than this, because I have felt more of life in me than this.

(I wonder if I'm describing this well enough.)

I'd be interested in hearing others perspectives and experiences.

I've read a good number of the books you listed and while they were helpful as far as being informative and filling out the picture of what happened and why, they didnt provide the kind of information I'm presently looking for.

p.s. just the exercise of writing this post is showing me how, in some regards, my mind just isnt what it used to be pre-N-abuse (I've edited it 4 or 5 times now and my brain's feeling quite stilted and dry now). I had one T tell me I had "temporary ADHD". Well, maybe, but it feels like something else.... like the lingering after-effects of a poisoning, a slow slow recovery as the system cleanses, heals and re-boots itself. I'm just looking for the reset button I guess.
 
I think you described it just fine.

The bad news is, there is no reset switch. You are a product of your cumulative life experiences to date. I think it is only being realistic to say you cannot erase the effects of the past. Scars can heal and be less painful, but cannot be made 'shiny and new', instead they can only be processed, or 'integrated' into who you now are. I don't think there can ever be a 'sure thing' or a 'guaranteed process' that hits the reset like some star-trek 'plot-tidy-up', where next week proceeds as if nothing happened.

The good news is, with determination and some inspiration, attitudes and feelings can change, and things can be seen in a new light, but I don't think anyone should expect overnight changes (though they may happen I suppose...). I think it is also fair to say you quite likely will not ever feel exactly how you did before BUT just because you feel a certain way right now absolutely does not condemn you to be trapped feeling this way forever.

And also, painful experiences do have the potential to, in the long term, make you more of a person than you were before. Negative experiences do not have to lead to a purely negative result. They can give you even more impetus to seek out the meaning of "why am I here?". I guess that all comes down to what potential one has deep down, that would be much more likely to remain forever buried without a few 'incidents' to stir things up.

'Deep Therapy in the Fast Lane' might also be a good one to read, for those going through similar process. It is a story of one person's road to psychological recovery and is full of useful insights.
 
I'll give that title a quick search at the bookstore tonight. Thankyou.

Your post reminded me of The Velveteen Rabbit, a much more hopeful childrens tale of "becoming real" than Pinnochio ever was.

I know I cant be real again as soon as tomorrow, but that doesnt stop me from feeling the urge to...or following my interest in becoming real again, even if it isnt the same "real" I felt before.

Thank you for that supportive post.
 
just a quick note, 'Deep Therapy in the fast Lane' is not in print (as far as I know), but is available to read online at the link above. hope it useful.
 
Hi Phoenixxx

the spark, light, fire of life seems to be gone. Does that make sense?

Its not depression, or grief, or even a lack of forgiveness. Its not a lack of therapy, or reading and research and knowledge about what makes N/S's tick. Its not even much of a lack about what makes ME tick. Its the absence of.....light.
Click to expand...

Could you try to describe what it is you mean by the fire of life, the spark? What's the difference between the way you used to feel, and the way you feel now?
 
Hmmm...

I used to feel like a tree. Now I feel like a piece of cardboard. I'm still made of the same stuff, but I dont feel throbbing with the pulse of life, I feel "dessicated", dried out, processed and re-formed.

I used to find pleasure in sensations, satisfaction in my work, and engagement with people. I used to feel my emotions. I used to feel irritation, fatigue, hunger, satiation, drive, ambition, delight, awe, reverence and a whole slew of other things.

Oh! I know. Its even physical. I used to feel thirst when I was thirsty, hunger when I was hungry, tired when I was depleted. Now I only know I need to drink because my throat and lips become dry. I know I need to eat because I get dizzy. I go to sleep because the clock says its late.

I used to notice and "feel" the beauty of birds singing, the rush of storm winds gusting. I used to marvel at my own creative endeavours, and those of others. I used to find myself and other people funny. I used to be moved by people's vulnerabilities.

I dont feel those things now. Its like my brain and nervous system are on novacaine...numb...flat...blank. I have brief moments of when I feel normal again, but theyre fleeting. I havent ever felt this way before in my life, I always just felt that my capacity to feel was so keen and 'fine" because I had an "artist's temprament". It seems now like I'm the opposite, and I wouldnt feel so alarmed by that if it hadnt been this way for the most part since August. I guess I hoped "this too shall pass". I'm starting to feel if I want it to pass, I'm going to have to attend to this, like I attended to the grief and hatred part of recovery.

Does that sound familiar to anyone?

(thanks for asking)


Its as though I still have those feelings but theyre far away from me, like in living room while I'm outside in the backyard. Does that make sense? Its all still there, it just seems very faint and far away.
 
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