The Vegetarian Myth

Merci Constantin pour votre intérêt... Constantin thank you for your interest ...
Parlou, je respecte votre choix. Nous faisons ici le travail. Notre objectif principal est de comprendre la réalité objective et à travailler sur nous-mêmes. Le régime végétarien est un autre mythe. Une autre nouvelle manifestation d'âge qui prétend que si vous êtes végétarien, vous serez mieux aligné avec quelques dieux, quelques vibrations des anges et je ne sais pas ce que else.Its rien de plus un programme en cours d'exécution à l'intérieur de vous. Et nous essayons d'identifier et de neutraliser tous ces programmes à l'intérieur de nous, car ils nous empêchent de voir le reality.Agriculture objectif est à l'origine plus de douleur et plus de décès pour les animaux alors rien d'autre. Nous avons des membres sur ce forum qui se trouvaient dans une situation proche de votre, et ils ont été ou sont encore sur une transition de végétarien pour un mangeur de rencontre. Trouvent que les messages sont les lisent. Peut-être que les choses seront plus de soins de clear.Take.

Merci SeekinTruth pour votre intérêt... SeekinTruth thank you for your interest ...
Le halal (musulman, ainsi que casher pour les juifs) la pratique de tuer l'animal d'avoir à drainer le sang est probablement ce qui est appelé. Mais je ne sais pas pourquoi on ne pourrait pas acheter de la viande qui était halal ou casher pas en France.

Merci Mrs. Tigersoap pour votre intérêt... Mrs. Tigersoap thank you for your interest ...
Citation de: Vérité Seekin
il pratique halal (musulman, ainsi que casher pour les juifs) de tuer l'animal d'avoir à drainer le sang est probablement ce qui est appelé.

Je sais ce que halal est bien sûr, je ne comprends tout simplement pas comment / pourquoi il l'emporte en France ».

Citation de: Vérité Seekin
Mais je ne sais pas pourquoi on ne pourrait pas acheter de la viande qui était halal ou casher pas en France.

Mes pensées exactement .;)



Je vais me commander ce livre sur Amazon pour en avoir le coeur net mais pour nourrir un boeuf, un porc ou des poulets il faut des graines qui poussent dans la terre et beaucoup d'eau pour les faire pousser donc au point de vue agriculture, je ne vois pas de gain... Croyez bien que je reviendrai vous donner mon point de vue de ma lecture terminée...

Pour ce qui est de la mort hallal dans les abattoirs en France, l'animal a la gorge tranchée d'où une souffrance atroce puisqu'il n'y a pas d'anesthésie ni étourdissement comme c'était le cas avant en France, Brigitte Bardot et beaucoup d'associations se sont battues pour cela mais le coût étant moindre et les musulmans de plus en plus nombreux, la mort hallal est maintenant pour ainsi dire généralisée, ce qui ne me convient pas, il faut savoir que l'agonie de l'animal dure entre 15 et 30 mn voir plus...
Comment accepter de prendre leurs vies dans ces conditions...


I will order this book on Amazon me to get to the bottom but to feed an ox, pig or chickens must seeds that grow in the soil and lots of water to grow them so the view agriculture, I see no gain ... Believe me, I will come back to give you my perspective from my reading over ...

Regarding the death halal slaughterhouses in France, the animal throats slit where excruciating pain since there is no anesthesia or stunning as was the case before in France Brigitte Bardot and many associations have fought for it but the cost is lower and Muslims more numerous, halal death as it is now widespread, which does not suit me, you must know that the agony the animal takes about 15 to 30 minutes more ...
How willing to take their lives in these conditions ...
 
PERLOU said:
Je vais me commander ce livre sur Amazon pour en avoir le coeur net mais pour nourrir un boeuf, un porc ou des poulets il faut des graines qui poussent dans la terre et beaucoup d'eau pour les faire pousser donc au point de vue agriculture, je ne vois pas de gain... Croyez bien que je reviendrai vous donner mon point de vue de ma lecture terminée...



I will order this book on Amazon me to get to the bottom but to feed an ox, pig or chickens must seeds that grow in the soil and lots of water to grow them so the view agriculture, I see no gain ... Believe me, I will come back to give you my perspective from my reading over ...
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The book is also available from Les Éditions Pilule Rouge en France : http://pilulerouge.com/shop/le-mythe-vegetarien/

Le livre est aussi disponible aux Éditions Pilule Rouge en France : http://pilulerouge.com/shop/le-mythe-vegetarien/
 
Merci Gandalf, j'ai commandé hier matin ce livre à Pilule Rouge chez Amazone...
Mais comme je viens de recevoir les deux tomes de l'histoire Secrète du Monde dont le 1er tome est un gros livre, je lirai le livre sur le Mythe Végétarien après...

Gandalf thank you, yesterday morning I ordered this book at Amazon Red Pill ...
But as I just got the two volumes of the Secret History of the World, whose first volume is a big book, I will read the book on the Vegetarian Myth after ...
 
Merci à tous pour m'avoir fait lire ce livre "le Mythe Végétarien"...
Je l'ai lu d'une traite sans pouvoir le poser...
Je suis anéantie, abasourdie par cette lecture, si navrée de tout ce que nous faisons endurer à notre pauvre Terre Mère nourricière...
Quelle ignorance, que de mensonges, quel désastre, quel dommage que l'on ne puisse pas vivre d'amour et d'eau fraîche...
Ce livre devrait être étudié dans toutes les écoles...
Je vais remettre en question mon alimentation en trouvant de bons producteurs bio et vider mes placards...


Thank you all for making me read that book 'Vegetarian Myth ...
I read it in one sitting without being able to ask the ...
I am devastated, stunned by reading this, sorry if everything we endure our poor Mother Earth Mother ...
What ignorance that lies, what a disaster, what a pity that we can not live on love and fresh water ...
This book should be studied in all schools ...
I will challenge my diet by finding good organic producers and empty my cupboards ...
 
It really is mind boggling how much damage agriculture does to the Earth and ecosystems. Lierre says it's the most destructive human activity, and all things taken into consideration, she's probably right. Even war, especially large-scale war, came after the "agricultural revolution", whereas hunter gatherers lived much more peaceful, fulfilling, and healthier lives.

It's good that you want to change your diet because of the new knowledge, but do it cautiously, and read as much of the forum and book material about making drastic dietary changes as you can, as it will take time and knowledge to adapt.
 
Seekin Truth said:
Il est vraiment ahurissant comment les dommages beaucoup agriculture fait à la Terre et les écosystèmes. Lierre dit qu'il est l'activité humaine la plus destructrice, et toutes les choses prises en considération, elle a probablement raison. Même la guerre, en particulier la guerre à grande échelle, est venu après la «révolution agricole», tandis que les chasseurs-cueilleurs vivaient beaucoup plus paisible, l'accomplissement, et de plus sain lives.It bon que vous voulez modifier votre régime alimentaire en raison de la nouvelle connaissance, mais faites-le avec prudence et lire autant du forum et livre matériau à faire des changements alimentaires drastiques que vous le pouvez, car il faudra du temps et de connaissances pour s'adapter.
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Merci Seekin Truth pour vos sages paroles...

Seekin Truth thank you for your wise words...

Mod's note: Added the quotation boxes.
 
I've been vegan for some time now. The evidence is overwhelming in respect to health benefits, body, mind and spirit. With any 'diet', whether a carnivorous one or vegan, each can be done with either health benefits or the contrary. I am living proof, you can be an overweight vegan. LOL

We know that this is a predator planet. It doesn't mean that we have to align with this premise.... but take the stance and cause the least amount of harm as possible. I believe if people, each and everyone had to individually go out, and kill an animal, rip off its hide, gut it, slice and dice, would probably go vegan on the spot. So, society hires psychopaths to do this. We are the inspiration of society of long ago, perpetuating through generations that eating flesh is just what we do. . . but do we kill and eat our pets? Oh the horror on that notion. Do we kill AND eat man? No, the lizzies through manipulation have the market on that one. Wolves don't farm. We endeavor to repress the lizzies from feeding off of us and take counter actions to do so with knowledge and understanding.

Eating the flesh of animals, wearing their skin means we are stealing their lives. Animals DO NOT belong to us. No different from the dairy industry where the white gold is stolen from baby calves. Calves are taken from their mothers within 24/48 hours and the mother mourns her baby for days crying. The calve's future is very dire. The dairy industry is one of the most cruelest. The dairy industry IS the meat industry. No different from the egg industry where male chicks are culled in the most horrific ways; into a grinder alive.

Why be hypocrites and continue to abuse our animal friends? They are here with us, not for us. Violence towards animals or man begets violence. Whether you are the one slitting the throat of a defenseless animal; pulling the trigger on a bolt gun, or a perpetuator of this horror industry by supporting it with your 'taste buds', keeps the violence towards animals in status quo.
 
Cat said:
Why be hypocrites and continue to abuse our animal friends? They are here with us, not for us.
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How do you know they are here with us not for us? Maybe they are here for us. And maybe we're here for a higher purpose involving conscious evolution. Or, if we fail to consciously evolve, maybe we're here for those that eat us. Most of these animals you are talking about also kill animals to eat. Chickens eat tons of insects, for example. Do you hate cats because they torture and eat small animals?

As Lierre Keith points out in the book, which you might want to read if you're open, even growing plants results in the death of millions of animals, mostly by removing their habitat. The vegetarian path is also paved with lots of death. That's the way it is in down here in 3rd Density STS-land. The question becomes, how do we evolve (consciously) to a higher level where we don't have to eat other beings to live. The Cs suggest that, for us, that evolution involves eating meat.
 
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I know this is a predator planet. That is what I mostly hate about this place. Well, I won't be a party to it.

Just because the 'C's said this doesn't make it true. Could they be testing us? Are we really that gullable and not look at ALL the evidence of how animals are raised for food? That the land used to feed the animals, the water used to raise livestock, that feed us can be eliminated and concentrated only in the plant agriculture for human consumption.

If I don't evolve to 4D because I won't hurt animals well, that is pretty contradictory thinking because STO means service to others, not service to self and I won't be STS by hurting animals or man.
 
Hi Cat,

I'm part Native American. My father was a hunter and a respected one at that. He taught me and my siblings to be grateful for the meat we ate. A prayer was always given in thanks to the spirit of the animal who helped give us life.

For thousands of years our ancestors (and most of the world at large) ate primarily meat, fat, berries in season and wild vegetation when available. Paleo peoples brains were larger than those of people today. Grains have only been with us for about 10,000 years.

When Native Americans were introduced to the white man's wheat and refined fats (like Crisco and Canola oil) via treaties that led to the reservation system, their health suffered terribly. My brother reacted poorly to this diet of fry bread and corn soup and became a vegetarian for over 15 years, but was constantly sick and weak from eating only so-called good grains and vegetables. He and many other Anishnabe (Ojibwa/Chippewa Indians) of the Keweenaw decided to return to the native hunter/gatherer diet and their health improved immensely. Once my brother added either hunted or grass-fed, sustainable, well-treated animal meat (No CAFOES or supermarket garbage meat) to his diet, he become a new man. He too is disgusted by the practices of most farmed animals and campaigns to end it. Of course he has confrontations with vegans and vegetarians who consume soy products and the like and tell him he is evil and not very spiritual because he eats meat, but he maintains his integrity.

Unfortunately, on this earth, we all must eat life to survive. Plants are living beings too. Native Americans believe even the stones, minerals and water have spirits. The earth must consume dead animals to produce plant life. Without it, you would not be able to enjoy the salad you probably ate recently. :) The author of "The Vegetarian Myth" discovered this fact and was shocked at how agriculture destroys the environment...and how even her garden needed the stuff from dead animals for the plants to grow.
 
Cat said:
I know this is a predator planet. That is what I mostly hate about this place. Well, I won't be a party to it.

Just because the 'C's said this doesn't make it true. Could they be testing us? Are we really that gullable and not look at ALL the evidence of how animals are raised for food? That the land used to feed the animals, the water used to raise livestock, that feed us can be eliminated and concentrated only in the plant agriculture for human consumption.

If I don't evolve to 4D because I won't hurt animals well, that is pretty contradictory thinking because STO means service to others, not service to self and I won't be STS by hurting animals or man.
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Well this forum is based in large part on the 4th Way work of Gurdjieff. Gurjdieff said that good and evil as far as we're concerned can only be determined by our Aim. And for most of us here, our Aim is to wake up from sleep and stop being machines and start being able to actually Do something. That's a real difficult goal, and if eating meat helps us achieve that, as the Cs suggested, then it is "good." Have you read In Search of the Miraculous, by P.D. Ouspensky. It's a great, concise introduction to Gurdjieff's teachings. What you'll find if you read it is that most all of us have all these high-falutin' ideas about our own morality, but we're actually all machines, just reacting to stimuli. From Chapter 8 of that book:

"But do not good and evil exist in themselves apart from man?" asked someone present.

"They do," said G., "only this is very far away from us and it is not worth your while to even try to understand this at present. Simply remember one thing. The only possible permanent idea of good and evil for man is connected with the idea of evolution; not with mechanical evolution, of course, but with the idea of man's development through conscious efforts, the change of his being, the creation of unity in him, and the formation of a permanent I.

"A permanent idea of good and evil can be formed in man only in connection with a permanent aim and a permanent understanding. If a man understands that he is asleep and if he wishes to awake, then everything that helps him to awake will be good and every thing that hinders him, everything that prolongs his sleep, will be evil... But this is so only for those who want to awake, that is, for those who understand that they are asleep. Those who do not understand that they are asleep and those who can have no wish to awake, cannot have understanding of good and evil. And as the overwhelming majority of people do not realize and will never realize that they are asleep, neither good nor evil can actually exist for them."

...

"As has been explained before, there are many qualities which men attribute to themselves, which in reality can belong only to people of a higher degree of development and of a higher degree of evolution than man number one, number two, and number three. Individuality, a single and permanent I, consciousness, will, the ability to do, a state of inner freedom, all these are qualities which ordinary man does not posess. To the same category belongs the idea of good and evil, the very existence of which is connected with a permanent aim, with a permanent direction, and a permanent center of gravity."
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Cat said:
If I don't evolve to 4D because I won't hurt animals well, that is pretty contradictory thinking because STO means service to others, not service to self and I won't be STS by hurting animals or man.
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Having studied Biology at the university, I got to learn quite a bit about plants, and when we got to study their way of communicating with other plants, their ability to survive in harsh conditions and so forth, I started to admire Nature's intelligence, complexity and creativity even more. You can say that most things, if not all things, are 'alive' in some way or another, and have their own lessons to learn in this world. Unfortunately, if you decide to go for a plant-based diet, know that you're still a 'predator'. Also keep in mind that plant agriculture has its toll on the planet's ecosystem, causing the death of animal species, and so on. Most times, when we act based on our emotions and subjective feelings, rather than on objective information, we do more harm than good, even if we don't mean to. So, taking this into account, I wouldn't say you are 'serving others' in this manner. You are still serving yourself, you just decided to 'prey on' another living species.

I can understand you though, it doesn't feel 'right' to eat meat from animals. But it's one thing to eat meat from animals who have been treated with zero respect, and another thing to eat meat from those who have been treated with the most respect. And by buying meat from good-hearted farmers we support them, and their way. That's the best we can do. Fact is, humans are not herbivores. Of course, anyone can try to be one, and take all kinds of supplements to try to get in the vitamins and minerals they're not getting for not eating meat, but it will cause them problems either in the short run or the long run. If we are to respect Nature, we have to learn to face the facts and act as accordingly as possible.

My 2 cents. :)
 
Cat said:
I know this is a predator planet. That is what I mostly hate about this place. Well, I won't be a party to it.

Just because the 'C's said this doesn't make it true. Could they be testing us? Are we really that gullable and not look at ALL the evidence of how animals are raised for food? That the land used to feed the animals, the water used to raise livestock, that feed us can be eliminated and concentrated only in the plant agriculture for human consumption.

If I don't evolve to 4D because I won't hurt animals well, that is pretty contradictory thinking because STO means service to others, not service to self and I won't be STS by hurting animals or man.
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That is just your perception. Its not the reality. I can see that its very painful for you when your perception is touched.Its you place where you feel nice.
So serving and making decisions only by your perception is not really an STO. I would say its a pure STS. You are serving only yourself, only your perception and not the objective reality , that been an vegetarian will safe animals lives. You are serving only yourself and that gives you feeling that you are doing something STO, or something holy by avoiding to eat meat.
In this position where we are in this universe we must eat flesh. We cant change that. Maybe our bodies will change if we step further in our evolution , If we ascend to 4D.But in order to do that we must finish all the 3D lessons. One of that lessons is our diet and our position in this grand scheme, no matter if we like it or not. We are all STS. Some of us wil probably be an STO , but only after they finish their 3D STS lessons.
 
Yeah, the crux of the matter is that we are all STS. Full stop. That's why we must consume other life to survive. Some of us are STO (and 4D) candidates, at least hypothetically. But another crux of the matter is, as the subject of this thread and the book by that title have detailed, plant (grains and other annuals) agriculture actually kills A LOT more life than hunting or raising free range / pastured animals (which also improves soil quality and enhances / balances the ecosystems). Lierre Kieth correctly calls the eradication of the huge amounts of species for growing plant based foods ecocide - not only all the perennial plant life but all the animal species and down to the microbes in the soil - wholesale killing and destroying of natural habitats/ecosystems. You actually have to kill MUCH more plants AND animals to get the plant based food onto your plate (or rather somebody else is doing all the killing for you, so you don't have to think about it - and that's a huge problem).

To work WITH nature is always better than to try to dominate her and make her yield. That is actually more STO than the domination model that "civilization" has brought about which is very STS - in all ways. Might as well face reality that in the world we live in, there must be the cycle of life and death that keeps the whole thing - the Life System - viable. It's actually less damaging to life forms at large to eat healthy and well treated animals than the wholesale ecocide of large scale agriculture, no matter how good it makes one feel that they don't eat animal based food - it's just another illusion. I think we'd all be better off if we all HAD to kill what we eat - as hunters or raising our own animals or whatever - as we'd be closely in touch with that cycle of life and death and have less illusions (and be able to sincerely be grateful for all life for providing for our physical needs/survival), although that is highly improbable in the world we live in now.
 
WOW, I'll gleen what I can but I stand alone. If you people think that murder is the way....

All that diatribe on psychopaths, how they start out by torturing animals, their lack of empathy and their murderous ways and you can't see the parallel. What is wrong with you!!!
 
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