Venezuela: Resistance or disintegration?

[Windmill knight]

I'm pretty sure this exact tweet will go down in history as marking an important tipping point for the US empire. Think about the implications of taking off the mask of sanity for the world to see.

Not only are they are admitting that they were pretty much responsible for removing Gadaffi (no people's revolution), but they are threatening that "we can do this to you too". The US is openly a criminal gang, and if the whole world didn't know it then they do now. And if they have any sense, they will unite together against it.

Yeah, that's totally crazy. Last thing I did last night before going to bed was see that tweet, and it left me with such a bad feeling about the state of affairs for the human race. Marco Rubio cares not about masks; he is so sure that the masses have been so thoroughly brainwashed, that he probably even thinks he is being witty with a post like that. Same goes for Bolton, Pompeo and Pence - it's just unbelievable how blatant they are with their tweets and statements lately! Total psychos!

As for Trump, I don't know what's going on with him, but my impression is that he is a very opinionated man, and unfortunately, he doesn't form his own opinions with much research or deep thought (he's not a 'thinker' but a 'doer'). Rather, he gets an impression, mostly through the lens of business, and decides what's what and sticks to it. The results is that half the time he is right about something, and the other half he is totally wrong. He was right about being friendly to Russia - 'cause it's good business' - and about pulling out of Syria - 'cause there's just sand and death'. But he was wrong about Venezuela, 'cause socialism bad, plus oil good'. I imagine that one day, when he finally decided he was really going to pull out of Syria, the neocons sat him down and said: 'Look, you gotta give us something here, we're starving!' And he said, 'well alright then, I never liked that Maduro guy so you can have him, plus we'll get his oil business'.

Now the neocons are all invested and having the time of their lives harassing Venezuela, waiting to see some serious blood flowing, and Trump is just kinda letting them be. When they ask to escalate the dirty tricks into actual 'shock and awe' bombing or sending troops, will Trump say no? With the 2020 elections around the corner, the logical response would be that he wouldn't allow a direct US involvement. Wars don't tend to be popular with the masses, especially if you run the risk of having a difficult one or even failing at it. But who knows with this guy. The Cs did say once that he had given in to the deep state, so what we are seeing in Venezuela seems to confirm it.

 

[irjO]

Obviously I’m not inside the mind of Trump to know what he really thinks about. But when I see Trump talking about Venezuela’s situation he doesn’t seem that enthusiastic as when talking about other subjects, like North Korea, Syria or the security on the border. It’s like in this subjects he is just following “recommendations” but maybe he knows what’s really happening at some level?.

Pence, Pompeo and Rubio are the ones who always have something to say about it. Maybe Trump knows that supporting Guado could help to create a good impression of him, specially for the coming elections. I could be wrong of course. But at some point that’s my impression, either way is not something positive at all.

 

[Chu]

Just a bit of a rant: I lived in Venezuela for 4 years as a child, and I'm connected to some acquaintances on FB. Well, last week I had a message from a "friend", asking me to please pray for Venezuela and reassure her that the articles I was sharing weren't a sign that I didn't care. That one didn't go so badly, and I explained that it was BECAUSE I cared, that I shared what I did.

Well, today my only childhood friend went on the attack and insulted me for sharing a SOTT article and having made a comment along the lines of what's being discussed here. I remained civil, but she basically refused to read anything we shared (Windmill Knight joined the discussion), came up with silly paramoralisms, super illogical arguments and propaganda, and that's all she had to offer. She even came right out to say that she would be the first one to welcome a military coup and a US intervention so that (quote) " all that scum is killed and we regain our freedoms". After that, I was done with her. No point in explaining anything or providing any data, when she cannot see how dangerous that is when simply looking at other examples, and telling that to SouthAmericans who know what a US-backed coup can do.

I had a bit more "hope" for her than others, because she suffered a lot (brain cancer as a teenager). Well, it's not the first "friend" that goes byebye, and it won't be the last one. We've all had a few, I'm sure. But in this day and age with access to real information, to hear a Venezuelian pretty much say that she'd rather have her country destroyed like all the other victims of "Amurrika spreading democracy", her own people killed, just because as a member of the high-middle class she decided to leave the country years ago, is quite sad. It gave me a direct taste of the people who are buying into the propaganda, and who in the name of "caring", are willing to throw their own country down the drain (and from abroad, mind you).

North American libtards are bad enough, but when you see pathological persistence in emotional Latin Americans, it's a strange combination of a soap opera and libtards. "I hate you and you are a stupid bastard for not agreeing with me, but I'm saying this with love, dear." It's almost funny, actually.

 

[irjO]

" all that scum is killed and we regain our freedoms". After that, I was done with her. No point in explaining anything or providing any data

but when you see pathological persistence in emotional Latin Americans, it's a strange combination of a soap opera and libtards. "I hate you and you are a stupid bastard for not agreeing with me, but I'm saying this with love, dear." It's almost funny, actually.

Yes, I completely understand that frustration, a lot of my “friends” are aligned with the same thinking, even members of my family. I remain to stay quiet first because of my immigration status (I’m still waiting for the interview to get my residency approve) but second because I’m living with family and want to avoid any confrontation or discomfort.

I only throw some questions in the air in my social media from time to time, like questioning the opposition just a little bit but good enough to “not look any suspicious” If you know what i mean.

It’s really jaw dropping how radical and extremist many people have become. It’s like authoritarian followers as it best.

 

[Cosmos]

North American libtards are bad enough, but when you see pathological persistence in emotional Latin Americans, it's a strange combination of a soap opera and libtards. "I hate you and you are a stupid bastard for not agreeing with me, but I'm saying this with love, dear." It's almost funny, actually.

Sadly, it seems a lot of people just like to live in illusions. There is pretty much nothing you could ever say to such people that would make any difference as long as they are so "ideologically possessed" and happy to be ignorant as hell.

 

[Alejo]

I’ve had that same experience Chu,

It’s immediately aggressive and defensive, there’s very little room for reason and one wonders. Where the heck does it come from? I mean when people are sick or hurt they go to the doctor and the doctor might say... “quit sugar you dingus!!” And they dislike it but go... “well that makes sense..” information while unpleasant is accepted.

In this case it’s a personal attack. “How dare you say I’m wrong in my beliefs?!” While information is being presented that will expand the issue and definitely allow it to be helped and addressed. No, that’s not what they’re looking for, they want blood because they’ve been convinced that it’s the devil personified that is the cause of all their troubles, and they go into this mode of histeria that can only be fixed by their target being obliterated.

It’s like a whole bunch of cognitive biases coalesced in a single event, confirmation bias, tribalism, wanting a quick magic pill fix, confirmation bias and on and on until their behavior is controlled by something so far from the truth that is impossible to explain.

Same thing that is happening in the US, you can watch it live, just go on Twitter... it’s literally insane.

 

[angelburst29]

The whole thing is making me angry at Trump. How would he feel if Hillary Clinton asked for aid and support to oust him from the White House? He's setting a very bad precedent. But then, what else is new?

I think we ought to get out and tweet to Trump that he needs to leave Venezuela alone and clean up the swamp.

As for Trump, he's in route to Vietnam to meet North Korean leader Kim Jong Un. That's another interesting situation. It's been rumored that Kim doesn't like to fly but why spend two and a half days on a train to reach a secret destination in Vietnam? I speculate, there's much more to that meeting, then meets the press? Is it just a meeting between Trump and Kim or has Trump scheduled several meetings - some with other Top Dignitaries? This is the first meeting outside of the US, since the partial Government shut down.

The position Trump took on Venezuela, supporting Juan Guaidó, didn't make sense to me. Why would Trump endorse an unelected surrogate (Guaido) - placing a democratically elected President (Maduro) - in the exact same awkward position that Trump finds himself in - by "the same neocons"? Think about that for a minute! Isn't this also, what Laura is hinting about (above) with Hillary?

Is Trump that stupid? No, I don't think so - something else "is in the works" here? Could it be, Trump is playing the neocons on their own turf, giving them "free rein" to support their greedy and power hungry arrogance, so they can openly expose their true nature?

While VP Pence, Bolton and Pompeo are distracted in Latin America, chasing rainbows and watching their efforts go down the drain, Trump is quietly arriving in Vietnam for constructed Peace efforts. Apparently, there's a lot more on the agenda in Vietnam, then just the Trump-Kim Summit, set for Feb. 27-28.

Lavrov notes polycentric world will take decades to establish
Starting out in Ho Chi Minh City on February 25-26, an international conference titled "International Cooperation in a Troubled World", arranged by the international discussion club Valdai and Vietnam’s diplomatic academy is being held.
Included in the Russian-Vietnamese conference is Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov and 40 experts, political scientists and diplomats.

North Korea warns U.S. skeptics as Kim heads for summit with Trump
The Trump-Kim Summit is Feb. 27-28.

http://tass.com/politics/1046219
After the Trump-Kim Summit - The six-party talks on the Korean Peninsula nuclear issue, which involve Russia, China, the US, Japan and the two Korean states, may prove useful if there is progress in dialogue between Washington and Pyongyang, Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said at a conference dubbed International Cooperation in a Troubled World, organized by the Valdai International Discussion Club in partnership with the Diplomatic Academy of Vietnam.

"I hope that if there is progress in relations between the US and North Korea, then the six-party mechanism will prove very useful, particularly in relation to peace and security issues," Lavrov added.

 

[sToRmR1dR]

The opposition's attempt to create the impression that Maduro is unable to control the border and the situation in the country failed.

Venezuela’s opposition fails to create impression Maduro is losing control, says analyst
February 25, 2019

 

[jhonny]

I’ve had that same experience Chu,

Same here!
I went to Colombia last year in December and I was speechless! You are only “allowed” to say bad things about Maduro, otherwise they (family included) see you like a criminal!
I was overwhelmed to realize how Colombian people are biased and influenced by social media. It really is insane!

 

[Windmill knight]

But in this day and age with access to real information, to hear a Venezuelian pretty much say that she'd rather have her country destroyed like all the other victims of "Amurrika spreading democracy", her own people killed, just because as a member of the high-middle class she decided to leave the country years ago, is quite sad. It gave me a direct taste of the people who are buying into the propaganda, and who in the name of "caring", are willing to throw their own country down the drain (and from abroad, mind you).

I've experienced something similar! The other day I posted about Venezuela on FB and a cousin of mine complained about how Chavez and Maduro 'destroyed' the country. I asked for some sources (and it was an honest request, cause I wanted to find out) and he replied that he had lived and worked in Caracas, was even married to a Venezuelan and that 'everyone' hated Maduro. The thing is, he doesn't realize that he lived within the segment of the upper classes - those who lost privileges with chavismo, or to the very least saw the country go into an economic crisis so were doing much worse than they used to - while the silent lower classes have been feeling the opposite, that for the first time they were getting something and weren't totally ignored, so they still support Maduro.

In the end he just gave me an article about how there's so much poverty and grief in Venezuela. But that's not what I was looking for - we already know they have an economic crisis, what I wanted to know was why, and who was most responsible. (Now I got a better idea, I think). But they never wonder about that - they are stuck in 'well if you think Venezuela is so great why don't you come and live here!', which is of course not the point.

I also went one day to troll Mike Pence on Twitter a little and an army of very aggressive antichavistas fell on me. The funny thing is they were really mad at me, and I wasn't even defending Maduro. I was defending Venezuela from military intervention! Some of them too were openly asking for an invasion! I'm sure a number of them were writing from Miami (they mentioned the place a few times), so yeah, it's so easy to ask for war when you aren't living there. Maybe some were paid trolls, but surely not all. Still, it takes a special type of evil or ignorance and dellusion to wish for something like that to your own country!

 

[angelburst29]

The Good - the Bad - the Ugly - THE DEFEATED!


Venezuela hit with new U.S. sanctions after clashes over food aid on border
The United States targeted Venezuela's government with new sanctions on Monday and called on allies to freeze the assets of its state-owned oil company PDVSA after deadly violence blocked aid from reaching the crisis-hit country during the weekend.

U.S. ramps up pressure on Venezuela's Maduro with sanctions on state governors
The United States on Monday imposed sanctions on four state governors in Venezuela as it ramped up pressure on President Nicholas Maduro for blocking humanitarian aid convoys.

U.S. asks U.N. Security Council to meet on Venezuela: diplomats
The United States has asked the United Nations Security Council to meet to discuss the situation in Venezuela on Tuesday, said diplomats after Venezuelan President Nicolas Maduro's troops repelled foreign aid convoys at the weekend.

Brazil will not allow U.S. use its territory to invade Venezuela: vice president
Brazil's vice president, retired general Hamilton Mourão, said on Monday that under no circumstances would his country allow the United States to intervene militarily in Venezuela from Brazilian territory.

 

[mabar]

Lima's group statement live--spanish

http://<iframe width="560" height="...picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[mabar]

... it would be very good if the International Court took that matter, to see who comes out more scraped ... bunch of hypocrites! ... they need to go higher ground because their plans had not worked out well ...

Lima Group asks International Criminal Court to consider Venezuela's "grave situation
Posted: 25 Feb 2019 21:01 GMT | Last updated: 25 Feb 2019 21:43 GMT
85110
"The transition to democracy must be led by Venezuelans themselves," says the Final Declaration, which states that they do not support the "use of force."

Lima Group asks International Criminal Court to consider Venezuela's "grave situation
Guaidó reacts after the Lima Group meeting in Bogotá, Colombia, February 25, 2019.

The so-called Lima Group will take the case of Venezuela's "grave situation" to the International Criminal Court (ICC), Colombia's Foreign Minister Carlos Holmes Trujillo said on Monday.

After the meeting of this group, which was held in Bogotá, Colombia, Holmes read the "Final Declaration", which consists of 18 points, and noted that the attendees determined as "crimes against humanity," "the regime's violence against civilians and denial of access to international assistance," in reference to the failed attempt on Saturday, February 23, to bring several trucks with supplies from Colombian and Brazilian territories to Venezuela, which culminated in several incidents.

The actions that were decided in Bogotá contemplate only diplomatic measures and none point in the direction of military intervention in Venezuela, at the request of the majority of attendees.

The group said that "the transition to democracy must be conducted by Venezuelans themselves peacefully and within the framework of the Constitution and international law, supported by political and diplomatic means, without the use of force. They called for "free and fair elections".

Going to the UN
In line with the request to the ICC, the Lima Group decided to encourage the appointment by the United Nations Human Rights Council of "an independent expert or commission of inquiry on the situation in Venezuela".

They also called on the United Nations High Commissioner for Human Rights, Michelle Bachelet, "to respond as soon as possible to the situation in that country, prior to the presentation of her comprehensive report at the 41st session of the Human Rights Council".

Also, this group will promote the discussion of Venezuela in the United Nations Security Council", and in the Organization of American States (OAS).

They will ask the Secretary General of the United Nations (UN), António Guterres, to "promote the activation of the UN System in relation to what is happening in Venezuela".

Holmes said the group resolved to advance in the recognition before the world of the representatives of Juan Guaidó, a Venezuelan congressman who proclaimed himself "president in charge" of his country.

Message to Venezuelan institutions
In the Final Declaration, the Lima Group called on the Bolivarian National Armed Force (FANB) to recognize Guaidó as its "Commander in Chief.

They also urged members of the Venezuelan judiciary and justice system to "respect the full exercise" of Guaidó's constitutional powers, "in order to facilitate the democratic transition and the re-establishment of the rule of law in Venezuela.

Alleged threats to Guaidó
After finishing reading the Final Declaration of the meeting, Holmes said the group "blames" the Venezuelan government for the "integrity" of Guaidó and his family in the face of "serious information" they have received about intentions to attack him.

At Monday's meeting, U.S. Vice President Mike Pence, who earlier sent a message to the Venezuelan military, participated as a guest: "If you take the flag of democracy, President Guaidó and the U.S. will welcome your support," otherwise "you will lose everything.

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator

 

[angelburst29]

As Washington and Caracas blame each other for torching a truck carrying what the US called vital ‘humanitarian supplies’ from Colombia to Venezuela, a video has emerged, finally shedding some light on the incident.

Mon Feb 25, 2019 - US-Backed Opposition Caught on VIDEO Throwing Molotov Cocktails at Aid Truck on Venezuela Border
Farsnews

The truck caught fire and burned down during a failed attempt on Saturday by US-backed opposition activists to breach the closed Colombia-Venezuela border crossing at the Francisco de Paula Santander Bridge, near the Venezuelan city of Urena, RT reported.

Photos of the incident were immediately used by US officials to double down on their outrage and calls for regime change in Caracas. But footage that has surfaced on social media tells a strikingly different story, pinning the blame on ‘activists’ in the crowd.

One clip appears to have caught the moment a man on the Colombian side of the border pelted a Molotov cocktail at the truck, while another video from the scene showed the opposition activists openly preparing the incendiary devices. Border security guards can be seen patiently holding their line at a distance, casting further doubts on claims that the truck was seized and torched after it had crossed into Venezuela.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1099720481161310214

https://twitter.com/x/status/1099475226080014337

 

[jhonny]

I wasn't even defending Maduro. I was defending Venezuela from military intervention! Some of them too were openly asking for an invasion!

That’s the point! They (USA and allies) want people to think that Maduro is the bad guy and a dictator, so people cannot see the whole picture. Obviously this is taken personally against maduro. They also use the word “regime” als motto to “touch the heart” of the people around the world