Kochav ben Yehuda and Joni Ferris: An A.D.L. saga?
From: Arkadiusz Jadczyk <lark1&&ozline.net>
To: Joni Ferris <jferris&&mindspring.com>
Subject: btw
Send reply to: lark1&&ozline.net
Date sent: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 10:34:48 -0400
On 5 Aug 2001, at 1:13, Joni Ferris wrote:
> BTW, the "center" of activity for me is my Starfriends list.
I know.
You can't find answers to your question on anti-missionary.
They will tell you, at best, the you must stick to Hashem and
His Torah. But they will not understand the reality of evil, and they
know no means of protecting you from it.
You need a larger scope, you need to know what scientists
know today, and you need to apply it
There are known techniques to access your subconsciouss
mind, and to find out what is going on. Not many people know
these techniques. You probably read a lot about alien
abductions. Did you read Mack? Did you read other references
that are pointed on our site? Did you read the discussion
of alien abduction phenomenon?
Do you know how many people experience it?
In how many forms?
Do you know about "spirit attachments?"
They have to be dealt with first.
That is science, conteporary frontier of science.
These "spirits" are all hyperdimensional "entities".
Life is more than what you just see around.
It extends into other dimensions.
That is what physics is about.
But there is long way to go.
The more you know - the more protection you can have.
Maimonides speaks again
Shavua tov,
ark
**************************
From: Arkadiusz Jadczyk <lark1&&ozline.net>
To: Joni Ferris <jferris&&mindspring.com>
Subject: starfriends
Send reply to: lark1&&ozline.net
Date sent: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 10:54:58 -0400
Dear Joni,
As a step toward reconciliation, to see what YOUR step will be,
we removed your name and email address from the web site.
The same with Kochan. We put using aliases instead.
Shall we be friends - even with different opinion on some
subjects, but agreeing on many important ones?
ark
************************
Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 11:16:13 -0400
To: lark1&&ozline.net
From: Joni Ferris <jferris&&mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: how did you know...
>On 5 Aug 2001, at 1:13, Joni Ferris wrote:
>
>> Since "Agents" check out the activities abductees, how did you know I
>> was on the Anti Missionary List?
>
>Joni,
>
>When we will be friends, and I still hope that such day will come,
>I will tell you how simple it is.
No - tell me now, since I am an abductee and want to know.
It isn't that simple, there are no search engines that can do this.
Anti missionary posts are NOT stored on the web.
Since now that you violated my privacy by digging into what egroups,
etc. I join.
Joni
***************************
From: Arkadiusz Jadczyk <lark1&&ozline.net>
To: Joni Ferris <jferris&&mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: how did you know...
Send reply to: lark1&&ozline.net
Date sent: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 11:35:04 -0400
On 5 Aug 2001, at 11:16, Joni Ferris wrote:
> No - tell me now, since I am an abductee and want to know.
Joni,
I want to be your friend. I want to be a friend of all abductees.
But you need to extend your hand too.
I wrote you - there will be many subjects where we will
disagree, for instance the subject of circumscission, which
I consider be lizard manipulated, to accomplish a psychic damage, not
coming from G-d. WE should not hide these differences.
But there will many other subjects that we can discuss about
in a rational way. Why not be friends, understanding the differences,
but having enough of common goals?
ark
**************************
From: Arkadiusz Jadczyk <lark1&&ozline.net>
To: Joni Ferris <jferris&&mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: how did you know...
Send reply to: lark1&&ozline.net
Date sent: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 11:45:14 -0400
Joni,
We added couple of paragraphs about Rabbi's Gershom research on
reincarnation to the page. If you do not know yet his book - check
our page again.
ark
*****************************
From: Arkadiusz Jadczyk <lark1&&ozline.net>
To: Joni Ferris <jferris&&mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: how did you know...
Send reply to: lark1&&ozline.net
Date sent: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 12:59:36 -0400
On 5 Aug 2001, at 13:06, Joni Ferris wrote:
> This is private, since you have a habit of publishing private posts on
> the web. If you agree this is private read on, otherwise delete the
> post.
OK Once you ask it to be private - it will be so.
> When I wrote to you challenging your website, it was a private post.
> It is how I do research. I answered your post about a website that
> dealt with the Jews. I found out about this from a Starfriends
> listmember who wanted to know if it was true your site or not.
>
> When I wrote to the name you gave me as a reference, I did not know
> that your friend Jack would add a whole list of names and make my
> challenge on his list.
I didn't know either. But you were including other people to your
attacks on us, that how it came.
> Therefore I was doing research and asking you questions. The
> listmember on Starfriends told me to apply to your list. You wrote
> back asking me about an introduction, etc.
I was really open to admitting you. It would be nice to have you
and to discuss.
Meanwhile, I did not
> know that you would be making my challenge to you public, on your
> private list.
I had no option left after I learned about the way we are being
stamped as "anti-semitic" on other lists. Also, I had to protect
other members of our list aginst possible similar attacks, by
taking all the fire on myself. That was a difficult decision. But
there was no choice at the time.
I refused to admit you with a broken heart. But I had to.
> That was between me and you/and I guess your wife who channels.
> So, when you wrote back that you decided after sleeping on it NOT to
> let me in, your wife also wrote to me saying that the list took a
> "vote", and on the website it states that it was discussed on the list
> what *I asked in private to you* about your site.
No, nothing that you told me as "private" was discussed on the
list.
> So, you put my private post with the name Asur on the site. Please
> remove it, that name is private.
Alright, I will do it, if you ask. I didn't know.
> I wasn't kidding about being
> contacted by that being. Only it wasn't through channelling. I get
> contacted IN PERSON.
That happens sometimes. There ARE fourt density beings that
come here in person. We had similar cases before. Quite
recently in fact.
> Did you talk about me on your private list and they took a "vote"?
Yes, we did talk. Like you were talking about our site and my emails
to you on other lists. But all that you wrote to me in your "Intro"
is deeply private, and so it will remain.
Hand?
ark
************************
From: Arkadiusz Jadczyk <lark1&&ozline.net>
To: Joni Ferris <jferris&&mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: how did you know...
Send reply to: lark1&&ozline.net
Date sent: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 13:06:54 -0400
On 5 Aug 2001, at 13:06, Joni Ferris wrote:
> So, you put my private post with the name Asur on the site. Please
> remove it, that name is private.
Done.
Hand?
ark
*********************
From: Arkadiusz Jadczyk <lark1&&ozline.net>
To: Joni Ferris <jferris&&mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: how did you know...
Send reply to: lark1&&ozline.net
Date sent: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 13:34:27 -0400
On 5 Aug 2001, at 13:40, Joni Ferris wrote:
> Remove that site.
I am removing changes that I made.
ark
*********************************
Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 13:58:47 -0400
To: lark1&&ozline.net
From: Joni Ferris <jferris&&mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: how did you know...
>On 5 Aug 2001, at 13:40, Joni Ferris wrote:
>
>> Remove that site.
>
>I am removing changes that I made.
>
>ark
You asked for a hand. The way to show that you want to be friends
is to remove that site with the letters on there.
Joni
***************************
Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 16:01:21 -0400
To: lark1&&ozline.net
From: Joni Ferris <jferris&&mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: how did you know...
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"
X-PMFLAGS: 34078848 0 1 P5F5B0.CNM
>On 5 Aug 2001, at 13:06, Joni Ferris wrote:
>
>> So, you put my private post with the name Asur on the site. Please
>> remove it, that name is private.
>
>Done.
>
>Hand?
>
>ark
You still did not remove that word. That is NOT supposed to be on
YOUR site at all.
Remove it. Certain symbols, signs, words researchers use is NOT for
the public, you should know this.
Joni
*****************************
Meanwhile Kochav was still going on the Sarfatti list:
From: "Kochav ben Yehuda" <kochav_benyehuda&&hotmail.com>
To: sarfatti&&well.com, lark1&&ozline.net
Copies to: [snipped extremely long list of recipients]BCC to:
Subject: Re: Occult Third Reich in New Age Today
Date sent: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 09:11:58 +0200
>From: "Dr. Jack Sarfatti" <sarfatti&&well.com>
>Arkadiusz Jadczyk wrote:
>
> > On 5 Aug 2001, at 10:34, Dr. Jack Sarfatti wrote:
> >
> > > Sarfatti
> > > asks how many explanations, equations and detailed blueprints for
> > > advanced technology the Cassiopaeans can deliver NOW!
> >
> > Jack,
> >
> > How many explanations, equations and detailed blueprints for
> > advanced technology the Cassiopaeans can YOU deliver NOW!
>
>WYSISWG, but that is hardly the point. I do not claim to be an advanced
>alien or human time traveler from the future who already knows how to
>make Star Gate Time Machines and build flying saucers with vacuum
>propellers. Like Hal Puthoff and Eric Davis and others we are trying to
>figure it out, scratching our heads and a&%#s like monkeys, and yes,
>maybe we are getting some help from "up there", maybe not.
>
>I got so far
>
>Guv + Lp*|psi|^2guv = (G*/c^4)Tuv
>
>plus its background equations and ideas that connect to string theory,
>Regge trajectories J ~ (G*/hc)m^2, charge to mass ratios e/m ~ G*^1/2,
>how lepto-quarks can be both extended structures ~ h/mc and point
>particles in high energy scattering at the same time from h/mc ~
>G*m/c^2! This one is a BIGGY!
Jack, did you get this from aliens?
Or was your human mind all by itself capable of producing this?
If so, wouldn't you say that your human mind is far superior to whatever
alien "channeled" being ark lets appear out of his head (oh sheesh, I mean
hat). Must be Freudian.
Because these "channeled" aliens have not been able to come up with much so
far, apart from retrieving the old theosophical Jew-hatred, and a bunch of
movie-inspired sci-fi.
> > I wrote more papers on the subject than you. Will you agree?
> > I am not saying that my papers are of any importance, perhaps
> > they are, perhaps they are not. Some of these papers, especially
> > dealing with conformal structures, or papers on EEQT go
> > parallel to your own research. In some respect you were
> > even following my own steps.
> >
> > You are working and I am working.
>
>Yes, again this is not my point. In that case who needs the Casseopeans?
>We are doing our job, now tell them to do theirs and stop pussy footing
>around with the same stuff we can read in Seat of the Soul or
>Macroshift? My point is, if the channeling is real then it's about time
>they send some significant scientific information and not clichés that
>we find in many many occult books in every bookstore about "the sixth
>density" et-al. They should especially send it to you or to me and
>others who can handle it in its fullness.
Good question Jack!
Yet it won't be answered, except for maybe in another timeline.
You will not see coming anything worthwhile from these Cassiopeans (you may
quote me on this).
>Same with Uri Geller, so what
>if he can bend spoons and start old watches, how banal. Let's see him
>part the Red Sea, or trigger a bomb with PK at a distance, or stop a
>Scud - I mean something useful.
Who says starting old watches isn't useful? smile
I think you are setting your goals to high, Jack. This is bound to get you
disappointed.
>Tell them also to send us the equations showing how they are able to
>communicate with us telepathically!
Oh, this is an easy one.
>How do they get post-quantum signal
>nonlocality to work?
They don't
> > I am trying to understand somewhat deeper into the theory,
> > you want to be as close to the applications as possible.
>
>Yes, I am working on this Star Gate/flying saucer stuff, not only
>because it's damn interesting physics, but because we may not have that
>much time to prepare to defend ourselves against a hostile superior
>advanced technology now building the alien hugger Fifth Column using the
>Greers, the Sheehans as puppets in a classic Trojan Horse operation with
>their idiotic "Ban Space Weapons" et-al and their call to arms to
>disrupt American and British and allied defense facilities on Oct. 13,
>2001 and at other times. I want to get those "Spitfires" with vacuum
>propellers and Star Gate generators up and flying yesterday! So tell
>your Casseopean buddies, from Sarfatti that:
>
>Now is the time for all good aliens to come to the aid of their human
>cousins with the real Mc Coy, with The Right Stuff! I mean with the
>clear physical explanations, like in Wheeler and Feynman, with the
>detailed equations, and with the schematics, the detailed engineering
>plans to build the advanced weapons we need to keep us from enslavement.
>If they can deliver the plans, we will build it.
They will not deliver anything.
If you want new developements, you wil have to use your own mind, and that
of fellow scientists. Maybe even ark can contribute smile if he is able to
focus his attention on real things instead of on channeled anti-Semitic
mumbo-jumbo.
> > You say you do not buy Cassiopaean's.
>
>That's not what I said. I said the time has come for them to give us
>something of value not vague moralizing and metaphysics.
There wil be snowstorms in gehinnom, before you will experience such.
Tell them we
>have a lot of home spun macroshift and don't need theirs to add to the
>huge pile.
OMEIN!
> > That's okay.
> > But you were contacted by strange mettalic voice.
>
>That's right Bhubba and I got
Don't we all get contacted?
>Guv + Lp*|psi|^2guv = (G*/c^4)Tuv
>
>which looks, so far, pretty good to me. What you got Holmes?
The anti-Semitic Cassiopeans in Laura's hat (or is it head?)
> > Other people were contacted by similar voices.
>
>Yes, and I am very interested in that since I had the same thing happen
>to me.
>
>http://stardrive.org/cartoon/spectra.html
>http://stardrive.org/Jack/contact.html
>http://qedcorp.com/book/psi/hitweapon.html
>http://stardrive.org/cartoon/MagicBean.html
>http://stardrive.org/cartoon/USSKron.html
>http://stardrive.org/cartoon/coffee.html
>http://qedcorp.com/pcr/pcr/sioo.html
>
> >
> > Other people were abducted. Other people were implanted.
> > Do you have acceptable explanations?
>
>Yeah, the abductors are criminals and we are going to kick their butts
>and put them in jail. It's Rule of Law. Aliens are not exempt from the
>law.
Indeed, Torah applies to all of creation.
And we are the ones, it was given to.
Anyone who condones abductions, or murder whether by Einhorn or
>not, is a fool in my book. Was Miss Levy abducted? I mean is Chandra on
>a flying saucer? Now that's a new one. Imagine if a saucer lands at the
>Lincoln Memorial and Chandra steps out of it! She did tell her aunt she
>had something "really big" to tell her, then she disappears without a
>trace.
>
> > Can you explain it through
> > modified field equations? If you have - publish your work in
> > a peer-reviewed journal.
>
>Sure Physical Review is going to publish a paper on abductions and
>implants by ET's? Surely you jest? Also, this is a Red Herring having no
>logical connection to what I am doing and what I was asking the alleged
>Casseopeons for.
Jack, there are thousands of people, who get "channeled information". You
might want to also ask the ascended "masters", or Yeshu, or the Ashtar
command, or the Pleiadians.
> > Let it be examined and criticised
> > by others.
>
>Hey Ark, I put all my work on the Web exactly for that reason.
I'm glad to be of service:)
Examine
>and criticize! Please do. Who is stopping you? Certainly not me. I even
>offered to pay you small honoraria ~ $50 to $100 to do exactly that! I
>am doing Hal Puthoff a BIG FAVOR in critiquing his theories the way I
>am. He owes me. I only do unto others what I want them to do unto me.
>
Hillel, the great.
You are not lost yet, Jack smile
> > You will say: I don't care. You will say "I am busy with
> > "real stuff". Fine.
> >
> > You ask "what is six density?"
> >
> > To answer this question I would have to use some math
> > of the type Tony Smith has on his side. The work is in progress.
> > Will tell you when finished.
>
>OK, fine. If you have something there let me see it. I had a brief
>affair with a New Age woman in Marin about 5 years ago who has published
>several UFO books with all this "density" stuff I think seven levels.
>Made no sense to me, but it was not her mind that attracted me.
Kabbalah speaks of 7 worlds.
Kochav
*********************
Meanwhile, all kinds of revelations were being made in other directions. Readers of our site were sending us evidence that Vincent Bridges was deeply involved in Enochian/ Golden Dawn magic, and we realized that our association with him had really made us vulnerable to this attack from Kochav, Tenen, and Ferris. I mean, geeze, Bridges WAS into "occult nazi black magic," or so it seemed, and if we had not decided to terminate our relationship with him, we could have so easily been tarred with that brush.
More than that, we realized afterward that, even though these people were, on the surface, in opposition to one another, behind the scenes they were obviously on the same team! Because, no sooner had we put the question to Bridges, pointed out the danger, than HE went on the attack using the SAME words that Stan Tenen and Kochav had used, accusing us of being a cult, "kool-aid" references, and the whole nine yards!
Since this whole thing was really taking up a lot of our time, and I was horribly distressed to be accused of anti-Semtism, trying to start a black magic cult, and just the whole thing, we decided to chat with the C's about it.
7 August 01
Q: Hmm. Well. We recently had a major attack from a bunch of Jews who were claiming that we were anti-Semitic because we didn't believe their religion, but we did believe they were special, which was kind of a weird twist to that whole thing. Ummm ... is this something that we should just back - I mean, you don't normally advise, but you know, I've been having thoughts about just simply pulling the material down off the site completely and just leaving the subject matter alone. This is what I've been thinking, and I would like to know if the future looks brighter with respect to ourselves if I do that.
A: Yes.
Q: I mean, I know it's courageous and all that, but it's not necessary. I mean, what's said is said on the site. (A) I had another idea, which I was checking, and we can put one or two pages out and put it on a different website that we have, which is not linked - not associated with Cassiopaea in any way - and we can just - instead of being on Cassiopaea, these pages will be on a different website. And you can always read the pages by clicking, going there, then come back, and it would give us a kind of legal advantage, so that in case someone decides to attack, it would be not on Cassiopaea pages. (L) Yeah, well, I think that discretion at this point is probably the better part of valor. (A) What do you mean "discretion"? (L) In other words, not telling everything you know. (A) Right.
A: Good idea.
Q: Well, the thing was, I put it up ... [unfinished remark was "to help because of my deep sympathy for the Jews...C's interrupted.]
A: Jews will be destroyed anyway.
Q: (L) Well, that's NOT friendly! So, it is better to pull it all down and leave them alone, let them fry in their own juices and do their own stupid things, and let them destroy themselves; because there's nothing anybody can do anyway? (A) Right. (L) I mean, there's no point in trying to ... (A) No gain. (L) There's no gain for us, no gain for them, and nothing we can do.
A: Yes.
Q: Well, anyway... That's pretty depressing.
***********************
Meanwhile, on the Sarfatti list, others were getting involved and the subject was going all over the place.
Date sent: Thu, 09 Aug 2001 14:06:55 -0700
From: "Dr. Jack Sarfatti" <sarfatti&&well.com>
Subject: Re: Occult Nazi's in Esalen New Age UFO Movement
To: William Lyne
Copies to: [snipped extremely long list of recipients]
Organization: The Sommerfeld Institute of Advanced Physics
William Lyne wrote:
> One should not forget that Steiner shared most of the same esoteric
> philosophy as the Nazis, so was viewed as the chief competitor, which is why
> the Nazis burned him out.
Yes.
>
> Lambach Abbey was, and may still be, covered with swastikas, from
> the days that "Father" Georg Lanz was a monk there. It was supposedly during
> that time that the young Hitler was indoctrinated into these esoteric
> teachings.
>
> Also, don't forget General Karl Haushoffer's influence. He spent
> seven years in Tibet, becoming an 'ordained' Tibetan Bhuddist priest, then
> came back to Germany, where he bacame a member of the Thullegesellschaft. He
> studied those seven years also with Gurdjieff, who was tutoring the Dalai
> Lama.
Yes, and some one we know has given a lot of money to the Dalai Lama in past two
years. The Dalai Lama today is a major force in the New Age. Indeed, Fred Alan
Wolf was invited to see him. Is it the same Dalai Lama or a new one? Also my
cousin David Padwa brought over some of the Tibetan Tulku's to USA
http://qedcorp.com/pcr/pcr/sioo.html
interesting synchronicity. Also Werner Erhard gave money to the Karmapa we all
recall back in the 70's.
>
> Gurdjieff's main influence in Tibet was to bring out the suppressed
> Bon cult, the worshippers of Kali Ma (Kali Matrakis, Bloody Mother), and
> worship of the "collective consciousness" which was the basis for
> Gurdjieff's "Synergy", which became the "group identity principle" or the
> Brownshirts and SS. (This doctrine was a distortion of the Spartan "flying
> wedge" principle, which was developed for use against "totalitarian
> armies"---the "Immortal 10,000" of Xerxes, for example---but was NOT the
> philosophy of the Spartans).
>
> The movie "Seven Years in Tibet" whitewashed the fact that Harrer
> was there as an SS Officer, tutoring the younger Dalai Lama. The previous
> Dalai Lama, then in Germany---schooled in the suppressed Bon cult
> teachings--- died in Nazi Germany, as head of a group of over 10,000 Tibetan
> monks, a contingency of the SS. Most of those monks died in the defense of
> Berlin. The rest of them were taken to New Jersey by the Allies, and all
> eventually died there in a monastery.
Similar story about Oscar Ichazo of the Arica Cult from South America that
strongly influenced Esalen in the 70's.
>
> Gurdjieff tutored Ernst Roehm ("Father of the Brownshirts"),
> Rosenberg, Haushoffer, Stalin, Mao, Dietrich Eckart, Blavatsky, and quite a
> few others. In short, almost all the totalitarian leaders of the 20th
> century. The "synergy" teachings gave rise to totalitarianism. I don't know
> whether or not that was Gurdjieff's intent, but that was the apparent
> result.
>
> This milieu of mystical esoteric rot was where the myth that
> Apophis/Apepi/Seth---the evil serpent of darkness, and evil brother to
> Osiris---was an actual "reptilian alien" who lived under the Great Pyramid
> at Giza, (now a part of the Stargate SG-1 script). It is also the basis for
> Zechariah Sitchin's version, which has the Ancient Sumerians worshipping
> actual "fish gods" and "serpents". This mythical distortion of ancient
> folk-mythology, which eventually gave rise to religions, became part of a
> covert anti-Semitism which was shared even by Blavatsky, derived in part
> from the history of the Canaanites as worshippers of serpents, and that the
> Canaanites were therefore not people, but "serpent-people", interbred with
> reptiles, the origin of the currently vogue "shape-shifting reptilian
> aliens" idea, which is now claimed to be the origin of the British royal
> family, etc., primarily because the Hapsburgs were intermarried with Jews
> (i.e., "serpent-people"), though this thought of course is not shared by
> those who spread it.
>
> William Lyne
Stick to your occult historical studies and leave the physics to me.
>
>
> -
>
> > PS Rudolf Steiner, founder of The Waldorf Schools, was an enemy of
> > Hitler and Thule. Indeed the Nazi's burnt one of his buildings.
> >
--
CREATE, COMMUNICATE, COLLABORATE
http://stardrive.org
*****************************
Date sent: Thu, 09 Aug 2001 14:25:00 -0700
From: David Gladstone <d1494&&wwc.com>
To: "Dr. Jack Sarfatti" <sarfatti&&well.com>
Copies to: William Lyne
[snipped extremely long list of recipients]
Subject: Re: Occult Nazi's in Esalen New Age UFO Movement
What rock do these guys crawl out from under?
"Dr. Jack Sarfatti" wrote:
William Lyne wrote:
> One should not forget that Steiner shared most of the same
esoteric
> philosophy as the Nazis, so was viewed as the chief competitor, which
is why
> the Nazis burned him out.
Yes.
No, he was small potatoes then. The Strasser brothers were far more
important as a threat to become rivals, they built the party into an
effective force throughout Germany. Hitler was incapable of organizing
anything. See John Toland.
>
> Lambach Abbey was, and may still be, covered with swastikas,
from
> the days that "Father" Georg Lanz was a monk there. It was supposedly
during
> that time that the young Hitler was indoctrinated into these esoteric
> teachings.
This is not proven by any means. There is no evidence to support this
but the claims of people, whose testimony can't be accepted. Most likely
Hitler's ideas were long before meeting Lanz, after WWI.
]
>
> Also, don't forget General Karl Haushoffer's influence. He
spent
> seven years in Tibet, becoming an 'ordained' Tibetan Bhuddist priest,
then
> came back to Germany, where he bacame a member of the
Thullegesellschaft. He
> studied those seven years also with Gurdjieff, who was tutoring the
Dalai
> Lama.
This is also fiction, The Thule idiots have always tried to gain
credibility by claiming non-existent connections with other more well
known mystics. If you make such claims, show some evidence, not the
raving of loons.
Yes, and some one we know has given a lot of money to the Dalai Lama in
past two
years. The Dalai Lama today is a major force in the New Age. Indeed,
Fred Alan
Wolf was invited to see him. Is it the same Dalai Lama or a new one?
Also my
cousin David Padwa brought over some of the Tibetan Tulku's to USA
http://qedcorp.com/pcr/pcr/sioo.html
<http://qedcorp.com/pcr/pcr/sioo.html>
interesting synchronicity. Also Werner Erhard gave money to the Karmapa
we all
recall back in the 70's.
>
> Gurdjieff's main influence in Tibet was to bring out the
suppressed
> Bon cult, the worshippers of Kali Ma (Kali Matrakis, Bloody Mother),
and
> worship of the "collective consciousness" which was the basis for
> Gurdjieff's "Synergy", which became the "group identity principle" or
the
> Brownshirts and SS. (This doctrine was a distortion of the Spartan
"flying
> wedge" principle, which was developed for use against "totalitarian
> armies"---the "Immortal 10,000" of Xerxes, for example---but was NOT
the
> philosophy of the Spartans).
This is QUATSCH, as they say 'auf Deutsch'- BS!
>
> The movie "Seven Years in Tibet" whitewashed the fact that
Harrer
> was there as an SS Officer, tutoring the younger Dalai Lama. The
previous
> Dalai Lama, then in Germany---schooled in the suppressed Bon cult
> teachings--- died in Nazi Germany, as head of a group of over 10,000
Tibetan
> monks, a contingency of the SS. Most of those monks died in the
defense of
> Berlin. The rest of them were taken to New Jersey by the Allies, and
all
> eventually died there in a monastery.
Similar story about Oscar Ichazo of the Arica Cult from South America
that
strongly influenced Esalen in the 70's.
>
> Gurdjieff tutored Ernst Roehm ("Father of the Brownshirts"),
> Rosenberg, Haushoffer, Stalin, Mao, Dietrich Eckart, Blavatsky, and
quite a
> few others. In short, almost all the totalitarian leaders of the 20th
> century.
You are so full of hot air, it's beyond belief. Gurdjieff may have been
one of the best liars to ever grace this planet and your evidence is
nill. Haushoffer and Eckardt are two hopless bohenian psychos, who
philosophized as they cadged drinks in Munich cafes. I can get you
philosphy of equal value (()) any night in a bar or Cafe around here!!
> William Lyne
Stick to your occult historical studies and leave the physics to me.
>
>
> -
>
> > PS Rudolf Steiner, founder of The Waldorf Schools, was an enemy of
> > Hitler and Thule. Indeed the Nazi's burnt one of his buildings.
> >
--
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**********************************************
From: "William Lyne" <billlyne&&earthlink.net>
To: "Dr. Jack Sarfatti" <sarfatti&&well.com>
Copies to: [snipped extremely long list of recipients]
Subject: Re: Occult Nazi's in Esalen New Age UFO Movement
Date sent: Thu, 9 Aug 2001 16:04:14 -0600
The Dalai Lama today was the one tutored by Harrer. He may or may not have
received the "wrong stuff." I have traced the "wrong turn of Tibetan
Bhuddism" to Gurdjieff's encouragement of the fordidden Bon teachings. A
Tibetal monk who used to live nearby, whom I used to take into Santa Fe,
told me that the Nazi connection was to the Bon cult. He described the Bon
teachings as "Black Magic", and the Tibetan Bhuddism as "White Magic". The
Bon cult was pre-Bhuddist, supposedly driven underground by Padma Sambava,
who brought Bhuddism into Tibet. But the Bonpas are still there, lurking,
and the likes of Gurdjieff 'brought them back out'---back into prominence,
with the prior Dalai Lama, and passed it off to the totalitarians. They are
the same as the Thuggee cult we saw in "Indiana Jones and the Temple of
Doom". That's where all the death worship comes from.
As for my physics, you don't know much about it. I will continue to
do my work there, and have already contributed significantly to advancements
in physics. You on the other hand will probably never contribute anything
new.
As for all the talk about "alien huggers", if you believe in any
kind of alien presence on earth, you are an alien hugger too. I don't see
any difference. There is no evidence of alien presence on earth, ever. If
you believe in such things without evidence, a taint is placed upon anything
you might have to say about physics, since the same kind of faulty
reasoning, which begins with a personal dishonesty with yourself, will be
passed off to others. I don't have such a problem. I only believe what I
have reason to believe.
Meanwhile, I trace the 'wrong turn' of physics to the advent of
Relativism, which has many of the same qualities of mysticism that the cults
practice.
William Lyne
***************************
From: "William Lyne" <billlyne&&earthlink.net>
To: "David Gladstone" <d1494&&wwc.com>, "Dr. Jack Sarfatti" <sarfatti&&well.com>
Copies to: [snipped extremely long list of recipients]
Subject: Re: Occult Nazi's in Esalen New Age UFO Movement
Date sent: Thu, 9 Aug 2001 16:13:18 -0600
A lover of these mystical teachings will never admit the documented
facts, and they are documented, but they won't be documented here by me,
because you people always deny the validity of the source. Steiner's
mystical movement was seen as a competitor by the Nazi mystics, drawing
its content from many of the same sources. Hitler met Father Lanz at
Lambach Abbey, when he was a boy.
The "underground masters" Hitler referred to were the Tibetan Bon cult,
who actually built an underground city in Tibet.
William Lyne
************************
Date sent: Thu, 09 Aug 2001 20:26:58 -0700
From: "Dr. Jack Sarfatti" <sarfatti&&well.com>
Subject: Re: Occult Nazi's in Esalen New Age UFO Movement
To: William Lyne
Copies to: [snipped extremely long list of recipients]
Organization: The Sommerfeld Institute of Advanced Physics
William Lyne wrote:
> The Dalai Lama today was the one tutored by Harrer. He may or may not have
> received the "wrong stuff." I have traced the "wrong turn of Tibetan
> Bhuddism" to Gurdjieff's encouragement of the fordidden Bon teachings. A
> Tibetal monk who used to live nearby, whom I used to take into Santa Fe,
> told me that the Nazi connection was to the Bon cult. He described the Bon
> teachings as "Black Magic", and the Tibetan Bhuddism as "White Magic". The
> Bon cult was pre-Bhuddist, supposedly driven underground by Padma Sambava,
> who brought Bhuddism into Tibet. But the Bonpas are still there, lurking,
> and the likes of Gurdjieff 'brought them back out'---back into prominence,
> with the prior Dalai Lama, and passed it off to the totalitarians. They are
> the same as the Thuggee cult we saw in "Indiana Jones and the Temple of
> Doom". That's where all the death worship comes from.
>
> As for my physics, you don't know much about it.
I know everything about it from that telling sentence you wrote. You are
completely deluded that you have the slightest understanding of real physics. I
hope your historical scholarship is better than your physics.
> I will continue to
> do my work there, and have already contributed significantly to advancements
> in physics.
Oh really? Prove it. Document it. What have you contributed? We are all waiting.
Put up or shut up. I am willing to admit I was wrong that you are not as big a
clueless idiot about physics as you appear to be. However, I see nothing to
change my opinion.
> You on the other hand will probably never contribute anything
> new.
>
> As for all the talk about "alien huggers", if you believe in any
> kind of alien presence on earth, you are an alien hugger too. I don't see
> any difference.
Then you really are stupid.
> There is no evidence of alien presence on earth,
A different issue.
> ever. If
> you believe in such things without evidence, a taint is placed upon anything
> you might have to say about physics, since the same kind of faulty
> reasoning, which begins with a personal dishonesty with yourself, will be
> passed off to others. I don't have such a problem. I only believe what I
> have reason to believe.
> Meanwhile, I trace the 'wrong turn' of physics to the advent of
> Relativism, which has many of the same qualities of mysticism that the cults
> practice.
Case closed. You are a clueless arrogant fool.
--
CREATE, COMMUNICATE, COLLABORATE
http://stardrive.org
************************************
Date sent: Fri, 10 Aug 2001 09:00:41 -0700
From: "Dr. Jack Sarfatti" <sarfatti&&well.com>
Subject: Re: Occult Nazis, Esalen, Gurdjieff, UFO, KGB
To: "Hudson, Ray (Santa Monica)"
Copies to: William Lyne
Organization: The Sommerfeld Institute of Advanced Physics
Thanks Ray.
I have been seeing this sort of clich psycho babble since 1973. Lyne had some
interesting things to say about the occult history, but he is such a clueless
crackpot on physics and engineering that we cannot trust anything he says. He is
very very typical of the level of the people leading the UFO Disclosure Movement
BTW. Criminally stupid, yet arrogant, about physical science.
"Hudson, Ray (Santa Monica)" wrote:
> > William Lyne wrote:
> >>The Synergy idea---that the "total effect is
> >> greater than the sum of the parts", isn't even true of a chemical
> compound,
> >> muchless of people.
>
> And Jack responded with:
> >There you go again. You are wrong! That the organic whole is
> greater than the
> >simple mechanical sum of its parts is the basic quantum principle.
> Indeed what
> >you say about the chemical bond is false. Eat sodium and chlorine
> separately see
> >what happens. It ain't same as salt! This is Physics 101 and
> Chemistry 101.
>
> Bill, I hate to say this (not!) but every time you spout off something like
> this that is demonstrably
> wrong though conventional, well-known science, you make me less interested
> in even looking into
> some of the things you claim about Tesla's work and whether it was ever
> demonstrated! Jack's
> NaCl example is a great one...want another from my field? Let's talk about
> drag production and
> measurement: You have a wing, and you have a fuselage....you measure the
> drag of each, call
> the results X and Y respectively. Now you mount the wing on the fuselage
> and measure the drag,
> and let's call that Z....you know what?
>
> X + Y =/= Z if the thing is serodynamically well-designed, then Z < X +
> Y
>
> Hey bubba....ever wonder why birds fly in a "V" formation? It's got to do
> with DRAG REDUCTION,
> and the birds don't even need degrees in aerodynamics (which I possess BTW)
> to figure that out!
> Sorry, but this is synergystic! You're wrong.
>
> And in another thread, the Bill Lynne fantasy went like this:
> >>then quickly
> >> accelerating toward Ft. Bliss, Texas, at about mach 30.
>
> and Jack so rightly challenged you with:
> >This is goofy. If you saw something like that. It was alien ET that
> our guys
> >were trying to figure out. How did you measure "Mach 30"? How old
> were you in
> >1953?
>
> Once again, this stuff is treading in the physics of my livelihood. I would
> hazard to guess that I know more
> about supersonic aerodynamics than you do, Mr. Lynne (unless you want to
> show some credentials that
> you understand it, which I don't think you do). First: Do you know how
> DIFFICULT it is to exceed even
> Mach 3 (much less 30!) in the troposphere (up to 36000 feet) or even in the
> stratosphere? Second: If you
> did get to this high of a Mach number in air of this density, do you
> understand how STRONG the shock
> wave would have been? I'd hazard to guess that if this thing DID speed off
> at Mach 30, and it was below
> 20,000 feet pressure altitude, that your ears would have bled from the
> impact of the shock from you being
> so close to it. And yet you did not even MENTION that you heard a sonic
> boom! Or have the government
> spooks found a way around the fluid dynamics of supersonic compressibility?
>
>
> So I have to echo Jack's sentiments when he says:
> >Prove it. Put up or shut up.
>
> And when you say things like:
> >>As for my physics, you don't know much about it. I will continue
> to
> >>do my work there, and have already contributed significantly to
> advancements
> >>in physics.
>
> And we don't know much about it because it is not in the mainstream! Why is
> "your physics" so
> well-hidden? Why don't we know about your contributions to significant
> advancements in physics?
> Are you talking about historical interpretations of physics, or no-sh**
> scientific advances? A TRUE
> scientist who DOES contribute to advancements does not "hide" his work and
> refer to it in veiled
> allusions to their own greatness! They spread it around for others to read,
> digest, consider, and
> shoot darts at! C'mon man! Get with the Scientific Process that everyone
> else accepts!
>
> Bill, your rhetoric is even tiring me out....and I have a higher tolerance
> for it than Jack, possibly just
> because I am younger than he is and haven't had to wade thru as much of the
> BS! So I am no longer
> going to wade-thru FBI-released documents on Telsa looking for something YOU
> claim is scientific
> proof his his zero-point energy creations! If you really are a scientist,
> then you will send it to me,
> and make it as plain as day so I can evaluate it (like every other scientist
> is willing to do!)
>
> Regards,
> Ray
> Raymond A. Hudson
> Member of Technical Staff
> Flight Controls Systems Engineering
> BAE Systems, Controls Inc.
--
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***********************************
Date sent: Tue, 14 Aug 2001 11:33:30 -0700
From: "Dr. Jack Sarfatti"
Subject: Re: Occult Nazis, Esalen, Gurdjieff
To: Glen Lindenstadt
Organization: The Sommerfeld Institute of Advanced Physics
Glen Lindenstadt wrote:
> Jack:
>
> Who knows the true story about the Nazi connection to manipulating the whole
> New Age Spiritual movement?
Wrong question. Read Rashomon, Alexandria Quartet, Wheeler's "Twenty Questions"
Observer-Participator, Borges's Tlon Ubquar Tlon (sp?) Also remember its the End
to Ordinary History. The Greater Earth is Super Cosmos of Hyperspace with
alternate timelines both past and future. One must look for degrees of
consistency in any record from the past. Which past? This opens Pandora's Box.
> Schwartz alleges the KGB was using Esalen for
> these purposes.
Yes. In the past most of us share.
>
> Let's connect next time your in LA.
I gave you the coordinates Aug 17 - 20. You got them?
>
> Do you know Dan Drasin? Have you seen the documentary called Hello Heaven,
> which examines Instrumental Transcommunication or "ITC"?- alleges in the
> 50's anomalous voices began to appear on audio recording tapes.
No I know nothing about that. Only my 1953 contact which was not on tape. I know
of Puharich and Schnabel's stories (Ch 11 Remote Viewers).
>
>
> Best,
> Glen
--
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***********************
So, we removed the pages, and the whole thing faded into the background; except for Vincent Bridges, Jay Weidner, Stormbear Williams, their pal Jeff Rense (who came on stage a bit later, but interestingly, again relating to the Jewish issue, but that will come soon enough), and then even later, John Kaminski and Judy Andreas.
